35ppg seasons, modern era.

[OldSchoolBBall]

What? What relevance does only 2's have to overall efficiency? Next you're going to tell me jordan shoots better from 17 to 19 feet going left? Awesome, who cares.

The fact of the matter is that once 3pointers are adjusted for being worth more points to offset them being less efficient, jordan is about 2-3% more efficient. Which happens to be about 1 more missed shot by kobe every 2 games.

Even if you use eFG% (which is a busted stat), Jordan was still +4.6% above Kobe. Not 2-3%...nearly 5%. Try again.

[I LUV KOBE]

Kobe avg 35ppg in the best defensive era >>> Mike avg 37ppg in no defense era..

[Halcon]

Best defensive era where 3 players can average over 30ppg...

[RazorBaLade]

Even if you use eFG% (which is a busted stat), Jordan was still +4.6% above Kobe. Not 2-3%...nearly 5%. Try again.

And if you use TS% what is it?

Why ignore FTs?

[OldSchoolBBall]

And if you use TS% what is it?

Why ignore FTs?

TS% difference is 4.3%, which is an enormous difference. Try. Again.

[Story Up]

Even looking strictly at 2's, Kobe shot 48.2% (+2.3% above league average FG% and only +0.4% above league average 2FG%) as compared to MJ's 54.6% (+6.4% above league average FG% and +5.6% above league average 2FG%). So no, not really close at all. Nice try, though.

You're a ****ing moron, MJ shot minus 20% from 3 LOL, what's your point dipshit? We shouldn't look at 3's bc MJ sucked at those? MJ is ****ing overrated, so many ****ing random players had ridiculous numbers in that era. Ppl need to understand times have changed. Kobe would average 40 PPG on 50% in 80's.

Jordan got single coverage on the perimeter all the time, look at the tapes, the defensive pressure was way more lackadaisical back then. Which is why most every team scored 100 PPG plus and shot ridiculously high.

[RazorBaLade]

TS% difference is 4.3%, which is an enormous difference. Try. Again.

Oh god, my prediction was 3 but its actually 4. Oh god.

Practically no difference from the 9 with FG% right.

[OldSchoolBBall]

Oh god, my prediction was 3 but its actually 4. Oh god.

Practically no difference from the 9 with FG% right.

A 4+% difference in TS% is huge. I don't think you really understand what it means to be 6.6%% above league average TS% (Jordan) as compared to only +2.4 above league average like Kobe. Astronomical difference.

[RazorBaLade]

A 4+% difference in TS% is huge. I don't think you really understand what it means to be 6.6%% above league average TS% (Jordan) as compared to only +2.4 above league average like Kobe. Astronomical difference.

4% difference on 20 shots a game is just under 1 missed shot per game. 1 shot. Its not huge, its clear, its obvious, but its not huge.

League average means absolutely, absolutely nothing. Theres no reason to say jordan is above league average because hes so good and not just hes better because theres no one that good at the time.

Kobes career has gone through:

AI
SHAQ
DUNCAN
DIRK
LEBRON
WADE
KG

How many top 20 players all time has kobe been playing vs?

MJ had... A little of bird, rookie shaq and drexler?

[NuggetsFan]

You're a ****ing moron, MJ shot minus 20% from 3 LOL, what's your point dipshit? We shouldn't look at 3's bc MJ sucked at those? MJ is ****ing overrated, so many ****ing random players had ridiculous numbers in that era. Ppl need to understand times have changed. Kobe would average 40 PPG on 50% in 80's.

Jordan got single coverage on the perimeter all the time, look at the tapes, the defensive pressure was way more lackadaisical back then. Which is why most every team scored 100 PPG plus and shot ridiculously high.

LOL tell us how you really feel

[OldSchoolBBall]

4% difference on 20 shots a game is just under 1 missed shot per game. 1 shot. Its not huge, its clear, its obvious, but its not huge.

League average means absolutely, absolutely nothing. Theres no reason to say jordan is above league average because hes so good and not just hes better because theres no one that good at the time.

Kobes career has gone through:

AI
SHAQ
DUNCAN
DIRK
LEBRON
WADE
KG

How many top 20 players all time has kobe been playing vs?

MJ had... A little of bird, rookie shaq and drexler?

You're all over the place in this topic, but that's to be expected since you're dense. Kobe "went through" those guys? No, he did not go through Lebron or Wade, he played against them during the regular season. In which case we can list players for MJ too:

Magic
Bird
Barkley
Hakeem
Shaq
DRob
Malone
Drexler
Isiah
Hill
Penny
Payton
Kemp

[RazorBaLade]

You're all over the place in this topic, but that's to be expected since you're dense. Kobe "went through" those guys? No, he did not go through Lebron or Wade, he played against them during the regular season. In which case we can list players for MJ too:

Magic
Bird
Barkley
Hakeem
Shaq
DRob
Malone
Drexler
Isiah
Hill
Penny
Payton
Kemp

So we agree that since kobe had more top level players in the league during his career its understandable that hes not as much above league averages?

[SuperPippen]

Goddamn pauk, turning this into a another vs. thread when it might have a been a great thread appreciating two great players.

[SuperPippen]

4% difference on 20 shots a game is just under 1 missed shot per game. 1 shot. Its not huge, its clear, its obvious, but its not huge.

League average means absolutely, absolutely nothing. Theres no reason to say jordan is above league average because hes so good and not just hes better because theres no one that good at the time.

Kobes career has gone through:

AI
SHAQ
DUNCAN
DIRK
LEBRON
WADE
KG

How many top 20 players all time has kobe been playing vs?

MJ had... A little of bird, rookie shaq and drexler?

I agree with you that because the 3-pointer is ultimately a more efficient shot than a 2-pointer, FG% is inherently flawed. However, that's not so say that TS% is a better statistic, because it, too, is flawed. Not all shots are created equally, even within the 3-point line.

No one should base their opinions solely on statistics, but we all should already know that.

And for the sake of (hopefully) fair, unbiased comparison, here are the arguable top 20 players that Kobe and Jordan played a significant part of their career against:

Jordan:
Magic
Bird
Hakeem
Barkley
Malone
Shaq


Kobe:
Duncan
LeBron
KG
Dirk

[RazorBaLade]

I agree with you that because the 3-pointer is ultimately a more efficient shot than a 2-pointer, FG% is inherently flawed. However, that's not so say that TS% is a better statistic, because it, too, is flawed. Not all shots are created equally, even within the 3-point line.

No one should base their opinions solely on statistics, but we all should already know that.

And for the sake of (hopefully) fair, unbiased comparison, here are the arguable top 20 players that Kobe and Jordan played a significant part of their career against:

Jordan:
Magic
Bird
Hakeem
Barkley
Malone
Shaq


Kobe:
Duncan
LeBron
KG
Dirk

I agree theres no perfect stat but cmon.. Its not nearly a double digit difference in efficiency. Its just not. Hes just not that much better. It doesnt mean kobe is instantly somehow as good as jordan but its a lot closer than that. TS paints a very accurate picture with a 4% difference IMO.

Don't know about shaq being in jordans list and not kobes. In this case its not about playing AGAINST, its just how many players are there that can drive up that league average. Same team is fine to me.