Lets talk phenoms. On pre draft hype only....who is the all time #1 pick?

[Kblaze8855]

Figured it was worth bringing up with all the Zion talk....

Plenty of options....plenty of obvious #1 picks...but a phenom is more than a top pick. Its a guy the world decides is the guy long before its that time. These are the guys you trade your best players away for a chance to draft. We arent talking Kenyon Martin just because he went #1. Im talking the "We got him!" prospects.




To make it clear....this is how you react when you win the lottery for a known phenom...





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Ewing lottery







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Shaq lottery





This is how you react when you have to go figure out what youre gonna do with your pick:










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Ben Simmons lottery. Good player. Just not Shaq or Patrick Ewing.







We clear? Our younger posters will remember a few but not that many. Lebron of course. Zion is that guy now. Im not sure we had one in between....were you all in on Wiggins? Duncan may have been one in 97....there was no question at all who that draft was for. Celtics were set back a decade when they lost the lottery for him and ended up with Billups(or was it Ron mercer?).

AI had talk but wasnt on that level prospect wise. Shaq was. Ewing before him. Hakeem as well. Bill Walton. Kareem. Maybe Magic. Jordan was to the people who paid attention but going behind Bowie hurts. It was stupid....and they were wrong clearly....but the kind of hype we are talking doesnt allow you to not go #1(allowing for era rules like the territory pick days where you got the rights to guys who were local...obviously Wilt is a phenom).

Im gonna give you a name or two that wont come to everyones mind quickly...


Larry Johnson was a big deal. Danny Manny was a big deal. But the guy im gonna focus on?


Im not 100% sure he wouldnt go #1 all time based only off hype. Hed have a tough fight with Kareem and Walton.....but he might take it. Some of you 30+ already thought of him no doubt....


Ralph Sampsons. You really have no way to understand how major that guy was supposed to be. And ill show you why...


He was about 7'2'' barefoot(I saw a measurement of 7'1'' and 7/8ths when he was like 18) but listed 7'4''. In shoes he was probably 7'3''. He ran the floor...he could shoot...dunk from the Ft line...handle it.








Here...this is Ralph Sampson:

























Yes....really tall guys could move 35 years ago.


Now...let me give you an impression of how badly he was wanted...

He and Hakeem are the reason the draft lottery exists. The Bulls, Knicks, and Pacers made a mockery of the game trying to lose late in those seasons to get into the coin flip. Back then there was a coin flip between the worst teams in each conference for the top pick.....so worst you could get was #2. Teams started trading away talent and benching guys or playing washed up vets huge minutes. Late in Ralphs rookie year to make sure they got Hakeem the Rockets pulled Ralph after a hot start and played through 39 year old Elvin Hayes who played 53 minutes in the second to last game of his career and had a triple double in a blowout loss.

But let me make this even more clear....this is what teams were willing to give up for the pick to get him....

The Lakers had a locked up top 2 pick in 82. Sampson was a junior. He told them if they got the first two picks...so he could be sure to go there? HEd come out early. They had the Cavs pick because they traded it for nothing to LA before the NBA changed the rules to stop the Lakers fleecing shitty run teams. But the Clippers were also ass. So it was gonna be down to LA(Cleveland) or the Clippers. But Sampson wasnt willing to risk being a Clipper and he was gonna have to declare for the draft before the coin flip.

So....

Buss offered $ 6 million for the guarantee of the pick. Sterling declined. Buss offered $ 6 million plus (should he have it) the number two pick in the upcoming draft. Sterling declined. Buss offered $ 6 million plus the number two pick in the upcoming draft and the team’s first-round pick in 1984. Sterling declined again. Buss suggested that he could, somehow, land the Clippers Moses Malone from Houston. Sterling was moderately intrigued, but he also wanted two Laker players— Norm Nixon and Michael Cooper. Buss said he’d have to think about it.

Clippers ended up not doing it. Wouldnt take the league MVP(Moses) an all star point and a DPOY level wing for the pick because it MIGHT be Sampson. So Ralph went back to school. Pick ended up being the Lakers but it was too late. Lakers got Worthy and the Clippers Terry Cummings.

So after his senior year? The tanking I mentioned which embarrassed the league.... but even worse?

The rockets TURNED DOWN Drexler and the #2 pick for Sampson....which would have given them the GOAT big 3 of Hakeem, Jordan, and Drexler.

Think about that for a second.

Portland offered young Clyde Drexler...and a pick that would have been Jordan to pair with their #1 pick(Hakeem). They said no...and instead drafted Hakeem to play with Ralph to make a Twin Towers instead of an inside/out threat with Hakeem/MJ and Drexler on the wings. And Drexler and Hakeem both went to Houston in college....so it would have been two local legends...plus Michael Jordan.

They said no.

To keep Ralph Sampson.


He ended up injured and a scrub on the Warriors....but when he was whole you couldnt have traded anyone in the NBA for him short of Larry Bird or maaaaaaaaaaaybe Magic.


Hes not gonna be anyones all time #1 who doesnt remember how glowingly he was praised and how much people gushed over him but really....hes up there.

Ralph Sampson off hype alone....might go all time #1.

Wouldnt be my pick...but hed go pretty high.

So...


Who is your phenom of choice in the all time draft? Again....guys like Jordan and Steph while obviously amazing picks...they wouldnt go over these guys at draft time.

Im asking more what you remember hype wise than who ended up the proper pick.

[Ben Simmons 25]

Shaq, it's not close.

[The Iron Fist]

[Loco 50]

DRob was so coveted the Lakers tried to deal for him before seeing a single game and the Spurs were willing to draft him despite knowing he was going to fulfill his obligation to the Navy.

Boston tried to throw half it's team at the Spurs for Duncan.

[Kblaze8855]

Shaq, it's not close.

Jerry Buss offered Donald Sterling 80% of the value of an NBA franchise, the #2 pick, and 2 key players from a title team and he said no. You could buy an NBA team for 8-9 million in 1982. The Nuggets sold for 2 million 4 years earlier. The Rockets sold for 8.9 in 83. Sterling wouldnt take almost the cash value of his franchise plus still having his pick of 2 hall of famers(Worthy and Nique) for Ralph sampson.

Its at least close.

[kennethgriffen]

the ewing lottery was the most hyped because it was new york and the first lottery format


as far as who gets selected #1 i would say kareem

[Ben Simmons 25]

Jerry Buss offered Donald Sterling 80% of the value of an NBA franchise, the #2 pick, and 2 key players from a title team and he said no. You could buy an NBA team for 7-9 million in 1983. Sterling wouldnt take almost the cash value of his franchise plus still having his pick of 2 hall of famers(Worthy and Nique) for Ralph sampson.

Its at least close.

Literally every single team in the 1992 lottery had a pre made jersey with Shaq's name on it ready to go... I'm not sure that ever happened before or since.



I think the 2003 lottery had some pre made James jerseys, but it wasn't the entire set of teams like 1992.

[tpols]

biggest thing is the foot control & general coordination... hes changing pace all over the place. javale mcgee wouldve compiled a HOF shaqtin highlight in some of those situations.

[Kblaze8855]

Im not saying Shaq isnt in the discussion....im saying....im not sure you could have traded your actual franchise for Ralph Sampson in 1983. He was worth about...what an NBA team was worth. Buss offered 2.5 times the salary cap at that point.

The cash offer for Ralph Sampson was about the same as the NBA salary cap of 1988.

[elementally morale]

Best player drafted number 1 and biggest hype ever for a player are not the same. The best is probably Kareem.

As for hype, I'm not sure Zion would be drafted ahead of LeBron. LeBron got insane hype even in high school.

[Ben Simmons 25]

I'll never be able to discuss this topic rationally.

Literally the first time I saw an NBA game on TV or in person was in 1992... at the O-Rena... when Shaq was a rookie... against the Rockets. He's literally the reason I became an NBA fan.

**** it.

[Kblaze8855]

I get that. I just want you to understand the creepy affection basketball people had for Ralph Sampson. Its in no way anti Shaq.....but...







It was a love affair.

[Ben Simmons 25]

https://www.basketball-reference.com...211250ORL.html

Yep, pretty trippy that I can say that I know the exact game, but it had to be this one... and that was my very first experience ever with NBA basketball... and it was in person.

I even remember we sat in the lower bowl... with handicap seating at the top of the lower bowl... someone gave my dad the tickets.

Scott Skiles played 48 minutes... the ****?

[SpaceJam2]

Im not saying Shaq isnt in the discussion....im saying....im not sure you could have traded your actual franchise for Ralph Sampson in 1983. He was worth about...what an NBA team was worth. Buss offered 2.5 times the salary cap at that point.

The cash offer for Ralph Sampson was about the same as the NBA salary cap of 1988.

Insane

[Kblaze8855]

Insane

For comparisons sake...the highest paid teams and players 4 years later....not when the offer was made....after salaries started to rise:


1. Los Angeles Lakers $8,579,750
2. New Jersey Nets $6,840,500
3. Philadelphia 76ers $6,825,500
4. New York Knicks $6,691,500
5. Boston Celtics $6,560,000
6. Seattle Supersonics $5,683,333
7. Los Angeles Clippers $4,745,000
8. Detroit Pistons $4,603,666
9. Chicago Bulls $4,486,000
10. Washington Bullets $4,381,383
11. Golden State Warriors $4,365,833
12. Houston Rockets $4,259,000
13. Phoenix Suns $4,189,500
14. San Antonio Spurs $4,052,846
15. Dallas Mavericks $4,052,346
16. Sacramento Kings $4,052,000
17. Cleveland Cavaliers $3,920,666
18. Portland Trailblazers $3,831,000
19. Indiana Pacers $3,758,200
20. Atlanta Hawks $3,671,250
21. Milwaukee Bucks $3,661,332
22. Denver Nuggets $3,425,500
23. Utah Jazz $2,914,500


Top 25 players
1. Magic Johnson (LAL) $2,500,000
2. Moses Malone (Phi) $2,145,000
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (LAL) $2,030,000
4. Larry Bird (Bos) $1,800,000
5. Jack Sikma (Sea) $1,600,000
6. Julius Erving (Phi) $1,485,000
7. Patrick Ewing (NY) $1,250,000
8. Ralph Sampson (Hou) $1,165,500
9. Mitch Kupchak (LAL) $1,150,000
10. Otis Birdsong (NJ) $1,100,000
10. Marques Johnson (LAC) $1,100,000
12. Albert King (NJ) $1,035,000
13. Kevin McHale (Bos) $1,000,000
14. Wayman Tisdale (Ind) $987,000
15. Adrian Dantley (Uta) $950,000
16. Bill Cartwright (NY) $925,000
17. Buck Williams (NJ) $915,000
18. Sidney Moncrief (Mil) $884,000
19. Akeem Olajuwon (Hou) $882,500
20. Bernard King (NY) $874,000
21. Alex English (Den) $825,000
22. Darryl Dawkins (NJ) $808,000
23. George Gervin (Chi) $806,000
24. Joe Barry Carroll (GS) $800,000
24. Tom Chambers (Sea) $800,000






And Buss offered 6 million plus picks and players for Sampson 4 years before that. He offered Magic, Kareem, and Birds combined salary just as the cash bonus on top of a great basketball offer for a prospect.