New franchise: Kobe Bryant or Charles Barkley?

[jstern]

Not really. With Kobe you are getting 17 seasons at least of longevity. Barkley had arguably a more dominant prime. Although, I think its lame someone is giving Kobe props for staying in LA his whole career. The guy demanded a trade when he didn't get the help he wanted. People can sugarcoat it all they want, but he did infact demand a trade.

He wouldn't be as effective at this age if the league was more physical, and you just cannot factor in the rule changes. He would be effective, but not as much. It's just the way the league is.

[Sarcastic]

Pretty easily Kobe.

[PJR]

Kobe. He's the protypical size for his posistion (pause), thus he's easier to build around. Plus prime Kobe is a much better defender at his respective posistion as well.

[Sparts Arwell]

Not really. With Kobe you are getting 17 seasons at least of longevity. Barkley had arguably a more dominant prime. Although, I think its lame someone is giving Kobe props for staying in LA his whole career. The guy demanded a trade when he didn't get the help he wanted. People can sugarcoat it all they want, but he did infact demand a trade.

Not to mention he singlhandedly broke up a nucleus that had been to 4 finals, which brought the team three years of first-round-exit misery under his leadership. Then he demanded to be traded away from the mess he created. Luckily for him Mitch Kupchak came to the rescue and saved him from himself, and saved the team by putting together the most dominant frontcourt at the time. Just like they had when they won the first three titles.

Kobe's "5 ringz" credit should also be divided between Shaq, Kupchak, and Fisher. So really Kobe has earned about 1.25 rings. Uness we include the other players who had to bail out his last second hero-shot failures and bricks. Then it'd be even less.

[kNicKz]

Not to mention he singlhandedly broke up a nucleus that had been to 4 finals, which brought the team three years of first-round-exit misery under his leadership. Then he demanded to be traded away from the mess he created. Luckily for him Mitch Kupchak came to the rescue and saved him from himself, and saved the team by putting together the most dominant frontcourt at the time. Just like they had when they won the first three titles.

Kobe's "5 ringz" credit should also be divided between Shaq, Kupchak, and Fisher. So really Kobe has earned about 1.25 rings.

Shaq was as guilty as Kobe in that feud

[jcsrplumply]

hmmmm

A) lazy fat man never done shit, never won shit, never played defense, ring chases, leaves franchises on bad terms, top 18-20 player ever

vs

B) hardest working athlete of all time, most accomplished player of his generation, all time most defensive 1st team awards, stays with 1 franchise, legend, top 5-6 player ever

He never won shit because he played against a guy called Michael Jordan.
And don't tell me he should have won with Hakeem and Drexler because that team is really old.

[KobeClutchAsFK]

Not to mention he singlhandedly broke up a nucleus that had been to 4 finals, which brought the team three years of first-round-exit misery under his leadership. Then he demanded to be traded away from the mess he created. Luckily for him Mitch Kupchak came to the rescue and saved him from himself, and saved the team by putting together the most dominant frontcourt at the time. Just like they had when they won the first three titles.

Did you just call Pau Gasol, Lamar Odom, and Andrew Bynum on 1 leg "the most dominant frontcourt of all time"?

[SilkkTheShocker]

Not to mention he singlhandedly broke up a nucleus that had been to 4 finals, which brought the team three years of first-round-exit misery under his leadership. Then he demanded to be traded away from the mess he created. Luckily for him Mitch Kupchak came to the rescue and saved him from himself, and saved the team by putting together the most dominant frontcourt at the time. Just like they had when they won the first three titles.

Trust me, im far from a Kobe fan. But if im a GM, im taking Kobe and not even thinking twice. The only thing Barkley has on Kobe is arguably being more dominant in his prime. Prime Barkley was one of the most double teamed players of all time. Not to mention he was extremely efficient. Neither were that great of leaders imo. Kobe was always kind of a front runner. And Barkley has a history of throwing his teammates under the bus. But your still have to give Kobe the edge seeing as he has been the best player on three teams that made the Finals. Barkley's teams have also had some epic collapses. And thats not even bringing up that Kobe is a lot more marketable.

[kNicKz]

Trust me, im far from a Kobe fan. But if im a GM, im taking Kobe and not even thinking twice. The only thing Barkley has on Kobe is arguably being more dominant in his prime. Prime Barkley was one of the most double teamed players of all time. Not to mention he was extremely efficient. Neither were that great of leaders imo. Kobe was always kind of a front runner. And Barkley has a history of throwing his teammates under the bus. But your still have to give Kobe the edge seeing as he has been the best player on three teams that made the Finals. Barkley's teams have also had some epic collapses. And thats not even bringing up that Kobe is a lot more marketable.

A rational post from silkk?

*dies*

[SilkkTheShocker]

Did you just call Pau Gasol, Lamar Odom, and Andrew Bynum on 1 leg "the most dominant frontcourt of all time"?

If you learned how to read properly, he stated they were the most dominant frontcourt "at the time". Which is absolutely true. You have a stacked frontcourt if prime Odom is coming off your bench.

[Sparts Arwell]

Shaq was as guilty as Kobe in that feud

But Shaq was justified in not wanting his touches taken away since he was the driving force behind three championships, not to mention a finals appearance with Orlando, not to mention he would go on to win another title two years later.

Kobe was basically demanding a change in the way the team played, which would cause the team to be less successfully but allow Kobe to shoot more. And the result was missed playoffs, first round exit, first round exit. Until he got carried back to the finals again two years later by an Odom/Bynum/Gasol trio that was unmatched in the NBA. Plus wasn't it always Ariza or Artest guarding the Carmelo's, Durant's, Pierce's?? Kobe basically took all the 'difficult hero shots' throughout the playoffs which did essentially nothing except win a Phoenix series they would have won anyway.

In all honesty Kobe Bryant, to objective basketball minds, will probably go down as the most overrated basketball player in history if you compare his impact vs. the adoration of his fans. The stuff he does at an 'elite level' is basically play like a globetrotter. He doesn't rebound or defend or even score with efficiency at an elite level. He's a selfish streetballer who has been spoiled by the team around him. The need to "jesusify" players on winning teams has resulted in him becoming the most undeservingly credited player for his team success that I've sen in all my years.

[SilkkTheShocker]

A rational post from silkk?

*dies*

I just don't see how this is an argument. Would people take D-Rob over Shaq?

[Sparts Arwell]

Did you just call Pau Gasol, Lamar Odom, and Andrew Bynum on 1 leg "the most dominant frontcourt of all time"?

I think you misquoted me on purpose here fella. You can clearly see I said "at the time" but since you don't have a way to disprove that you tried to attribute different words to me.

Twinkle toes, go play somewhere Im busy.

[SilkkTheShocker]

But Shaq was justified in not wanting his touches taken away since he was the driving force behind three championships, not to mention a finals appearance with Orlando, not to mention he would go on to win another title two years later.

Kobe was basically demanding a change in the way the team played, which would cause the team to be less successfully but allow Kobe to shoot more. And the result was missed playoffs, first round exit, first round exit. Until he got carried back to the finals again two years later by an Odom/Bynum/Gasol trio that was unmatched in the NBA. Plus wasn't it always Ariza or Artest guarding the Carmelo's, Durant's, Pierce's?? Kobe basically took all the 'difficult hero shots' throughout the playoffs which did essentially nothing except win a Phoenix series they would have won anyway.

In all honesty Kobe Bryant, to objective basketball minds, will probably go down as the most overrated basketball player in history if you compare his impact vs. the adoration of his fans. The stuff he does at an 'elite level' is basically play like a globetrotter. He doesn't rebound or defend or even score with efficiency at an elite level. He's a selfish streetballer who has been spoiled by the team around him. The need to "jesusify" players on winning teams has resulted in him becoming the most undeservingly credited player for his team success that I've sen in all my years.

This is a great post. I feel when it comes to actual impact on team basketball, Kobe is very overrated in that department.

[KobeClutchAsFK]

If you learned how to read properly, he stated they were the most dominant frontcourt "at the time". Which is absolutely true. You have a stacked frontcourt if prime Odom is coming off your bench.

Yeah my bad, I misread that.