Which player in the general top 20 is most dependent on team accomplishments?

[Akrazotile]

Just a question, don't really have a particular guy in mind or an agenda in any way. I'm just wondering who you guys think receives the most charitable elevation in his all-time rank due to the teams he was lucky enough to be a part of.

We all know how incredibly stupid it is to rank guys based on "The Horry Statistic" because it would be silly to suggest Horry was better than Hakeem, or Fisher and Kobe were better than Shaq. However the sad reality is that most people do weigh team titles far too heavily. Which is the equivalent of suggesting Phil is twice the coach Pop is and then some. To put it simply, it's a formula for the dumb fans to cling to.

But who does it benefit most? Guys in the top 20 all have different claims to fame. Jordan is the most accomplished with accolades. Kareem is the points leader. Stockton the steals and assists leader. Bran and Wilt are statistical gods. Hakeem perhaps the best two way big. Shaq perhaps the most dominant peak. Oscar with an untouchable triple-double record. A few guys have multiple MVP's.


If we stripped away "The Horry Statistic" and evaluated guys solely on their own game and not on the achievements of the organization they played for, how do you think it would reshape the Top 20? Would anyone rise or drop? Does anyone else fall out of it completely? Keep in mind, we're certainly including the way players IMPACT their own team. We're just not adding or subtracting credit based on who they had around them.

Discuss.

[Black and White]

In other words, what OP is trying to say is: "Kobe is overrated"

[longtime lurker]

Weren't you supposed to leave the forum?

[SOD 21]

Rings matter when comparing players with similar accomplishments, resumes and legacies. It obviously doesn't apply to limited role players like Horry or Fisher.

It's a lame argument.

[Droid101]

You guaranteed you'd leave if LeBron didn't score 45. Go away.

[Akrazotile]

You guaranteed you'd leave if LeBron didn't score 45. Go away.

Link?

[Akrazotile]

Rings matter when comparing players with similar accomplishments, resumes and legacies. It obviously doesn't apply to limited role players like Horry or Fisher.

It's a lame argument.

Why?

You think Duncan > Shaq > McHale > Bosh = Hakeem > Dirk > Barkley because of rings?

[Akrazotile]

In other words, what OP is trying to say is: "Kobe is overrated"

Nah man this thread is for objective, non partisan discussion about which players get way more credit than they should relative to their real impact on the game. You brought up Kibe, not me.

[Myth]

Why?

You think Duncan > Shaq > McHale > Bosh = Hakeem > Dirk > Barkley because of rings?

To be fair, that only needs a couple tweaks.

[The Repo Man]

Link?

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

[Johnny Jones]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

Google Cache OP

[TheMarkMadsen]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

So OP..

See ya phaggit

[Akrazotile]

http://webcache.googleusercontent.co...&ct=clnk&gl=us

Interesting. Alright, fine. I will be a man of my word and submit this to the lab for authenticity, and IF it does prove to be an authentic screen cap I will be gone for good. Results typically take 4-6 weeks to get back.

[jstern]

Kobe.

The reason Kobe gets so much hate is because his fan elevate him as a god, say he's the Goat, yet gets to play with a Shaq, gets a Gasol for nothing, has mediocre Finals. And has no great moments of overcoming things like others on the top 10 list. So many other players that had more impact yet never won anything because they were on shitty teams.

And it's just so many things. Has a horrible game winning percentage, yet is considered as a clutch king. And just dozens of things like that.

So out of the top ten I would say Kobe.

Won't say top 20 because that's such a rare list.

[Black and White]

Interesting. Alright, fine. I will be a man of my word and submit this to the lab for authenticity, and IF it does prove to be an authentic screen cap I will be gone for good. Results typically take 4-6 weeks to get back.

What a bitch, everybody knows you made that thread, just leave now.