Cavs, Kings, Celtics in trade talks (Rondo, 1st round pick, more)

[Black and White]

How about this?

Cavs get - Jeff Green, Derrick Williams, #6 pick (Celts), #8 pick (Kings)
Celts get - Jason Thompson, Isaiah Thomas, #1 pick (Cavs)
Kings get - Rajon Rondo, Tristan Thompson, #17 pick (Celts)

This isn't a bad deal, #1 and Thomas is a good deal, would mean that we are going in for a full rebuild tho

[Black and White]

Dealing Rondo makes me feel like a Kevin Love trade isn't going to happen. Why the hell bring KLove in if we're shipping out Rondo's expirer? A Kevin Love-led Celtics gets us f*cking nowhere.

The only reason we'd want the #1 is to have the best possible pick for Skip to take and it feels like he doesn't give a damn about picks...whereas it doesn't appear that Danny really thinks this draft class is quite as amazing as everyone else seems to.

Getting Love requires him to commit to re-signing (to some extent) thats not going to happen if Rondo gets traded.

If Danny wants to compete sooner, we put together the package to get Love, then make a strong pitch for Melo or something.

[Levity]

Hmmm...I like the idea of Peyton but at 8? Do we keep 6 as well and draft 6 8 and 17 in the first round?

what i read was that is they want payton @ 6 and smart @ 8. and from other rumors im reading, the lakers are looking at possibly getting payton, as well (they like him more than smart) so thats why its rumored payton at 6

[JohnFreeman]

I would like Green + Rondo

[Black and White]

I would like Green + Rondo

As long as we end up with #1, you can have them

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

This isn't a bad deal, #1 and Thomas is a good deal, would mean that we are going in for a full rebuild tho

but isn't it pretty confirmed they're in rebuild mode?

But imagine this roster:

Sullinger
Bass
Wallace
Wiggins
Bradley
-------
Faverani
Olynyk
Jason Thompson
Bogans
Chris Johnson
IT
Pressey

I think that could get you 30~35 wins in the East, which is improvement, and gives you your franchise player in Wiggins.

That young core of Sullinger, Olynyk, Wiggins, Bradley, IT could be real good in 2~3 years.

[RedBlackAttack]

How about this?

Cavs get - Jeff Green, Derrick Williams, #6 pick (Celts), #8 pick (Kings)
Celts get - Jason Thompson, Isaiah Thomas, #1 pick (Cavs)
Kings get - Rajon Rondo, Tristan Thompson, #17 pick (Celts)

Horrible trade for the Cavs. Who the hell are we taking at 6, or 8 for that matter? And, giving up TT just as a capper? WTF?

[PleezeBelieve]

but isn't it pretty confirmed they're in rebuild mode?

But imagine this roster:

Sullinger
Bass
Wallace
Wiggins
Bradley
-------
Faverani
Olynyk
Jason Thompson
Bogans
Chris Johnson
IT
Pressey

I think that could get you 30~35 wins in the East, which is improvement, and gives you your franchise player in Wiggins.

That young core of Sullinger, Olynyk, Wiggins, Bradley, IT could be real good in 2~3 years.

That is an awful roster. You dudes really think Wiggins is a star. Cavs about to rape someone tomorrow

[RedBlackAttack]

That is an awful roster. You dudes really think Wiggins is a star. Cavs about to rape someone tomorrow

You need to prepare yourself for the Cavs taking Wiggins tomorrow. I'm just being realistic with you. If we stay at No. 1, he's most likely the choice.

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

Who the hell are we taking at 6, or 8 for that matter?

some combo of Embiid, Gordon, Randle, Stauskas, McDermott, Saric, Harris. That's who.

edit:
but you are right, even I believed I undervalued Thompson. I just want to see him on the Kings.

[PleezeBelieve]

You need to prepare yourself for the Cavs taking Wiggins tomorrow. I'm just being realistic with you. If we stay at No. 1, he's most likely the choice.

No, you need to prepare yourself for Wiggins getting drafted by the Cavs. I know what's going to happen if the Cavs take him.

Actually, I don't a huge issue if the Cavs take him as long as they keep Dion. He's a role player who needs playmakers around him.

Better hope Embiid don't blow, tho. You won't hear the end of of it from me

[RedBlackAttack]

No, you need to prepare yourself for Wiggins getting drafted by the Cavs. I know what's going to happen if the Cavs take him.

Actually, I don't a huge issue if the Cavs take him as long as they keep Dion. He's a role player who needs playmakers around him.

Better hope Embiid don't blow, tho. You won't hear the end of of it from me

I don't think anyone denies the impact Embiid could have on this league. There's huge risk in taking him and huge risk in not. With that being said, I don't think anyone will kill the Cavs in retrospect for not taking Embiid No. 1 overall independent of how good he gets. Big men with back and foot problems are scary, regardless of the potential.

I'd be fine if we traded down and got him.

I think you're going overboard on Wiggins' downside and not factoring in his upside quite enough. He's a rare athlete who does possess some transitional offensive basketball skills already. The mechanics on his jumper are actually surprisingly good, he's got a great first step and he's deadly in transition. Meanwhile, he has the potential to be an elite wing defender if he bulks up, which I think he will.

Do I think he's going to be the next Michael Jordan the way he was hyped up to be out of high school? Absolutely not, but I don't look at players in the context of their hype. When I sit down and really watch Wiggins, I see a very young player who possesses the frame/athleticism to be very good and, worst case, we're talking about Rudy Gay with a much better first step and better defense.

That isn't exactly the worst thing in the world, and I think that's his floor.

We're going to get a good player, here, who is going to help us.

[BrownEye007]

I don't think anyone denies the impact Embiid could have on this league. There's huge risk in taking him and huge risk in not. With that being said, I don't think anyone will kill the Cavs in retrospect for not taking Embiid No. 1 overall independent of how good he gets. Big men with back and foot problems are scary, regardless of the potential.

I'd be fine if we traded down and got him.

I think you're going overboard on Wiggins' downside and not factoring in his upside quite enough. He's a rare athlete who does possess some transitional offensive basketball skills already. The mechanics on his jumper are actually surprisingly good, he's got a great first step and he's deadly in transition. Meanwhile, he has the potential to be an elite wing defender if he bulks up, which I think he will.

Do I think he's going to be the next Michael Jordan the way he was hyped up to be out of high school? Absolutely not, but I don't look at players in the context of their hype. When I sit down and really watch Wiggins, I see a very young player who possesses the frame/athleticism to be very good and, worst case, we're talking about Rudy Gay with a much better first step and better defense.

That isn't exactly the worst thing in the world, and I think that's his floor.

We're going to get a good player, here, who is going to help us.

Do you remember drafting Waiters over Drummond? 4 other teams passed on Drummond after the Cavs but people still act like Waiters was a terrible choice. They could pick the best player in the draft and they'll still get shit on simply because they're located in Cleveland.

[PleezeBelieve]

I don't think anyone denies the impact Embiid could have on this league. There's huge risk in taking him and huge risk in not. With that being said, I don't think anyone will kill the Cavs in retrospect for not taking Embiid No. 1 overall independent of how good he gets. Big men with back and foot problems are scary, regardless of the potential.

I'd be fine if we traded down and got him.

I think you're going overboard on Wiggins' downside and not factoring in his upside quite enough. He's a rare athlete who does possess some transitional offensive basketball skills already. The mechanics on his jumper are actually surprisingly good, he's got a great first step and he's deadly in transition. Meanwhile, he has the potential to be an elite wing defender if he bulks up, which I think he will.

Do I think he's going to be the next Michael Jordan the way he was hyped up to be out of high school? Absolutely not, but I don't look at players in the context of their hype. When I sit down and really watch Wiggins, I see a very young player who possesses the frame/athleticism to be very good and, worst case, we're talking about Rudy Gay with a much better first step and better defense.

That isn't exactly the worst thing in the world, and I think that's his floor.

We're going to get a good player, here, who is going to help us.

His jumper is not consistent, no matter how you think of his mechanics. He has a good first step but lacks the bulk and ball handling to consistently take advantage of it.

He has no chance to be a 'star'. His floor is around what you said but his ceiling isn't anywhere close to what you think. When he gets to the league you will see, albeit, a plus athlete, he's not the type of athlete who can use his athleticism to bend the defense on a consistent basis. He has far more in common with Gerald Green (with better D) than the best players in the league.

He is not the piece that will catapult them to championship contenders. He is just that, a piece. One that the Cavs could easily pass and won't miss him.

[RedBlackAttack]

His jumper is not consistent, no matter how you think of his mechanics. He has a good first step but lacks the bulk and ball handling to consistently take advantage of it.

He has no chance to be a 'star'. His floor is around what you said but his ceiling isn't anywhere close to what you think. When he gets to the league you will see, albeit, a plus athlete, he's not the type of athlete who can use his athleticism to bend the defense on a consistent basis. He has far more in common with Gerald Green (with better D) than the best players in the league.

He is not the piece that will catapult them to championship contenders. He is just that, a piece. One that the Cavs could easily pass and won't miss him.

I don't have any real issue with your points except I do see an extraordinarily high ceiling based on his athleticism and mechanics alone. We're not talking about MKG, here. He's got a lot to work with already as far as his jumper goes and I actually think it has the potential to become an elite skill based on what I've seen. If that happens and defenses have to honor him and play him close on the outside, he's an ideal piece next to talented ball-handlers/slashers like Irving and Waiters.

If you leave him alone, he's going to bury you with his jumpshot and if you're too aggressive, he can be at the basket in a flash.

We're in sort of a unique position with our backcourt being so heavy with young playmakers. Wiggins won't have to "bend the defense" as you say, at least not right off the bat. He's one of those guys that looks like he could make a seamless impact in this lineup.


The other thing is this... I've seen these uber-athletes with loose handles come through the collegiate ranks before and look one way on an NCAA court and completely different on an NBA floor. Russell Westbrook was thought to be a late lottery pick at best by a lot of the "experts," mostly based on his lack of ball-handling and trouble finishing in the half court.

What wasn't taken into account is this... the floor can be much more congested in college ball than in the NBA. The court is wider and the gameplay is just more friendly to great athletes out on the perimeter. You could literally see in Russ' first Summer League game that he was born to play in the NBA.

I would not be the least bit surprised if Wiggins had a similar trajectory. He needs to work on his left hand, no doubt. But god damn he can be explosive.


Here's the other thing... The Cavs know what is happening with Embiid's injuries. We don't. Let's assume for a moment that things are a lot worse than we even know and he's out of the conversation. Who are you taking? You can't just blindly take Embiid without factoring in the very real issues that may be going on here and we have to make a pick.