Kobe Bryant vs. John Havlicek

[Doctor K]

Who deserves to be higher all-time????


Kobe Bryant:

12 Time All-Star
12 All-NBA Selections
5 NBA Championships
2 Final MVPs

Peak Statline:

30.0ppg-6.9rpg-5.9apg
All-Defensive 1st


John Havlicek:

13 Time All-Star
11 All-NBA Selections
8 NBA Championships
2 Final MVPs*

Peak Statline:

28.9ppg-9.0rpg-7.5apg
All-Defensive 1st







Who do you have? Both pretty close. They had even statistics at their peaks, even amount of All-Stars and All-NBA selections. Kobe has 5 titles and 2 as the best player. Havlicek has 8 titles, and at least 3 of them he was considered the best player in. He would've had 2 Final MVPs too it appears had they kept the award back then. He did get it for his 74 performance, and would've also had it for his 68 performance.



All in all, close....I'll take Havlicek, more titles and more as the best player on his team!!! Also, at this point Havlicek has a big longevity edge too.

[Jacks3]

Good comparison,but Kobe's peak is generally considered to be his 05-06 yr.

[Doctor K]

Good comparison,but Kobe's peak is generally considered to be his 05-06 yr.

Well maybe yes. But I just chose that year because it was more All-Around, to match Havlicek's even more All-Around year. It would be harder to compare the 06 season because it was less All-Around.

[griffmoney2084]

cheer picker lol

il play this game even though havlicek isnt on anyones top 10 list anywhere any time


Havlicek - 4 1st team all nba's
Kobe - 8 1st team all nba's

that right there means kobe is double havlicek in peak play

Havlicek - 0 mvps
Kobe - 1 mvp

the amount of mvps doesnt matter, but try being top 10 without one

Havlicek - 5 1st team defense's
Kobe - 8 1st team defense's

3 more and will probably add to that


again...............................need i remind people kobes only 31 and his storey isnt even finished yet he blows most legends out of the water with his career achivements lol


Havlicek - 1 finals mvp
Kobe - 2 finals mvps

noticed the OP got that wrong too, he has an asterisk, guess its his way of telling us its a lie


Havlicek - 20ppg
Kobe - 25ppg

you have to atleast average 25ppg to be considered a legendary go to guy



Havlicek - 43%fg's
Kobe - 45% fg's

JESUS he cant even beat kobe in a useless non true shooting statistic, which is the basis of 100% of kobe bashing threads






oh yeah and ( cough ) BILL.............RUSSELL ? anyone? anyone lol comon



put kobe with bill and he doesnt stop at 11

[Doctor K]

cheer picker lol

il play this game even though havlicek isnt on anyones top 10 list anywhere any time


Havlicek - 4 1st team all nba's
Kobe - 8 1st team all nba's

that right there means kobe is double havlicek in peak play

Havlicek - 0 mvps
Kobe - 1 mvp

the amount of mvps doesnt matter, but try being top 10 without one

Havlicek - 5 1st team defense's
Kobe - 8 1st team defense's

3 more and will probably add to that


again...............................need i remind people kobes only 31 and his storey isnt even finished yet he blows most legends out of the water with his career achivements lol


Havlicek - 1 finals mvp
Kobe - 2 finals mvps

noticed the OP got that wrong too, he has an asterisk, guess its his way of telling us its a lie


Havlicek - 20ppg
Kobe - 25ppg

you have to atleast average 25ppg to be considered a legendary go to guy



Havlicek - 43%fg's
Kobe - 45% fg's

JESUS he cant even beat kobe in a useless non true shooting statistic, which is the basis of 100% of kobe bashing threads






oh yeah and ( cough ) BILL.............RUSSELL ? anyone? anyone lol comon



put kobe with bill and he doesnt stop at 11

So because the Finals MVP Award wasn't around all of Havlicek's career and was around Kobe's career, we should say Kobe give Kobe more credit for his Finals MVPs? So I guess Kobe since has more Finals MVPs than Russell ,that's an argument of Kobe > Russell.

The fact is, Havlicek clearly would've got it in 68. Check the stats yourself. His Game 6 clinching performance was a 40/10/7.


FG% were generally lower in the 60s. So weak argument.



Lastly, Havlicek won with and without Russell. He won 6 with Russell, and 2 more without him. Sound familiar to Kobe and Shaq? But at the end of the day, he has 8 titles, with 3 as best player. And Kobe has 5 with 2 as best player. Forget the Final MVPs. 3 > 2.


Sure Kobe is 31 and will pass him someday. But right now, Havlicek's longevity is far mroe than Kobe's, and he has higher career totals.

[ImmortalD24]

cheer picker lol

il play this game even though havlicek isnt on anyones top 10 list anywhere any time


Havlicek - 4 1st team all nba's
Kobe - 8 1st team all nba's

that right there means kobe is double havlicek in peak play

Havlicek - 0 mvps
Kobe - 1 mvp

the amount of mvps doesnt matter, but try being top 10 without one

Havlicek - 5 1st team defense's
Kobe - 8 1st team defense's

3 more and will probably add to that


again...............................need i remind people kobes only 31 and his storey isnt even finished yet he blows most legends out of the water with his career achivements lol


Havlicek - 1 finals mvp
Kobe - 2 finals mvps

noticed the OP got that wrong too, he has an asterisk, guess its his way of telling us its a lie


Havlicek - 20ppg
Kobe - 25ppg

you have to atleast average 25ppg to be considered a legendary go to guy



Havlicek - 43%fg's
Kobe - 45% fg's

JESUS he cant even beat kobe in a useless non true shooting statistic, which is the basis of 100% of kobe bashing threads






oh yeah and ( cough ) BILL.............RUSSELL ? anyone? anyone lol comon



put kobe with bill and he doesnt stop at 11

pwnd. /thread

[ProfessorMurder]

And Kobe has 5 with 2 as best player.

He wasn't the best player this time either. I'd say he was the best on his team once.

[TryToBeUnbias]

put kobe with bill and he doesnt stop at 11

[JtotheIzzo]

wow, when I read the thread title, I thought:

"Another Kobe hater thread, this is a diss to Kobe."

But actually, Hondo did some shit and it is a lot closer than people realize. If Hondo didn't play in the lost era (70s) we might remember him more fondly.

My question is, if ISH was around then, would there be endless "Where does Hondo rank all time?" "Is Hondo in your top five" etc...threads?

Having a lot of athletes (read: blacks) plying their trade in the ABA at the time does take a bit of luster off Havlicek's diamond and thus:

Kobe > Hondo.

[StacksOnDeck]

Griff shut the thread down. mods, delete.

[Kblaze8855]

Hondo is the disregarded guy who really has the legacy of an all time great but nobody cares about. Boston fans voted him the best celtic of all time in the 70s...over russell. He put up straight superstar numbersi n the playoffs from the mid 60s to the mid 70s. He wasnt on some roleplayer shit most of the time. For the last 3 title runs with Russell around he put up 24/9/4, 26/9/8, and 25/10/6.

He could realistically be like a 15 time all star. He was putting up 20/5 in his second season and wasnt an all star...but he made it putting up 19/6 years later. If they had the loose definition of assists we use back then he might well have been a 29/11/9 player.

He had rings as a high scoring 6th man, rings as his teams leading scorer(though not best player), and rings when Russell was gone. He just has the bad(well...depending on how you look at it) luck of being teamed with someone to overshadow him all the time.

He won it all in college...on a team with Jerry Lucas. Guy forgotten today but he was considered one of the best players in the world for some time. Top 50 all time. All that. And a bigman...bigmen get the credit.

He then went to the NBA to be outshined by Russell.

Russell left and they draft Cowens. Another bigman to get the love. Didnt hurt that cowens was a legit superstar....plus loved because of his style of play.

John was born to be the winner in the background.

Id say he should have stuck with football where he could have gotten attention relative to his accomplishments.....but he was drafted to Cleveland. Where he of course would have been outshined by...Jim Brown.

Yes...John Havlicek was drafted by the NFL.

[ImmortalD24]

Hondo is the disregarded guy who really has the legacy of an all time great but nobody cares about. Boston fans voted him the best celtic of all time in the 70s...over russell.

Interesting. I'm sure most in Boston would pick Bird over Russell today as well. How much of that do you think has to do with Boston's not so subtle racism? or is it more recent-ism (ala the new goat theory)?

[RazorBaLade]

He wasn't the best player this time either. I'd say he was the best on his team once.

How are u getting on the internet from a padded room?

[MAC system]

Hondo is the disregarded guy who really has the legacy of an all time great but nobody cares about. Boston fans voted him the best celtic of all time in the 70s...over russell. He put up straight superstar numbersi n the playoffs from the mid 60s to the mid 70s. He wasnt on some roleplayer shit most of the time. For the last 3 title runs with Russell around he put up 24/9/4, 26/9/8, and 25/10/6.

He could realistically be like a 15 time all star. He was putting up 20/5 in his second season and wasnt an all star...but he made it putting up 19/6 years later. If they had the loose definition of assists we use back then he might well have been a 29/11/9 player.

He had rings as a high scoring 6th man, rings as his teams leading scorer(though not best player), and rings when Russell was gone. He just has the bad(well...depending on how you look at it) luck of being teamed with someone to overshadow him all the time.

He won it all in college...on a team with Jerry Lucas. Guy forgotten today but he was considered one of the best players in the world for some time. Top 50 all time. All that. And a bigman...bigmen get the credit.

He then went to the NBA to be outshined by Russell.

Russell left and they draft Cowens. Another bigman to get the love. Didnt hurt that cowens was a legit superstar....plus loved because of his style of play.

John was born to be the winner in the background.

Id say he should have stuck with football where he could have gotten attention relative to his accomplishments.....but he was drafted to Cleveland. Where he of course would have been outshined by...Jim Brown.

Yes...John Havlicek was drafted by the NFL.

KBlaze is always bring the truth to threads. He is, by far, the most knowledgeable poster on this forum.

[MAC system]

He wasn't the best player this time either. I'd say he was the best on his team once.

Dumb stats are for dumb people. Kobe=5x champ.