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-   -   I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball... (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=281935)

e's Nikees 11-19-2012 11:31 AM

I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
When the clock is winding down and you're up by 6 or 8 points rather than just try and score? Like what Damian Lillard did last game against the Bulls?

Pushxx 11-19-2012 11:32 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by e's Nikees
When the clock is winding down and you're up by 6 or 8 points rather than just try and score? Like what Damian Lillard did last game against the Bulls?


Sportsmanship.

theaussieguy 11-19-2012 11:32 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
multiple reasons, one being whats the point of trying to score and potentially risking injury if u have it in the bag.

Clippersfan86 11-19-2012 11:35 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pushxx
Sportsmanship.


This. You don't want to embarrass or show an opponent up when you're already going to win anyways. Certain situations it's acceptable such as the excuse Lilliard gave. If you truly believe the team is trying to intentionally foul I'd definitely dunk it or shoot it too just to prevent that stupid back and forth, futile free throw drama.

Crown&Coke 11-19-2012 11:38 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
its an unwritten rule, you don't go for the score to pad your stats when the game is in the bag. Its kind of like showing the other team up. And the NBA is one big fraternity

Sasha Vuvacic did this against NOLA a few years ago, he got fouled HARD by Speedy Claxton. Sasha tried to get crazy and big bad Marc Jackson came running up like he was going to take Sasha's head off. Safe to say Sasha calmed the eff down. Both Phil and Kobe were shaking their heads at Sasha.

You just don't do that

stallionaire 11-19-2012 11:40 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Crown&Coke
its an unwritten rule, you don't go for the score to pad your stats when the game is in the bag. Its kind of like showing the other team up. And the NBA is one big fraternity

Sasha Vuvacic did this against NOLA a few years ago, he got fouled HARD by Speedy Claxton. Sasha tried to get crazy and big bad Marc Jackson came running up like he was going to take Sasha's head off. Safe to say Sasha calmed the eff down. Both Phil and Kobe were shaking their heads at Sasha.

You just don't do that


video?

Crown&Coke 11-19-2012 11:46 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by stallionaire
video?


did a quick search and nothing on youtube.

Its Sasha Vujacic, Speedy, and Marc Jackson. Not too many hits when you type those three dudes in the search box

Rake2204 11-19-2012 11:53 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
I really have zero issue with what Damian Lillard did. In fact, watching the video clip, the response of the announcers and opposition is almost laughable to me. It... was a dunk. He didn't scream, pound his chest, flip off the opposition, kick Joakim Noah in the balls. It was just a random two points at the end of a decided game.

To be clear, I do believe there are instances where it may not be deemed acceptable. For instance, in high school there are often times where the level of one team can vary greatly from the level of another. They're all technically "high school", but if Oak Hill Academy played my former club, it wouldn't really be fair. And in that case, if Oak Hill's winning by 84 and they placed a starter back in the game with 30 seconds left so he could sit at one end of the floor and attempt a 360 between-the-legs flush, I think I'd be a little salty.

Other than that though, to use the high school example again (and oftentimes college), both teams usually play until the final buzzer. I've played for and watched teams that got dunked on during garbage time. I didn't get pissed about a supposed lack of sportsmanship. I was just bummed we were getting beat and just got dunked on too.

What ever happened to playing until the final buzzer in the NBA? When and why was it deemed so unacceptable for a millionaire (playing in front of tens of thousands of fans who paid his salary so they could watch him do neat things) to pull off a random dunk at the end of the game and then quietly run up the floor? He clearly meant no ill will, yet the announcers reacted as if he committed a felony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKC9YGtBHd4

swi7ch 11-19-2012 11:58 AM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Pushxx
Sportsmanship.


Tell that to the NE Patriots. :oldlol:

iamgine 11-19-2012 12:00 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rake2204
I really have zero issue with what Damian Lillard did. In fact, watching the video clip, the response of the announcers and opposition is almost laughable to me. It... was a dunk. He didn't scream, pound his chest, flip off the opposition, kick Joakim Noah in the balls. It was just a random two points at the end of a decided game.

To be clear, I do believe there are instances where it may not be deemed acceptable. For instance, in high school there are often times where the level of one team can vary greatly from the level of another. They're all technically "high school", but if Oak Hill Academy played my former club, it wouldn't really be fair. And in that case, if Oak Hill's winning by 84 and they placed a starter back in the game with 30 seconds left so he could sit at one end of the floor and attempt a 360 between-the-legs flush, I think I'd be a little salty.

Other than that though, to use the high school example again (and oftentimes college), both teams usually play until the final buzzer. I've played for and watched teams that got dunked on during garbage time. I didn't get pissed about a supposed lack of sportsmanship. I was just bummed we were getting beat and just got dunked on too.

What ever happened to playing until the final buzzer in the NBA? When and why was it deemed so unacceptable for a millionaire (playing in front of tens of thousands of fans who paid his salary so they could watch him do neat things) to pull off a random dunk at the end of the game and then quietly run up the floor? He clearly meant no ill will, yet the announcers reacted as if he committed a felony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKC9YGtBHd4

It's just in NBA culture, it's seen as disrespectful.

stallionaire 11-19-2012 12:03 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by iamgine
It's just in NBA culture, it's seen as disrespectful.


Yep.

ZenMaster 11-19-2012 12:10 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rake2204
I really have zero issue with what Damian Lillard did. In fact, watching the video clip, the response of the announcers and opposition is almost laughable to me. It... was a dunk. He didn't scream, pound his chest, flip off the opposition, kick Joakim Noah in the balls. It was just a random two points at the end of a decided game.

To be clear, I do believe there are instances where it may not be deemed acceptable. For instance, in high school there are often times where the level of one team can vary greatly from the level of another. They're all technically "high school", but if Oak Hill Academy played my former club, it wouldn't really be fair. And in that case, if Oak Hill's winning by 84 and they placed a starter back in the game with 30 seconds left so he could sit at one end of the floor and attempt a 360 between-the-legs flush, I think I'd be a little salty.

Other than that though, to use the high school example again (and oftentimes college), both teams usually play until the final buzzer. I've played for and watched teams that got dunked on during garbage time. I didn't get pissed about a supposed lack of sportsmanship. I was just bummed we were getting beat and just got dunked on too.

What ever happened to playing until the final buzzer in the NBA? When and why was it deemed so unacceptable for a millionaire (playing in front of tens of thousands of fans who paid his salary so they could watch him do neat things) to pull off a random dunk at the end of the game and then quietly run up the floor? He clearly meant no ill will, yet the announcers reacted as if he committed a felony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKC9YGtBHd4


Playing and showing off until the final buzzer was replaced with good sportsmanship.

I'd tell my guys to foul hard if they had the chance in a situation like that if they want to, I also tell my guys to hold the ball when we have secured the win unless we play someone who we want to piss off, say a team who has been playing particularly dirty or a team who has tried to score in the same situation vs us.

Rake2204 11-19-2012 12:11 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by iamgine
It's just in NBA culture, it's seen as disrespectful.

I understand that's the reasoning. I'm saying, why is that the reasoning. Why and how did that somehow become established in the manner with which it did? I think it's a ridiculous unwritten rule and I'm often pleased when I see players fight such a preposterous concept.

Again, I'm not saying the floodgates should be open to players on winning teams yelling in opponent's faces, break dancing on the court, or grabbing a microphone with 15 seconds left and declaring, "These guys all suck." But a meaningless end-of-game bucket should have absolutely no repercussion. If nothing else, it's something for the fans, who again, are paying to see things like that.

It sort of reminds me of an incident a year or two ago when the Mavericks were winning by 10 or so with 20 seconds left. Their opponent was pressing the length of the floor, pressuring Dallas' point guard and really making him work. To assist, Brian Cardinal stepped up and set a screen on the defender. The opposition drew huge issue with Cardinal's play because they claimed the game was already decided.

Again, I understand it's part of the culture, I just think it's a terrible part of the culture and nearly makes zero sense, particularly in Lillard's case where he just put it in with two hands and pretty much ran up the floor with his head down.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ZenMaster
Playing and showing off until the final buzzer was replaced with good sportsmanship.

I'd tell my guys to foul hard if they had the chance in a situation like that if they want to, I also tell my guys to hold the ball when we have secured the win unless we play someone who we want to piss off, say a team who has been playing particularly dirty or a team who has tried to score in the same situation vs us.

To me, good sportsmanship is taking it easy on a team who clearly cannot compete (I mean, taking it easy after you've already established a healthy win, not taking it easy from the start). For instance, I coached a seventh grade team who had absolutely no ability to break one team's full court press. That team was up by 20+ early in the second half (which is more significant than it sounds when considering our middle school played six minute quarters). Even after I'd emptied my bench, the opposing coach insisted upon pressuring full-court for the remainder of the game. I found that to possibly be poor sportsmanship.

I also played against a squad in high school who built a big lead on us and in an effort to get a jam, an opposing player laid down in the backcourt out of sight so after we'd missed a shot, he could pop back up, catch an outlet, and attempt a dunk (he missed). I found that to be relatively poor sportsmanship, because of the whole laying down thing.

On the flip side, I've been part of a game where we were done for, down by 15+ late in the fourth quarter. We didn't give up. Nor did the other team. They forced a turnover and one of their players broke away for a power slam. Their crowd went nuts. Dude just earned himself a solid slam. I found absolutely nothing wrong with that, even when he could have easily held up and refused to shoot.

Basically, I think there's being a jerk and there's just playing until the final buzzer. Even if an opponent had a breakaway windmill against my squad after we were already down 25 with 10 seconds left, as long as he doesn't flex in front of my bench, grab his nuts, or laugh in every one of our faces, it's just him playing basketball. I won't like that we're getting slammed on, but I understand it.

In my opinion, it'd be unnecessarily fouling hard in a late game situation that'd be the poor sportsmanship, particularly if the offensive team is merely attempting to play through the final buzzer and not actively attempting to humiliate their opponent.

jlip 11-19-2012 12:14 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Rake2204
He clearly meant no ill will, yet the announcers reacted as if he committed a felony.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pKC9YGtBHd4


I liked how Nate Robinson handled that.

ChrisPosh 11-19-2012 12:51 PM

Re: I'm still young to the game... why do you have to hold the ball...
 
P*ssy ass Bulls players "O.M.G. did-did you just dunk..... IN A BASKETBALL GAME???!?!? :lebroncry: "

Fukk outta here with that sensitive princess attitude, wasn't like he was running up the court with his hands gesturing as if to pleasure himself


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