PTI: Kornheiser said Dirk had a top 3-4 playoff run of all-time in all of sports

[greensborohill]

This is what the Heat should done. ..

[DMAVS41]

definitely not top 3-4 in sports....definitely not top 3 all time in nba.

though it depends on how you define "playoff run"....is it factoring things in like upsets and unlikely performances?

i think we can all agree that duncan was a better player than dirk was for his legendary run in 03. but which run was better is a different discussion in the eyes of someone like kornheiser.

regardless of where it ranks, dirk's playoff run and the mavs title is legendary and an extremely rare happening in the nba. winning 2 series without home court as huge underdogs playing better teams is remarkable enough. but getting through both the blazers and thunder is hugely impressive as well.

as is the the players the mavs/dirk went through. kobe/gasol, durant/westbrook, lebron/wade....amazing. one of the toughest roads to the title i can remember. no easy series. playing some of the best players in the league on some of the best teams all the way through.

and the mavs did it with only one all nba player. again, an extremely rare happening in the nba.

[guy]

definitely not top 3-4 in sports....definitely not top 3 all time in nba.

though it depends on how you define "playoff run"....is it factoring things in like upsets and unlikely performances?

i think we can all agree that duncan was a better player than dirk was for his legendary run in 03. but which run was better is a different discussion in the eyes of someone like kornheiser.

regardless of where it ranks, dirk's playoff run and the mavs title is legendary and an extremely rare happening in the nba. winning 2 series without home court as huge underdogs playing better teams is remarkable enough. but getting through both the blazers and thunder is hugely impressive as well.

as is the the players the mavs/dirk went through. kobe/gasol, durant/westbrook, lebron/wade....amazing. one of the toughest roads to the title i can remember. no easy series. playing some of the best players in the league on some of the best teams all the way through.

and the mavs did it with only one all nba player. again, an extremely rare happening in the nba.

If you factor in "unlikely performances" too much then you are judging them more relative to their expectations, which isn't really fair to greater players who had great playoff runs that they were EXPECTED to have. For example, I'd easily say all of Jordan's 6 title runs (at least the first 5, maybe you can argue against 98) and Shaq's 3 title runs were better then Dirk's even though Dirk's was easily more unexpected.

I really doubt Kornheiser said it in a literal sense, or at least it was just an off-hand comment that he didn't really think about (probably why Wilbon didn't really argue about it). I just wanted to discuss cause it was a bizarre comment regardless.

[DMAVS41]

If you factor in "unlikely performances" too much then you are judging them more relative to their expectations, which isn't really fair to greater players who had great playoff runs that they were EXPECTED to have. For example, I'd easily say all of Jordan's 6 title runs (at least the first 5, maybe you can argue against 98) and Shaq's 3 title runs were better then Dirk's even though Dirk's was easily more unexpected.

I really doubt Kornheiser said it in a literal sense, or at least it was just an off-hand comment that he didn't really think about (probably why Wilbon didn't really argue about it). I just wanted to discuss cause it was a bizarre comment regardless.

That is why I said it depends on the definition of "playoff run"....I personally think a lot of that stuff above matters in this sense.

[Scoooter]

Hype factors in. Gravity. No one gives a shit about the '03 Nets. This Heat team though? That's a big deal. That's a factor.

[guy]

That is why I said it depends on the definition of "playoff run"....I personally think a lot of that stuff above matters in this sense.

What stuff?

[NugzHeat3]

What stuff?

I think he's talking about shock value because that's the only way you can justify it. Sort of.

Its no more shocking than Russell in 1969, Moses in 1981 (though he didn't win) or Hakeem in 1995 though. Maybe look at Rick Barry in 1975 but I don't know anything about the circumstances of his run.

And this is just looking in the NBA. If you go by beyond basketball, it won't even be close.

If you look at who played better and exclude the expectations, then it drops further down the list. All 6 of Jordan's runs except 1996 maybe, 3 peat Shaq, Wilt 1967, Bird, Magic ect.

[DMAVS41]

What stuff?

expectations, competition, iconic moments...etc. i think that all factors into a playoff run. that is why hakeem and duncan have two of the best ever...along with level of play of course.

[guy]

expectations, competition, iconic moments...etc. i think that all factors into a playoff run. that is why hakeem and duncan have two of the best ever...along with level of play of course.

I really don't think expectations should really matter much. If two players play the exact same way under the exact same circumstances and lead there team to a title, and the only difference was one was expected to win a title and the other was expected to lose in the first round, one shouldn't be considered greater then the other. The player with lower expectations had lower expectations because he wasn't as great beforehand, so its not really fair to the other guy who was playing that great beforehand. From an entertainment standpoint its different, but not greatness.

[Doctor Rivers]

PTI: Kornheiser is a dumb idiot.

this. what about that time he was on MNF? hahahaha

[SCdac]

All the analysts have been burned in the past by picking the Mavs, and some of the NBA fan base as well. The Mavs just weren't the "sexy" pick, it's not surprising really?... They were however the best team in the NBA, that much is evident. The Mavs from top to bottom, were better than every other team.

If anything, it's the immense emotion that comes with "upsets" and "surprises" that's causing people to overly sensationalize his playoff run. It's pretty obvious, and not entirely unnatural, however exaggerated. Emotions are part of the game. When it comes to analysis though, and the dust settles, I don't factor them in too much. I would't say, "Rose came waaay out of left field and won MVP, and because of the shock he's one of the greatest MVP's ever".

When you say Dirk's playoff run is top-3 in all of basketball, football, baseball, soccer, etc... that's clearly an emotional, loaded statement and not very well thought out when you digest what it really infers. It's a perfect example of somebody living only in the moment, and why it's hard to take some of these sports-show people seriously.

[R.I.P.]

Who cares Mavs are certainly a great bunch.

Chandler

[EricForman]

I've disagreed with everyone that has said Dirk has been overrated as a result of his playoff run. But thats a little insane.

i don't know enough about other sports to comment on that, but if we're talking strictly basketball, it's debatable but not a ridiculous comment. we forget how no one thought they had a chance to beat the Lakers, let alone the Heat. If you asked 1000 fans, at least 995 woulda picked Lakers to win that series. It's not some disrespect to Dirk, but the Lakers, when Bynum was healthy and rolling in parts of the season, looked unbeatable. And then there's Miami with two of the top three (or top five, whatever) players IN THE GAME TOGETHER.

when you throw in the comebacks (down 15 in 5 minutes to OKC, down 15 in 8 mins to Miami), AND arguably the most efficient game ever (game 1 vs OKC), it's not too outrageous to say his run was the greatest in all of basketball.

Again, it's definitely up for debate, and I think this debate can never have a clear winner because 20 other runs must have a good argument... I just think Dirk could be in that discussion.

[EricForman]

whether or not Dirk's 2011 run was the greatest in NBA history is definitely debatable (but again, i dont feel it's ridiculous to say it is so), but i believe it is undoubtedly, at the very least, a top 10 run all time in NBA history. where do the rest of you rank it?

i feel like some of the ones in the "Dirk's run was overrated" camp are dissing Dirk a little too much. Like, to say Dirk's run wouldn't even be a top three run in Texas? Of everyone Hakeem played in the 94 playoffs, only Barkley was equal to Kobe, Durant, Lebron, or Wade. And THE LATTER TWO PLAYED TOGETHER.

[GOBB]

definitely not top 3-4 in sports....definitely not top 3 all time in nba.

though it depends on how you define "playoff run"....is it factoring things in like upsets and unlikely performances?

i think we can all agree that duncan was a better player than dirk was for his legendary run in 03. but which run was better is a different discussion in the eyes of someone like kornheiser.

regardless of where it ranks, dirk's playoff run and the mavs title is legendary and an extremely rare happening in the nba. winning 2 series without home court as huge underdogs playing better teams is remarkable enough. but getting through both the blazers and thunder is hugely impressive as well.

as is the the players the mavs/dirk went through. kobe/gasol, durant/westbrook, lebron/wade....amazing. one of the toughest roads to the title i can remember. no easy series. playing some of the best players in the league on some of the best teams all the way through.

and the mavs did it with only one all nba player. again, an extremely rare happening in the nba.

I dont (didnt at the time) see the Mavs as underdogs vs OKC or Miami. Dallas was favorites in my book. One all NBA player I look at differently as well. If we asked what Miami needs in order to win a title or titles? It revolves around constructing a better team/cast around its stars. Dallas had that, they also had more experience than the OKC Thunder. Guys have war wounds and stripes.

Still a great run for Dirk and the Mavs. I think defeating Miami was big just given the hype and who played on the team.