Is LeBron really a better passer than mj?

[tpols]

Jordan's team seem to average more assists, near the top of the league, while with Lebron's dominant style they're usually in the middle, or closer to last in the league.

Bingo.

Assists gathered by westbrooking are less impressive.

[And1AllDay]

Is Jordan better than anything than LeBron?

Scoring? No
Rebounding? No
Playmaking? No
Clutch? No
Passing? No
Defense? No
Gambling? Yes
Building prisons? Yes
Punching teammates? Yes
Beating super teams? No
Beating dynasties? No

Welcome to the forums, any other questions feel free to ask

[andgar923]

Lebron passes more
Lebron has the ball more

That does not = 'better' passer

MJ is a better 'creator' and has a better sense of the game than Bron will ever have.

Most of Bron's assists come from drive and kick, something that most of today's players do (see Harden, Westbrook) and isn't necessarily the sign of a great passer (just one aspect).

MJ was able to create by attacking the defence, getting them off balance and finding gaps where there were none.

More importantly, he puts his teammates in position to get high efficient field goals. F*ck I can go out there and just throw to a 3pt shooter all day and will eventually rack up assists. But setting up your teammates for easier high percentage shots is harder to do.

Not saying that Bron does not do this, just not enough compared to MJ
Not saying that MJ didn't do drive and kick, just wasn't his main source of dishing out.

Bron is indeed one of the best passers of all time, but MJ gets highly underrated for his passing and is the better passer.

[Manny98]

Honest question to the statnerds, are you guys truly shocked that Bran has more assists than Jordan when you consider that for majority of Jordan's career he was confined to an offensive system which limits individual assist totals? You guys are unable to grasp the fact that for Bran's entire career he had FREE WILL over his offenses for 16 years to do as he pleases with absolutely nothing holding him back?

The sooner you guys realize stats are a joke the less embarrassing Bran's demise these next 3 years will be for you guys

No MJs teams had higher assist totals so individual assist totals were actually less limited

Less ball movement = less assist opportunitys

[Manny98]

Anyone that says "all LeBron does is drive and kick" doesn't watch LeBron enough

[Manny98]

If you you call me someones alt you should prove it. You **** ** a ****! **** ** ****** you **********.

Meltdown

[andgar923]

Anyone that says "all LeBron does is drive and kick" doesn't watch LeBron enough

Um... that's the vast majority of his assists. Oh and pick and roll.

It's great and all, but not as impressive as 'creating' easier shots for others which MJ did more consistently.

[andgar923]

No MJs teams had higher assist totals so individual assist totals were actually less limited

Less ball movement = less assist opportunitys

Unless you control the ball, then YES less opportunities for 'others'.

If you control the ball then of course there will be less assists as a whole because the ball doesn't move enough. But the person controlling the ball will get those assists.

[3ball]

Jordan is the only player to average 10+ apg without playing point guard and bringing the ball up the floor (91 Finals)

Otoh, lebron needs to hold the ball longer than anyone ever has to get 10 apg in the Finals

i.e. lebron's hold-time was 12.2 minutes per game in the 15' Finals, compared to Harden's 9.5 minutes this year... Let that sink in.. To get his stats, lebron holds the ball longer than anyone EVER..

that isn't impressive, especially since his ball-domination and assist-padding comes at the expense of TEAM assists/ball movement.. consequently, the team can't compete well at the championship level

[andgar923]

Jordan is the only player to average 10+ apg without playing point guard and bringing the ball up the floor (91 Finals)

Otoh, lebron needs to hold the ball longer than anyone ever has to get 10 apg in the Finals

i.e. lebron's hold-time was 12.2 minutes per game in the 15' Finals, compared to Harden's 9.5 minutes this year... Let that sink in.. To get his stats, lebron holds the ball longer than anyone EVER..

that isn't impressive, especially since his ball-domination and assist-padding comes at the expense of TEAM assists/ball movement.. consequently, the team can't compete well at the championship level

He literally holds the ball for half the shot clock???

I used to exaggerate when I trolled Bron Stans, but sh*t that's bonkers.

[Manny98]

Um... that's the vast majority of his assists. Oh and pick and roll.

It's great and all, but not as impressive as 'creating' easier shots for others which MJ did more consistently.

No he gets a lot of his assists in transition

Magic is the only player ever that is a better transition passer than LeBron

There is no easier shot than the Corner 3 which LeBron is the very best at putting shooters in position for a easy open shot

MJ wasn't close to LeBron as a passer he never had the court vision and the passing accuracy that LeBron possesses

[Manny98]

He literally holds the ball for half the shot clock???

I used to exaggerate when I trolled Bron Stans, but sh*t that's bonkers.

No he doesn't that was just one series where he was playing without a legitimate point guard so he had to hold the ball for that long

Generally his time of possession is not even that high compared to the likes of Harden,Westbrook and Wall

[TheCorporation]

Jordan is the only player to average 10+ apg without playing point guard and bringing the ball up the floor (91 Finals)

Otoh, lebron needs to hold the ball longer than anyone ever has to get 10 apg in the Finals

i.e. lebron's hold-time was 12.2 minutes per game in the 15' Finals, compared to Harden's 9.5 minutes this year... Let that sink in.. To get his stats, lebron holds the ball longer than anyone EVER..

that isn't impressive, especially since his ball-domination and assist-padding comes at the expense of TEAM assists/ball movement.. consequently, the team can't compete well at the championship level

You keep talking about points. Yes we know he dropped a bunch of points on Starks and Hornacek.

However, aside from MJ, how many players were carried in four of five categories?

Was anybody carried more than MJ?

[Gus Hemmingway]

Is LeBron really a better passer than mj?

yep, light years

MJ wasn't even close to the floor general Lebron is, Jordan's not even top 50 passers all time. Lebron is Top 10 consensus and up there with Magic/Stockton/Bird's etc

Jordan was universally mocked for being a ball hogging chucker for 3/4's his career, never once recognized as a quality playmaker/passer

[andgar923]

No he doesn't that was just one series where he was playing without a legitimate point guard so he had to hold the ball for that long

Generally his time of possession is not even that high compared to the likes of Harden,Westbrook and Wall

Even then, he still holds the ball longer than MJ did.

And I can almost bet that Magic and Bird held the ball less.

I've seen him play his entire career (going back to high school), he takes longer than they do to read and react.

His court vision is on par with the greats no doubt, but he tends to be slower than they do. Partially due to the type of offensive plays, part is his style of play.

If you saw them play you'd notice a big difference on how they approach the game and how they pass.