Lebron fans unite

[IamRAMBO24]

Yep....my suspicions are correct. You're really dmavs

And like I said before, the real reason why you started backpeddling is cuz you already know you're making this up as you go along. I said name me 5 players and you still can't do it yet. While still claiming your supposed information is accurate. Theories have to be proven, but facts are facts. And if you actually had facts, you would've posted those 5 names already.

Who the f*ck is dmavs?

[BlackVVaves]

The FMVP is of course important, but you need both to be consider a legend. Bird, Magic, and of course Jordan are consider the best of all time because they won both MVP and FMVP.

In Kobe's case, his inability to win MVP on a consistent basis overrides his FMVP argument. Billups won FMVP but he was not the best player on the team or even in the league that year,.

Why isn't he winning it consistently if he is truly the best player in the league?

So when you are talking about individual performances, the MVP has more weight the FMVP, but both are equally important. Don't get me wrong.

So who deserved the FMVP that year? Ben Wallace?

The MVP is strictly media driven. Do you really think Nash was the best player in the league in 2005? No, that would be Shaq. But, Nash's and Phoenix's storyline, appeal, and rise made it an obvious choice as to who would win it.

Regardless, I'm not disputing that Lebron at this point is the better overall player. Stay on track. You were trying to make the case that Bron has been the better player and has the better career, which I have been and still am declaring wrong.

I'd also love to hear the three players who don't have a ring whom are higher in the All Time list than Kobe. Please, share with us.

[dude77]

this is a good gif .. I'm gonna steal it from you if you don't mind

[IamRAMBO24]

So who deserved the FMVP that year? Ben Wallace?

The MVP is strictly media driven. Do you really think Nash was the best player in the league in 2005? No, that would be Shaq. But, Nash's and Phoenix's storyline, appeal, and rise made it an obvious choice as to who would win it.

Regardless, I'm not disputing that Lebron at this point is the better overall player. Stay on track. You were trying to make the case that Bron has been the better player and has the better career, which I have been and still am declaring wrong.

I'd also love to hear the three players who don't have a ring whom are higher in the All Time list than Kobe. Please, share with us.

Yes Nash was the best that year based on impact couple with seed. He also lead the league in assists, which covers the 3 criteria of the best that year while Kobe is not.

What you stans don't realize is impact is the most important criteria to use as a measurement for MVP.

Face it, Kobe is too limited in his ability to be an impact type of player; he shoots too much from the perimeter (which allows the defense to stick to their man and not rotate for the help) and he is not known as a pass first player (which again, allows the defense to not care about the passing lane), plus rarely does he play the fast break which makes the D hustle back on defense and lose their positioning allowing the team to score an easy bucket.

Lebron does those things because he is more of a team player, which draws the defense to help and opens his teammates, hence why he is in the MVP conversation every year.

IMPACT > Chucking up shots

[BlackVVaves]

Yes Nash was the best that year based on impact couple with seed. He also lead the league in assists, which covers the 3 criteria of the best that year.

What you stans don't realize is impact is the most important criteria to use as a measurement for MVP.

Face it, Kobe is too limited in his ability to be an impact type of player; he shoots too much from the perimeter (which allows the defense to stick to their man and not rotate for the help) and he is not known as a pass first player (which again, allows the defense to not care about the passing lane).

And he doesn't make the defense hustle because rarely does he start the fast break.

First off, I'm not a Kobe stan, so cut that shit out right there. I'm one objective mother****er.

Second, yes, Kobe is so limited in making an impact that he was never a All NBA First Team member, never led his team in assists, and never was the second leading rebounder in a Game 7, which ultimately came down to rebounding and second chance points (and free throws) with 15 boards at the shooting guard position. Right?

Third, love how you keep ignoring everyone who is asking for these imaginary players whom don't have a ring but are higher-up in the All Time List than Kobe.

Kobe isn't the GOAT, isn't better than Jordan, and isn't the best player in the league right now. But I ****ing can't stand you people so obsessed with molding Lebron into a player you wish he would be, yet he keeps failing at becoming, that you resolve in eroding all other competition through belittling those players' career, like Kobe.

[LakersReign]

Who the f*ck is dmavs?

iamrambo24 = damvs

The ducking and dodging of the question, when you already know you made yourself look stupid, the long 6 paragraphs posts of rambling Kobe hatin' nonsense, the insistance of comparing Kobe to people 34-40 years ago, then claiming they're supposedly better than him, are all dead giveaways. You're totally incapable of coming up with something new, aren't you?

First off, I'm not a Kobe stan, so cut that shit out right there. I'm one objective mother****er.

Second, yes, Kobe is so limited in making an impact that he was never a All NBA First Team member, never led his team in assists, and never was the second leading rebounder in a Game 7, which ultimately came down to rebounding and second chance points (and free throws) with 15 boards at the shooting guard position. Right?

Third, love how you keep ignoring everyone who is asking for these imaginary players whom don't have a ring but are higher-up in the All Time List than Kobe.

Kobe isn't the GOAT, isn't better than Jordan, and isn't the best player in the league right now. But I ****ing can't stand you people so obsessed with molding Lebron into a player you wish he would be, yet he keeps failing at becoming, that you resolve in eroding all other competition through belittling those players' career, like Kobe.

OWNED!!!!

[IamRAMBO24]

First off, I'm not a Kobe stan, so cut that shit out right there. I'm one objective mother****er.

Second, yes, Kobe is so limited in making an impact that he was never a All NBA First Team member, never led his team in assists, and never was the second leading rebounder in a Game 7, which ultimately came down to rebounding and second chance points (and free throws) with 15 boards at the shooting guard position. Right?

Third, love how you keep ignoring everyone who is asking for these imaginary players whom don't have a ring but are higher-up in the All Time List than Kobe.

Kobe isn't the GOAT, isn't better than Jordan, and isn't the best player in the league right now. But I ****ing can't stand you people so obsessed with molding Lebron into a player you wish he would be, yet he keeps failing at becoming, that you resolve in eroding all other competition through belittling those players' career, like Kobe.

I quoted 3 players: Iceman, Wilkins, and Malone based on the 3 criterias that determine the worth, value, and talent of a player: impact, stats, seed.

Kobe rarely dominates in the one area he is good at: scoring. How many scoring titles does he have? Sure he put up 80 (which is impressive in it's own right), but has he done it consistently enough to dominate the scoring title? No.

How much of an impact has he had compare to Malone on the Jazz and Wilkins on the Blazers? You take out Kobe during the Shaq years, put in another solid player and can you with a straight face NOT exercise the idea that is a legit title contender?

You take out Malone on the Jazz or Lebron on the Cavs, what happens? Lottery team at best.

So f*ck you for not taking impact into consideration when you talk about which player is the better one.

Impact wins games. Highlights don't.

[LakersReign]

I quoted 3 players: Iceman, Wilkins, and Malone based on the 3 criterias that determine the worth, value, and talent of a player: impact, stats, seed.

Kobe rarely dominates in the one area he is good at: scoring. How many scoring titles does he have? Sure he put up 80 (which is impressive in it's own right), but has he done it consistently enough to dominate the scoring title? No.

How much of an impact has he had compare to Malone on the Jazz and Wilkins on the Blazers? You take out Kobe during the Shaq years, put in another solid player like Reggie Miller and can you with a straight face NOT exercise the idea that is a legit title contender?

You take out Malone on the Jazz or Lebron on the Cavs, what happens? Lottery team at best.

So f*ck you for not taking impact into consideration when you talk about which player is the better one.

Impact wins games. Highlights don't.

AND....ALL of that is YOUR hater opinion, since you have nothing legit to back it up , but your own opinion. Why is it that you originally stated that "there were so many players without a title that were/are better than Kobe", but NOW, can ONLY list 3 names? I asked you to list 5 names and you acted like you were getting a root canal, without novocaine. The fact of the matter is, you were talking out your a** like you always do, and didn't expect to get challenged. Since you're under some pathetic delusion that people just AUTOMATICALLY take your word on whatever you say, simply cuz you said it. Which is exactly why you can only list 3 names cuz you're making this all up out of your own hater opinion, that's why. You need to go back to no drama hoops and stay there..........dmavs/iamrambo24/indiefan23/indiefan24.




Nice try

[IamRAMBO24]

AND....ALL of that is YOUR hater opinion, since you have nothing legit to back it up , but your own opinion. Why is it that you originally stated that "there were so many players without a title that were/are better than Kobe", but NOW, can ONLY list 3 names? I asked you to list 5 names and you acted like you were getting a root canal, without novocaine. You can only list 3 names cuz you're making this all up out of your own hater opinion, that's why....dmavs.




Nice try

Haha you're too f*ckin stupid to NOT realize the straw you were trying to throw at my argument.

First I said "players." My original intent was 3 players.

Your dumba*s decided to convert that definition to mean 5 when all along I meant 3. I responded by saying, "I'll start with 1." I never accepted your definition dumbsh*t. All along I meant 3 and I have clearly stated the 3 that I feel is superior based on the criteria of MVP: impact, stats, seed.

If Kobe is so goddamn great, why has he not proven to fit those 3 criterias and win MVP every year? Y'know, like how great players do it.

[D-Wade316]

[LakersReign]

Haha you're too f*ckin stupid to NOT realize the straw you were trying to throw at my argument.

First I said "players." My original intent was 3 players.

Your dumba*s decided to convert that definition to mean 5 when all along I meant 3. I responded by saying, "I'll start with 1." I never accepted your definition dumbsh*t. All along I meant 3 and I have clearly stated the 3 that I feel is superior based on the criteria of MVP: impact, stats, seed.

If Kobe is so goddamn great, why has he not proven to fit those 3 criterias and win MVP every year? Y'know, like how great players do it.

That's an opinion.

You can say he has not won a championship. That's a fact.

This doesn't make him a loser. There are plenty of stars better than Kobe who has never won a championship.

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...=257333&page=6

You never said anything about 3 players until AFTER I asked you to name 5 to back up this delusional hot garbage



Nice try....damvs/iamrambo24/indiefan23/indiefan24

[IamRAMBO24]

http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/sho...=257333&page=6

You never said anything about 3 players until AFTER I asked you to name 5 to back up this delusional hot garbage



Nice try....damvs/iamrambo24/indiefan23/indiefan24

Character assassination (trying to say I am someone who I am not) and strawmans does not make your argument anymore legit.

If you are so versed in why your lover boy Kobe is so damn great, why can't you argue the premises I have laid out?

1. Kobe has failed to win MVP on a consistent basis based on the 3 criterias that make a player great.

2. Iceman, Wilkins, and Malone have proven to be better players based on those 3 criterias even though they have not won a ring.

3. When we are talking about how good a player is, a ring (which is a collective unit) and top ten highlights cannot be used to determine the talent of a player; the criteria should be impact, stats, and contribution along with awards such as MVP, FMVP, and all time records.

[BlackVVaves]

I quoted 3 players: Iceman, Wilkins, and Malone based on the 3 criterias that determine the worth, value, and talent of a player: impact, stats, seed.

Kobe rarely dominates in the one area he is good at: scoring. How many scoring titles does he have? Sure he put up 80 (which is impressive in it's own right), but has he done it consistently enough to dominate the scoring title? No.

How much of an impact has he had compare to Malone on the Jazz and Wilkins on the Blazers? You take out Kobe during the Shaq years, put in another solid player and can you with a straight face NOT exercise the idea that is a legit title contender?

You take out Malone on the Jazz or Lebron on the Cavs, what happens? Lottery team at best.

So f*ck you for not taking impact into consideration when you talk about which player is the better one.

Impact wins games. Highlights don't.

Impact wins games, and lack of impact loses games, right? Like Lebron's lack of impact in crucial points of crucial games in the last 5 years?

While Kobe's lack of impact has helped him reach the NBA Finals three of the last four years. Interesting.

I won't argue with a person who is so deeply rooted in their delusion that they think Gervin or Wilkins is higher up in the All Time List than Kobe. I will say that it's a shame that individuals like you truly are lost in the realm of Lebron that you create and live in. But, it doesn't matter to me, just something to laugh at in passing like a dog eating it's own shit in the middle of a park. Unless Bron ends his career with 3+ rings, he will not be ranked higher than Kobe himself, particularly if his lack of "IMPACT" continues in critical moments and games. People will remember what Lebron DIDN'T do, before they recall what he DID do if his pattern of ineffectiveness in the crunch persists. The same way people's first thought of Lebron these days aren't his MVPs, but his transformation into Casper last June.

Well, rational people. So no, that doesn't refer to you. What DOES refer to you? ****boy supreme. Try breathing without Bron's scrotum shoved down your throat. You'll find the air tastes a bit cleaner.

[LakersFan626]

why does LeBron take so much "Heat" when the real choker is Kobe?

Last playoff/final game each year.THE BIG GAMES...Elimination games

Kobe: .................LeBron:
2011: 7-18 39%........9-15 60%

2010: 6-24 25%........8-21 38%

2009: 10-23 44%........8-20 40%

2008: 7-22 32% ......14-29 48%

2007: 13-33 39%......10-30 33%

2006: 8-16 50%.........11-24 46%

2004: 7-21 33%

2003: 9-19 47%

2002: 7-16 44%

2001: 7-18 39%

2000: 8-27 30%

1999: 7-16 44%

1997: 4-14 29%


One has had a longer career than the other.... what we know right now?

Games over 60%: LeBron - 1 Kobe - 0

Games over 50%: LeBron - 1 Kobe - 1

Games over 45%: LeBron - 3 Kobe - 2

Games under 40%: LeBron - 2 Kobe - 8

Games under 35%: LeBron - 1 Kobe - 5

Games under 30%: LeBron - 0 Kobe - 2 ( should be 3 but 2000 is rounded)

Looks like LeBron is doing ok while kobe chokes it up

Kobes overall finals performance:

09-10 40.5%
08-09 43.0%
07-08 40.5%
03-04 38.1%
01-02 51.4%
00-01 41.5%
99-00 36.7%

Look how terrible Kobe's numbers are (choking!!!)..... LeBrons overall finals performance in 2011:

10-11 47%.... Kobe only had ONE year better than this. Heck Kobe's second best year is 43%...fail!

Also in the Finals LeBron averaged more assists per game than Jason Kidd and almost as many rebounds as Tyson Chandler.

But Kobe blows EVERY finals EVERY SINGLE ONE except for once in 2002? and all the silly Kobe kids ignore that?...

Im not a LeBron fan. But I do know that Kobe is overrated and for some reason LeBron gets some undeserved hate when he is a better player than Kobe.

Kobe's Final Stats are laughable. Biggest choker/chucker

I wouldn't have made this thread If it hadnt been for all the annoying Kobe kids spamming the forums the past few days. Go away! Kobe is Turrible we dont need to support terrible chuckers who dont improve in the playoffs and turn to jelly in the finals....

Once again no Kobe fan has come in here and backed Kobe up with any stats... As expected.

LeBrons doing well. The only reason I see for the hate is that all the Kobe kids are scared. Im not a LeBron fan nor a Heat fan. But its easy to see LeBron is the better player who will see more finals perform at a higher level and win multiple championships.

Kobe has never had a regular season where he shot over 47%...

LeBron has all his seasons over 47% except for one (rookie season)

While destroying Kobe in shooting he beats him in the PPG category

Kobe career 25.3

LeBron James career 27.7

While destroying Kobe in scoring he beats Kobe in rebounds and assists

Kobe career 5.3/4.7

LeBron James Career 7.1/7

But the playoffs are what matter when you really step it up!!!!

Kobe:.......................LeBron:
2011: 23/3/3.......................24/8/6
2010: 29/6/6.......................29/9/8 on 50%
2009: 30/5/6.......................35/9/7 on 51%
2008: 30/6/6.......................28/8/8
2007: 33/5/4.......................25/8/8
2006: 28/6/6.......................31/8/6

Career averages:

Kobe: 25/5/5
LeBron: 28/8/7

LeBron beats Kobe even when comparing a better Kobe want to compare these two at the same stages of their career and see what really happens?

Kobe:.....................LeBron:
1999: 20/7/5..............2006: 31/8/6
2000: 21/5/4..............2007: 25/8/8
2001: 29/7/6..............2008: 28/8/8
2002: 27/6/5..............2009: 35/9/7 on 51%
2003: 32/5/5..............2010: 29/9/8 on 50%
2004: 25/5/6..............2011: 24/8/6

LeBron crushes Kobe.

Now If we are staying on topic and comparing choking jobs...In Kobes 2004 playoff run he shot 41% FG and 25% 3PT ...

LeBron shot 47% FG and 35% 3PT

So I guess its safe to say with all the information gained in this thread...

LeBrons' regular season > Kobe's

LeBron's postseason > Kobe's

LeBron's Finals performance in 2011 is better than all of Kobe's but one. I expect that to be surpassed very soon at the rate LeBron is going.

So once again where is the hate for LeBron coming from when Kobe is worse?

Kobe Kids: Please refrain from using pictures and youtube videos to debate. I like to reason with statistics and facts.

Like i said im not e lebron fan but people need to lay off...i want him to lose every game he plays and i hate him and the heat lol but that doesnt change the fact that he pleysa some pretty good bball i just dont come here and talk about pointless shit about lebron like every1 else

Kobe- 5 rings
LeBron- 0 rings

How is Kobe a bigger choker than LeBron, especially when LeBron quit in game 5 of the 2010 ECF with a tied series at HOME and only scored 8 points in game 4 of the finals last year? Could you ever imagine Kobe or Jordan doing that?

Also, LeBron is far from the greatest player ever when he has no rings yet...

[spiegel]

The clown original poster has replied with 3 different ids in this thread.For christ sake mods, check the rocketsgreatness IP and ban him forever. Problem is if he gets banned probaly half the ids here will dissapear.