Honesltly, put Jordan in the Cavs instead of Lebron James in 2004, how many rings?

[3ball]

I'll take logic over Bill's exaggeration.

You were too young to have been there, but it was common knowledge that all the focus was on Jordan.


Chuck Daly: "It doesn't entail me playing you necessarily... it's our 5.... playing... you."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gCMWuCdsGQ&t=27m41s


Joe Dumars: "I talked to Isiah later that night (after Jordan had hit the GW in Game 3 of 1989 ECF) and Isiah said he went out to Michigan Avenue on the water out there, and he said he sat out there for 4-5 hours (thinking about MJ)"

Isiah Thomas: "Me and Dumars were on the phone for HOURS... talking about 23 in red."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqC74bv46Z8&t=1h05m32s


It's called the Jordan Rules... .... it's common knowledge that it was all about MJ.
.

[Roundball_Rock]

So what changed in 91'? Why did the Bulls go from losing every year to Detroit for three years to finally defeating them? MJ was putting up big numbers in 88', 89' and 90' too. If it was all Mike, what happened when CHI went 6-12 against Detroit in the playoffs from 1988-1990? Pippen's 22/8/5 and Grant had nothing to do with it, right?

[Hey Yo]

You were too young to have been there, but it was common knowledge that all the focus was on Jordan.


Chuck Daly: "It doesn't entail me playing you necessarily... it's our 5.... playing... you."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gCMWuCdsGQ&t=27m41s


Joe Dumars: "I talked to Isiah later that night (after Jordan had hit the GW in Game 3 of 1989 ECF) and Isiah said he went out to Michigan Avenue on the water out there, and he said he sat out there for 4-5 hours (thinking about MJ)"

Isiah Thomas: "Me and Dumars were on the phone for HOURS... talking about 23 in red."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xqC74bv46Z8&t=1h05m32s


It's called the Jordan Rules... .... it's common knowledge that it was all about MJ.
.

Not too young at all.

Never said that the majority of the focus wasn't on MJ. But to imply that Scottie was an afterthought to Detroit is laughable at best.

[Prime_Shaq]

Still wouldn't win. Put in prime shaq however...

[Roundball_Rock]

Not to young at all.

Never said that the majority of the focus wasn't on MJ. But to imply that Scottie was an afterthought is laughable at best.

Exactly. Detroit even tried to trade up to draft Pippen in 87'. 3ball should be grateful that did not happen.

[TheMilkyBarKid]

Very hard to say after 2010 as LeBron leaving changed that team a lot the following seasons.

He would probably have another finals appearance in 2009 &/or 2010. Cavs could be a good chance to take one, especially considering how MJ outplayed magic/drexler/barkley in his first 3 finals.

[ralph_i_el]

Good point. It's night and day in what they allowed in terms of physical contact in MJ's era and today. You can't even touch anyone anymore or it's a flagarant. Mj had to go up against one of the toughest, baddest and best defenses in history and those Pistons respected MJ so much, they invented the Jordan Rules.

Defense is so much better today

[ClipperRevival]

Defense is so much better today

Based on what? That the league might be more athletic? What about the lack of legit rim protectors today? No hand checking. Not allowed to be physical at all. All of the rules are catered to the wing player and ease of movment on the perimeter today. I'm not saying the D back in the day was better. All I'm saying is if I'm an athletic wing, I know which era I would prefer to play in.

[ralph_i_el]

Based on what? That the league might be more athletic? What about the lack of legit rim protectors today? No hand checking. Not allowed to be physical at all. All of the rules are catered to the wing player and ease of movment on the perimeter today. I'm not saying the D back in the day was better. All I'm saying is if I'm an athletic wing, I know which era I would prefer to play in.

There's a reason why teams have to spread the ball around more today instead of running lots of ISO's for their best player.

Removing Illegal D opened up a lot of stuff for defenses.

[knicksman]

So what changed in 91'? Why did the Bulls go from losing every year to Detroit for three years to finally defeating them? MJ was putting up big numbers in 88', 89' and 90' too. If it was all Mike, what happened when CHI went 6-12 against Detroit in the playoffs from 1988-1990? Pippen's 22/8/5 and Grant had nothing to do with it, right?

JOrdan finally trusted his teammates. I thought it was pretty well documented that jordan was playing 1on5 during his career

[ClipperRevival]

There's a reason why teams have to spread the ball around more today instead of running lots of ISO's for their best player.

Removing Illegal D opened up a lot of stuff for defenses.

What illegal D? A big cheating a bit? Anyways, if you say the defense is much better today than in MJs era, agree to disagree. I think in the modern era, say 1980s on, the skill level and level of comp has been great. So it's tough to have success against any kind of defense. But like I said, if I'm an athletic wing player, I know which era I would prefer to play in.

You think a guy like Westbrook would be nearly as devastating if a Oakley, Barkley or Malone were allowed to give real, hard fouls like they allowed in back in the days? Or get hand checked from half court on? The rules today are completely tailored for a guy like Westbrook to thrive.

And MJ would've been more devastating today. You also have to consider the lack of rim protectors today and how smaller the game has become in terms of the size of 4s and 5s. What I can admit is the league is more athletic today.

[ClipperRevival]

So what changed in 91'? Why did the Bulls go from losing every year to Detroit for three years to finally defeating them? MJ was putting up big numbers in 88', 89' and 90' too. If it was all Mike, what happened when CHI went 6-12 against Detroit in the playoffs from 1988-1990? Pippen's 22/8/5 and Grant had nothing to do with it, right?

No team stays on top forever. Detroit had been to 3 straignt finals and had already peaked and were on the decline while the Bulls were an ascending team. Also, the emergence of Pip and Grant along with MJ playing the rignt way.

[ralph_i_el]

What illegal D? A big cheating a bit? Anyways, if you say the defense is much better today than in MJs era, agree to disagree. I think in the modern era, say 1980s on, the skill level and level of comp has been great. So it's tough to have success against any kind of defense. But like I said, if I'm an athletic wing player, I know which era I would prefer to play in.

You think a guy like Westbrook would be nearly as devastating if a Oakley, Barkley or Malone were allowed to give real, hard fouls like they allowed in back in the days? Or get hand checked from half court on? The rules today are completely tailored for a guy like Westbrook to thrive.

And MJ would've been more devastating today. You also have to consider the lack of rim protectors today and how smaller the game has become in terms of the size of 4s and 5s. What I can admit is the league is more athletic today.

Westbrook is not the type of guy that getting rid of hand checking helps. If a player is big and strong for their position, chances are they would be the ones to benefit in an environment that allowed hand checking. Don't forget, offensive players had more freedom to make contact as well.

Real short list of dudes who could stay in front of westbrook and also effectively/consistently check him with hands and forearms. Much easier to guard a guy like that by having the freedom to rotate and get help in the paint.

[sdot_thadon]

2007 lebron had to score 29 of the last 30 to get by detroit. Mj hasn't ever done that.
2009 lebron put up 38 8 and 8 against the magic and still lost 4-2. Can't really see Mj improving on that performance either.
2010 I'm sure Mj could have played better against Boston but not so sure the cavs would have backed him up enough to win a title.

All the bullshit 3ball is posting is irrelevant.