Originally Posted by DMAVS41
No. I'm saying that there are certain shots they have very little chance to get fouled on. Melo takes more of them. And I never said fga was nearly as big a factor as you. I'm just pointing out that a certain number of the fga for Melo and Kobe simply have very little chance to get fouled on. Just like Harden with his threes. Martin shot 3.2 shots at the rim in 11 and his free throws were off the charts...LOL
I watch Melo and Durant more than I watched Martin so it's difficult to make a completely fair comparison, but I do know that Martin for years has been known as one of the most notorious floppers. On his mid-range shots, he constantly leans his body in trying to draw fouls, is quite thin which helps sell contact as well and has that awkward shot.
I don't think players like that often deserve all of their free throws either, btw.
Now. How much more often do you think Durant gets to the line simply by his team being in the bonus more often. The thunder shoot 1.5 more free throws per qtr than the Knicks and are likely in the bonus more often.
As I said before, even if Durant only got to the line 1 more time every 3 games off of this...that would be a .7 difference.
So on minutes and that alone...I get Durant down from 9.4 to 8.4. And that isn't even taking into account techs...but we can ignore that.
So you are left with 7.6 for Melo and 8.4 for Durant on things the players don't do. Minutes and Durant having an advantage for being on a team that draws more fouls.
Is 8.4 too high for you still?
Except we have no idea how much being in the penalty has added to either of their numbers. Watching the games, I suspect Durant draws more fouls that way, but as I said, Melo with his typical rest is playing at the end of all 4 quarters. Durant gets his rests the last few minutes of the 1st and 3rd, taking out some situations where his opponent would more likely be in the penalty.
8.4 would be on the high side, yes.
You still haven't explained why Durant's OWN FTA have jumped almost 2 per game from 7.6 to 9.4.
Originally Posted by DMAVS41
Also, I'm confused as to how shots at the rim and fga are the best indicators here when;
Melo shoots more shots at the rim and shoots 5.1 shots more than Harden...yet Harden shoots 2.5 more free throws per game.
Melo shoots more shots at the rim than Kobe and shoots 1.6 more shots...yet Kobe takes more free throws.
And Kevin Martin in 11 just destroys that notion with very few shots at the rim and an inordinate amount of free throws on very few fga.
You might not like it, but Harden and Durant have an actual skill that allows them to get to the line more often....and I don't think it is all that related to shots at the rim or overall fga. I think it's just something they intentionally try to do...and happen to be very good at it.
I think Harden does get more credit than he should for his flops. I said that before. So I never said he deserves all the FTA he gets either. And as I said, he plays on the fastest paced team in the league and transition/semi-transition opportunities often result in fouls. Melo doesn't get many of these since the Knicks don't run, and when they are in transition, often look for open 3s.
It's not just the number with Durant either. Again, I see him get calls with little to no contact, pretty much if he twists his body awkwardly and misses a shot, hell, sometimes when he makes it. While I see Melo often go up strong, get contact and no call. Calls that Durant will literally get almost every time.
There's no question in my mind just from watching them play. I don't believe in league conspiracies, I think it may have more to do with Melo's reputation in addition to the refs rewarding Durant too much for his own flopping, combined with his weaker frame and just how unusual he looks with his length, especially when his shot is contested.