Prime Tim Duncan vs. Prime Hakeem Olajuwon

[Big#50]

That's true. But...

98-99 - Spurs over Lakers 4-0. Spurs Champion. David was defending Shaq more than half the time.
99-00 - Spurs lost first round.
00-01 - Lakers over Spurs 4-0
01-02 - Lakers over Spurs 4-1
02-03 - Spurs over Lakers 4-2. Spurs Champion. David and Rose was defending Shaq more than half the time. David retires.
03-04 - Lakers over Spurs 4-2
04-05 - Spurs Champion. Shaq was with Miami.

On 98-99 Spurs, David was at age 33 and already past his prime, was defending Shaq more than half the time. Did Duncan guard Shaq? Of course he did, but it was David's job. Two times the Spurs won was David defending Shaq and the third time they won, Shaq was with Miami. To say Duncan won against prime Shaq is very misleading. Yes he did got his titles against the era of prime Shaq, but in what ways?
The difference with Hakeem was, he had to face Ewing, David, and Shaq and it was his job to defending them.
That's why most people will say Prime Hakeem is better than Prime Duncan.

Hate Is Strong In This One. Duncan is the only player who guarded Shaq one on one with some success. Shaq knows this and so should you. Yes, DROB guarded Shaq but Duncan did a good job on Shaq when he did guard him.

[Kellogs4toniee]

Yup. It's such a fallacy when people compare the big men of TD's era to Hakeem's era and conclude that Duncan had no competition.

I mean what's the probablility that so many of the greatest centers in NBA history all happened to be concentrated during Hakeem's generation? Doesn't it seem far more likely that the NBA's rules at the time had a little more to do with it? It's just common sense. Do you really think a guy like Patrick Ewing (no offense to Ewing, he was a great player) would be putting up 28.6 ppg and 4.0 blks in today's league? He'd be completely owning the league for god's sakes. Shit, guys like Rony Seikaly and Kevin Willis were pulling down 34 rebounds some nights during that era. The point is, you can't compare statistics between eras and make conclusions.

It's fine say that Hakeem played in an era with better big men, but by the same token you have to at least acknowledge that big men had inflated stats during Hakeem's era. The discrepancy isn't nearly as great as the numbers would have you believe.

I'm not talking about the stats. I'm talking about the competition Olajuwon had. Duncan's best rival was Shaq, and a few times, most noticeably when they beat the Lakers that year to win there second championship, Horry was the one who actually guarded Duncan.

It was always a big deal to look forward to watch Orlando vs. the Rockets, Knicks vs. the Rockets, Spurs vs. the Rockets. HoF centers vs. HoF centers.

Because of that I think Hakeem was better. Hakeem is arguably the most skillful center ever.

[Big#50]

I'm not talking about the stats. I'm talking about the competition Olajuwon had. Duncan's best rival was Shaq, and a few times, most noticeably when they beat the Lakers that year to win there second championship, Horry was the one who actually guarded Duncan.

It was always a big deal to look forward to watch Orlando vs. the Rockets, Knicks vs. the Rockets, Spurs vs. the Rockets. HoF centers vs. HoF centers.

Because of that I think Hakeem was better. Hakeem is arguably the most skillful center ever.

Shaq tried guarding Duncan in the 2003 series. Tried.

[Amare4lyfe]

Hate Is Strong In This One. Duncan is the only player who guarded Shaq one on one with some success. Shaq knows this and so should you. Yes, DROB guarded Shaq but Duncan did a good job on Shaq when he did guard him.

Retarded response. David and Rose was guarding Shaq mostly and Duncan was the help defender. Duncan can never guard Shaq one on one, no one can. Stop glorified Duncan. The truth is Pop would never use Duncan to guard Shaq unless they have no choice. Shaq knows Duncan can guard him well??? Since when he said that? Stop assuming because you have no idea what you are talking about.

[Big#50]

Retarded response. David and Rose was guarding Shaq mostly and Duncan was the help defender. Duncan can never guard Shaq one on one, no one can. Stop glorified Duncan. The truth is Pop would never use Duncan to guard Shaq unless they have no choice. Shaq knows Duncan can guard him well??? Since when he said that? Stop assuming because you have no idea what you are talking about.

Watch the games. You're a ****ing idiot. I said he guards him well when he does. Even in Shaq's prime.

[RonySeikalyFTL]

I'm not talking about the stats. I'm talking about the competition Olajuwon had. Duncan's best rival was Shaq, and a few times, most noticeably when they beat the Lakers that year to win there second championship, Horry was the one who actually guarded Duncan.

It was always a big deal to look forward to watch Orlando vs. the Rockets, Knicks vs. the Rockets, Spurs vs. the Rockets. HoF centers vs. HoF centers.

Because of that I think Hakeem was better. Hakeem is arguably the most skillful center ever.

Thing is, would it have been such a big deal if instead of those guys averaging 26, 27, 28 ppg they were putting up 21,22 ppg? Look, it's not a coincidence that Dirk Nowitski has been the only big man to consistently average more than 23 ppg over the past several years. The game has changed, and teams aren't just dumping the ball into their big men and letting them work anymore. You can argue that they aren't doing that because the big men today aren't as good as they were in Hakeem's day, but wouldn't you expect there to be at least one prolific 7 foot scorer today? Teams adapt their offenses to the rules, and that's reflected in the statistics.

[Amare4lyfe]

Watch the games. You're a ****ing idiot. I said he guards him well when he does. Even in Shaq's prime.

I did watch the games, you ****ing retard. The point is Coach Pop would never had Duncan guard Shaq 1 on 1 unless he has to. Even when at times he did guard Shaq, it was only at short moments and there were weakside help til David and Rose comes in. Shaq still punished Duncan if the help came too late.

Duncan is the only player who guarded Shaq one on one with some success. Shaq knows this

Plus since when did Shaq ever said Duncan guarded him well??? It's your words, not his.

[redhonda76]

Retarded response. David and Rose was guarding Shaq mostly and Duncan was the help defender. Duncan can never guard Shaq one on one, no one can. Stop glorified Duncan. The truth is Pop would never use Duncan to guard Shaq unless they have no choice. Shaq knows Duncan can guard him well??? Since when he said that? Stop assuming because you have no idea what you are talking about.

Great response. That was exactly what I was going to say but you beat me to it.

[craiye]

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

None of the players from the 90s have had their legacy inflate after retiring quite like Hakeem. It's amazing what a few year away from the game and one dominant series over Robinson did for people's perception of his career.

I'm not saying Hakeem wasn't great. Just pointing out that he wasn't considered to be easily the best center of the 90s while playing. That "consensus" came after he hung 'em up.

[ThaRegul8r]

98-99 - Spurs over Lakers 4-0. Spurs Champion. David was defending Shaq more than half the time.
99-00 - Spurs lost first round.
00-01 - Lakers over Spurs 4-0
01-02 - Lakers over Spurs 4-1
02-03 - Spurs over Lakers 4-2. Spurs Champion. David and Rose was defending Shaq more than half the time. David retires.
03-04 - Lakers over Spurs 4-2
04-05 - Spurs Champion. Shaq was with Miami.

Duncan was injured and never played a second in the 2000 playoffs.

[Big#50]

I've said it before and I'll say it again:

None of the players from the 90s have had their legacy inflate after retiring quite like Hakeem. It's amazing what a few year away from the game and one dominant series over Robinson did for people's perception of his career.

I'm not saying Hakeem wasn't great. Just pointing out that he wasn't considered to be easily the best center of the 90s while playing. That "consensus" came after he hung 'em up.

That series needs to be watched by everybody that rides his ****. People go by 2 highlight moves.

[DCL]

Retarded response. David and Rose was guarding Shaq mostly and Duncan was the help defender. Duncan can never guard Shaq one on one, no one can. Stop glorified Duncan. The truth is Pop would never use Duncan to guard Shaq unless they have no choice. Shaq knows Duncan can guard him well??? Since when he said that? Stop assuming because you have no idea what you are talking about.

+1

[ShaqAttack3234]

I mean what's the probablility that so many of the greatest centers in NBA history all happened to be concentrated during Hakeem's generation? Doesn't it seem far more likely that the NBA's rules at the time had a little more to do with it? It's just common sense. Do you really think a guy like Patrick Ewing (no offense to Ewing, he was a great player) would be putting up 28.6 ppg and 4.0 blks in today's league? He'd be completely owning the league for god's sakes. Shit, guys like Rony Seikaly and Kevin Willis were pulling down 34 rebounds some nights during that era. The point is, you can't compare statistics between eras and make conclusions.

Go back and watch some footage of Ewing in 1990(pre-knee injury). He was very skiled, but also very athletic and one of the longest centers you'll ever see. His wingspan was freakish.

Dwight Howard was averaging something like 23/15/4 through his first 21 games of 2008-2009 before injuries slowed him a bit and lowered his minutes. Why couldn't Ewing put up similar numbers?

Tim Duncan just had two 26+ rebound games less than a month apart and he's passed his prime so I don't see your point about Willis and Seikaly each having 1 big night of 34 boards.

[Big#50]

Go back and watch some footage of Ewing in 1990(pre-knee injury). He was very skiled, but also very athletic and one of the longest centers you'll ever see. His wingspan was freakish.

Dwight Howard was averaging something like 23/15/4 through his first 21 games of 2008-2009 before injuries slowed him a bit and lowered his minutes. Why couldn't Ewing put up similar numbers?

Tim Duncan just had two 26+ rebound games less than a month apart and he's passed his prime so I don't see your point about Willis and Seikaly each having 1 big night of 34 boards.

Tim Duncan also went 10 for 38 or something ugly like that. That fool is a bum. The NBA now>NBA of before.

[Duncan21formvp]

Who was the better player?

Duncan