Suns lose to Wemby-less Spurs

[warriorfan]

Tell me more about bradley beal’s contract. i legit laugh out loud every
time.


Educate me.

[Kblaze8855]

At this point you’re just being willfully ignorant and dishonest. you said it was an albatross contract they would be stuck with. They paid a fraction of it and traded him easily when it was time. It did absolutely no harm to the team that signed it and they got picks out of it. That alone makes you factually incorrect. The fact that his contract is now on a team with two other guys one of which makes more than he does and the other is on a super max is even more proof. His contract is not large enough to keep a team from having other stars.

you are factually wrong on every point you were making at this point. All you have left is the hopes they don’t win a title, which is a long way from being destroyed or crippled, which you said would happen to any team that had his contract on it.

You don’t appear to have the maturity to acknowledge it, but it has done no tangible harm to anyone. But you feel a need to bring it up once a month or so as if all your initial claims weren’t already disproven the moment the team that signed it easily got out from under it with no harm done.

None of it is going to sink in because you decided in advance you couldn’t be wrong. Doesn’t make it true. These contracts just aren’t as significant and immobile as people like you always think they are. The next one won’t be either. But you’ll have the same thing to say. Then it will also prove to be of no consequence.

[ImKobe]

Beal's contract is terrible. That's a fact. There's no way around it. That's like justifying Tobias Harris' contract in 2019. Philly tried to trade his ass for years and no one went for it. They paid 35-40 mil a year for a glorified role player. At least Harris has been healthy and consistent in his production for the most part, can't say the same about Beal since he signed that deal.

[Axe]

Beal's contract is terrible. That's a fact. There's no way around it. That's like justifying Tobias Harris' contract in 2019. Philly tried to trade his ass for years and no one went for it. They paid 35-40 mil a year for a glorified role player. At least Harris has been healthy and consistent in his production for the most part, can't say the same about Beal since he signed that deal.

Zach lavine of the bulls sit close to him lol. I mean his contract.

[warriorfan]

At this point you’re just being willfully ignorant and dishonest. you said it was an albatross contract they would be stuck with. They paid a fraction of it and traded him easily when it was time. It did absolutely no harm to the team that signed it and they got picks out of it. That alone makes you factually incorrect. The fact that his contract is now on a team with two other guys one of which makes more than he does and the other is on a super max is even more proof. His contract is not large enough to keep a team from having other stars.

you are factually wrong on every point you were making at this point. All you have left is the hopes they don’t win a title, which is a long way from being destroyed or crippled, which you said would happen to any team that had his contract on it.

You don’t appear to have the maturity to acknowledge it, but it has done no tangible harm to anyone. But you feel a need to bring it up once a month or so as if all your initial claims weren’t already disproven the moment the team that signed it easily got out from under it with no harm done.

None of it is going to sink in because you decided in advance you couldn’t be wrong. Doesn’t make it true. These contracts just aren’t as significant and immobile as people like you always think they are. The next one won’t be either. But you’ll have the same thing to say. Then it will also prove to be of no consequence.

this is max cringe

[Kblaze8855]

Beal's contract is terrible. That's a fact. There's no way around it. That's like justifying Tobias Harris' contract in 2019. Philly tried to trade his ass for years and no one went for it. They paid 35-40 mil a year for a glorified role player. At least Harris has been healthy and consistent in his production for the most part, can't say the same about Beal since he signed that deal.

when Harris‘s contract is small enough that you can also have Harden and Embiid on the team it’s not doing tangible harm. The 76ers are 16th in salary. They were 15th before that. They got up to 7th before that just behind Utah. Only year higher they were the top seed that year Ben had the refusal to dunk it moment vs the Hawks. They definitely have not been short on talent. No contract that can coexist with two other top players is the issue. The issue is them choosing Harris instead of Jimmy Butler. Harris at 32 instead of 37 they drop down to a bottom 10 payroll in the league last year. But you aren’t adding anyone significant with $5 million in savings that still has you over the cap.

Pay him 25 they’re capped out anyway. The problem isn’t how much he was paid. It was choosing to pay him in the first place when they should’ve paid Jimmy Butler.

I don’t know how many Max players people think a team is supposed to be able to have. They have reduced the top pay so you can generally accommodate three of them. We think team should be able to have four? Five? And for the record teams can do that as well if they want to make the massive luxury tax payment the Warriors made to win that last title.

As I’ve been saying, we give cheap teams too much leeway. Anyone who decides they want to go get a lot of talent can go get it if players are willing to play for your organization. A lot of teams just don’t attempt to do it. Big contracts no longer occupy enough of the cap to keep anyone down. You can no longer make a mistake like signing Juwan Howard for seven years where you pay him 43% of the cap(61 million today).

off the top of my head nobody these days get the deal big enough that you can’t build a borderline super team, even if they sat out completely. Last year you could take 40 million and throw it in the trash. Pay it to you or me to literally never arrive at the facility. You could do that I have the salary of the MVP that season(Embiid) And the MVP of the previous season(Jokic) And the $82 million short of the clippers payroll that year. Light 40 million on fire and pay two veteran MVPs. You can still spend 80 million and not have a highest payroll.

There is an absurd amount of wiggle room for teams that want to use it. I think we scapegoat the wrong people. Most teams that are shit are shit because they either can’t convince people to play for them or they choose the wrong ones be it draft or free agency. The system is rigged, so no individual you pay can be the reason your team isn’t talented. I’m really not sure it’s possible anymore. You can pay the wrong person. But you cant pay them enough to be the reason you suck anymore and fans let these owners cheap out without a peep way too often.

[Kblaze8855]

this is max cringe

whatever you want to call it. You called it a suicidal contract and one year later they traded it for the seventh pick in the draft(not that I have any idea if he will be good or not ), The ability to take the suns first rounders all the way out to 2030(which would be useful if he actually did destroy the suns), and they’re set to be under the cap this off-season next off-season and the one after that. They signed the contract, didn’t have to pay it, sent him where he decided, and got draft considerations and ended up with immense cap space going forward while tanking for picks. I don’t need you to say you were wrong. You aren’t stupid enough to not realize that isn’t suicide.

It’s exactly what I told you all those contracts were. A calculated overpay of second and third tier guys in order to implement a system, where you don’t have to pay the true legends what they’re worth. It all went exactly the way it was meant to go if bailing were the call by either side and the Wizards end up in position for a top 3 pick, with little salary on the books going forward, a bunch of pick swaps if the suns fall apart, a lottery pick from the previous year, and Beal gets to play with talent as his career winds down.

Win win. That can rarely be said of suicide.

[ImKobe]

when Harris‘s contract is small enough that you can also have Harden and Embiid on the team it’s not doing tangible harm. The 76ers are 16th in salary. They were 15th before that. They got up to 7th before that just behind Utah. Only year higher they were the top seed that year Ben had the refusal to dunk it moment vs the Hawks. They definitely have not been short on talent. No contract that can coexist with two other top players is the issue. The issue is them choosing Harris instead of Jimmy Butler. Harris at 32 instead of 37 they drop down to a bottom 10 payroll in the league last year. But you aren’t adding anyone significant with $5 million in savings that still has you over the cap.

Pay him 25 they’re capped out anyway. The problem isn’t how much he was paid. It was choosing to pay him in the first place when they should’ve paid Jimmy Butler.

I don’t know how many Max players people think a team is supposed to be able to have. They have reduced the top pay so you can generally accommodate three of them. We think team should be able to have four? Five? And for the record teams can do that as well if they want to make the massive luxury tax payment the Warriors made to win that last title.

As I’ve been saying, we give cheap teams too much leeway. Anyone who decides they want to go get a lot of talent can go get it if players are willing to play for your organization. A lot of teams just don’t attempt to do it. Big contracts no longer occupy enough of the cap to keep anyone down. You can no longer make a mistake like signing Juwan Howard for seven years where you pay him 43% of the cap(61 million today).

off the top of my head nobody these days get the deal big enough that you can’t build a borderline super team, even if they sat out completely. Last year you could take 40 million and throw it in the trash. Pay it to you or me to literally never arrive at the facility. You could do that I have the salary of the MVP that season(Embiid) And the MVP of the previous season(Jokic) And the $82 million short of the clippers payroll that year. Light 40 million on fire and pay two veteran MVPs. You can still spend 80 million and not have a highest payroll.

There is an absurd amount of wiggle room for teams that want to use it. I think we scapegoat the wrong people. Most teams that are shit are shit because they either can’t convince people to play for them or they choose the wrong ones be it draft or free agency. The system is rigged, so no individual you pay can be the reason your team isn’t talented. I’m really not sure it’s possible anymore. You can pay the wrong person. But you cant pay them enough to be the reason you suck anymore and fans let these owners cheap out without a peep way too often.

It's just not a good contract. You can defend it by saying that the team's over the cap anyway, but they can't move off that contract if they wanted to. They took on all that salary and gave up all those picks for someone who's slightly more productive than a 38 y.o Chris Paul. They're going to be limited in their roster moves and they're going to be in tax hell moving forward. Good luck.

[Kblaze8855]

Hell is a punishment, not a decision. The owner decided immediately on arrival this is what he wanted to do and they did it. The luxury tax is only a problem for an owner who says it’s a problem. The person paying it doesn’t care it does no tangible harm aside from factored in things like eligibility for certain options after buyouts. He’s a banking and mortgage billionaire. and a college basketball player. I have a feeling he understands what he agreed to pay and for how long and to who. You think the luxury tax implications snuck up on him and he found out after the deal? If he wants to use some of his 8 billion to stack players and give the whole Phoenix area the games for free over the air that’s his business.

We should have more owners like that, not less. The cheap ones just lose anyway. You can go for it or you can be the pacers:

“I ain’t gon’ say the names, because I’m going to keep their business private, I’ma just say it like this: I had, at the time, the best power forward saying he wanted to come to Indy and team up with me,” George explained. “They’re like, ‘We’re a mid-major, we’re a small market. We can’t do it. We’re a small market and we can’t afford that.’ I’m like, ‘The best power forward wants to come play here! Y’all can’t make that work?’ They didn’t want to do it.
“So, now I’m pissed because it’s like, ‘What am I doing here?’ You know what I mean? They don’t want to win. I’ve got the best power forward that wants to come play here. Not everybody chooses Indy to come play at, but this dude wanted to come play here! They didn’t want to do it.”
Instead, George said that the Pacers tried to sell him on a different power forward.
“They call me up and, again, I’m gonna leave the names out, but now this person that they’re talking about [signing instead] is maybe a Top 20 or Top 25 power forward,” George said. “They put him up like, ‘Hey, how do you feel about this person?’ This other person that they were gonna sign in free agency [was] coming off an injury; I didn’t feel comfortable with that. After that phone call, I’m like, ‘They don’t get it.’ I call my agent like, ‘Man, get me up out of here, they don’t want to win.'”

The suns probably won’t win the way they’re trying it. Teams like the Pacers definitely won’t win.

If you arent willing to risk it, stay out of the game.

not that the suns are even as locked in as you would assume. They have less salary on the books than the Timberwolves do two years from now. That off-season they’re only $3 million off the Hawks. If they choose to play it that way in two years they’re gonna go into an off-season paying Beal and Booker and still 20+ million under the cap of right now which is going to be higher by then.

They’re going to pay them both an obscene amount of money and be under the salary cap. I promise you a guy who has billionaire banker accountants has someone on the staff who knows those numbers.

Beal is going to be a $57 million expiring contract going into an off-season when they are already 20 to 30 million under if they want to go hunting. They’re gonna end up trading him and another several years worth of picks to some disgruntled stars team that will use his expiring deal to clear cap space to throw at some other guy. Beal gets bought out and signs with a contender like all the washed rich guys do.

None of it is as dire as fans think it is. They’re going to go for it for two years and be in perfect position to reset “**** them picks” style again. There is no such thing as a true long-term problem. The way the league has set up contracts? No more seven year Rashard Lewis deals.

Everyone is a couple years from being an asset. The NBA has totally removed long-term problems. You just go for it. If it doesn’t work, you change directions in two years. If you think they can’t all I can tell you is wait and see. It’s not as tough as you imagine.

[wagexslave]

They also beat the Nuggets the very next game.

Those 2 games are a perfect display of how this team has been all year. Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde ass season.

A big part of it is coaching, sadly. Vogel and the coaching staff just lets them go out there and live or die by sloppy iso ball most of the time. I still like Vogel in a playoff setting better than Monty, but this team would be so much better if they had an offensive guru coach who cares about the X's and O's, and had this team running more set plays with way more ball movement and guys getting involved. They're such a dangerous team when they're moving the ball and picking up the pace.

The coaching staff in general has failed to consistently keep them focused/motivated from game to game... even quarter to quarter they often play with completely different hustle levels. Beal even admitted the other night that they expected the Spurs game to be "easy". But it wasn't. This is the NBA. If a bad team plays a really good game for their level, and a good team plays a bad & lazy game for their level, generally the bad team will win. Regardless, there's no excuse to take teams lightly when you're fighting to avoid a play-in spot. Why even play with fire?

If they just played with the type of hustle and energy they brought vs the Nugs more often then they'll win so many more games. "Playing with their food" has cost them so many wins this year, especially when they take their foot off the gas and try to coast in 4th quarters. Shit's so annoying.

[highwhey]