What's a better starting hand (poker analogy)

[ShawkFactory]

It's not nonsense at all. In the 2022 playoffs Wiggins put up identical Pippen offensive production and he was playing straight jacket lock down defense on the opposing teams best player. Outside of 1991, Pippen never even had a playoff run that matched 2022 Wiggins.

Just a factually false statement. Looking at the raw and advanced numbers (which is what we're going to go off of here because you watched Wiggins and didn't watch Pippen), Wiggins' 2022 would have been literally the worst production of Pippens runs between 90-98. By a decent margin in several of them.

And this is of course excluding the always selectively omitted era difference.

[tpols]

Just a factually false statement. Looking at the raw and advanced numbers (which is what we're going to go off of here because you watched Wiggins and didn't watch Pippen), Wiggins' 2022 would have been literally the worst production of Pippens runs between 90-98. By a decent margin in several of them.

And this is of course excluding the always selectively omitted era difference.

Wiggins averaged 18/9/2 on 45% shooting while totally locking Tatum up and holding him to one of the worst series of his career.

Those are Pippen numbers on average and defense but with better efficiency. I suggest you look into what Pippen shot '96-'98, '93, and '99. You might learn a thing or two.

Don't get mad at the facts. They are what they are.

[ShawkFactory]

Wiggins averaged 18/9/2 on 45% shooting while totally locking Tatum up and holding him to one of the worst series of his career.

Those are Pippen numbers on average and defense but with better efficiency. I suggest you look into what Pippen shot '96-'98, '93, and '99. You might learn a thing or two.

Don't get mad at the facts. They are what they are.

Facts

We’re now boiling equal Pippen production down to selectively choosing a couple of years where Wiggins’s FG% in 2022 was marginally better than?!

This is an intense level of trolling. Even for you.

[tpols]

selectively choosing a couple of years

A couple of years?

'93, '96, '97, and '98 are 4/6 of pippens prime years. I didn't even mention the '94 "sit out game" choke job or 1992 where Pippen was factually outplayed by the X-man and almost allowed the Knicks to win when they were huge underdogs.

You need do to more research pal.

[ShawkFactory]

A couple of years?

'93, '96, '97, and '98 are 4/6 of pippens prime years. I didn't even mention the '94 "sit out game" choke job or 1992 where Pippen was factually outplayed by the X-man and almost allowed the Knicks to win when they were huge underdogs.

You need do to more research pal.

So we've gone from Wiggins putting up a playoff run as good as Pippen ever has to discussing FG% in some years and mentioning random series or plays in others. You don't realize it but you've already lost.

This while still hilariously ignoring the era difference in FG% in general. I know for a fact that shit wouldn't fly with you were your agenda in favor of someone from that era

Quite comical, so thank you for that.

Over the years I've watched almost all of those games btw. At least ones after the first round.

[tpols]

So we've gone from Wiggins putting up a playoff run as good as Pippen ever has to discussing FG% in some years

We're not discussing "FG% in some years"... I gave you Pippens production in his prime years and you accused me us of cherrypicking lmao.

The fact of the matter is Andrew Wiggins at his best was a Pippen level talent (honestly even higher ) and player BUT he was initially drafted to a dogshit franchise which stunted his growth. While Pippen was drafted to the... literally... GOAT situation.

[ShawkFactory]

We're not discussing "FG% in some years"... I gave you Pippens production in his prime years and you accused me us of cherrypicking lmao.

The fact of the matter is Andrew Wiggins at his best was a Pippen level talent (honestly even higher ) and player BUT he was initially drafted to a dogshit franchise which stunted his growth. While Pippen was drafted to the... literally... GOAT situation.

No you didn't. You gave his FG% in some of the years. That is quite literally the definition of cherrypicking

[SouBeachTalents]

We're not discussing "FG% in some years"... I gave you Pippens production in his prime years and you accused me us of cherrypicking lmao.

The fact of the matter is Andrew Wiggins at his best was a Pippen level talent (honestly even higher ) and player BUT he was initially drafted to a dogshit franchise which stunted his growth. While Pippen was drafted to the... literally... GOAT situation.

Absolutely ridiculous. Wiggins isn't even close to the passer/playmaker Pippen was, and outside of literally one playoff run, not even close to the rebounder either.

[tpols]

Absolutely ridiculous. Wiggins isn't even close to the passer/playmaker Pippen was, and outside of literally one playoff run, not even close to the rebounder either.

That's literally exactly what I said.

"Outside of literally one playoff run."

Yes... that is the playoff run I mentioned.

The one where Wiggins averaged 18/9 on good shooting while playing lockdown defense. That's Scottie Pippen level impact. (minus the good shooting)

The point is neither of these guys were MVP talents and it took huge carry jobs from MJ and Curry to win titles.

[ShawkFactory]

I wonder what the response would be if we discussed prime Reggie Miller going 23/3/3 on 45% during his prime in the playoffs and Donovan Mitchell going 30/6/5 on 46% so far in his. Could be interesting.

[Full Court]

Wiggins averaged 18/9/2 on 45% shooting while totally locking Tatum up and holding him to one of the worst series of his career.

Those are Pippen numbers on average and defense but with better efficiency. I suggest you look into what Pippen shot '96-'98, '93, and '99. You might learn a thing or two.

Don't get mad at the facts. They are what they are.

Efficiency in general is higher than it was in the 90s due to it being much easier to score. I don't think it's a fair comparison to put Pippen's efficiency against Wiggins'.

[tpols]

Scottie Pippen didn't have Reggies jumper. He'd probably be even worse in today's league where defense isn't prioritized and shooting is at a premium. That isn't even remotely a good argument. But you guys can pivot when you know you've taken an L. It's okay. The carousel will keep on spinning.

[ShawkFactory]

Reggie from 96-98: 20/3/2 on 41%
Klay from 15-18: 20/4/2 on 44%

Interesting.

[ShawkFactory]

Efficiency in general is higher than it was in the 90s due to it being much easier to score. I don't think it's a fair comparison to put Pippen's efficiency against Wiggins'.

Hmmmm....

[tpols]

How did we go from Wiggins matching Pippens best year to Reggie (factually) being better than Pippen in the playoffs to Klays 15ppg 35% shooting ass?



I wouldnt be surprised if Elden Campbell and Jamal Mashburn were the next guys to be brought up. You fellas are running a new carousel with each argument lost.