Could anyone else in NBA history do what LeBron did in Cleveland?

[mlh1981]

If we are going to break down the inability of the Cavs to surround LeBron with the proper pieces, I will say that many of the moves seemed like the right thing to do at the time. Hindsight is 20/20.

I can't remember many naysayers when they got Mo Williams and Larry Hughes. Williams was known as a guy who could put up points, and Hughes was part of an efficient scoring trio in Washington. Off the top of my head, I forget what year it was that Hughes was a free agent (edit: 2005), but they missed out on several other guys, so the criticism would have been there if they hadn't done SOMETHING that offseason. I remember the panic that year, the fear the Cavs weren't going to do anything to address their shooting guard needs.

and then there is the unfortunate Carlos Boozer saga.

[sixer6ad]

This dude had one of the most inept coaches in the league along with a bunch of average to garbage players and:

-Made the finals in '07
-Back to back 60 win seasons
-Never lost in the first round

Seeing the Lakers have this clown as their coach really makes me appreciate what LeBron was able to accomplish with that Cleveland team. His second best player for all of his years in Cleveland was Mo f*cking Williams.

The Cavs only have themselves to blame for him leaving as well. They could have gotten Amare (which would have been more than enough to put the Cavaliers in the finals from '10 and up), but they didn't want to gave up Hickson ( ) who they ended up shipping out for f*cking Casspi.

I don't think even Jordan could have gotten that piss poor '07 cast to the finals like LeBron did. As much as I dislike the guy, if LeBron is able to win 3+ titles/FMVPs, he's going to become a legitimate GOAT candidate.

Just so everyone on ISH doesn't read a post and automatically believe it, let's get some facts straight:

FIRST AND FOREMOST...THE SUNS pulled the trade back - NOT THE F-ING Cavs. The trade idea that surfaced was Amare for Hickson, but the SUNS PULLED THE TRADE OFF THE TABLE. OKAY??? ONCE AND FOR ALL??? The rumor that the Cavs balked was absolutely just that.

SECONDLY - (and read carefully) - Mike Brown was the lead assistant in Indiana under Rick Carlisle and in San Antonio under Mike Popovich. Mike Freaking Popovich (World Champion) and Rick Carlisle (World Champion player and coach) pushed for Ferry to get Brown. Those NBA legends know how good Mike Brown is. In Cleveland, Brown made 1 appearance in the Finals, set many franchise records, and was NBA coach of the year. Thank God people like Larry Bird, and Rick Carlisle and Mike Popovich know the truth and make NBA-related decisions and that people who really don't know can sit around and type in a forum chat.

THIRDLY - people like Big Z and Anderson Varejo, and Boobie Gibson, and Joe Smith, and Carlos Boozer and Drew Gooden and Mo Williams and are freaking NBA players who have lasted in the league. Not ONE of them is a legitimate All-Star; however, each of these garbage players are capable of playing a role on an NBA Championship team. The problem was not all of these "garbage players", the problem was the lack of another scoring stud next to LBJ. None of those players had the design for that. PLENTY of NBA titles come to teams who play their roles (i.e. Dallas Mavericks), but that additional scoring stud never came. You are so wrong in believing it was the "garbage players" fault. It was the fault of someone who never made it to Cleveland.

FINALLY - Funny you mention Jordan, because you were wrong on him too. Jordan would have gotten more out of this group; it's what he did. Players like Bill Wennington and Craig Hodges and Steve Kerr and Tony Kukoc won titles by playing their roles. The same could have happened in Cleveland. The huge difference was Scottie Pippen sitting right next to Jordan every single night. THAT'S WHAT THE CAVS MISSED. It was not the coach, it was not LBJ, it was not the role players. Everything was there except PLAYER #2.

Other than missing out on 4 of your 4 points, this was one of the best threads I have read in awhile.

[Fatal9]

Get to the finals in '07? Yes, lot of players imo could have given how shitty the East was.

Back to back 60 win seasons with his cast? I really can't picture anyone else doing as good or better than him.

[jbryan1984]

Here we again. I'm so tired of this bullshit. If you want my opinion, you can do a search and read about 200 similar threads I have responded to the last year and a half.

[Dave3]

Here we again. I'm so tired of this bullshit. If you want my opinion, you can do a search and read about 200 similar threads I have responded to the last year and a half.

Look, I respect Cavs fans (the ones on this board at least, as they're the only ones I know) but you've said some ridiculous crap in the past. You're hardly in a position to be judging what's bull and what isn't.

[OldSchoolBBall]

I don't think even Jordan could have gotten that piss poor '07 cast to the finals like LeBron did. As much as I dislike the guy, if LeBron is able to win 3+ titles/FMVPs, he's going to become a legitimate GOAT candidate.

Considering that Jordan beat a Cavs team in '88 which was significantly better than anything Lebron faced in the EC, and did so with a worse team than Lebron had in Cleveland, I'm going to go out on a limb and say that he would have reached the Finals.

[blablabla]

there's a reason lebron won more games with the cars than with the heat

[rule1223]

no doubt in my mind that kobe wouldve took atleast 2 games from the spurs

[LBJMVP]

Regardless, Cavs management had ample time to surround LeBron with better talent, but the best they could do was a declining Jamison. Mike Brown is an idiot and didn't utilize Jamison right at all, but is that really the best piece they could acquire?

we tried to sign some free agents, but they asked lebron if he was stayin and he refused to answer them so they refused to sign.

[HEAT111]

Regardless, Cavs management had ample time to surround LeBron with better talent, but the best they could do was a declining Jamison. Mike Brown is an idiot and didn't utilize Jamison right at all, but is that really the best piece they could acquire?

I agree with Doranku here. Think about it, Pat Riley was smart enough to bring Shaq to the Heat while noticing how Wade was playing during the time and look at the results. The Cavaliers brought this to themselves.

[HEAT111]

we tried to sign some free agents, but they asked lebron if he was stayin and he refused to answer them so they refused to sign.

That maybe factual but that's no alibi. When you take to notice that your player is playing like a GOAT, you got to take the chance and start making a championship contending team. Hence, the Orlando Magic; Dwight is going the through the samething and if the Magic atleast doesn't pull out a good move by next summer, they'll end up like Cleveland.

[Doranku]

Just so everyone on ISH doesn't read a post and automatically believe it, let's get some facts straight:

FIRST AND FOREMOST...THE SUNS pulled the trade back - NOT THE F-ING Cavs. The trade idea that surfaced was Amare for Hickson, but the SUNS PULLED THE TRADE OFF THE TABLE. OKAY??? ONCE AND FOR ALL??? The rumor that the Cavs balked was absolutely just that.

SECONDLY - (and read carefully) - Mike Brown was the lead assistant in Indiana under Rick Carlisle and in San Antonio under Mike Popovich. Mike Freaking Popovich (World Champion) and Rick Carlisle (World Champion player and coach) pushed for Ferry to get Brown. Those NBA legends know how good Mike Brown is. In Cleveland, Brown made 1 appearance in the Finals, set many franchise records, and was NBA coach of the year. Thank God people like Larry Bird, and Rick Carlisle and Mike Popovich know the truth and make NBA-related decisions and that people who really don't know can sit around and type in a forum chat.

THIRDLY - people like Big Z and Anderson Varejo, and Boobie Gibson, and Joe Smith, and Carlos Boozer and Drew Gooden and Mo Williams and are freaking NBA players who have lasted in the league. Not ONE of them is a legitimate All-Star; however, each of these garbage players are capable of playing a role on an NBA Championship team. The problem was not all of these "garbage players", the problem was the lack of another scoring stud next to LBJ. None of those players had the design for that. PLENTY of NBA titles come to teams who play their roles (i.e. Dallas Mavericks), but that additional scoring stud never came. You are so wrong in believing it was the "garbage players" fault. It was the fault of someone who never made it to Cleveland.

FINALLY - Funny you mention Jordan, because you were wrong on him too. Jordan would have gotten more out of this group; it's what he did. Players like Bill Wennington and Craig Hodges and Steve Kerr and Tony Kukoc won titles by playing their roles. The same could have happened in Cleveland. The huge difference was Scottie Pippen sitting right next to Jordan every single night. THAT'S WHAT THE CAVS MISSED. It was not the coach, it was not LBJ, it was not the role players. Everything was there except PLAYER #2.

Other than missing out on 4 of your 4 points, this was one of the best threads I have read in awhile.

While I admit to being wrong about the whole Stoudemire debacle, the premise that Cavs management failed to surround LeBron with a team capable of winning a title still stands.

I simply don't see how you can say Mike Brown is a good coach. He's good defensively, but he is simply CLUELESS on offense. Just look at the Lakers this year. You have a team with Kobe Bryant, Andrew Bynum, and Pau Gasol and their offense is absolutely putrid to watch. It was the same thing in Cleveland with their LeIso offense. You should be thanking LeBron for those franchise records and finals appearance, not Mike Brown.

Whose fault was it then when Cleveland lost to Orlando? LeBron put up 39/8/8, what more can you ask for? How about when LeBron put 45 on the Celtics in Game 7 '08? Cleveland lost because no one else stepped up. It's as simple as that.

Jordan would have got more out of that group? You think Jordan is winning an NBA title with Mo Williams, Big Z, and Varejao? Dude was 1-9 in playoff series before Pippen came. Jordan is the GOAT and best basketball talent I've ever seen, but there's no way he's going to win an NBA title with that team.

[Da_Realist]

I don't think even Jordan could have gotten that piss poor '07 cast to the finals like LeBron did. As much as I dislike the guy, if LeBron is able to win 3+ titles/FMVPs, he's going to become a legitimate GOAT candidate.

Jordan would have got more out of that group? You think Jordan is winning an NBA title with Mo Williams, Big Z, and Varejao? Dude was 1-9 in playoff series before Pippen came. Jordan is the GOAT and best basketball talent I've ever seen, but there's no way he's going to win an NBA title with that team.

The real point of this bait thread.

[brisbaneman]

Dirk did it in Dallas and unlike lebron he actually won something

[Meticode]

Tracy McGrady, Allen Iverson just off the top of my head.

Disagree, neither made it to the Finals.