Jason Kidd in Last 13 Games.....Yikes

[Clifton]

He has been washed up for a long time. I still find it outrageous that people found him to be one of the best players on that Mavs championship team.

Veteran presence. He could seriously shoot 20% for the playoffs and the team would be better off with him on the court for 20 and JR Smith for 30 rather than JR Smith for 40.

This team wins nothing without JKidd. Neither do those Mavs. You *need* a guy like him. Especially if you're such an unbalanced team like the Knicks (JR, Felton, Melo, Amare, a ton of old guys who will be injured every other game so your lineup's never the same...)

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Huh? Kidd knocked down 20 more three's than Dirk in those playoffs (lead the team with 43 threes), dished out twice as many assists as the next highest Mav (153 assists to Barea's 71), and lead the team in steals (40 in 21 games). Not to mention the intangible impact he had and defensive edge he provides at his position. No need to denigrate him and his performance. Fact that he won a championship with the team that drafted him is even more badass.

So Kidd is more important to the team then Dirk to you? The guy who averaged 28 points in the play off's? Shooting a better percent then Kidd despite taking way more shots? Kid averaged 9 and 7 in the play off's. Dirk averaged 28 points a game. Do realize how hard that is to accomplish? Most of the shots Dirk made were high difficulty shots. It wasn't like Kidd's existence was making it easy on Dirk. Dirk was just that good. He willed that championship on his own. And he got some help when he struggled in the finals.

[Clifton]

Kid averaged 9 and 7 in the play off's. Dirk averaged 28 points a game. Do realize how hard that is to accomplish?

Obviously Dirk is the MVP of that team and not Kidd; that doesn't mean they could have won the title without Kidd though. Great as Dirk is, there is something he lacks that JKidd brings. The greatness of Larry Bird is that he was both players rolled into one; the ability to sustain a heavy load on offense *and* bring those intangibles are what separate the "big 6" who have an argument for GOAT from guys like Karl Malone and Dirk.

It wasn't like Kidd's existence was making it easy on Dirk. Dirk was just that good. He willed that championship on his own.

Well, despite winning 55 games in the regular season for ten straight years, he sure didn't "will that championship on his own" any season other than when he had JKidd. Sure didn't against the Warriors in 07. Didn't against the Heat in 06.

[SCdac]

So Kidd is more important to the team then Dirk to you?

No, he wasn't more important, but this statement by you is just trollish and retarded:

He has been washed up for a long time. I still find it outrageous that people found him to be one of the best players on that Mavs championship team.

Did you even watch the playoffs? Kidd played 37 mpg in the WCF and Finals. That's about how much Parker plays in the playoffs for instance

[Sarcastic]

You're retarded. Kidd started off the season playing great but his age has caught up with him. He shouldn't be playing more than 20 mins a game - Woodson's distribution of minutes is at fault here.

Exactly. Kidd was originally signed to be the backup to Jeremy Lin, and be his tutor and provide leadership. He was not signed to be a starting shooting guard playing near 30 minutes per game. Woodson is an ass.

[bagelred]

In 13 games, Kidd has made only three 2-point field goals. THREE in 13 games. All his other points (which aren't many) were 3 pointers. That's Steve Novak territory.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Obviously Dirk is the MVP of that team and not Kidd; that doesn't mean they could have won the title without Kidd though. Great as Dirk is, there is something he lacks that JKidd brings. The greatness of Larry Bird is that he was both players rolled into one; the ability to sustain a heavy load on offense *and* bring those intangibles are what separate the "big 6" who have an argument for GOAT from guys like Karl Malone and Dirk.


Well, despite winning 55 games in the regular season for ten straight years, he sure didn't "will that championship on his own" any season other than when he had JKidd. Sure didn't against the Warriors in 07. Didn't against the Heat in 06.

Kidd was replaceable and his intangibles were overrated. Had that same team had Devin Harris as the PG they would have been a better team. Dirk wasn't replaceable.

[Clutch]

Kidd was great to start the season but in the last 2 months he's been absolutely horrible. He's not making many mistakes but he's not helping us either.

[Clifton]

Kidd was replaceable and his intangibles were overrated. Had that same team had Devin Harris as the PG they would have been a better team.

Dude, your screen name is HorryIsMyMVP... even it agrees with me.

But seriously, think of what that kind of thinking does to teams. That's Mark Cuban thinking: "I could have a solid roleplayer who can't really do anything other than play defense... or I could have Antoine Walker. AND Antoine Jamison. Those guys score 20 points a game, that's awesome. I wonder why they're so easy to trade for and Shane Battier's so hard." Devin Harris is one of dozens and dozens of players who can score 20 points a night if you want but who won't make your team better. Shane Battier will go weeks shooting under 30% from 3, but just try and pry him from the Heat. Quality programs know what makes a winner.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Dude, your screen name is HorryIsMyMVP... even it agrees with me.

But seriously, think of what that kind of thinking does to teams. That's Mark Cuban thinking: "I could have a solid roleplayer who can't really do anything other than play defense... or I could have Antoine Walker. AND Antoine Jamison. Those guys score 20 points a game, that's awesome. I wonder why they're so easy to trade for and Shane Battier's so hard." Devin Harris is one of dozens and dozens of players who can score 20 points a night if you want but who won't make your team better. Shane Battier will go weeks shooting under 30% from 3, but just try and pry him from the Heat. Quality programs know what makes a winner.

Devin Harris is a better defender then Kidd. He was younger and got a lot of steals. Played better pressure defense. Do you not remember when Harris played for the Mavs? I mean they certainly didn't have the team they had when they won it all. But everything Harris did outweighed anything Kidd did on the Mavs. In every regard of basketball. Harris was a superior player.

[Clifton]

Do you not remember when Harris played for the Mavs?

I remember him well. I thought he was one of the most overrated players in recent memory and I hated his game. I remember looking at box scores after games and not believing my eyes because he seemed to have such a negligible impact and to score by accident.

[shortsoptional]

Kidd needs a coach like Pop that will manage his minutes. Kidd was playing way too many minutes at the beginning of the season. He needs to be 20 minute a game guy who closes out games as the SG position.

He was terrible at the end of the 2011 regular season, and then Carlisle sat him down for a week or so before the playoffs. He came out and was a huge reason for Dallas beating Portland in game 1 (and obviously the entire playoffs).

He just needs to be managed well and given rest.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

I remember him well. I thought he was one of the most overrated players in recent memory and I hated his game. I remember looking at box scores after games and not believing my eyes because he seemed to have such a negligible impact and to score by accident.

Are you kidding? Harris use to shut down star point guards. He shut down prime Steve Nash.

[shortsoptional]

Devin Harris is a better defender then Kidd. He was younger and got a lot of steals. Played better pressure defense. Do you not remember when Harris played for the Mavs? I mean they certainly didn't have the team they had when they won it all. But everything Harris did outweighed anything Kidd did on the Mavs. In every regard of basketball. Harris was a superior player.

Um... no.

Defensively is debatable, but you need to actually watch those playoff games in 2011 if you don't think Kidd was great defensively. Great at anticipation, knowing where defensive rebounds (and offensive) were going to fall and guarding everyone from PG to SG to SF. He's very savvy and what he lacked in speed he made up for in strength and superior BBIQ.

With regards to Devin Haris, yes, his man defense on Tony Parker was superb and a large reason the Mavs didn't bring back Nash. They knew they would have to go through Parker every year if they wanted to win it all and Devin was the perfect defensive player for him. However, Devin didn't rotate on defense like Kidd did. He didn't place players in the correct positions like Kidd did. Defense goes beyond just manning up a defender and locking him down. It's a large part, but it's not all there is to it.

[HorryIsMyMVP]

Um... no.

Defensively is debatable, but you need to actually watch those playoff games in 2011 if you don't think Kidd was great defensively. Great at anticipation, knowing where defensive rebounds (and offensive) were going to fall and guarding everyone from PG to SG to SF. He's very savvy and what he lacked in speed he made up for in strength and superior BBIQ.

With regards to Devin Haris, yes, his man defense on Tony Parker was superb and a large reason the Mavs didn't bring back Nash. They knew they would have to go through Parker every year if they wanted to win it all and Devin was the perfect defensive player for him. However, Devin didn't rotate on defense like Kidd did. He didn't place players in the correct positions like Kidd did. Defense goes beyond just manning up a defender and locking him down. It's a large part, but it's not all there is to it.

Kidd has gotten blown up by almost every star point guard in the game. Do you remember when Chris Paul pounded his chest saying Kidd can't guard me? When he went right at Jason Kidd scoring 39 points?