Kobe lost the game for the Lakers

[RazorBaLade]

Your right...No one is close to taking that many, except Vince Carter, who is 31 for 96 at 32.3%......I'm just saying if you talk to a fanboy you'd think he hit's that shot 60% of the time....Reality says otherwise.

ya. this shot today will be forgotten, but if he had made it........ i'd be remembering it for a long time. happens for all players tho.

somewhat true. although a guy like melo or dirk is definitely making more.

but his attempts alone tell the story. he refuses to pass late in games. today isn't a very good example of that because its such a tough play, but having that many attempts alone and that average of a conversion rate is pretty telling.

he simply needs to either pass more or convert more....the Lakers are very poor as a team in game winning situations throughout kobe's career.

no reason to believe that. when u know dirks go to moves in the clutch for attempt number 100 and you double team and put a 7 fter on him hes going to shoot worse... when you shoot that many times they know exactly what youre oging to do and it gets harder.

i wish we had someone who can make those kinda shots but we really dont. i know kobe wanted to make lamar his Go to guy early on when they were rebuilding and he clanked like 5 of em and then Pau messed a few up... awful fisher at this point is his best chance to give a pass to for a shot.. thats nothing compared to having Billups or Terry. lakers might not be the best cluthc team but thats because we only really have 1 or 2 clutch players.

[TheAesirsFinest]

No wonder LeBron is so hated on this board. His stans are *****.

[DMAVS41]

ya. this shot today will be forgotten, but if he had made it........ i'd be remembering it for a long time. happens for all players tho.



no reason to believe that. when u know dirks go to moves in the clutch for attempt number 100 and you double team and put a 7 fter on him hes going to shoot worse... when you shoot that many times they know exactly what youre oging to do and it gets harder.

i wish we had someone who can make those kinda shots but we really dont. i know kobe wanted to make lamar his Go to guy early on when they were rebuilding and he clanked like 5 of em and then Pau messed a few up... awful fisher at this point is his best chance to give a pass to for a shot.. thats nothing compared to having Billups or Terry. lakers might not be the best cluthc team but thats because we only really have 1 or 2 clutch players.

and when they double...you pass the ball. kobe's attempt total is a negative really. its just a sign of him going "hero" and not making simple passes.

you can try to make excuses all you want. the truth is that both kobe and his teams have performed average in game winning situations. kobe is right at the league average at makes...and his teams have had the 12th best offense in these situations.

[I.R.Beast]

i don't think you can call that choking...but that is just my opinion of what the word means

however, it is pretty funny to see kobe miss yet another game winning shot and see his fans act like its abnormal or something. if it was the playoffs, there would be around a 75% chance of him not making that basket. i'll go with the odds....especially when he's tripled team...LOL

So i guess the majority of the sports world is wrong about Kobe's "clutch"?....the notion of him being clutch just came from nowhere right?....Kobe made a poor decision more than he choked....Opting to drive was the mistake. Thought he'd take the one dribble pull up. and quite frankly lebron James fans shouldn't even have a say in regards to other player choking, and Dirk has had his fair share of choke jobs as well.

[RazorBaLade]

and when they double...you pass the ball. kobe's attempt total is a negative really. its just a sign of him going "hero" and not making simple passes.

you can try to make excuses all you want. the truth is that both kobe and his teams have performed average in game winning situations. kobe is right at the league average at makes...and his teams have had the 12th best offense in these situations.

and then steve blake misses.... like i said, if there was a guy who was clutch on the team that can make those shots then fine. When there was horry and prime fisher he should hvae passed when he was doubled. But at this point kobe shooting 30% is fine for me because steve and artest are gonna shoot way worse imo. a team with one clutch player being 12th best says a lot about that one player.

of course dirk passes sometimes.. he has Kidd and Terry. Seriously. Whos gonna make more GW shots, Kidd + terry or blake + artest?

[DMAVS41]

So i guess the majority of the sports world is wrong about Kobe's "clutch"?....they notion of him being clutch just came from nowhere right?....Kobe made a poor decision more than he choked....Opted to drive was the mistake. Thought he take the one dribble pull up. and quite frankly lebron James fans shouldn't even have a say in regards to other player choking, and Dirk has had his fair share of choke jobs as well.

i actually do think kobe is clutch. he's always been one of the best players late in tight games.

i don't think he's that great in game winning situations though. again, 16 years of evidence is hard to ignore.

so is his playoff track record on these shots. its not hard. he either needs to make more of them or pass more often. its simple. not complicated.

[DMAVS41]

and then steve blake misses.... like i said, if there was a guy who was clutch on the team that can make those shots then fine. When there was horry and prime fisher he should hvae passed when he was doubled. But at this point kobe shooting 30% is fine for me because steve and artest are gonna shoot way worse imo. a team with one clutch player being 12th best says a lot about that one player.

yes. fisher just has never made a big basket. my guess is that blake would at least hit the rim on an open look created by kobe.

just me though. again, its 16 years of evidence. really just facts at this point. he's not great in game winning situations. not as a shot maker and not as a play maker.

but i love hearing the "help" excuses.....

i also love hearing people disregard the "stats"...as if they don't matter. stats stats stats...worthless...right? funny how they always seem more accurate than the biased opinions of fans.

[RazorBaLade]

yes. fisher just has never made a big basket. my guess is that blake would at least hit the rim on an open look created by kobe.

just me though. again, its 16 years of evidence. really just facts at this point. he's not great in game winning situations. not as a shot maker and not as a play maker.

but i love hearing the "help" excuses.....

i also love hearing people disregard the "stats"...as if they don't matter. stats stats stats...worthless...right? funny how they always seem more accurate than the biased opinions of fans.

fisher is 5 million years old. theres no reason to believe blake would shoot over 30% on gws. /

[IGOTGAME]

yes. fisher just has never made a big basket. my guess is that blake would at least hit the rim on an open look created by kobe.

just me though. again, its 16 years of evidence. really just facts at this point. he's not great in game winning situations. not as a shot maker and not as a play maker.

but i love hearing the "help" excuses.....

i also love hearing people disregard the "stats"...as if they don't matter. stats stats stats...worthless...right? funny how they always seem more accurate than the biased opinions of fans.

Kobe has had a better career than Dirk. Kobe has been a better player than Dirk throughout his career.

I have my fallback argument too.

[Juges8932]

somewhat true. although a guy like melo or dirk is definitely making more.

but his attempts alone tell the story. he refuses to pass late in games. today isn't a very good example of that because its such a tough play, but having that many attempts alone and that average of a conversion rate is pretty telling.

he simply needs to either pass more or convert more....the Lakers are very poor as a team in game winning situations throughout kobe's career.

That's simply not true, lol. He passes and passes frequently in late-game situations. One of his two crucial mistakes in the game was in the last 30 seconds when he tried passing it... He routinely attempts to draw double teams to free someone up and hit the open man. He has passed numerous times, even in the playoffs.

It's a dual-edged sword. Kobe wants to take the last shot and claims that it is his duty to the team- that that is why he gets paid the big bucks. Then he is being some selfish ballhog who doesn't pass because of it. Then, the reverse is somebody like LeBron who doesn't mind passing up on game-winning shots and will just make whatever play he feels is best, even if that isn't him trying to create for himself. Then people call him a coward and say he's afraid of the moment. Really, it's so stupid and contradictory.

People need to stop flip-flopping what they want the superstar player to do based on who the player is and pick a standard. Much like with stats (only choosing to bring up stats relevant to making their side of the argument, when there are just as many supporting the other side, lol).

[I.R.Beast]

i actually do think kobe is clutch. he's always been one of the best players late in tight games.

i don't think he's that great in game winning situations though. again, 16 years of evidence is hard to ignore.

so is his playoff track record on these shots. its not hard. he either needs to make more of them or pass more often. its simple. not complicated.

outside of melo noone is worth mentioning in game winning situations if you play the FG% game in those situations. Choking in my book is disappearing in crucial juncture of the game , folding under the pressure etc. Most game winning shot attempts are tough looks for star players so i dont expect high FG%s in those situations especially when players only face those circumstances a handful of times.

And pass to who...some else so they can miss the shot?..... I want my best player taking the last shot as long as he can get a decent look,

[DMAVS41]

Kobe has had a better career than Dirk. Kobe has been a better player than Dirk throughout his career.

I have my fallback argument too.

careers? not sure the relevance.

dirk and his teams have performed much better than kobe and his teams in game winning situations throughout their careers.

mavs have the best record in close games since the 05 season as well.

but yea...lets make this about their careers when kobe misses another game winner. why not just post a "5 rings...U MAD" pic...LOL

[DMAVS41]

That's simply not true, lol. He passes and passes frequently in late-game situations. One of his two crucial mistakes in the game was in the last 30 seconds when he tried passing it... He routinely attempts to draw double teams to free someone up and hit the open man. He has passed numerous times, even in the playoffs.

It's a dual-edged sword. Kobe wants to take the last shot and claims that it is his duty to the team- that that is why he gets paid the big bucks. Then he is being some selfish ballhog who doesn't pass because of it. Then, the reverse is somebody like LeBron who doesn't mind passing up on game-winning shots and will just make whatever play he feels is best, even if that isn't him trying to create for himself. Then people call him a coward and say he's afraid of the moment. Really, it's so stupid and contradictory.

People need to stop flip-flopping what they want the superstar player to do based on who the player is and pick a standard. Much like with stats (only choosing to bring up stats relevant to making their side of the argument, when there are just as many supporting the other side, lol).

I'm talking about game winning situations. Kobe has one of the worst assist ratios out of any player ever in these scenarios. He had 1 assists in 66 attempts at one point.

He simply refuses to pass the ball. That is why his attempts are so high and his makes are low.

I would never call him a coward for making the right basketball play. I'm actually all for it....LOL

[RazorBaLade]

I'm talking about game winning situations. Kobe has one of the worst assist ratios out of any player ever in these scenarios. He had 1 assists in 66 attempts at one point.

He simply refuses to pass the ball. That is why his attempts are so high and his makes are low.

I would never call him a coward for making the right basketball play. I'm actually all for it....LOL

im not dispusting ur post btw, do u know how many actual shots have released after a pass from him in these situations tho?

i mean assists doesnt mean much.. what if they all missed? who knows. how many times has he PASSED?

[Legends66NBA7]

I'm talking about game winning situations. Kobe has one of the worst assist ratios out of any player ever in these scenarios. He had 1 assists in 66 attempts at one point.

He simply refuses to pass the ball. That is why his attempts are so high and his makes are low.

I would never call him a coward for making the right basketball play. I'm actually all for it....LOL

Who did you want Kobe to setup with less than 5 seconds though ?