Who would have been an equivalent backcourt sidekick to Pippen in the 90s

[iamgine]

I'd say prime Pippen's impact is like 97-98 David Robinson. Fresh off his injury, Robinson was not as good as before but still an all star, all NBA, All D, getting DPOY and MVP votes.

[AussieSteve]

Here are some epic playoff performances by Barkley that were not enough to get a win against the Bulls because Jordan's team mates outperformed Barkley's.


1990 ECSF

Game 1
Barkley: 30pts on 21 fga, 20reb (9orb), 4ast, 2stl, 2blk, 3tov

Jordan: 39 points on 30fga. Rest of Bulls: 25/58 = 43fg%. Rest of 76ers: 20 / 58 = 34fg%

This game is just open brick after open brick by Barkley's team mates, after he draws the double.


1991 ECSF

Game 1
34pts on 13 fga, 11reb (5orb), 2ast, 1stl, 0blk, 0tov

Jordan: 29 points on 15fga. Rest of Bulls: 32 / 59 = 54%fg. Rest of 76ers: 18 / 62 = 29%fg

This game was arguably Barkley's all time best playoff performance through 3 quarters, but the rest of his team were so bad that they were down by 20 at that stage, so he sat out the entire 4th.


Game 5
Barkley: 30pts on 20fga, 8reb (1orb), 7ast, 2stl, 1blk, 1tov

Jordan: 38 points on 31fga. Rest of Bulls: 27/54 = 50fg%. Rest of 76ers: 24 / 56 = 43fg%


1993 finals

Game 2
Barkley: 42pts on 26 fga, 13reb (6orb), 4ast, 1stl, 1blk, 2tov

Jordan: 42 points on 36fga. Rest of Bulls: 27/53 = 51fg%. Rest of 76ers: 27 / 62 = 44fg%


Game 4
Barkley: 32pts on 19 fga, 12reb (3orb), 10ast, 3stl, 1blk, 1tov

Jordan: 55 points on 37fga. Rest of Bulls: 23/46 = 50fg%. Rest of 76ers: 28 / 60 = 47fg%


I know that Jordan was great in all of these games too. But in all of these 5 bulls wins, Jordan got more help than Barkley, and that was ultimately the difference. Give Barkley a guard of Pippen's calibre, who can find the open man more often, or hit the open shot more regularly than Hawkins or 93 KJ (who was pretty trash), and he probably wins at least 3 or 4 out of these 5 games, if not all of them... And probably has multiple rings between 1990 and 1993.

[brooks_thompson]

I would've loved to see Stockton and Jordan play together. I'm pretty sure Jordan would've loved Stockton; he have called him Stock all the time and wouldve pressured him to go out gambling with him and Oak.

[AussieSteve]

Pippen sucks and Jordan had no help. Here's some irrelevant and off topic stats to not convince anyone.

@3ball.

Conceding defeat?

If the other superstars had more help than Jordan, why did the Bulls keep beating Barkley even when he was the dominant player on the court?

[3ball]

@3ball.

Conceding defeat?

If the other superstars had more help than Jordan, why did the Bulls keep beating Barkley even when he was the dominant player on the court?

I quit because I won the thread about 3 times already.

MJ had a worse cast than Barkley in 90' and 93', so he had to average 45 and 41 in those series.. In 1991, Barkley's Sixers had begun their decline (inspired by jordan's 1-man butt-whuppin in 90') and pippen took another step, so Barkley's cast was worse

[NBAGOAT]

Sounds like Stockton, Malone unfortunately wasn

[TheCorporation]

Who? No one

[3ball]

.
KJ won 53-55 games with the Suns from 89-92', which includes making the 89' WCF and demolishing Magic's favored Lakers to make the 90' WCF..

indeed, Barkley was added to a 55-win team

[COLOR="DarkGreen"]KJ could carry teams better because he led Pippen in usage (finishing plays) and assist percentage (finding the finisher).. Here's their other stats:[/COLOR]

RS

[COLOR="DarkRed"]KJ[/COLOR]:[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 17.9.. 3.3.. 9.1.. 58.5 ts.. 118 ortg.. 20.7 PER.. 0.178 ws/48
[COLOR="Navy"]Pip[/COLOR]:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 16.2.. 6.4.. 5.2.. 53.6 ts.. 108 ortg.. 18.6 PER.. 0.146 ws/48


PO

[COLOR="DarkRed"]KJ[/COLOR]:[COLOR="White"]..[/COLOR] 19.3.. 3.3.. 8.9.. 55.7 ts.. 113 ortg.. 19.1 PER.. 0.117 ws/48
[COLOR="Navy"]Pip[/COLOR]:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 17.5.. 7.6.. 5.0.. 52.4 ts.. 108 ortg.. 18.4 PER.. 0.140 ws/48

Similarly, Jordan carried Pippen by finishing more plays (usage) and finding the finishers (assist %):

91-93' Playoffs

MJ:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 34 on 52%.. 6.6 apg.. 2.9 TO.. 31.1 ast%.. 36.1 usg.. 120 ortg.. 29.5 PER
Pip:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 20 on 47%.. 6.1 apg.. 3.4 TO.. 23.3 ast%.. 24.9 usg.. 109 ortg..19.6 PER


96-98' Playoffs

MJ:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 31.4 on 45.9%.. 4.1 apg.. 2.3 TO.. 22.3 ast%.. 35.1 usg.. 118 ortg.. 27.3 PER
Pip:[COLOR="White"].[/COLOR] 17.6 on 40.8%.. 5.0 apg.. 2.7 TO.. 22.0 ast%.. 23.4 usg.. 109 ortg.. 19.0 PER

Goat scoring load, team-leading passer, goat defender at position, goat clutch = GOAT (easily)
.

[paksat]

I can't believe you people give pippen so much credit

the guy didn't jump up to 30ppg when mj left, that should tell you something

the guy also didn't win a championship in mj's absence

so many of you prop him up to be a top tier player, he should have proved it then

[And1AllDay]

I can't believe you people give pippen so much credit

the guy didn't jump up to 30ppg when mj left, that should tell you something

the guy also didn't win a championship in mj's absence

so many of you prop him up to be a top tier player, he should have proved it then

93 Bulls = 57 wins (Jordan)
94 Bulls = 55 wins (No Jordan)

[Vino24]

I can't believe you people give pippen so much credit

the guy didn't jump up to 30ppg when mj left, that should tell you something

the guy also didn't win a championship in mj's absence

so many of you prop him up to be a top tier player, he should have proved it then

first MJ retirement they only dropped 2 games. MJ in his prime is only worth a 2 game impact.

[paksat]

93 Bulls = 57 wins (Jordan)
94 Bulls = 55 wins (No Jordan)

so you highlight what I said ( has NOTHING to do with wins total ), and then you..

..highlight wins total

[paksat]

first MJ retirement they only dropped 2 games. MJ in his prime is only worth a 2 game impact.

you're not even worth my time with caveman thinking like this

something like 80% of the human species says MJ is the greatest, go argue with someone stupid enough to engage you

[NBAGOAT]

I can't believe you people give pippen so much credit

the guy didn't jump up to 30ppg when mj left, that should tell you something

the guy also didn't win a championship in mj's absence

so many of you prop him up to be a top tier player, he should have proved it then

Op is not throwing out guys like Hakeem and Barkley and Malone as replacements. He

[paksat]

[QUOTE=NBAGOAT]Op is not throwing out guys like Hakeem and Barkley and Malone as replacements. He