Will Jokic surpass Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan?

[kawhileonard2]

Will Jokic surpass Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan?

[L.Kizzle]

Once he wins some championships it can be a discussion.

[FultzNationRISE]

Well, splitting hairs to rank guys in a similar tier is a popular fan past time, but in reality its not a thing. There is no objective way to prove whether Duncan is better than Hakeem or vice versa. You can have an opinion but it’s realistically more about circumstance than about some measurable criteria.

Point is, there is no level of big man tier beyond Jokic’s belonging. Hes already as good as the guys you mentioned in my book.

[FultzNationRISE]

Once he wins some championships it can be a discussion.

So you dont have Malone or Barkley above McHale?

[L.Kizzle]

So you dont have Malone or Barkley above McHale?

McHale was the 4th best player in his team and only started 4 seasons in his career. Bad comparison.

[Im Still Ballin]

McHale wad the 4th best player in his team and only started 4 seasons in his career. Bad comparison.

Bro. Did you miss this thread? Check out how high McHale is.

A guy went back and tracked plus-minus and calculated RAPM for the 1987-88 season

[tpols]

Once he wins some championships it can be a discussion.

His help is alright but give him prime Kobe or clyde and he's winning.

[L.Kizzle]

Bro. Did you miss this thread? Check out how high McHale is.

A guy went back and tracked plus-minus and calculated RAPM for the 1987-88 season

I saw it.

[SaltyMeatballs]

He's gonna have to win at least 2 championships to be in the discussion

[ShawkFactory]

McHale wad the 4th best player in his team and only started 4 seasons in his career. Bad comparison.

That’s a new one.

[John8204]

Will Jokic surpass Hakeem, Shaq, Duncan?

Hakeem - not possible maybe if he gets a three-peat 2 MVP's in an era in which he wasn't winning and a ring this year puts him top 15.

Duncan - borderline top ten all-time for me Jokic is likely a top 30 guy

Shaq - this is actually doable for Jokic if he never leaves Denver and wins two titles that's better than what Shaq did...he's on pace to surpass Shaq in my eyes

[Phoenix]

Well, splitting hairs to rank guys in a similar tier is a popular fan past time, but in reality its not a thing. There is no objective way to prove whether Duncan is better than Hakeem or vice versa. You can have an opinion but it’s realistically more about circumstance than about some measurable criteria.

Point is, there is no level of big man tier beyond Jokic’s belonging. Hes already as good as the guys you mentioned in my book.

True, but at least Hakeem and Duncan's eras were close apart enough( there was even a cross-section between young Duncan and old Hakeem in the late 90s/early 2000s) that you could reasonably guesstimate how one does in the others spot and compare skills. For me Hakeem was clearly a more talented and prolific post scorer and overall defender, as great as Duncan was in both departments. Joker's era, though, is so far apart in terms of passage of time, how the game is played in general and what skills are even required from a big nowadays to be dominant that there really is no way to measure them beyond dominance relative to their contemporaries.

[FultzNationRISE]

True, but at least Hakeem and Duncan's eras were close apart enough( there was even a cross-section between young Duncan and old Hakeem in the late 90s/early 2000s) that you could reasonably guesstimate how one does in the others spot and compare skills. For me Hakeem was clearly a more talented and prolific post scorer and overall defender, as great as Duncan was in both departments. Joker's era, though, is so far apart in terms of passage of time, how the game is played in general and what skills are even required from a big nowadays to be dominant that there really is no way to measure them beyond dominance relative to their contemporaries.

True.

Altho for the people who see championships as some gatekeeper criterion, they must all surely consider Duncan twice as good as Hakeem, no? If championships are what we rank guys with, Duncan has to be above Lebron, Bird, and Hakeem for sure.

[Phoenix]

True.

Altho for the people who see championships as some gatekeeper criterion, they must all surely consider Duncan twice as good as Hakeem, no? If championships are what we rank guys with, Duncan has to be above Lebron, Bird, and Hakeem for sure.

I'm assuming that's why many (most?) have him ranked higher on GOAT lists. IMO Hakeem clearly peaked higher, not some massive gap but I think its fairly obvious. Duncan was able to age gracefully as guys like Ginobli, Parker and young Kawhi became more promiment in their success, where the Rockets were only as great as Hakeem was going to be until he fell out of his prime.

[ArbitraryWater]

He genuinely might surpass Duncan.

I see him surpassing him tbh.

Probably staying behind Shaq and Hakeem though.