POLL: Should Lakers have kept Kobe or Shaq?

[Knoe Itawl]

Good post by Batchoy.

I woulda dumped Kobe for top talent when his trade value was sky high after they lost to the Spurs that season.

They would still be contenders and have top talent to build around as Shaq got older.

Only people who think that wouldn't have been better short term and long term for the Lakers are mindless groupie scum.

[Batchoy]

Man, you should be a GM. Who wouldn't go for Crawford for Ray Allen?

I've had this senario (or something similar) even before Shaq was traded 2 years ago. Crawford still had some good trade value going for him and with the addition of a #1 pick, I think Seattle would have thought of it. And even if they didn't, The Lakers weren't in any big trouble with Crawford as a temporary filler in the 2 spot. The #1 pick from The Bulls would have covered that (I believe they took Gordon with that pick)

I'm sure the Bulls would trade all their players for Kobe.

They would have. Bulls management would have been salivating like hungry animals to see Kobe "The next MJ" in a Bulls uniform. Also, remember, The Bulls were perennial lottery picks and probably would have given anything for Kobe.

[Twiens]

Do I have to explain this again?

Yes. Explain how they would still be good. Without mentioning a bunch of people who you think would take paycuts to play with Shaq.

[shadow]

Kobe was the right choice.
LA didn't have a choice at that point in time because Shaq was
a)fat and out of shape showing no commitment to improve in that area
b)demanding ungodly amounts of money while being in condition as noted above.
c)even if kept shaq, kobe would've bolted. I don't think he would've agreed to a S&T because of ego.
d)in the situation where we kept shaq, even assuming he gets in shape, we're cap strapped, and hoping vets on their way out will take our minimums and exceptions to play with shaq, and then retire a year or so later leaving us hoping for another cheap vet. Mind you it has to be impact players, like Karl & GP, not playerwhodaheckcaresovich or whatever.

Finally it remains to be seen what the end result will be. Did the lakers trtade one championship for more

[Batchoy]

Keeping Shaq was the right move, both in the short term AND long term. Do I have to explain this again?

I've tried telling that to Kobe/Laker fans, but they were so infatuated with Kobe at that time, that they just saw Kobe's potential for greatness (the next MJ) andthey didn't care who was thrown away, just as long as they got to see Kobe do his stuff. Well, they got what they wished for.

[Batchoy]

Kobe was the right choice.
LA didn't have a choice at that point in time because Shaq was
a)fat and out of shape showing no commitment to improve in that area
b)demanding ungodly amounts of money while being in condition as noted above.
c)even if kept shaq, kobe would've bolted. I don't think he would've agreed to a S&T because of ego.
d)in the situation where we kept shaq, even assuming he gets in shape, we're cap strapped, and hoping vets on their way out will take our minimums and exceptions to play with shaq, and then retire a year or so later leaving us hoping for another cheap vet. Mind you it has to be impact players, like Karl & GP, not playerwhodaheckcaresovich or whatever.

Finally it remains to be seen what the end result will be. Did the lakers trtade one championship for more

And if you read any of my posts, I explain why keeping Shaq would have deemed most of your points moot. And Shaq winning another Championship puts all your reasoning out the window.

[shadow]

I've tried telling that to Kobe/Laker fans, but they were so infatuated with Kobe at that time, that they just saw Kobe's potential for greatness (the next MJ) andthey didn't care who was thrown away, just as long as they got to see Kobe do his stuff. Well, they got what they wished for.

its amazing how you accuse people of being blinded by kobe yet absolutely refuse to accept the incredibly high possibility that shaq would not have gotten in shape had we kept him.
its not a fat shaq that just won this ring. Its was a guy who workd his butt of. The lakers were never goin to get this shaq, no matter what and when we made the choice between him and kobe.

[Knoe Itawl]

Kobe was the right choice.
LA didn't have a choice at that point in time because Shaq was
a)fat and out of shape showing no commitment to improve in that area
b)demanding ungodly amounts of money while being in condition as noted above.
c)even if kept shaq, kobe would've bolted. I don't think he would've agreed to a S&T because of ego.
d)in the situation where we kept shaq, even assuming he gets in shape, we're cap strapped, and hoping vets on their way out will take our minimums and exceptions to play with shaq, and then retire a year or so later leaving us hoping for another cheap vet. Mind you it has to be impact players, like Karl & GP, not playerwhodaheckcaresovich or whatever.

Finally it remains to be seen what the end result will be. Did the lakers trtade one championship for more

Idiotic. If they had dumbed Kobe after the Spurs series that year, they could have gotten top flight talent for him and still be contenders today and good for the future.

Your allegiance to Kobe goes in the face of LOGIC and REASON. I know you hate to think Kobe could have been replaced, but the fact is he could have and it would have been better for the Lakers.

Instead the Lakers are stuck in mediocrity for the forseeable future.

Hey at least you get to see Kobe score a lot, right?

[Knoe Itawl]

its amazing how you accuse people of being blinded by kobe yet absolutely refuse to accept the incredibly high possibility that shaq would not have gotten in shape had we kept him.
its not a fat shaq that just won this ring. Its was a guy who workd his butt of. The lakers were never goin to get this shaq, no matter what and when we made the choice between him and kobe.

And in your love of Kobe you refuse to see that just MAYBE Shaq worked his butt off because he was inspired by not having to play with that prick anymore.

[Batchoy]

its amazing how you accuse people of being blinded by kobe yet absolutely refuse to accept the incredibly high possibility that shaq would not have gotten in shape had we kept him.
its not a fat shaq that just won this ring. Its was a guy who workd his butt of. The lakers were never goin to get this shaq, no matter what and when we made the choice between him and kobe.

You are blinded by Kobe. You refuse to believe that if a team believed in Shaq, he would get back in shape. Trading the person who has been the root of his problems would make that person change. I was a Laker fan who believed in Shaq. Most of you were too busy jacking off to Kobe and his "talent". You brushed away all of Kobe's faults and wanted to see the next MJ. Now Shaq has just won his 4th Championship and Kobe is watching at home and will probably watch the Championship for the next couple of years (because The Lakers will be over the cap the next 2 seasons) and more than likely a few years after that.

While Shaq can start getting ready for another chance at a Championship. How's that for being fat, out shape, and too old?

[shadow]

Idiotic. If they had dumbed Kobe after the Spurs series that year, they could have gotten top flight talent for him and still be contenders today and good for the future.

Your allegiance to Kobe goes in the face of LOGIC and REASON. I know you hate to think Kobe could have been replaced, but the fact is he could have and it would have been better for the Lakers.

Instead the Lakers are stuck in mediocrity for the forseeable future.

Hey at least you get to see Kobe score a lot, right?

OK for someone who prides himself in never calling others names first...

As for your logic, I know very well about your brand of "logic." Its your way or the high way. You sound like a republican you know. No other POV.

As I keep saying by 2002 shaq had already shown he was not interested in staying in shape. The reason Miami won was because he was in Shape. Give this heat team a fat shaq and do they still win?

The Lakers never had to make a choice till 2004. That is when the choice was made. At that point in time LA had only one choice. But then you'd know that if you read what I wrote as opposed to if you read what you want to.

You know the thing about you is, that you pretend to hide under this facade of "logic" when all you're spewing is pure hate. Atleast with aap & batchoy, even if I disagree with them, they openly admit they hate Kobe and the Lakers. Thats more admirable in a twisted way, then your "ooooh look at me I'm logical and smart, and everyone else is wrong because I'm always correct and logical" approach.

[KNOWLEDGE20]

Kobe was the right move he's younger and still the best player in the league he just needs a little more help! Shaq asked for a trade because he feeling got hurt when Dr. Buss offered him a reported $70-$80million dollars for 3yrs (which would have made him still the highest paid player in the NBA) because he wanted $100 million! Yeah Shaq got a ring but he still isnt worth a $100million right now he's 34 now by the time his contract end with Mia hell be 38 making 20million in that season probable sitting at the end of the bench collecting a check! Besides Mia had the money to pay shaq the lakers could pay kobe and shaq that the would have been crazy

[Knoe Itawl]

OK for someone who prides himself in never calling others names first...

As for your logic, I know very well about your brand of "logic." Its your way or the high way. You sound like a republican you know. No other POV.

As I keep saying by 2002 shaq had already shown he was not interested in staying in shape. The reason Miami won was because he was in Shape. Give this heat team a fat shaq and do they still win?

The Lakers never had to make a choice till 2004. That is when the choice was made. At that point in time LA had only one choice. But then you'd know that if you read what I wrote as opposed to if you read what you want to.

You know the thing about you is, that you pretend to hide under this facade of "logic" when all you're spewing is pure hate. Atleast with aap & batchoy, even if I disagree with them, they openly admit they hate Kobe and the Lakers. Thats more admirable in a twisted way, then your "ooooh look at me I'm logical and smart, and everyone else is wrong because I'm always correct and logical" approach.

You're not even READING what's being said because you're just a mindless follower of Bryant

Go ahead and tell me why it wouldn't have worked to get rid of Kobe when they failed to win the championship again. They could have dumped him for another all star perimter player like AI, Pierce, etc. or a combination of players and STILL been contenders and Shaq would have been more motivated since it was playing with Kobe that was unmotivating him. And they would still be contenders as his career wound down.

Why wouldn't that have worked, Kobe Groupie?

[Qwyjibo]

Keeping Shaq was the right move, both in the short term AND long term. Do I have to explain this again?

I'd like to hear the explanation on this. Keeping Shaq and having Kobe leave for nothing while still having Shaq's gigantic contract hamstringing your ability to sign major players...

Let's hear it.

[shadow]

You're not even READING what's being said because you're just a mindless follower of Bryant

Go ahead and tell me why it wouldn't have worked to get rid of Kobe when they failed to win the championship again. They could have dumped him for another all star perimter player like AI, Pierce, etc. or a combination of players and STILL been contenders and Shaq would have been more motivated since it was playing with Kobe that was unmotivating him. And they would still be contenders as his career wound down.

Why wouldn't that have worked, Kobe Groupie?

whatever you say wade groupie.