ESPN all time rankings: 40-11

[ImKobe]

So you agree LeBron is top 2 when they inevitably rank him 2?

Good to know

Kobe is top 10 on ESPNs list because he died 2 months ago. Congrats

I don't agree with ESPN rankings at all, it's just hilarious how you're melting down over LeSPN rankings. They'll have Lebron as high as possible because that's who's currently the face of their league. He'll be left in the dust like everyone else once his time is over. Jordan's the only ATG who's consistently been ranked in the same spot (1).

Still don’t see any consistency in the rankings

I will say KG, Dirk and Admiral seem underrated there though. Giannis rank is a placeholder

I think D-Rob is actually ranked fairly enough, considering how disappointing his prime was Playofs-wise. Surprised Kawhi's just 25 with how they ranked Curry & Durant. You'd think a 2x DPOY & 2x FMVP would be a top 20 lock, though you could argue that his prime hasn't been long enough to warrant such a high ranking yet.

[Phoenix]

Still don’t see any consistency in the rankings

I will say KG, Dirk and Admiral seem underrated there though. Giannis rank is a placeholder

There never will be, because it's tough to lock down the criteria. Some of these rankings are just invariably going to lead to odd conclusions in some cases, and getting it generally right in others.

[Roundball_Rock]

I can't believe how Kawhi is getting on these lists. How many great seasons has he had at this point?

Curry too high but probably because of his impact on the style of the game.

[Phoenix]

I can't believe how Kawhi is getting on these lists. How many great seasons has he had at this point?

Curry too high but probably because of his impact on the style of the game.

Yeah. Kawhi wasn't really a star until 2015 as far as being an all NBA player. Barely played in 2018. My guess is last year has led to some recently bias. My thing is, as far as 'peak' I feel he's in the top 40 but he hasn't had a top 25 career yet by any means. So maybe it's a projection of where they expect him to be based on what they're expecting out of him over the next 2-3 years, but I think that's a flawed metric *if* that's part of what they're doing.

[Roundball_Rock]

Yeah. Kawhi wasn't really a star until 2015 as far as being an all NBA player. Barely played in 2018. My guess is last year has led to some recently bias. My thing is, as far as 'peak' I feel he's in the top 40 but he hasn't had a top 25 career yet by any means. So maybe it's a projection of where they expect him to be based on what they're expecting out of him over the next 2-3 years, but I think that's a flawed metric *if* that's part of what they're doing.

Agree with everything. Especially the last part. You can't do history that way. Injuries happen. Dwight Howard circa 2012 looked like he was on his way to a top 50 career and it didn't happen. T Mac. Grant Hill. Rose. And so on.

I think Kawhi has the potential to finish that high but right now he is riding recency bias. If his knees are as bad as "load management" defenders claim, and he lacks longevity, then I can see him sliding back as the recency bias fades. His resume is not close to top 50 but he deserves to be in because of his peak and his elite defense that is Pippen-like but putting him top 25 today is crazy.

[Lebron23]

Still don’t see any consistency in the rankings

I will say KG, Dirk and Admiral seem underrated there though. Giannis rank is a placeholder

I don't agree with ESPN rankings at all, it's just hilarious how you're melting down over LeSPN rankings. They'll have Lebron as high as possible because that's who's currently the face of their league. He'll be left in the dust like everyone else once his time is over. Jordan's the only ATG who's consistently been ranked in the same spot (1).




I think D-Rob is actually ranked fairly enough, considering how disappointing his prime was Playofs-wise. Surprised Kawhi's just 25 with how they ranked Curry & Durant. You'd think a 2x DPOY & 2x FMVP would be a top 20 lock, though you could argue that his prime hasn't been long enough to warrant such a high ranking yet.

LeBron is way better than Kobe. Soon to be a 5thtime nba mvp, 4x finals mvp.

[Phoenix]

Agree with everything. Especially the last part. You can't do history that way. Injuries happen. Dwight Howard circa 2012 looked like he was on his way to a top 50 career and it didn't happen. T Mac. Grant Hill. Rose. And so on.

I think Kawhi has the potential to finish that high but right now he is riding recency bias. If his knees are as bad as "load management" defenders claim, and he lacks longevity, then I can see him sliding back as the recency bias fades. His resume is not close to top 50 but he deserves to be in because of his peak and his elite defense that is Pippen-like but putting him top 25 today is crazy.

And even taking last year on its own merits, I don't think many would pick the Raptors to win that finals with KD and Klay healthy. In fairness, you can only play who's in front of you so kudos for taking advantage of the situation, and he did have a great postseason, but all of these things need some level of context if it's not possible to be entirely objective or judge on a straight line. And I like Kawhi alot but yeah, I can't get onboard with that ranking.

[ImKobe]

LeBron is way better than Kobe. Soon to be a 5thtime nba mvp, 4x finals mvp.

Giannis was the clear MVP favorite so that's a no, and these Playoffs would be a huge asterisk anyway if they're even able to do it.

[Roundball_Rock]

For sure. There are three big flaws I consistently see with how people rate Kawhi:


1) What you mentioned, injuries. If the Warriors aren't decimated (KD, Klay, Cousins) they win the series. Even with KD out the Warriors were on track to win before Klay went down. So how does injury luck make Kawhi a better player?
2) The narrative is "Kawhi carried the Raptors." The available evidence contradicts this. They went 17-5 without him that season (63 win pace). This season they had the third best record in the NBA, better than the Clippers in fact, without him. It is clear the Raptors weren't Kawhi and scrubs.
3) People merge current Kawhi with young Kawhi. When the Spurs won in 14' Duncan got most of the credit on ISH and in the media coverage. Now it is portrayed as Kawhi was the leading figure. In fact Kawhi was a 13/6/2 player back then. He did not make his first all-star team until 2016 (his 5th season).

I think a lot of these will correct over time as the bias fades, though.

[ArbitraryWater]

Pip ahead of Wade


oh there's some mad folks now

Pip ahead of Chuck however, cringeworthy...

Curry at 13???

Looks right to me.

[ArbitraryWater]

Kobe getting a post-death boost here

[AlternativeAcc.]

Curry at 13 is the biggest joke of all

Jersey sales/popularity reasons

Can't upset those Asian teenagers and little kids, I get it

But he's not even top 50 for real fans

[Whoah10115]

Kobe outside the top 10 is embarrassing.

[petezahut]

Zion should already be number 1

[SouBeachTalents]

Kobe outside the top 10 is embarrassing.

He's gonna be in their top 10