What would Jordan fans say?

[3ball]

You guys are on here all day talking mj/lebron, more than me, and anytime you can't counter facts about Lebron's inferiority, you deflect with the "how many lebron threads you gonna make" act

Weak

OP got destroyed in his own thread, so lestans start in with the deflections and derail.

[TheCorporation]

You guys are on here all day talking mj/lebron, more than me, and anytime you can't counter facts about Lebron's inferiority, you deflect with the "how many lebron threads you gonna make" act

Weak

OP got destroyed in his own thread, so lestans start in with the deflections and derail.

The fact that you legitimately think this is the scariest part of it all.

MJ is #2 in everything individual, now. I am sorry to break it to you harshly, perhaps I should have been more gentle but he has been passed up in the stats category, which used to be his only weight as being considered GOAT since he clearly does not have the most rings (Bill Russell).

So...I'm sorry, 3ball.

[3ball]

The fact that you legitimately think this is the scariest part of it all.

MJ is #2 in everything individual, now. I am sorry to break it to you harshly, perhaps I should have been more gentle but he has been passed up in the stats category, which used to be his only weight as being considered GOAT since he clearly does not have the most rings (Bill Russell).

So...I'm sorry, 3ball.

Magic is recognized as the best passer because he led in APG for regular season and playoffs.. but I'm sure if mark Jackson had the media in his pocket like lebron, people would be praising his greater assist total over magic

Per game is what matters

You're grasping at straws acting like career totals make Reggie Miller and lebron better scorers than bird and MJ, respectively

But there's no law against being dumb, so carry on

[sportjames23]

Only thing we need to say, OP:

[TheCorporation]

Only thing we need to say, OP:

[img]Michael Frauden pic[/img]

Nah, this is the only thing you need to say

[sportjames23]

Nah, this is the only thing you need to say

Got this kid's mind scrambled.

[TheCorporation]

Got this kid's mind scrambled.

Coward

[Leviathon1121]

The fact that you legitimately think this is the scariest part of it all.

MJ is #2 in everything individual, now. I am sorry to break it to you harshly, perhaps I should have been more gentle but he has been passed up in the stats category, which used to be his only weight as being considered GOAT since he clearly does not have the most rings (Bill Russell).

So...I'm sorry, 3ball.

This is just not true at all...

Jordan is the consensus GOAT because of his stats, and his winning, and his heart, and his effort, and his clutch ness, and his defense, etc etc. He has the combination of it all that gives him the easiest GOAT arguement. Saying he was all stats is just the Lebron Stan narrative to put Lebron into the conversation because LeBron is the actual one who

[Phoenix]

[QUOTE=Leviathon1121]This is just not true at all...

Jordan is the consensus GOAT because of his stats, and his winning, and his heart, and his effort, and his clutch ness, and his defense, etc etc. He has the combination of it all that gives him the easiest GOAT arguement. Saying he was all stats is just the Lebron Stan narrative to put Lebron into the conversation because LeBron is the actual one who

[TheCorporation]

The thing is, it wasn't strictly a stat argument 20 years ago. Kareem has the most points. Wilt has the higher peak PPG( 50.4). It wasn't a 'most rings' argument because obviously 11>6. It's always been about the totality of everything and the Letard above you is trying to turn it into a stat accumulation argument because the boat has sailed on rings, MVPs, FMVPs, or averages. I don't even have MJ as a consensus, because I personally don't believe in that idea. I personally do a tier system.

Then what is your tier system?

Tier 1
LBJ
MJ
Magic
Shaq
Ducan

Tier 2
Kareem
Bird

Tier 3
Wilt
Russell
Kobe
Hakeem
Oscar

Something like that?

[Phoenix]

Then what is your tier system?

Tier 1
LBJ
MJ
Magic
Shaq
Ducan

Tier 2
Kareem
Bird

Tier 3
Wilt
Russell
Kobe
Hakeem
Oscar

Something like that?

I don't see why I even need to bother, because it's all subjective and arbitrary, but anyways. Note that the listed order in each tier doesn't necessarily represent how I rank them as players within specific tiers:

Tier 1- MJ, Kareem, Russell

Tier 2 - Shaq, Duncan, Lebron, Wilt, Magic, Bird

Tier 3 - Hakeem, Kobe, Oscar

The big issue we have in this discussions, there's not like a ton of difference in talent and ability between guys at this level. You're pretty much nitpicking 'flaws' to separate one player from another. There's not much 'ability' gap between Kareem and Hakeem. Frankly I think Hakeem is about as complete on both ends as anybody, but I can recognize that he should come below other players who better maximized their talents into even better careers.

[TheCorporation]

If LeBron was the one with three 1st round exits?

If LeBron was #2 in post season scoring?

If LeBron was #2 in post season steals?

If LeBron was #2 in post season game winners?

If LeBron was the one who was bailed out by Scottie Pippen? (1-9)

If all of Jordan's opponents had a better post season net efficiency rating than the BEST team LeBron faced?

If Jordan beat a 73-win all time record team?

If Jordan had the highest ppg during elimination?

If Jordan mounted the greatest 3-1 comeback in sports history?

What would Jordan fans say?

Anyone?

[3ball]

Anyone?

If LeBron was #2 in post season scoring?

If LeBron was #2 in post season steals?

If LeBron was #2 in post season game winners?

MJ had higher per game stats in the categories above, so that explains those stats.. everyone knows that per game is the REAL record (career apg - magic.... career ppg - jordan... etc)

and even without per game, MJ has far more clutch shots when you include game-tying shots or overall clutch stats (late in tight games) - MJ blows lebron away, especially on the championship level, where Lebron wasn't capable of a single clutch shot, lol

If LeBron was the one who was bailed out by Scottie Pippen? [COLOR="DarkRed"](1-9)[/COLOR]

1-9 with an 8 seed > missing playoffs as 9 seed

or going 1-9 with 2 seeds (17' and 18' Finals)

or going 2-16 in with 2 seeds in four Finals destructions (07/14/17/18.. yikes.. )

If all of Jordan's opponents had a [COLOR="DarkRed"]better post season net efficiency[/COLOR] rating than the BEST team LeBron faced?

the warriors and spurs had high net efficiency because they had no comp

they were the only big fish in the pond (the only super-teams with 3+ HOF's), whereas the 90's west had 3-4 big fish with the best talent that took turns losing to MJ in the Finals

If Jordan beat a [COLOR="DarkRed"]73-win[/COLOR] all time record team?

Lebron never beat b2b champs like MJ did in 91'...

Isiah/Dumars/Rodman > Curry/Klay/Dray, and the Pistons had two more 3x all-stars ON TOP of their big 3 (laimbeer, aguirre)..

And when did lebron destroy Duncan/Popovich in 5 games like the 98' jazz did?..

Finally, Shaq/Penny > Hibbert/George, and Riley's Knicks would've made lebron cry

If Jordan had the [COLOR="DarkRed"]highest ppg during elimination[/COLOR]?

lebron went 7 with weak teams, so he has better elimination game stats...

[ballinhun8]

OP getting destroyed in his own thread yet again


That's just sad

[SamuraiSWISH]

The thing is, it wasn't strictly a stat argument 20 years ago. Kareem has the most points. Wilt has the higher peak PPG( 50.4). It wasn't a 'most rings' argument because obviously 11>6. It's always been about the totality of everything and the Letard above you is trying to turn it into a stat accumulation argument because the boat has sailed on rings, MVPs, FMVPs, or averages. I don't even have MJ as a consensus, because I personally don't believe in that idea. I personally do a tier system.

Agreed.

They always shift the goal past.

Also me too but the tier has a hierarchy and a pyramid top. I don’t like including players in my list who for the majority of their career or all of it was pre merger. But:

MJ
Russell / Kareem
Magic / Bird / Bron / Duncan
Shaq / Wilt / Hakeem / Kobe