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  1. #16
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer 3ball's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin

    Thanks Stu



    Very funny.

    The idea was to allow more players to play the way Jordan was PERCEIVED to play - as a player that went 1-on-5 every play via dribble-penetration.

    But the NBA messed up.. they made it too easy to get in the lane, so now that's all players do - they drive for layups and kick for 3-pointers - but they've lost everything in between.

    Not that any of it matters - none of today's wings play like MJ because he was an off-ball player anyway.. Ironically, off-ball players actually benefit THE MOST from spacing, less physicality and enhanced ball movement, so the only question is which part of Jordan's game would go MORE bananas in today's game - his off-ball game that had the fastest isolation pace ever, or his GOAT ball-dominator game?.

    He's the only guy ever that was elite at everything - the guy could morph into Stephan Curry in the 1992 Finals if needed, or score 55 in the playoffs on all JJ Redick catch-and-shoot - whatever the defense gave him, he'd use elite ability to exploit.

  2. #17
    XXL Im Still Ballin's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    What do you think of Lebron James

  3. #18
    Local High School Star KirbyPls's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin
    What do you think of Lebron James
    Not as good as MJ, better than Kobe, legitimate shot to be top-5-6 player ever.

  4. #19
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer 3ball's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin

    What do you think of Lebron James
    He's already down to a 25 PER and he's barely 30.. He's basically a 25 PPG scorer at this point in his career..

    And even when his stats were slightly better a few years ago, his style (lebron-ball) always reduced the role and production of teammates (i.e. Bosh, Wade, Love).. With teammates not being able to maximize their production, the TEAM was prevented from maximizing its production, which was the source of the repeated underachievement Lebron's teams have become known for (2006 World Games, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2014).. In both 2009 and 2010, the Cavs were the #1 seed, and both seasons, they failed to reach the Finals (in part because Lebron-ball facilitates team-underachievement).

    Also, Lebron's teams are always stacked with the most talent in the league due to his team-hopping.. Consequently, compared to various all-time greats, the stats prove he gets to ring without having to play nearly as well as they did - for example, this year when he rings, he'll probably get to average like 22 ppg in the playoffs and/or Finals.. That's standard from here on out, nor is it a surprise - he almost never achieved a GOAT stat level in a playoff series, and the few times he did, he never won (due to lebron-ball).

  5. #20
    NBA All-star Nash's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    the lebron legacy, managed to make the league a perimeter orianted and made bigs obsolete.

    inb4 raging 3ball

  6. #21
    XXL Im Still Ballin's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    The SF position has been relatively stacked during Lebron's reign...

    Very top heavy to say the least, comparable to the center position in the 90's

    Lebron
    Durant
    Carmelo
    Pierce
    McGrady
    Joe Johnson
    Peja
    Richard Jefferson
    Rashard Lewis
    Jamal Mashburn
    Andre Igoudala
    Jeff Green
    Rudy Gay
    Parsons
    Gerald Wallace

  7. #22
    alternick = loser :D veilside23's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin
    The SF position has been relatively stacked during Lebron's reign...

    Very top heavy to say the least, comparable to the center position in the 90's

    Lebron
    Durant
    Carmelo
    Pierce
    McGrady
    Joe Johnson
    Peja
    Richard Jefferson
    Rashard Lewis
    Jamal Mashburn
    Andre Igoudala
    Jeff Green
    Rudy Gay
    Parsons
    Gerald Wallace
    mcgrady is more of a combo...

    yes i understand lebron and carmelo

    but 90's center are you kidding me?

    hakeem
    shaq
    ewing
    mourning
    drob
    divac
    rik smiths
    motombo


    i dont know if sf this decade is really top heavy... and imo mashburn peja jefferson lewis is not really considered lebron era... peak of those guys was pre lebron


    i think cousins , towns, embiid can change that really soon. we can also put AD to center as well

  8. #23
    NBA Legend and Hall of Famer 3ball's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin
    The SF position has been relatively stacked during Lebron's reign...

    Very top heavy to say the least, comparable to the center position in the 90's

    Lebron
    Durant
    Carmelo
    Pierce
    McGrady
    Joe Johnson
    Peja
    Richard Jefferson
    Rashard Lewis
    Jamal Mashburn
    Andre Igoudala
    Jeff Green
    Rudy Gay
    Parsons
    Gerald Wallace
    2000-2014 SF's [COLOR="White"].............[/COLOR]1984-1998 SF's

    Lebron.............................. Larry Bird
    Durant.............................. Dominique
    Carmelo............................ Adrian Dantley
    Pierce............................... James Worthy
    Paul George....................... Grant Hill
    Kawhi Leonard.................... Scottie Pippen
    Rashard Lewis.................... Glen Rice
    Peja................................. Chris Mullin
    Richard Jefferson................ Dr. J
    McGrady............................ Bernard King
    Ron Artest......................... Dennis Rodman
    Andre Igoudala................... Sean Elliot
    Jeff Green......................... Sharif Abdur Rahim
    Rudy Gay.......................... Alex English
    Parsons............................. Detlef Schrempf
    Gerald Wallace................... Reggie Lewis
    Shawn Marion.....................Richard Dumas
    Luol Deng.......................... Glenn Robinson
    Caron Butler...................... Mark Aguirre
    [COLOR="White"].......................................[/COLOR] Tom Gugliotta
    [COLOR="White"].......................................[/COLOR] Jamal Mashburn


    So it wasn't just the PF's and Centers that were deeper - ALL frontcourt positions had far greater depth of talent in previous eras, including SF's...

    Btw, the SF class from 1984-1998 looks night-and-day better than the SF's from today - the difference in quality couldn't look more obvious.

    And in the backcourt, the SG's of previous eras were deeper too... The only position where today has any advantage is PG.
    .
    Last edited by 3ball; 04-02-2015 at 03:01 AM.

  9. #24
    The Future Goat TripleA's Avatar
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    Talking Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by 3ball
    Your SF List [COLOR="White"]....................[/COLOR]1984-1998 SF List

    Lebron............................. Larry Bird
    Durant............................. Dominique
    Carmelo........................... Grant Hill
    Pierce.............................. Bernard King
    McGrady........................... Dr. J
    Joe Johnson...................... Glen Rice
    Peja................................ Chris Mullin
    Richard Jefferson............... James Worthy
    Rashard Lewis................... Adrian Dantley
    Jamal Mashburn................ Glenn Robinson
    Andre Igoudala................. Scottie Pippen
    Jeff Green........................ Sharif Abdur Rahim
    Rudy Gay......................... Alex English
    Parsons........................... Detlef Schrempf
    Gerald Wallace................. Dennis Rodman
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR] Mark Aguirre
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR] Sean Elliot
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR] Richard Dumas
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR] Reggie Lewis
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR] Tom Gugliotta
    [COLOR="White"].....................................[/COLOR]


    So it wasn't just the PF's and Centers that were deeper - ALL frontcourt positions had far greater depth of talent in previous eras, including SF's...

    Btw, the SF class from 1984-1998 looks night-and-day better than the SF's from today - the difference in quality couldn't look more obvious.

    And in the backcourt, the SG's of previous eras were deeper too... The only position where today has any advantage is PG.
    .
    Alright how but this list 2004 - 2015

    Lebron james
    Kevin durant
    Carmelo anthony
    Paul pierce
    t-mac
    Shawn marion
    andrei kirlenko
    Peja
    Luol deng
    iggy
    rashard lewis
    ron artest
    paul george
    gerald wallace
    stephen jackson
    caron butler
    josh howard

    I think this list is pretty equal in depth and star power

  10. #25
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Why are we talking about SFs? I don't care to look up why.

    Centers in today's league don't win as the number one offensive option on their team. Defenses are smart enough to double, recover, cut passing lanes, and make adjustments for a low post big man to single-handedly beat a playoff team. There's a reason Demarcus Cousins of the Sacramento Kings and Brook Lopez of the Brooklyn Nets struggle to make it out the lottery without major help from the perimeter. It's too easy in today's league to counteract the positive effect big men have for their respective team. The three pointer is so important and apparent that team's need shooters more than they need a low post threat. We're in the era of perimeter play, that's what wins in today's league.

  11. #26
    Local High School Star
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    BS! The league has HAD to become perimeter oriented because dominant centers are NOT being developed. Cousins and Lopez are not in the same league as the centers from 20 years ago!

    And what a discovery, again the NBA is a team game not one on one. Put Shaq, Kareem or Hakeem on bad teams and their going to struggle in 60's, 70's, 80's or any other decade no matter what the league focus is.

    In the same token, look at what an offensively limited center like Dwight Howard did a couple of years ago in getting to the Finals just surrounded with a bunch of shooters. Can you imagine if you put a prime Shaq or Hakeem with that team in the pathetic East? probably 70+ wins and sweeping their way to the title.

  12. #27
    Local High School Star
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Please TripleA!

    3ball's SF list included 12 hall of famers, how many in your list?

  13. #28
    jordan > leflop james Paul George 24's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Fawker
    No more great bigs.
    because big man lack skills

  14. #29
    jordan > leflop james Paul George 24's Avatar
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    Default Re: A dominating center is long gone in todays sceme. It's a peremeter era.

    Quote Originally Posted by Im Still Ballin
    What do you think of Lebron James
    weak era

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