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Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE]"It's a tough call with me because everybody wants to make the comparison between me and Michael, but our paths were just different," he says. "You almost have to evaluate our careers from two different lenses. Ultimately, I want to be known as a person who was just hell-bent on winning. If people say that about me, I'll be happy."
It's interesting Horford would call Bryant the best player in the NBA. Hasn't he been kicked out of that conversation by James, who has been anointed in the media as the reigning hoops god? Does it annoy Kobe that recent conversations have compared Jordan and LeBron while, somehow, omitting him? "I think it's a numbers thing," he says. "They look at the individual numbers Michael put up and those LeBron is putting up. My numbers are great, but I played with Shaq. So those numbers have to be looked at from that perspective. They didn't have to play with a 7-foot-1, 350-pound dominant force.
"My motivation is to win every year. When I was growing up and Magic had five and Michael was getting his [six], I decided this is what I'm supposed to do: win as many as I possibly can. [Bill] Russell had 11, so this is what it is. It does bother me that during your career, everyone says, 'Win championships.' Now, at the end of your career, they want to look at [individual] numbers. That drives me crazy a little."[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]Would he want to coach? "Uhhhhhh," he says, meaning no.
How about owning a team? "Only if it's in a big market," he says with a nervous laugh, knowing Jordan's chronically failing team is in Charlotte, a small market. L.A. is a big market. How about owning a piece of the Lakers? Like the idea?
"Of course, I would," he says. "Honestly, this franchise is part of me. I've been very lucky that I followed this team religiously [while growing up] and I've just happened to play for this team my whole career. I would love [ownership]. If I could be part of this organization forever, it would be very special."
Neither Jim nor Jeanie was available for comment.[/QUOTE]
[QUOTE]"I didn't just give them advice. I sort of made demands,'' says Bryant, laughing as he recalls that version of himself. "To me, it's about one thing only -- winning. You can have all the talent in the world, but if the organization isn't making the smartest decisions, you're not going to win. Dominique Wilkins had a great career, but he never got to that [championship] level. I didn't want to be that for the second half of my career. [Management] made a conscious call to cut costs then and kind of ride their goose with the golden eggs, and I wasn't OK with that. I said, 'Hey, look, you guys have got to do something.' ''[/QUOTE]
[url]http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9051655/nba-los-angeles-lakers-kobe-bryant-running-show[/url]
If Kobe had never played with Shaq, would his numbers/stat line be similar to MJ and LeBron like he is alluding to?
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
"It does bother me that during your career, everyone says, 'Win championships.' Now, at the end of your career, they want to look at [individual] numbers. That drives me crazy a little."
great quote.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
No matter what Lebron wud be way below mj and Kobe for being a franchise quitter:applause:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=willds09]No matter what Lebron wud be way below mj and Kobe for being a franchise quitter:applause:[/QUOTE]
In 2007, Kobe almost quit his favorite franchise aka NBAs winningest franchise that GIFTED him 3 rings. He was begging for a trade. This was after he was GIFTED 3 rings. Nobody is a bigger quitter than Kobe.
LBJ is guaranteeing himself Top 10 GOAT status as MIA. In hindsight, it is turning out to be his best decision ever.
Kobe is definitely below LBJ.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Levity]"It does bother me that during your career, everyone says, 'Win championships.' Now, at the end of your career, they want to look at [individual] numbers. That drives me crazy a little."
great quote.[/QUOTE]
This:applause:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
winning championships should not be everything.How its been won should be taken into debate as well. second fiddle, lot of help etc etc.
This is why Kobe being 2nd fiddle to shaq, and lebron with this huge help with miami will not surpass jordan
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=francesco totti]winning championships should not be everything.How its been won should be taken into debate as well. second fiddle, lot of help etc etc.
[B]This is why Kobe being 2nd fiddle to shaq, and lebron with this huge help with miami will not surpass jordan[/B][/QUOTE]
couldn't have said it better myself.
Well balanced Teams kicking on all cylinders win championships!
If you aint a leader, NUMERO UNO option, then you are just part of a well oiled machine.
Kobe can be credited for just 1 ring 2009 ring. (HINT: 6/24 in Game 7 for 2010)
LBJ can be credited for 1 ring too cuz he was clearly a leader of well oiled machine called MIAMI HEAT in 2012.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
No Kobe they didn't play with a dominant force which is why they didn't have instant success at the beginning of their careers as far as team wins(3 of your chips are because of Shaq) and you coming into a playoff team. And no Kobe, you would have not matched their numbers in your first two to three seasons....if that's the case you would have been more dominant early on and not sitting behind Eddie Jones.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Calabis]No Kobe they didn't play with a dominant force which is why they didn't have instant success at the beginning of their careers as far as team wins(3 of your chips are because of Shaq) and you coming into a playoff team. A[B]nd no Kobe, you would have not matched their numbers in your first two to three seasons....if that's the case you would have been more dominant early on and not sitting behind Eddie Jones[/B].[/QUOTE]
:no:
yea he would just look at what happened to james harden went from super role player to a superstar in just few months. kobe was way more skilled than harden too.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
He has s point. if the laker were a bad team (no shaq) he would have gotten more PT in his first couple of years so he would've had better numbers those years.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
Can see both sides to the playing with Shaq when it comes to more spacing and less numbers stand point..can work that either way for whatever you are argueing. Without Shaq lord knows how much better Kobe's numbers would of been but yes the titles may not of been there...
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=francesco totti][B]winning championships should not be everything.How its been won should be taken into debate as well. s[/B]econd fiddle, lot of help etc etc.
This is why Kobe being 2nd fiddle to shaq, and lebron with this huge help with miami will not surpass jordan[/QUOTE]
[img]http://myvintagephotos.com/images/John_Havlicek_February_1969.jpg[/img]
I couldn't have said it better myself. John Havlicek won 8 NBA championships, and the 1974 Finals MVP.
You don't see some of his fans ranking him over Hakeem, LeBron, Erving, West, Garnett, Barkley, Malone, Moses Malone, and Bob Pettit. He's still a top 18-20 player of all time.
LeBron won an NBA Championship last year with Bosh missing a lot of games in the post season. LBJ led his team in poinst, rebounds, assists, and steals in the playoffs.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]
LeBron won an NBA Championship last year with Bosh missing a lot of games in the post season. LBJ led his team in point, rebounds, assists, and steals in the playoffs.
[/QUOTE]
stay banned, lebron23
lmao, the fan of lebron james is the one who says rings don't matter, then adds in "bosh was injured" :roll: :roll: :roll:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
There is no greater myth than Kobe's legacy relies on championships. Throw out everybody's post season resume and Kobe is [I]still[/I] a top 10 player in NBA history. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Rysio]:no:
yea he would just look at what happened [B]to james harden went from super role player to a superstar[/B] in just few months. kobe was way more skilled than harden too.[/QUOTE]
:wtf: are you talking about...your telling me rookie Kobe was as good as Kobe year 3 and 4? No his little ass wouldn't have avg 28 ppg or 20/5/5 as the main focus.
Was rookie Harden as good as Harden this year?:facepalm
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=ripthekik]stay banned, lebron23
lmao, the fan of lebron james is the one who says rings don't matter, then adds in "bosh was injured" :roll: :roll: :roll:[/QUOTE]
Winning Finals MVP does matter. Kobe wasn't the best player of the 2000-2002 Lakers. LBJ was the best player of the 2012 Miami Heat in the regular season, playoffs, and in the Finals.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]Winning Finals MVP does matter. Kobe wasn't the best player of the 2000-2002 Lakers.[/QUOTE]
:facepalm
Lebron James winning a hypothetical title with prime Shaq and 10 scrubs is more impressive than Lebron James winning a hypothetical title with 11 other all star players.
Teammates strength matters, Finals mvp doesn't. Basketball isn't a 2 on 2 game.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
:oldlol: I love how Kobe makes it seem like playing with Shaq was some sort of burden or some shit.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]Winning Finals MVP does matter. Kobe wasn't the best player of the 2000-2002 Lakers. LBJ was the best player of the 2012 Miami Heat in the regular season, playoffs, and in the Finals.[/QUOTE]
Yet still needed the help of Top 2 SG Wade and Top 5 PF Bosh, what type of best player is that? They basically handed him the ring, and he got all the credit.
Oh, don't forget... 5>1*
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]:facepalm
Lebron James winning a hypothetical title with prime Shaq and 10 scrubs is more impressive than Lebron James winning a hypothetical title with 11 other all star players.
Teammates strength matters, Finals mvp doesn't. Basketball isn't a 2 on 2 game.[/QUOTE]
Who's the other 11 star players? I know you guys never play or touch a basketball in your entire life, but this is a very stupid logic.
Prime Shaq is the most dominant finals performer in NBA History. Lakers won an NBA Championship with an injured Kobe Bryant in the 2000 NBA Finals. Kobe averaged 15.6 ppg in under 40 FG% againts the Pacers.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=PJR]:oldlol: I love how Kobe makes it seem like playing with Shaq was some sort of burden or some shit.[/QUOTE]
:applause:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=ripthekik]Yet still needed the help of Top 2 SG Wade and Top 5 PF Bosh, what type of best player is that? They basically handed him the ring, and he got all the credit.
Oh, don't forget... 5>1*[/QUOTE]
LeBron was Miami's best player from the first round of the playoffs up to the NBA Finals.
Watch the 2012 NBA Playoffs run on youtube. Enough of this asterisk bull$hit. Miami beat the best team in the Western Conference in the NBA Finals. Thunder swept the defending NBA Champion in the first round, abused the Lakers in the 2nd round, and came back from a 0-2 deficit againts a veteran Spurs team in the conference finals.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]Who's the other 11 star players? I know you guys never play or touch a basketball in your entire life, but this is a very stupid logic.
Prime Shaq is the most dominant finals performer in NBA History. Lakers won an NBA Championship with an injured Kobe Bryant in the 2000 NBA Finals. Kobe averaged 15.6 ppg in under 40 FG% againts the Pacers.[/QUOTE]
The redeem team. Those are his teammates. Lebron wins the Finals MVP. Are you super impressed?
Meanwhile Lebron is paired with prime Shaq and 10 D league players. They win the title yet Shaq wins the Finals MVP. For the postseason Lebron averages 29/7/6.
Why would it be more impressive for Lebron to win with amazing teammates than with weaker ones?
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]The redeem team. Those are his teammates. Lebron wins the Finals MVP. Are you super impressed?
Meanwhile Lebron is paired with prime Shaq and 10 D league players. They win the title yet Shaq wins the Finals MVP. For the postseason Lebron averages 29/7/6.
Why would it be more impressive for Lebron to win with amazing teammates than with weaker ones?[/QUOTE]
No one except delusional Kobe fans think LeBron's 2012 playoffs wasn't super impessive.
LOL @ acting like Peak Shaq isn't a ridiculous amount of help. :oldlol:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]The redeem team. Those are his teammates. Lebron wins the Finals MVP. Are you super impressed?
Meanwhile Lebron is paired with prime Shaq and 10 D league players. They win the title yet Shaq wins the Finals MVP.
Why would it be more impressive for Lebron to win with amazing teammates than with weaker ones?[/QUOTE]
LeBron and Wade were the best players of the redeem team. Bird and Magic won multiple NBA titles with all star teammates and MVP/MVP Candidates.
Bird played with Mchale, Parish, former finals MVP Dennis Johnson, Danny Ainge, and a bunch of good role players. Magic also had a very good supporting casts. ( Kareem, Worthy, Nixon, Scott, and etc.) These 2 teams dominated the 1980's because they were the most stacked and talented teams of all time.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]No one except delusional Kobe fans think LeBron's 2012 playoffs wasn't super impessive.
LOL @ acting like Peak Shaq isn't a ridiculous amount of help. :oldlol:[/QUOTE]
How impressive?
Look at who they played in the weak east- not one superstar, injuries to Rose and Dwight, Lebron had Wade and Bosh, and played the youngest team in NBA finals history. So impressive.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]No one except delusional Kobe fans think LeBron's 2012 playoffs wasn't super impessive.
LOL @ acting like Peak Shaq isn't a ridiculous amount of help. :oldlol:[/QUOTE]
Its a ridiculous amount of help if it was a 2 on 2 tournament. But its not.
Unlike other NBA legends those Kobe/Shaq teams featured
- no 3rd HOFer
- no 3rd all star
- no all defensive team level role players
- no great shooters
- weak benches
Its not a ridiculous amount of help by any reasonable definition of the word. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]No one except delusional Kobe fans think LeBron's 2012 playoffs wasn't super impessive.
LOL @ acting like Peak Shaq isn't a ridiculous amount of help. :oldlol:[/QUOTE]
I'll trade Bosh and Wade for Prime Shaq. Prime Shaq would be the best player in today's NBA.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]LeBron and Wade were the best players of the redeem team. Bird and Magic won multiple NBA titles with all star teammates and MVP/MVP Candidates.
Bird played with Mchale, Parish, former finals MVP Dennis Johnson, Danny Ainge, and a bunch of good role players. Magic also had a very good supporting casts. ( Kareem, Worthy, Nixon, Scott, and etc.) These 2 teams dominated the 1980's because they were the most stacked and talented teams of all time.[/QUOTE]
Yet Kobe wins 5 titles with just one HOF teammate per title team and its his teams that get the "stacked" label. :oldlol:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Heilige][url]http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/9051655/nba-los-angeles-lakers-kobe-bryant-running-show[/url]
If Kobe had never played with Shaq, would his numbers/stat line be similar to MJ and LeBron like he is alluding to?[/QUOTE]
Kobe wouldn't have matched the numbers early on, IMO, but his overall career numbers would be better... I don't know how much better, but there would be a clear difference.
[QUOTE=Levity]"It does bother me that during your career, everyone says, 'Win championships.' Now, at the end of your career, they want to look at [individual] numbers. That drives me crazy a little."
great quote.[/QUOTE]
I agree, but I also think people look for context when they haven't seen the performances at hand and numbers are what they got to work with.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]I'll trade Bosh and Wade for Prime Shaq. Prime Shaq would be the best player in today's NBA.[/QUOTE]
I wish you were a GM when Shaq was traded a couple years later for Caron Butler and Lamar Odom. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]Its a ridiculous amount of help if it was a 2 on 2 tournament. But its not.
Unlike other NBA legends those Kobe/Shaq teams featured
- no 3rd HOFer
- no 3rd all star
- no all defensive team level role players
- no great shooters
- weak benches
Its not a ridiculous amount of help by any reasonable definition of the word. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]
Glen Rice wasn't a great shooter?
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2001.html-3[/url] guys over 39% on threes in regular season. Fisher 52% on threes in playoffs :bowdown: :bowdown:
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2002.html-Some[/url] good percentages, especially Fisher.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=Yao Ming's Foot]I wish you were a GM when Shaq was traded a couple years later for Caron Butler and Lamar Odom. :confusedshrug:[/QUOTE]
Shaq was past his prime in the 2004-05 NBA Off season, but he still finished 2nd in MVP voting in the regular season.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]Glen Rice wasn't a great shooter?
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2001.html-3[/url] guys over 39% on threes in regular season. Fisher 52% on threes in playoffs :bowdown: :bowdown:
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2002.html-Some[/url] good percentages, especially Fisher.[/QUOTE]
He just started to watch the NBA after Kobe scored 81 points againts that Raptors Team
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]Glen Rice wasn't a great shooter?
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2001.html-3[/url] guys over 39% on threes in regular season. Fisher 52% on threes in playoffs :bowdown: :bowdown:
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2002.html-Some[/url] good percentages, especially Fisher.[/QUOTE]
Why does it say File Not Found ?
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
The knock on Rice (should ask ShaqAttack for a better break down) on the Lakers is that he wasn't scoring enough as a 3rd option during the Lakers run and didn't play good defense.
Fisher's only runs that stand out to me is 01 and 08. Outside of that, it wasn't anything special.
Both were good shooters, though.
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=GOBB_Junior]Shaq was past his prime in the 2004-05 NBA Off season, but he still finished 2nd in MVP voting in the regular season.[/QUOTE]
Then why was the market so weak for him. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
I didn't follow basketball at all until 2002, so I can't speak on this. I only followed TMac back then mostly :D
Just trolling YMF :banana:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=RRR3]Glen Rice wasn't a great shooter?
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2001.html-3[/url] guys over 39% on threes in regular season. Fisher 52% on threes in playoffs :bowdown: :bowdown:
[url]http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2002.html-Some[/url] good percentages, especially Fisher.[/QUOTE]
Glen Rice was sub 40% 3 pt shooter for the Lakers. That's not great.
Fisher also never ranked a 3pt % leader board for the Lakers. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Kobe Bryant on Michael Jordan, LeBron, winning championships, etc
[QUOTE=PJR]:oldlol: I love how Kobe makes it seem like playing with Shaq was some sort of burden or some shit.[/QUOTE]
:facepalm
I'm at the point now where I don't know if you n!ggas are trolling or really just dumb as hell.