How underrated is Kevin Johnson?

[And1AllDay]

- Uh...do you know how many all time greats never averaged 25ppg? He's a point guard. He was getting you 20+ points and 10+ assits in his prime on very good shooting percentages. That's about as good as it gets at that position.

- He averaged 20/10/3/2 on 50% between '89 and 97'. I just posted his peak seasons. Most players are at their peak for a short period of time.

- Again, how many great players are ringless? Do you think I'm arguing him as a top 10-20 player or something?

- Right where he should be? You mean never mentioned? I disagree. I think he's deserving of some recognition for playing as well as he did in a tough era.

He is normally in the top 100 lists, I usually see him around 75-85 ish? Isn't that right about where he should be...? Where would you rank him? It's not like people say he is trash, he was a good player.

[warriorfan]

Kevin Johnson 12 year career stats of 18/9/3/1.5 on 58% TS

Peeked at age 24 with 22 pts / 10 ast / 3.5 rebounds / 2 steals on 51% FG, 60% TS

John Wall at age 24 - 17.6 pts / 10 ast / 4.6 rebounds / 1.7 steals on 45% FG, 52% TS

Chris Paul at age 24 - 19.7 pts / 10.7 ast / 4.2 rebounds / 2 steals on 49% FG, 60% TS

Chris Paul 10 year career stats 18.7/ 10 ast / 4.4 rebounds / 2.3 steals



Kevin Johnson was a borderline superstar. He was closer to Chris Paul than he was John Wall.

[JtotheIzzo]

KJ was a good little man, but he is extremely overrated for a few things. Mostly that the WC in the 90s was extremely high scoring and devoid of defense so the PG numbers are all inflated from that era (look at Mark Jackson in Denver, compared with the rest of his career). Also, people remember that dunk KJ had over Hakeem and the fact that the Suns went to the Finals.

Not spectacular for that era.

[ClipperRevival]

KJ was one of the most explosive athletes ever at the PG position. Not quite Rose/Westbrook but not far behind. One of the quickest first steps ever and could get to the rack at will at his peak. His career was a classic example of his play droping off considerably once he lost a step but if he was putting up 22/12 in the more physical and hand check era, he would've done better in today's era. If we are talking peak, I would take a handful of guys over him before I go with him. He's ranked right around guys like T. Hardaway or M. Price peak wise.

[bizil]

KJ was one of the most explosive athletes ever at the PG position. Not quite Rose/Westbrook but not far behind. One of the quickest first steps ever and could get to the rack at will at his peak. His career was a classic example of his play droping off considerably once he lost a step but if he was putting up 22/12 in the more physical and hand check era, he would've done better in today's era. If we are talking peak, I would take a handful of guys over him before I go with him. He's ranked right around guys like T. Hardaway or M. Price peak wise.

I agree! At that time, I can't recall a MORE EXPLOSIVE PG at that size. His dunk on a PEAK OLAJUWON says it all. Anytime time u are dropping 20 points and 10 dimes for 3-4 seasons in a row, u are a BEAST!

At the same time, KJ isn't underrated. He wasn't great for a long enough period of time to be ranked on the same level as Magic, Isiah, Stockton, or Payton. GOAT wise, all four of those guys are in the top 10. So for those who think KJ deserves to be ranked that high GOAT wise, they are sadly mistaken. But peak wise, he was a HOF kind of talent.

If people are looking for underrated PG's in the last 15-20 years, they need to look at guys like Rod Strickland, Terry Porter, Sam Cassell, and Andre Miller. Guess how many All Star games those guys have between them? ONLY THREE! When in reality, all three of those guys were good enough to have THREE ALL STAR APPEARANCES EACH!! But some guys just fall through the cracks for various reasons when it comes to accolades. I don't consider KJ one of those guys. He gets his just due historically.

Typically, its the casual fans or fans who aren't true students of the game that make guys underrated. THE THING IS many of those people are actually in the media covering sports. But basketball isn't their favorite sport. Or a sport that they know at a high student of the game level.

[ClipperRevival]

I agree! At that time, I can't recall a MORE EXPLOSIVE PG at that size. His dunk on a PEAK OLAJUWON says it all. Anytime time u are dropping 20 points and 10 dimes for 3-4 seasons in a row, u are a BEAST!

At the same time, KJ isn't underrated. He wasn't great for a long enough period of time to be ranked on the same level as Magic, Isiah, Stockton, or Payton. GOAT wise, all four of those guys are in the top 10. So for those who think KJ deserves to be ranked that high GOAT wise, they are sadly mistaken. But peak wise, he was a HOF kind of talent.

If people are looking for underrated PG's in the last 15-20 years, they need to look at guys like Rod Strickland, Terry Porter, Sam Cassell, and Andre Miller. Guess how many All Star games those guys have between them? ONLY THREE! When in reality, all three of those guys were good enough to have THREE ALL STAR APPEARANCES EACH!! But some guys just fall through the cracks for various reasons when it comes to accolades. I don't consider KJ one of those guys. He gets his just due historically.

Typically, its the casual fans or fans who aren't true students of the game that make guys underrated. THE THING IS many of those people are actually in the media covering sports. But basketball isn't their favorite sport. Or a sport that they know at a high student of the game level.

Yeah, KJ ranks higher peak wise than career wise because his peak and/or great years were short. That's why i specifically said he was the classic example of a guy's play dropping off considerably once he lost a step. That tells me he relied heavily on his first step and quickness (which he did) to succeed. And that's no shame because most guys under 6'1" need quickness to succeed. And once they lose a step, their play can fall off considerably. Most small guy's plays drop off considerably once they turn 30, especially for guys who relied on athleticism.

[bizil]

Yeah, KJ ranks higher peak wise than career wise because his peak and/or great years were short. That's why i specifically said he was the classic example of a guy's play dropping off considerably once he lost a step. That tells me he relied heavily on his first step and quickness (which he did) to succeed. And that's no shame because most guys under 6'1" need quickness to succeed. And once they lose a step, their play can fall off considerably. Most small guy's plays drop off considerably once they turn 30, especially for guys who relied on athleticism.

Well said! Even in Isiah's case, he retired at 32 or 33 years old because of the wear and tear. Then u look at Stockton who was still an All Star caliber PG into his late 30's. And played until age 40. Stockton never relied on speed as his main weapon. EVEN THOUGH he was quicker than people realized. Stockton was a master of pace.

[ClipperRevival]

Well said! Even in Isiah's case, he retired at 32 or 33 years old because of the wear and tear. Then u look at Stockton who was still an All Star caliber PG into his late 30's. And played until age 40. Stockton never relied on speed as his main weapon. EVEN THOUGH he was quicker than people realized. Stockton was a master of pace.

It's unreal how most athletes lose a step in the 30-32 range. It's always been that way. Why that age range? Who knows.

[Mrofir]

He's underrated per simple fact of not being in the hof yet. He belongs there.

[SHAQisGOAT]

Also a couple of people here who did not see him play keep comparing him athletically to AI, Rose and Westbrook which I think is absurd.

I've definitely seen him play and, imo, he's on that level athletically, before all the serious injuries... Not even saying he was as good, many times it's hard to exaclty judge, but to me, he's definitely on that level overall.

[bizil]

He's underrated per simple fact of not being in the hof yet. He belongs there.

In my opinion, KJ's career ISN'T a must for the HOF. At his peak, he was a HOF caliber PG FOR SURE. But an HOF is built around GOAT status. So I don't think KJ quite measures up. Which is a shame because he was on his way. BUT with the way the HOF has become somewhat watered down, he could get in one day...

[Lensanity]

Top 5 most underrated in NBA history. Prime KJ was one of the best PG's ever. Nobody even talks about him anymore.

[bizil]

When it comes to comparing KJ to guys like Westbrook and Rose, we gotta keep in mind that those guys have 2-3 inches on KJ. And are around the 190-200 pound mark. So they are gonna be more powerful finishing at the rack. BUT in KJ's era, he was THE GOLD STANDARD for a freak athletic PG.

And for guards 6'1 and under, KJ doesn't take a backseat to ANY great PG in terms of athletic ability. Among the elite small guards 6'1 and under, KJ, Iverson, and even Isiah were the most athletic in my opinion. For guys who are or were average to good NBA players u of course got the guys like Nate and Spud.

[TheCorporation]

Basketball reference had him in the top 100 (#99)
HoopDoctor did a top 20 PG and he was ranked #18

From their site "Currently the mayor of Sacramento, California,

[bizil]

[QUOTE=TheCorporation]Basketball reference had him in the top 100 (#99)
HoopDoctor did a top 20 PG and he was ranked #18

From their site "Currently the mayor of Sacramento, California,