What's a better starting hand (poker analogy)

[ShawkFactory]

How did we go from Wiggins matching Pippens best year to Reggie (factually) being better than Pippen in the playoffs to Klays 15ppg 35% shooting ass?


I wouldnt be surprised if Elden Campbell and Jamal Mashburn were the next guys to be brought up. You fellas are running a new carousel with each argument lost.

I've posted nothing but facts.

[3ba11]

How many All-NBA and All Defensive teams did Wiggins make? Surely he must have more than Pippen since he avg. more PPG than Pip, no?? Wiggins ever finish top 3 in MVP voting?

Before Pippen won titles, he had the same number of All-NBA as Wiggins - zero.. Pippen's caliber was Iguodala or Wiggins, but the winning spotlight inflated him to media accolade and all-time status.. Otherwise, his pedestrian "wiggins" stats and transition player type (mainly a dunker) would be just another guy with okay stats, kind of like Wiggins was.. There have always been tons of guys like that.

Pippen was just lucky that his pedestrian stats and caliber was carried to 6 titles, aka 19 on 42% in 6 Finals and 0/6 in matching Horry's gamescore from the 95' Finals, so it was a low bar to find guys that could match Pippen.. And Kukoc led Pippen in 4th quarter scoring for the entire 98' Playoffs, so it took nothing to supplant Pippen as 2nd option - he was only a 2nd option alongside the goat scorer, otherwise he wasn't a 2nd option because 2nd options still had to be go-to players, which Pippen was not.

[3ba11]

Facts

We’re now boiling equal Pippen production down to selectively choosing a couple of years where Wiggins’s FG% in 2022 was marginally better than?!

This is an intense level of trolling. Even for you.

Advanced box score stats (PER, BPM, etc) for cast members (non-1st options) are always correlated with system and the how a team uses it's supplementary pieces, but the 4th quarter, clutch and impact stats usually paint the right picture (below):

PLAYOFFS

22' Wiggins....... 6.4 plus-minus..... 9.3 net rating
97' Pippen'........ 6.4 plus-minus..... 8.6 net rating
98' Pippen'........ 5.6 plus-minus..... 8.1 net rating


FINALS

22' Wiggins....... 4.8 plus-minus..... 7.1 net rating
97' Pippen'........ 1.7 plus-minus..... 1.1 net rating
98' Pippen'........ 4.7 plus-minus..... 7.0 net rating


4th Quarter Finals

22' Wiggins..... 5.0 on 61%
98' Pippen'...... 2.8 on 31%
97' Pippen'...... 5.5 on 40%


Clutch-time Finals

98' Pippen'...... 1.6 on 25%
97' Pippen'...... 1.0 on 12%
22' Wiggins..... 1.0 on 100%

When did Pippen ever shoot 60% in 4th quarters or 100% in clutch-time?

And how could a team win a close series with a player bricking every shot in the 4th and clutch-time?

Wiggins was the kind of go-to player and clutch shot-maker that Pippen never was - this is shown in the 4th quarter and clutch-time efficiency, which translates to higher impact numbers like plus-minus and net rating..

Wiggins was a 19-year old rookie that averaged 17-24 right away (#1 pick), while Pippen was a 23-year old rookie and 8 ppg, so Wiggins was the far superior talent and therefore had more for MJ to develop - if MJ developed Pippen into an all-time player, than he would've done it even more so with Wiggins.. And remember that Wiggins was a 24 ppg player outside the system, while Pippen was literally nothing outside the system and worse than prime Jeff Green..

In addition to greater raw talent and go-to offense that didn't require system, Wiggins had a signature lockdown performance as the primary defender vs Tatum, which Pippen never had.

Ultimately, Pippen is a litmus test for how MJ develops long, athletic wings because Pippen was the bottom of the barrel as a 24-year old rookie that averaged 8 ppg - so Wiggins was far more talented and therefore had more capacity to develop to greater heights than Pippen ever did.. So given Wiggins' superior talent, MJ would've won earlier and easier with Wiggins since Wiggins was getting 17-24 right away as a 19-year old number 1 pick, instead of waiting 5 years for 27-year old Pippen to finally scrape 20 ppg.

Btw, in addition to Pippen's 97' and 98' Finals falling short of 22' Wiggins based on raw numbers, 4th quarter, clutch, or impact stats (plus/minus & net rating), his 96' Finals was the worst of his career (15.7 on 34%), so that's 3 runs that are equal or worse than 22' Wiggins