does how you talk about bball on this forum reflect how u discuss ball in real life?

Attention all Kobe mexicano kids, go eat your favorite burrito and take solace in knowing Kobe's the next best SG to Jordan. That's all he ever will be. An all-time great, no shame in that at all.

The greatest mimmic of Jordan there ever will be. In fact he's the "cover band" version of MJ. Like the fake Elvis you see in Las Vegas.

Kobe's a legend no doubt, but he will never fill those sneakers with the name AIR on it. He had his shot, he failed.

[QUOTE=Money 23]Attention all Kobe kids, go eat your favorite burrito and take solace in knowing Kobe's the next best SG to Jordan. That's all he ever will be. An all-time great. The greatest mimmick of Jordan there ever will be. In fact he's the "cover band" version of MJ. Like the fake Elvis you see in Las Vegas. Kobe's a legend no doubt, but he will never fill those sneakers with the name AIR on it. He had his shot, he failed.[/QUOTE]

^^^ exactly what you hear from the drunks.

Ok, I will agree with you. Put the beer down.:facepalm

See what I mean ISH?

[QUOTE=Money 23]Look, Kobe is close to MJ. He at times presents the image of being the same caliber of player. But he's ultimately NOT as good. Anyone who has watched both play can see that clear as day. In fact, I've never heard anyone OFF ISH flat out make even a case that Kobe is better.

Just LA native mexican, asians, canadian, psycho Laker / Kobe stans. That little run he had at his peak, when defense was at their weakest in '06 and '07 and league rules were soft as hell put a spell on some people, as well as some very high scoring games against meager opponents. Myself included for a VERY brief period of time. Was this guy as great as Mike? Ultimately he proved over the next several years he wasn't.

And even at Kobe's absolute peak, he still wasn't as great as Jordan. Anyone arguing otherwise is blinded by the very comparable SKILLS they both share, many of which Kobe directly copied Jordan's move arsenal, specifically in the post with footwork, the jumper, the fadeaway, etc.

Kobe at times over the course of his career has tried to compare himself to the Jordan standard. Trying to APPEAR to play full bore defense the way MJ did at all times. But really, he's a show pony in that regards. Yes, there is times he will be a lock down defender, but he usually conserves his energy on that end in order to appear like a dominant offensive weapon akin to Jordan. And when he does dominant offensively, it seems he has to do it in a different manner than MJ. Jordan could be DESTRUCTIVE with his offense within a team setting. Kobe has to go off on what seem like solo endeavors ignoring all teammates, and alienating himself just to get his. MJ did his damage a lot more within the natural flow of the game. Thus making him BETTER.

I mean for mexican Kobe kids who use the 81 point game to prop up Kobe's career (his most enduring memory being a regular season game v.s. a lowly Raptor team) ... do you honestly believe that MJ at his absolute peak (1990, 1991, or 1992) going out every night on a team not competing for a championship, and asked to just score (sacrificing energy on defense) wouldn't have been able to put up some down right FRIGHTENING numbers?

Not a lot of players can score 50+, 60+, or even 70 / 80+ ... but a lot of the games ELITE all-time could given the right circumstance. See David Thompson, George Gervin, David Robinson.

81 points ... It's not as impressive as I was lead to believe at first. To me a more impressive player is someone who dominates the best competition, when pressure is at it's highest. Usually that's the playoffs. When everyone is trying their absolute hardest. Otherwise, you become a glorified blow fish. Making yourself seem bigger and badder against inferior competition.

Yes, Kobe kids, their games resemble one another. Only difference is Kobe favors low percentage hero shots (3 balls) that create higher VOLUME scoring. MJ was a man of equal skill, greater athleticism, greater competitive tenacity, better bball IQ, and favored highlight reel and electric fearless drives to the basket over shots that bail out a defense like 3 pointers.

Kobe's close, but he simply is NOT Jordan. MJ dominated his peers at a higher level than Kobe has done to his contemporaries.[/QUOTE]


- It was actually MJ's scoring that hindered his teamates.....when he left in 94' 3 Bull's players had thier best seasons and made the allstar team.....Scotie Pippen had his best season without MJ...and nearly won MVP.

- when Kobe's teamates leave.... most of them don't even look good enough to be in the NBA

- Jordan was free to score without any pressure of winning ( before Phil arrived)...MJ took 23 - 26 FG attempts per game.....and his teams were stepping stones for the Bucs , Celtics and Pistons....MJ put up similar numbers to Kobe's 06' - 08' runs:confusedshrug:

- Kobe also could have scored 81 or more vs the Mavs in 06' ....the same Mavs who had top ranked defense...he scored 62 in 3 quarters....just as impressive.....he also ranks at the top of playoff point sscored and 30 - 40 point playoff games.

- Kobes overall offensive efficiency is only 1.2% TS below Jordans......and he played in a much different Defensive era...

- saying he is ennificient is just a blatant lie..and he has more all nba defensive teams then Jordan also....

- Kobe has too many enduring memories..81 is amazing 62 in 3 is Epic ...merking Jordan making him cry was inspiring....Jordans most amazing game 63 points was a loss...even when he played his best...Bird still merked him.

- I watched both players whole careers.....Both players do certain things better then each other....very similar players with similar results....

saying 1 is better then the other is just silly......magic and Bird were just as good...and played thier peaks in a much better era.....enjoy them for waht they are....Great players.

I called my mom a f.aggot because she didn't agree with me that lebron was the GOAT

[QUOTE=Money 23]Look, Kobe is close to MJ. He at times presents the image of being the same caliber of player. But he's ultimately NOT as good. Anyone who has watched both play can see that clear as day. In fact, I've never heard anyone OFF ISH flat out make even a case that Kobe is better.

Just LA native mexican, asians, canadian, psycho Laker / Kobe stans. That little run he had at his peak, when defense was at their weakest in '06 and '07 and league rules were soft as hell put a spell on some people, as well as some very high scoring games against meager opponents. Myself included for a VERY brief period of time. Was this guy as great as Mike? Ultimately he proved over the next several years he wasn't.

And even at Kobe's absolute peak, he still wasn't as great as Jordan. Anyone arguing otherwise is blinded by the very comparable SKILLS they both share, many of which Kobe directly copied Jordan's move arsenal, specifically in the post with footwork, the jumper, the fadeaway, etc.

Kobe at times over the course of his career has tried to compare himself to the Jordan standard. Trying to APPEAR to play full bore defense the way MJ did at all times. But really, he's a show pony in that regards. Yes, there is times he will be a lock down defender, but he usually conserves his energy on that end in order to appear like a dominant offensive weapon akin to Jordan. And when he does dominant offensively, it seems he has to do it in a different manner than MJ. Jordan could be DESTRUCTIVE with his offense within a team setting. Kobe has to go off on what seem like solo endeavors ignoring all teammates, and alienating himself just to get his. MJ did his damage a lot more within the natural flow of the game. Thus making him BETTER.

I mean for mexican Kobe kids who use the 81 point game to prop up Kobe's career (his most enduring memory being a regular season game v.s. a lowly Raptor team) ... do you honestly believe that MJ at his absolute peak (1990, 1991, or 1992) going out every night on a team not competing for a championship, and asked to just score (sacrificing energy on defense) wouldn't have been able to put up some down right FRIGHTENING numbers?

Not a lot of players can score 50+, 60+, or even 70 / 80+ ... but a lot of the games ELITE all-time could given the right circumstance. See David Thompson, George Gervin, David Robinson.

81 points ... It's not as impressive as I was lead to believe at first. To me a more impressive player is someone who dominates the best competition, when pressure is at it's highest. Usually that's the playoffs. When everyone is trying their absolute hardest. Otherwise, you become a glorified blow fish. Making yourself seem bigger and badder against inferior competition.

Yes, Kobe kids, their games resemble one another. Only difference is Kobe favors low percentage hero shots (3 balls) that create higher VOLUME scoring. MJ was a man of equal skill, greater athleticism, greater competitive tenacity, better bball IQ, and favored highlight reel and electric fearless drives to the basket over shots that bail out a defense like 3 pointers.

Kobe's close, but he simply is NOT Jordan. MJ dominated his peers at a higher level than Kobe has done to his contemporaries.[/QUOTE]

Good post but this is all speculating. It's based entirely on an opinion and not factual information.
Of course Jordan supporters will praise this and Kobe supporters will refute this. Proof that people will only raise points that support their own opinion, and this post is entirely opinion

[QUOTE=9erempiree]all opinions and I have heard this before amongst the drunks at the bar.

To counter these drunks, I use statistics and the eye test. I would have basketball reference on my phone and point out the [B]MJ's era was more running and gunning and no defense was played[/B].

If you made one great defensive play in a game, you were considered a lockdown defender for the next 2 games.

With that said, imagine if Player A played in an era when running and gunning was he norm.[/QUOTE]

You say run and gun....quick question that would be a reference to Pace they played at correct?

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]that's funny.....I was at a USF basketball camp in 1993....Ol' heads who watched Baylor , Russell and Chamberlain said the same thing about Jordan ..

"Jordan was never as good as Russell or Baylor"..."Jordan no matter what was [B]never on Chamberlains level of dominance[/B]"


:confusedshrug:


just different era's and who they believe is the best[/QUOTE]


There's still a few of us ol' heads around saying some of those kinds of things.

[QUOTE=La Frescobaldi]There's still a few of us ol' heads around saying some of those kinds of things.[/QUOTE]


NB4 J Baurs wall of text.

[COLOR="White"]( wait he done posted himself out of the interwebz)[/COLOR]

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]NB4 J Baurs wall of text.

[COLOR="White"]( wait he done posted himself out of the interwebz)[/COLOR][/QUOTE]
LMAO

he seems to be retired from ISH tho

[QUOTE=9erempiree]If you don't want to have to kick a guy's @ss or get provoked. Just say MJ. If you bring up someone else....there chest puffs out.:facepalm[/QUOTE]
[IMG]http://troll.me/images/yoda-senses/yoda-senses-internet-tough-guy.jpg[/IMG]

Ima little biased towards kobe IRL discussions, I keep it real here.

[QUOTE=Mr. Jabbar]Ima little biased towards kobe IRL discussions, I keep it real here.[/QUOTE]

Nothing wrong with that, he's the best player of his generation and your era of watching the game. I just don't think he's better than what I witnessed in Jordan. Like I said its not this huge gap as some make it seem. I always personally felt that their talent is damn near equal, but Jordan was just a smarter player. Each do things slightly better than the other, but imo Kobe is just a lesser version of MJ and probably the closet we will see

[QUOTE=Calabis]Nothing wrong with that, he's the best player of his generation and your era of watching the game. I just don't think he's better than what I witnessed in Jordan. Like I said its not this huge gap as some make it seem. I always personally felt that their talent is damn near equal, but Jordan was just a smarter player. Each do things slightly better than the other, but imo Kobe is just a lesser version of MJ and probably the closet we will see[/QUOTE]

Kobe8 = really was pretty much incredible

[QUOTE=AlphaWolf24]- It was actually MJ's scoring that hindered his teamates.....when he left in 94' 3 Bull's players had thier best seasons and made the allstar team.....Scotie Pippen had his best season without MJ...and nearly won MVP.

:facepalm [COLOR="Red"]Jordan just won 3 chips in a row, while leading the league in scoring, yet he hindered his teammates prior to 94[/COLOR]...:biggums: Am I the only one seeing this shit?

- when Kobe's teamates leave.... most of them don't even look good enough to be in the NBA

[COLOR="Red"]When Kobe came in he came to a 50 win team, with a TOP 10 GOAT and already established superstar, but yeah I guess Kobe made Shaq the dominant force he was and allowed him those three finals MVPS and allowed him to put up some of the greatest finals performances in NBA History[/COLOR]:rolleyes:

- Jordan was free to score without any pressure of winning ( before Phil arrived)...MJ took 23 - 26 FG attempts per game.....and his teams were stepping stones for the Bucs , Celtics and Pistons....MJ put up similar numbers to Kobe's 06' - 08' runs:confusedshrug:

[COLOR="Red"]Jordan was free to score, because he was an immediate stud and the Bulls had no one else to ease his burden, until Pippen matured...kinda like the excuse u use for Kobe after Shaq left and the lakers sucked. Also Kobe was losing to Nash, while Jordan was losing to teams stacked with HOF'mers, nice comparison[/COLOR] :hammerhead:

- Kobe also could have scored 81 or more vs the Mavs in 06' ....the same Mavs who had top ranked defense...he scored 62 in 3 quarters....just as impressive.....he also ranks at the top of playoff point sscored and 30 - 40 point playoff games.

[COLOR="Red"]Wow just wow, Jordan in playoffs against the #1 rated defense in a 5 game series...he dominated the series, unfortunately he had no help. Kobe 62 in the regular season(because he never has these outbursts in the playoffs) shot more free throws in three quarters 25, than Jordan did all game against the Celtics in a far more physical league[/COLOR]

- Kobes overall offensive efficiency is only 1.2% TS below Jordans......and he played in a much different Defensive era...

[COLOR="Red"]LOL...TS%, gtfoh with this garbage, we don't need free throws/extra points for 3 pointers added...if this stat is so legit, then why are win shares descreditied by Kobehomers? Oh I know, because out of all the GOAT candidates he is solo on the never led his team in this advanced created stat...give me how many shots you took and how many you missed, that's all that's needed
[/COLOR]

- saying he is ennificient is just a blatant lie..and he has more all nba defensive teams then Jordan also....

[COLOR="Red"]He is inefficient in comparison to MJ, him making a three doesn't count as 1.5 shots made....does he have a DPOY award, steals titles, where is he on the block list for guards, how about rebounding...KObe was not as good as a defender as Jordan

[/COLOR]- Kobe has too many enduring memories..81 is amazing 62 in 3 is Epic ...merking Jordan making him cry was inspiring....Jordans most amazing game 63 points was a loss...even when he played his best...Bird still merked him.

[COLOR="Red"]Bird, Mchale, Parrish, DJ, and a deep bench merked his sorry ass Bulls, I can really see you watched the NBA back then[/COLOR]

- I watched both players whole careers.....Both players do certain things better then each other....very similar players with similar results....

[COLOR="Red"]Yet one copied the other, and is a lesser version then he original its simple[/COLOR]

saying 1 is better then the other is just silly......magic and Bird were just as good...and played thier peaks in a much better era.....enjoy them for waht they are....Great players.

[COLOR="Red"]Prime Magic and Prime Bird were just as good in there primes, but Jordan dominated both ends of the court and was just a more dominant player when looking at their entire careers....Bird prior to injury would give MJ a run for his money and may have been better then he was(scary)
[/COLOR]
[/QUOTE]

I doubt you watched 80's basketball like you claim, you were probably 5 or 6 and remember those players, but have no idea how good they were

Baseball and football have a bigger following around where I live. I hardly ever interact with anyone who's not a Bulls fan though, just that basketball isn't always as talked about. Just how it is around here. I'll see a Lakers fan or a Miami bandwagoner once in a while and troll the **** out of them. I'd actually say I'm a huge sports troll in general IRL than I am in any of the forums I visit. Where's the fun in doing it online? :lol