91/92 Clyde Drexler or 08/09 Kobe Bryant?

[jrong]

Kobe ten times out of ten. The overrating of past players is becoming epidemic.

[beermonsteroo]

Kobe ten times out of ten. The overrating of past players is becoming epidemic.

Back up your opinion

[jstern]

You're comparing apples with oranges; what does comparing two teams from different eras prove? I did some research and found out that in 92' two teams per game averaged almost ten more possessions then teams in 2010 did.

One of the main reasons the pace has slowed visibly in the last half decade is primarily because of zone defense; that is why Stern was hesitant to institute this rule to begin with.

No, the league in the mid 90s was starting to score less and less, including 91ppg in 99, and ever since the league has been changing the rules to increase scoring. The league changed the rules, so that today teams could average more points per game. This was the reason given for the rule changes, so it's not a secret.

2 different eras. You gave a reason why we couldn't compare those 2 players based providing stats, and I gave a logical explanation to the stats you gave as why we could. Centers shooting higher percentage shots, unlike today, and only a 4.5 ppg difference between those 2 teams. I'm just using stats like you were.

[okayabc123]

Drexler was good, but he was known as a slasher and above average scorer. His mid-range was decent but not Kobe good. And his long range was no where near Kobe.

The problem with stats is that the one thing people always sh!t on Kobe is his FG%, and that translate to him not "making other players better", "he is selfish".

No, Kobe isn't Jordan good. But stop trying to compare X player's one season to Kobe's one season and use that as "look, Kobe is not even as good as player X."

Complete BS. Watch the games, stop just going to basketball-reference.com and go through the entire player stats history, and just go "hey, here is a player that I can start a post to say, he is better than Kobe because he had higher assist average or scoring average, or he shot 2 percent higher than Kobe in FG%. "

[crosso√er]

The pace of the game was already going down way before zone was introduced.

That defines Stern's stupidity; he instituted the zone defense to increase the pace of the game, subsequently he added the "illegal defense" rule because zone defense wasn't really working. The pace was slowing down at the beginning of 90's; the hand checking rule was also removed for that reason alone. Now that you're at least admitting the pace has dramatically decreased between 92' and 08'; I'll tell you why.

It's mostly because of the Bad Boy Pistons and Michael Jordan; more teams started to adopt their style of play and converge on other teams superstars. If you analyze the trend, you can see the pace slowly going down every year. In the midst of our last decade, the pace has been quite erratic. Mostly due to Stern's experiments at trying to increase the pace of the game.

What I'm trying to say to you is that teams mindset changed (as it pertains to playing defense) and while Stern tried to counterbalance that mindset by initializing different rules (zone defense, 3 seconds, hand checking rule) that backfired completely.

Like I said, different era; can't really compare players via stats without examining the pace of the game.

[beermonsteroo]

Drexler was good, but he was known as a slasher and above average scorer. His mid-range was decent but not Kobe good. And his long range was no where near Kobe.

The problem with stats is that the one thing people always sh!t on Kobe is his FG%, and that translate to him not "making other players better", "he is selfish".

No, Kobe isn't Jordan good. But stop trying to compare X player's one season to Kobe's one season and use that as "look, Kobe is not even as good as player X."

Complete BS. Watch the games, stop just going to basketball-reference.com and go through the entire player stats history, and just go "hey, here is a player that I can start a post to say, he is better than Kobe because he had higher assist average or scoring average, or he shot 2 percent higher than Kobe in FG%. "

The question wasn't which player has a better career overall
The question was ehich player was better in those particular years. Years in which both were about the same age and both made it to the finals.
Looking at the numbers and watching the games it is not bull shit to rank this version of Clyde over Kobe.

[beermonsteroo]

That defines Stern's stupidity; he instituted the zone defense to increase the pace of the game, subsequently he added the "illegal defense" rule because zone defense wasn't really working. The pace was slowing down at the beginning of 90's; the hand checking rule was also removed for that reason alone. Now that you're at least admitting the pace has dramatically decreased between 92' and 08'; I'll tell you why.

It's mostly because of the Bad Boy Pistons and Michael Jordan; more teams started to adopt their style of play and converge on other teams superstars. If you analyze the trend, you can see the pace slowly going down every year. In the midst of our last decade, the pace has been quite erratic. Mostly due to Stern's experiments at trying to increase the pace of the game.

What I'm trying to say to you is that teams mindset changed (as it pertains to playing defense) and while Stern tried to counterbalance that mindset by initializing different rules (zone defense, 3 seconds, hand checking rule) that backfired completely.

Like I said, different era; can't really compare players via stats without examining the pace of the game.

He really introduced zone cause he thought it makes the game faster?
I knew stern is stupid, but this blows me away nevertheless

[jrong]

Back up your opinion

Other than MJ, the other MJ, Bird, and Kareem, today's megastars surpass the stars of the 80s and 90s. Look at Drexler's advanced stats. They compare to Kobe's but Kobe has the rings as the trump card. But, compare him to Wade. Wade's PER crushes Drexler's. Drexler never had a PER higher tha 24.1. Wade has had a higher PER than that all but three years of his career.

And I'll explain to you the difference that is showing up when on the face their "actual stats" seem somewhat more similar. Pace. So LeBron, Wade, Chris Paul-- these guys are doing more on fewer possessions and they are doing it more efficiently.

Only the absolute cream of the 80s can top the contingent of megastars we have today. There's a reason I'm so excited about the NBA now. We have a big three like we had in the 80s. We have an Isiah Thomas figure in Chris Paul. We have a center in Dwight Howard who could become a Ewing or even an Olajuwon (he's still young-- it's not too late)....

[ImmortalD24]

Regular season stats:

Kobe (age 30)


26.3 PPG 4.9 APG 5.2 PPG 1.5 SPG 0. 5 BPG 2.6 TPG 467% FG 351% 3P


Clyde age (29/30)

25.0 PPG 6.7 APG 6.6 RPG 1.8 SPG 0.8 BPG 3.2 TPG 47% FG 337% 3P

Playoffs

Kobe

30.2 PPG 5. 6 APG 5.7 RPG 457% FG 34% 3P

Clyde

26.3 PPG 7.4 APG 7.0 RPG 466% FG 23% 3P

Where did you get your stats? and how is Clyde Drexler 30 that season? You do realize his birthday is after the finals, right?

[KenneBell]

Look at Drexler's advanced stats. They compare to Kobe's but Kobe has the rings as the trump card. But, compare him to Wade.

Kobe had a higher PER in '09 than Drexler had in his career as well. The difference gets even larger when comparing playoff runs.

[okayabc123]

The question wasn't which player has a better career overall
The question was ehich player was better in those particular years. Years in which both were about the same age and both made it to the finals.
Looking at the numbers and watching the games it is not bull shit to rank this version of Clyde over Kobe.

Based on what facts that Drexler was better than Kobe at the same age? That he had a higher assist and rebound avg per game than Kobe? Clyde was not the defensive player Kobe is, Clyde couldn't hit a 3 to save his life in the playoff that year. Clyde sucked in the finals... and if you want to pull stats like anyone and everyone could... Clyde shot a whopping 40.7 FG% and 15% from 3s, and he let his counterpart MJ to shoot over 50 FG% and 42% in 3s.

If you want to tell me Clyde was a better rebounder than Kobe in 91-92, sure.. go right ahead. But tell me Clyde as a better player? Uh.. that's a hell no!

[G-Funk]

Kobe's O/D > Drexler's O/D

[glidedrxlr22]

Clyde was pretty smooth .. but I pick Kobe ...

Of course you do bro. No shocker there.

[Lakerlove420]

Of course you do bro. No shocker there.

right. and I wonder who you pick glidedrxlr22.
no shock. what's your point ..

[glidedrxlr22]

right. and I wonder who you pick glidedrxlr22.
no shock. what's your point ..

My point is that I can pick other players over Clyde if they are better than him. You can't pick anyone over Kobe kid.

In this comparison, it's just a one season comparison. Those who are picking Clyde like his playmaking abilities. For this reason I'd pick Clyde for this one season, but Kobe has had the better career and is the better player.