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Old 07-06-2013, 04:14 PM   #16
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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If we just get rid of Gay we'll be bottom feeders
Does Charlotte have any cap room left to absorb a contract?

I think you need to get rid of Lowry too. He's a good player. Although you do want something of value in return for him. Can't just dump him.
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Old 07-06-2013, 06:34 PM   #17
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

They had to amnesty Tyrus Thomas, so I doubt it. If I were Masai I'd be pitching in about Gay for a 2014 first round pick if this draft is as deep as people make it out to be.
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Old 07-06-2013, 07:05 PM   #18
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
Does Charlotte have any cap room left to absorb a contract?

I think you need to get rid of Lowry too. He's a good player. Although you do want something of value in return for him. Can't just dump him.


Dallas seems to be striking out this offseason, give them a call.
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Old 07-07-2013, 02:03 PM   #19
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

I am ok with dealing all of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay and Amir if we can get a 1st round pick in return for each as well as an expiring contract. None of these players will win us a championship so might as well blow it all up. I still don't know what Masai's stance is on the roster he hasn't really said much.
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Old 07-07-2013, 04:33 PM   #20
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by Toni
I am ok with dealing all of Lowry, DeRozan, Gay and Amir if we can get a 1st round pick in return for each as well as an expiring contract. None of these players will win us a championship so might as well blow it all up. I still don't know what Masai's stance is on the roster he hasn't really said much.

Dealing Gay and Derozan makes sense. It opens up playing time for Ross, and it makes sure that Val will be getting the ball. I'm not sure if you'd get a first rounder for Lowry, and I don't think you're getting one for Amir either.

Derozan and Gay have good value around the league. Derozan's contract doesn't look as bad when compared to the deals signed this offseason. There will be a GM or two that would be desperate enough to part with their picks in the upcoming draft.

I wouldn't mind going into the season with Lowry still on the team. With a team that is going to struggle to score, Lowry will have the green light. You hope he puts up those insane numbers that he did for Houston couple of years ago to start the season. Then you look for a deal mid-season and package him with Amir if need be. Right now, I don't think they have enough stand alone value. I don't think there should be any urgent need to trade Amir, he does enough positive for the team, doesn't make too much, doesn't have enough value by himself and won't hurt the tank...
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Old 07-07-2013, 06:00 PM   #21
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by brwnman
Dealing Gay and Derozan makes sense. It opens up playing time for Ross, and it makes sure that Val will be getting the ball. I'm not sure if you'd get a first rounder for Lowry, and I don't think you're getting one for Amir either.

Derozan and Gay have good value around the league. Derozan's contract doesn't look as bad when compared to the deals signed this offseason. There will be a GM or two that would be desperate enough to part with their picks in the upcoming draft.

I wouldn't mind going into the season with Lowry still on the team. With a team that is going to struggle to score, Lowry will have the green light. You hope he puts up those insane numbers that he did for Houston couple of years ago to start the season. Then you look for a deal mid-season and package him with Amir if need be. Right now, I don't think they have enough stand alone value. I don't think there should be any urgent need to trade Amir, he does enough positive for the team, doesn't make too much, doesn't have enough value by himself and won't hurt the tank...

I'm ok with keeping Amir but obviously if you get a first round pick and an expirer for him you take it. Whether it be for the 2014 draft or later, doesn't matter. But you're right he doesn't make a lot, he has great character and plays hard, and he's a good teammate and good in the community. So I'm indifferent if he gets traded or not.

But I think their needs to be some urgency in trading Lowry over Gay and DeRozan since he will be a UFA after this season and we already gave up a first rounder to get him. If we don't receive another one back it will be a huge failure of a trade. I also think Lowry is a good enough player that still has some potential to command a 1st rounder in return. He is arguably one of the most versatile and all-around PGs in the league in terms of play making and rebounding as well as a decent inside-outside game.

Time will tell, but I really hope we can get some good assets in return for Lowry.. because I don't think he will resign here unless we give him a stupid 5-6 year $50-$60 million dollar contract.
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Old 07-07-2013, 07:28 PM   #22
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by Toni
I'm ok with keeping Amir but obviously if you get a first round pick and an expirer for him you take it. Whether it be for the 2014 draft or later, doesn't matter. But you're right he doesn't make a lot, he has great character and plays hard, and he's a good teammate and good in the community. So I'm indifferent if he gets traded or not.

But I think their needs to be some urgency in trading Lowry over Gay and DeRozan since he will be a UFA after this season and we already gave up a first rounder to get him. If we don't receive another one back it will be a huge failure of a trade. I also think Lowry is a good enough player that still has some potential to command a 1st rounder in return. He is arguably one of the most versatile and all-around PGs in the league in terms of play making and rebounding as well as a decent inside-outside game.

Time will tell, but I really hope we can get some good assets in return for Lowry.. because I don't think he will resign here unless we give him a stupid 5-6 year $50-$60 million dollar contract.

I think a team would have to be desperate to give a first rounder for Lowry (ie like the Raptors last year). I'm not a huge Lowry fan to be honest, but I was less of a fan of whatever the Raptors were making him out to be last year after he got injured. His one effectiveness comes from attacking, and they totally tried to change his game and he was invisible for long stretches. I understand that he will be a UFA, but I don't think we're going to be getting anything worth trading him for. If it's a late first rounder, not sure that's worth it. We need a desperate team or I say, let it play out, and if he's the lead dog, he'll end up putting numbers - that should increase his trade value. Only risk with that is he's had some injury trouble last couple of years...
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Old 07-08-2013, 10:49 AM   #23
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by Qwyjibo
Add Atlanta to the list of teams hungry for mediocrity. They just signed Millsap. To their credit, the contract is a good value but I question their direction.

Atlanta, Milwaukee and Charlotte are all signing players and clearly trying to win next year. Tanking is becoming the obvious option for the Raptors.

I think the Bobcats have to play for relevency in their own market. They have been bad for so long MJ and the ownership group 'have no choice'.

I have no idea what Danny Ferry is doing in Atlanta... not sure he knows either...

The Bucks are still tanking despite OJ Mayo. I mean they are keeping appearences. There is still a minimum level of salary cap and competativeness they need to maintain. 1 OJ Mayo - at reasonable salary - as good as he is - does not equal the loss of M, Red and Dunleavy. Sorry they just lost 50% of their scoring. I mean they have Jenning Mayo and Ilysov (spelling). The have no big men under contract yet as Pryz is retired and Dalembert is done.

__

I think we will know this week whether MU is tanking or building. There are enough "pieces in play" to find Camby a landing spot... What we get back fro Camby will tell us how he veiws the team.
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Old 07-08-2013, 11:07 AM   #24
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

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Originally Posted by kmart
Interesting that Detroit has just added Josh Smith. I would have to think that they are better than the Raps now. Plenty of teams that are better than the Raps, even with Rudy Gay.

Better than us
1. Miami
2. NY
3. Indiana
4. Brooklyn
5. Chicago
6. Atlanta
7. Detroit
8. Cleveland (with a healthy Kyrie)

In the same range as the Raps
9. Milwaukee
10. Washington
11. Boston (if they keep Rondo)
12. Charlotte

Riggin for Wiggins'
13. Philly
14. Orlando

If we just get rid of Gay we'll be bottom feeders

My take is slightly different

1) Miami
2) Brooklyn
3) Indiana
4) Chicago (with Rose back)
5) New York
6) Detroit (injuries and talent developing assumed)

Then as is ...

Atlanta, Toronto, Washington, Cleveland, Millaukee, Charlotte

Then as is

Orlando Boston Philly.

I dont think Rondo in Boston alone is the player type or leadership guy to carry that team.

I think ownership (and therefore MU by extension) want playoffs..want playoffs bad even as the 8th.. want the All Star game here... want want ...

But how MU deals with Camby will tell us likely whether this season or in 2.

Last edited by Jballer : 07-08-2013 at 11:22 AM.
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Old 07-08-2013, 07:18 PM   #25
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

I think Washington will be clearly better than Toronto. Wall, Beal, Nene and Okafor is a low playoff seed, assuming everyone is healthy.

Atlanta and Cleveland have more talent too.
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Old 07-12-2013, 01:49 AM   #26
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

This is supposably Masai's stance
Raptors chart an unglamorous route back to relevance
not much being said really, more of a wait and see, case by case approach. obviously even if he plans to tank he probably wouldn't say it outright anyways.
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Old 07-12-2013, 04:00 AM   #27
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Default Re: Is Ujiri Building or Tanking ? Thoughts ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bk33
This is supposably Masai's stance
Raptors chart an unglamorous route back to relevance
not much being said really, more of a wait and see, case by case approach. obviously even if he plans to tank he probably wouldn't say it outright anyways.

Quote:
“What are we going to do, throw players away?” Ujiri said at the prospect of “tanking.” Last week’s rumour of dealing Rudy Gay to Detroit for the expiring contracts of Rodney Stuckey and Charlie Villanueva might be an example of what Ujiri was talking about. “We’re not going to do that. And I think winning is what you want to build around. And I think when you [try to trade away talent for little in return], I’m not so sure the karma is great when you do stuff like that. But I understand the whole big picture and we’re putting all the options on the table.”

I'm liking him more and more.
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