The GOAT List: 100 Greatest Players in Basketball History

[L.Kizzle]

[QUOTE=G.O.A.T]
[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#233 Drazen Petrovic [/FONT]
Team(s): Portland Trail Blazers, New Jersey Nets
Years Played: 1989-1993
Career Averages: 15.4 ppg 2.3 rpg 2.4 apg
Prime Averages: 21-3-3-1 over two seasons

-With a lightning quick release, remarkable balance and unwavering confidence, the stiff but crafty Petrovic was one of the most exciting and successful players to make the move from Europe to the NBA during the early nineties. After building a reputation as an incredible scorer in leagues in his home Croatia and later Spain, Petrovic made the move to the NBA in 1989, joining the Portland Trail Blazers who had courted him since his 1986 season where at age 22 he was named Mr. Europa (Europe

[L.Kizzle]

[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#225 Kiki Vandewedge[/FONT]
Team(s): Denver Nuggets, Portland Trailblazers, New York Knicks, Los Angeles Clippers
Years Played: 1980-1993
Career Averages: 19.7 ppg 3.4 rpg 2.1 apg
Prime Averages: 25-4-2 over six prime seasons



[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#224 Calvin Murphy[/FONT]
Team(s): San Diego/Houston Rockets
Years Played: 1970-1983
Career Averages: 17.9 ppg 2.1 rpg 4.4 apg
Prime Averages: 21-3-5-2 over seven prime seasons




[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#223 Dale Ellis [/FONT]
Team(s): Dallas Mavericks, Seattle Supersonics, Milwaukee Bucks, San Antonio Spurs, Denver Nuggets, Charlotte Hornets
Years Played: 1983-2000
Career Averages: 15.7 ppg 3.5 rpg 1.4 apg
Prime Averages: 26-5-2-1 over four prime seasons





[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#222 Jimmy Jones[/FONT]
Team(s): New Orleans Buccaneers/Memphis Pros, Utah Stars, Washington Bullets
Years Played: 1967-1977
Career Averages: 16.6 ppg 4.3 rpg 4.5 apg
Prime Averages: 19-5-5 over seven seasons





[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#221 Allan Houston[/FONT]
Team(s): Detroit Pistons, New York Knicks
Years Played: 1993-2005
Career Averages: 17.3 ppg 2.9 rpg 2.4 apg
Prime Averages: 19-3-3-1 over eight seasons

Who was better, Kiki or Kelly Tripuka?

I met Calvin a few times (living here in Houston.) I tried out for his Wiz Kids camp maybe in 1996 or 97. I didn't make the team and was pissed. He picked a bunch of taller and older kids. Weird considering himself, a small NBA player.

Ellis was money. Him, Dell Curry, Miller, Person, Terry Mills (I know you remember him), Rice and Price in the 90s ...

Thanks for the ABA players bios. I've hear of the names, but their is not a lot on the net about him, and others like Mack Calvin, ect.

No way the guy guarding him (Michael Redd) get's a higher showing than H20?

[L.Kizzle]

[QUOTE=G.O.A.T]
[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#229 Willie Naulls [/FONT]
Team(s): St. Louis Hawks, New York Knicks, San Francisco Warriors, Boston Celtics
Years Played: 1956-1966
Career Averages: 15.8 ppg 9.1 rpg 1.6 apg
Prime Averages: 21-12-2 over five seasons

-Willie the Whale as he was known was one of the first black stars in the NBA. Drafted out of UCLA in 1956, Naulls would suit up alongside greats like Bob Pettit, Wilt Chamberlain and Bill Russell before his career was through. Playing the pivot at 6

[G.O.A.T]

[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#220 Donnie Freeman[/FONT]
Team(s): Minnesota Muskies/Miami Floridians, Utah Stars, Texas/Dallas Chaparrals, Indiana Pacers, San Antonio Spurs, Los Angeles Lakers
Years Played: 1967-1976
Career Averages: 18.9 ppg 3.5 rpg 3.5 apg
Prime Averages: 24-4-5 over four seasons

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]-The Indiana Pacers were the ABA's most successful franchise and in 1973 they won their third and final Championship during the leagues nine year run. Overcoming the Kentucky Colonels in a thrilling seven game finals series, the Pacers were a balanced well oiled machine. Led by veteran Pacers Mel Daniels, Freddie Lewis and Roger Brown and youngsters Darnell Hillman, Don Buse and George McGinnis, the Pacers were a solid nine players deep including NBA veteran Gus Johnson off the bench. The wing scorers for the Pacers were Billy Keller and an ABA veteran who was once regarded as the leagues best backcourt man, Donnie Freeman.

Freeman was the clutch scorer for the Pacers during their 1973 run and made a reputation as an impossible to stop offensive player who could contort his body on or off the ground for a variety of shots that he used to become a five time all-star and one of the ABA's top scorers in the late sixties and early seventies. He helped the Floridians, Chaparrals and Stars to playoff appearances as a four time all-ABA selection including first team in 1972 when he finished third in the MVP voting and was called "the best guard in the ABA" by rival Jimmy Jones. In 1973 the Pacers needed a boost of scoring as Lewis and Brown started to decline. Freeman accepted a smaller role and was crucial in the teams biggest games. In the closeout game of the first round versus Denver, Jones set the tone with 30 points including 20 on 8-11 shooting in the first half. In the Conference Finals he scored a game high 31, then 29 in games two and three. He added 21 more in the closeout game of that series. In the Finals he hit several key shots and finished with 15 second half points in game seven. All this from a guy who averaged just 14 ppg during the regular season. Rather he needed to be the man or just one of the guys, Donnie Freeman could flat out score. [/FONT]



[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#219 Phil Smith [/FONT]
Team(s): Golden State Warriors, San Diego Clippers, Seattle Supersonics
Years Played: 1974-1983
Career Averages: 15.1 ppg 3.0 rpg 3.9 apg
Prime Averages: 20-4-4-1 over four seasons

[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]-When the Warriors won the 1975 NBA title much was made of the contributions of star rookie Keith Wilkes who was the teams second leading scorer en route to the title, but few noticed the less obvious contributions of second round pick Phil Smith. Smith was a basketball junkie who quickly turned himself from afterthought to all-star and had it not been for a devastating series of injuries may have become one of the best guards of the early 1980's. "If that injury hadn't occurred, we'd be talking about him as one of the greatest guards ever to play this game," said former coach Al Attles who saw Smith from the time he entered the league in 1974. Attles felt strongly that it was Smith's love for the game that allowed him to excel:

[L.Kizzle]

[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#220 Donnie Freeman[/FONT]
Team(s): Minnesota Muskies/Miami Floridians, Utah Stars, Texas/Dallas Chaparrals, Indiana Pacers, San Antonio Spurs, Los Angeles Lakers
Years Played: 1967-1976
Career Averages: 18.9 ppg 3.5 rpg 3.5 apg
Prime Averages: 24-4-5 over four seasons





[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#219 Phil Smith [/FONT]
Team(s): Golden State Warriors, San Diego Clippers, Seattle Supersonics
Years Played: 1974-1983
Career Averages: 15.1 ppg 3.0 rpg 3.9 apg
Prime Averages: 20-4-4-1 over four seasons






[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#218 Phil Chenier [/FONT]
Team(s): Baltimore/Capitol/Washington Bullets, Indiana Pacers, Golden State Warriors
Years Played: 1971-1981
Career Averages: 17.2 ppg 3.6 rpg 3.0 apg
Prime Averages: 21-4-3-2 over five seasons





[FONT="Book Antiqua"]#217 Andrew Toney [/FONT]
Team(s): Philadelphia 76ers
Years Played: 1980-1988
Career Averages: 15.9 ppg 2.2 rpg 4.2 apg
Prime Averages: 19-3-5-1 over three prime seasons

I didn't know anything about Freeman, I seen his name a few times but no info about him.

I seen the first Phil in a few games on NBA TV, seemed very athletic.

The same about Chanier, he was a scorer. Was he better than World B Free?

Toney, seems injuries robbed him. He seemed like the Sam Jones of his era.

I'm guessing guys like Jerry Sloan, Jeff Malone, Hornacek, Baron Davis, Marbury should be coming soon (of the guards, since this four was just guards.)

Always look forward to your list. I though you forgot about it.

[G.O.A.T]

Willie is one of the more under-looked bigs (not really a big, is he?) from that era. Is Zelmo Beaty that much better than him?

I think by quite a bit. It's debatable rather or not he was the best player on the Hawks in the late sixties, but he was the highest paid and when he jumped to the ABA coach Bill Sharman predicted he would make the difference for the Stars and he did as they won the title behind like 25-16 from Zelmo. Naulls was miscast as a star player early on, he'd have been better served as a 3rd option or in a more modern era, an elite sixth man.

I always liked Mashburns game. He should have been so much more ...

Injuries, like so many on this list. At Kentucky he was a true beast.

Walker is underrated. His first few years were pretty sun shooting 4 pointers.

Until he stopped rebounding and fell in love with his jumper (which was average at best) he was a player I liked a lot.

Who was better, Kiki or Kelly Tripuka?

I'd take Kiki, Kelly T was pretty much a one-trick pony, Kiki had more moves to get himself a shot.

I met Calvin a few times (living here in Houston.) I tried out for his Wiz Kids camp maybe in 1996 or 97. I didn't make the team and was pissed. He picked a bunch of taller and older kids. Weird considering himself, a small NBA player.

Yeah but his teammates were all tall. I hear mixed things about Clavin the person, but the player was fearless and I respect him a lot.

Ellis was money. Him, Dell Curry, Miller, Person, Terry Mills (I know you remember him), Rice and Price in the 90s ...

The original long range bombers (of the three-point era), I think all those guys were part of a collection of Topps cards I had circa 1994 called the perimeter patrol. And yes I have many memories of T-Mills. Good ones when he was with the Pistons (two stints) and bad ones from his Michigan days (I was a Mich. St fan) when he Glen Rice, Loy Vaught, Rumeal Robinson and others were the pre-Fab Five stars who helped Michigan win the 1989 National Title in surprise fashion. Mills grew up right near the air port and even in high school, as a skinny kid, he could straight shoot it.

Thanks for the ABA players bios. I've hear of the names, but their is not a lot on the net about him, and others like Mack Calvin, ect.

More to come, the last five years I've really expanded my knowledge of the ABA and 1950's NBA.

No way the guy guarding him (Michael Redd) get's a higher showing than H20?

Red came in two tiers out of the top 250. About 50 spots below Houston.

Drazen and Reg were right before my time. I started watching ball in the 94 season at 7 years old.

Great players, the highlight packages available for both sort of show you what they were about in terms of skill set, but both were also great competitors, that's they key for me.

Is this the same Larry Jones on the Houston Rockets staff?

Don't think so, not totally sure.

There was a great special on Micheal Ray narrated by Chris Rock that came on maybe a decade ago on TNT/ That's were I learned about him.

I'm thinking he should be a few spots higher, maybe the late 100s?

Maybe, but for me his prime was so short and his off the court problems certainly held him back. Had he played on at least one contender I'd have a better idea of how good he really was.

I didn't know anything about Freeman, I seen his name a few times but no info about him.

Think Toney, Vinnie Johnson, Ricky Pierce, Eddie Johnson, Jason Terry, Jamal Crawford etc. Just instant offense.

I seen the first Phil in a few games on NBA TV, seemed very athletic.

The same about Chanier, he was a scorer. Was he better than World B Free?

I'd put Free and Chenier real close, probably the longer prime for Free and the greater peak season is why I give Lloyd a slight edge.

Toney, seems injuries robbed him. He seemed like the Sam Jones of his era.

Might be a fair comparison, he was damn good. Much better than I originally understood.

I'm guessing guys like Jerry Sloan, Jeff Malone, Hornacek, Baron Davis, Marbury should be coming soon (of the guards, since this four was just guards.)

Three of those guys yes, the other two were just on the other side of the top 250. At least one guy in the next tier.

Always look forward to your list. I though you forgot about it.

Thanks for all the feedback and fun discussion.

[Pearleojam]

update?

;)

[Purch]

update?

;)

Same, would be interested in seeing if anything changed for you

[ArbitraryWater]

Update would ne nice... And just looking at the OP, got any links for players 1-9?


Wait, you got 3 players for the 15 spot?

[G.O.A.T]

I'm very tempted, I'm back to writing full time having reloaded my bank account. If enough people are willing to discuss the list and help me get smarter, I'll do a new top 200, with the top 100 or so with mini bios and ranking explanations. Let me know ISH, I feel refreshed and could do it, but the last two times I tried the interest wasn't there.

It's a lot of work and while it's fun it takes away from my other projects I need to enjoy it or I'll quit since I'm not being paid. I'm a dick that way.

[L.Kizzle]

I'm very tempted, I'm back to writing full time having reloaded my bank account. If enough people are willing to discuss the list and help me get smarter, I'll do a new top 200, with the top 100 or so with mini bios and ranking explanations. Let me know ISH, I feel refreshed and could do it, but the last two times I tried the interest wasn't there.

It's a lot of work and while it's fun it takes away from my other projects I need to enjoy it or I'll quit since I'm not being paid. I'm a dick that way.

I'm down always enjoy your list.

[Roundball_Rock]

I enjoyed it the first time, particularly the bios of lesser known past players, and an update would be great, although understandably it would require a great time commitment on your part.

[magnax1]

This was one of the most popular topics on ISH ever. Everyone would be ecstatic if you did another one.

[Purch]

The intrest is finitely there. The only thing that makes it harder on Ish, is that the board has a lot of younger fans, which makes it harder to contribute on players before the 90's

[WillC]

"The Greatest Old-School White Guy of All-Time"

Cringe.

Give Pettit credit for what he achieved - his race is irrelevant. I don't understand people's fascination with skin colour.