Comparing MJ

[AirBonner]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

[Leviathon1121]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/pag.../all-nbarank-1

[ImKobe]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

2019-20 Lakers have the most 1st team all-defensive players on one team in league history and Anthony Davis is significantly better than any teammate Jordan ever played with.

[SpaceJam2]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

Anyone?

[superduper]

There is a significant gap between reality and LeBrick stain delusions

[Bronbron23]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

What about Bosh? Your not honestly saying Toni is better than him or even rodman at that stage of his career are you?

[SpaceJam2]

What about Bosh? Your not honestly saying Toni is better than him or even rodman at that stage of his career are you?

WasBosh All nba? 6th man?

[Bronbron23]

WasBosh All nba? 6th man?

No but he was better than any 6th man. Are really trying to hype up the 6th man?

[3ball]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

[COLOR="DarkRed"]The 11' Heat and 15' Cavs had the most on-paper talent since 1980, up until the 17' Warriors:[/COLOR]





https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-be-different/


/thread

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

how many 19.4/6.4/5.9 guys would be 1st-team All-NBA beside Lebron, or all NBA at all?

zero

that's how many.. /thread

MJ "made" Pippen into the piddly little 18 ppg sidekick he needed to have the goat modern dynasty - no one else could've won so much with so little.

And remember that Rodman averaged 4/8 on 37% for the entire 1997 playoffs, and wasn't even the starter in the 1998 playoffs (4/8 in those Finals), while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% for the entire 2nd three-peat playoffs - [COLOR="DarkRed"]no one ever won without a PF and horrific scoring at 2nd option - only MJ did that[/COLOR]

[COLOR="Red"]MJ: 95/96 Bulls[/COLOR]
Michael Jordan: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Scottie Pippen: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dennis Rodman: 1st Team All-Defensive
Toni Kukoc: Sixth Man of the Year
Phil Jackson: Coach of the Year

[COLOR="red"]LeBron: 12/13 Miami Heat[/COLOR]
LeBron James: 1st Team All-NBA, 1st Team All-Defensive
Dwyane Wade: 3rd Team All-NBA

That is a significant gap

What's the point in cherry-picking MJ's best supporting cast, when he won other years with less than Lebron ever did, based on professional statistical analysis and common knowledge?

PROFESSIONAL STATISTICAL ANALYSIS - 538 said that Jordan's 91' and 93' teams had the the least help of any championship team, except the 94' Rockets and 11' Mavs.. They also said the 11' Heat and 15' Cavs were the best on-paper talent since 1980, until the 2017 Warriors.

COMMON KNOWLEDGE - MJ three-peated with only 1 star teammate, while Lebron needed 2 to win rings.

And Rodman averaged 4/8 on 37% for the entire 1997 playoffs and didn't even start in the 1998 playoffs, while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% for the entire 96-98 playoffs, including 15 on 34% in the 96' Finals.. Lebron simply never won with weak help like that

Literally, all the PF's that Lebron ever had were better than 97' and 98' Rodman, and all his 2nd options from 2009 onwards were better offensively than 2nd three-peat Pippen..

[SouBeachTalents]

The 11' Heat and 15' Cavs had the most on-paper talent since 1980, up until the 17' Warriors:





https://fivethirtyeight.com/features...-be-different/


/thread




how many 19.4/6.4/5.9 guys would be 1st-team All-NBA beside Lebron, or all NBA at all?

zero

that's how many.. /thread

MJ "made" Pippen into the piddly little 18 ppg sidekick he needed to have the goat modern dynasty - no one else could've won so much with so little.

And remember that Rodman averaged 4/8 on 37% for the entire 1997 playoffs, and wasn't even the starter in the 1998 playoffs (4/8 in those Finals), while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% for the entire 2nd three-peat playoffs - [COLOR="DarkRed"]no one ever won without a PF and horrific scoring at 2nd option - only MJ did that[/COLOR]




What's the point in cherry-picking MJ's best supporting cast, when he won other years with less than Lebron ever did, based on professional statistical analysis and common knowledge?

PROFESSIONAL STATISTICAL ANALYSIS - 538 said that Jordan's 91' and 93' teams had the the least help of any championship team, except the 94' Rockets and 11' Mavs.. They also said the 11' Heat and 15' Cavs were the best on-paper talent since 1980, until the 2017 Warriors.

COMMON KNOWLEDGE - MJ three-peated with only 1 star teammate, while Lebron needed 2 to win rings.

And Rodman averaged 4/8 on 37% for the entire 1997 playoffs and didn't even start in the 1998 playoffs, while Pippen averaged 17 on 41% for the entire 96-98 playoffs, including 15 on 34% in the 96' Finals.. Lebron simply never won with weak help like that

Literally, all the PF's that Lebron ever had were better than 97' and 98' Rodman, and all his 2nd options from 2009 onwards were better offensively than 2nd three-peat Pippen..

1-9

[SpaceJam2]

You know 3ball is off the deep end when he quotes a 538 stat about 'projected' box plus minus

And not sure if you really want to put a ton of stock into box plus minus...leBron is the literal #1 playoff leader in nba history.

So which is it son?



*where is Kobe?

[3ball]

You know 3ball is off the deep end when he quotes a 538 stat about 'projected' box plus minus

And not sure if you really want to put a ton of stock into box plus minus...leBron is the literal #1 playoff leader in nba history.

So which is it son?



*where is Kobe?

BPM favors defensive rebounders, so it doesn't work for individual comparisons, but it works comparing the help of 2 entire teams.

Hope that's clear

And the BPM of the entire team shows that Lebron's 2011 and 2015 had the highest BPM projections of any team since 1980, until the 17' Warriors.

Btw, what's a tougher path - being gifted a team that is favored to win the championship in Year 1 (2011, 2015), or developing favorite status over many years like MJ?.. Sorry, but there is no case for Lebron.

[SpaceJam2]

I say again:

You know 3ball is off the deep end when he quotes a 538 stat about 'projected' box plus minus

And not sure if you really want to put a ton of stock into box plus minus...leBron is the literal #1 playoff leader in nba history.

So which is it son?

[3ball]

So which is it son?

I'll answer again

[Bronbron23]

I'm a little confused about the point of this thread. It seems like it's supposed to be an argument for LeBron and against mj but dosnt it just prove the opposite? Bosh went from one of the best fowards in the game before lebron to just a little above average. Wade went from first team all nba to third and it's not like it was because they were getting old. They were both just entering there primes so they should of been getting better.

This wasn't the case for Pip, rodman and kukoc with mj. Pip continued to improve under mj as he came into his prime and even though rodman was well past his prime he still maintained his first team defensive status.

And the Phil Jackson argument might be the worst one. How are you gonna penalize mj for being willing to play for a coach that was gonna hurt his numbers? This should be an argument for mj. He was willing to sacrifice his personal success for winning and the greater good of the team.

LeBron could of went anywhere when he left Cleveland. He could of went to the spurs with pop. I know that's what I was hoping. He would of won 3 or 4 rings easily with pop but his stats would of dropped a little. Instead he chose to go somewhere where he knew he wouldn't have a great coach. LeBron dosnt get credit for that. Personally I don't think LeBron intentionally did this. I just think he honestly thought that he was as smart as any coach so why would he even need a great coach. Even if this was the case mj still gets the credit for being smart enough to put his ego aside to let a professional coach.

Honestly this thread may be the worst argument for LeBron I've ever seen