I'll treat this as a poll.
I vote Iverson.
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I'll treat this as a poll.
I vote Iverson.
1. Julius Erving
2. Wilt Chamberlian
3. Allen Iverson
Not really a fan of Wilt, but Wilt >>>>>>>>>>>
Dr. J is 2nd.
Dr. J
Dr. J then wilt then iverson.
DR J
dead dude
Iverson
all of them were beast doe
Wilt
Dr J
Barkley
Iverson
I'm tired of all these KD/Lebron/Kobe threads.
Really really intrigued as to who shares my opinion of AI as the greatest 76ers of all time.
[QUOTE=miles berg]Wilt
Dr J
Barkley
Iverson[/QUOTE]
76ers Barkley is not even close to what Allen Iverson was
[QUOTE=miles berg]Wilt
Dr J
Barkley
Iverson[/QUOTE]
Moses > Barkley
Iverson might not be the "greatest", but he mighta been the most entertaining.
[QUOTE=Smook A.]76ers Barkley is not even close to what Allen Iverson was[/QUOTE]
This.
Dr. J and Iverson were the most influential though. both impacted basketball even more off the court than they did on the court which is a big deal as they were great players with great stats.
Anyhow, AI going into Staples and stealing the only game the peak Kobe-Shaq Lakers would lose that playoffs was incredible.
Though Shaq wrecked him in the Finals, Deke's importance in that run has long been downplayed. ThaRegul8r had a great post on his play in the Bucks series:
[QUOTE][quote="ThaRegul8r"][quote="Rosque"][quote="therealbig3"]Well, I do consider West a PG, but these are the SGs I'd take over him all time:
-Jordan
-Kobe
-Wade
-Drexler
-T-Mac
-Gervin
-Allen
-Miller
-Manu
-Carter[/quote]
I already responded to you in the other thread. Let me just copy all of the posts with stats.
[quote]Miller > AI? Dude. Really? Reggie Miller? AI averaged 26.7 points per game, 2.2 steals, 6.2 assists and 3.7 rebounds. Yeah, he wasn't that great of a shooter (3 point wise) but he was a true leade ([b]cough NBA Finals w/ scrubs cough[/b])[/quote][/quote]
I get tired of seeing people acting like Iverson was all alone dragging scrubs with him. Dikembe Mutombo was not some scrub. The Sixers don't get to the Finals without him, and no amount of revisionist history will change that fact.
In Game 1, Mutombo had 15 points, 18 rebounds
Mr. Fo, Fo, Fo is above Barkley as a 76er, imo.
[QUOTE=Smook A.]76ers Barkley is not even close to what Allen Iverson was[/QUOTE]
76er's Barkley was a better player than Iverson. Iverson's only argument is that he was there longer.
Wilt
Iverson
Dr. J
fvck Dr. J
[QUOTE=Smook A.]76ers Barkley is not even close to what Allen Iverson was[/QUOTE]
:biggums:
Are you nuts?
as much as i love AI
Doctor J
Iverson (stan, sorry)
Wilt
Moses
Barkley
[QUOTE=Smook A.]76ers Barkley is not even close to what Allen Iverson was[/QUOTE]
Barkley was the better player than Iverson was, but Iverson took the 76ers further than him.
Wilt, Moses Malone and Dr. J brought more to the table than both of them in terms of being apart of team success because they won a championship. Dr. J been in multiple finals and Moses Malone and Dr. J were apart of the 83 76ers, one of the best teams of all time. The 67 team is also considered to be one of the best.
Wilt probably hold the most records than them all. And probably had the best individual prime.
But I guess it's a mixture of all the above. Who has been here longer, who has brought more to the table, who stayed the most competitive for long periods of time, and who was the best player? Or...who had the most prestige during their respected time.
dr. j he brought the team a championship
[QUOTE=Micku][B]Barkley was the better player than Iverson was, but Iverson took the 76ers further than him[/B].
Wilt, Moses Malone and Dr. J brought more to the table than both of them in terms of being apart of team success because they won a championship. Dr. J been in multiple finals and Moses Malone and Dr. J were apart of the 83 76ers, one of the best teams of all time. The 67 team is also considered to be one of the best.
Wilt probably hold the most records than them all. And probably had the best individual prime.
But I guess it's a mixture of all the above. Who has been here longer, who has brought more to the table, who stayed the most competitive for long periods of time, and who was the best player? Or...who had the most prestige during their respected time.[/QUOTE]
Barkley was going against teams that were light years better than the teams Iverson faced. He was going against Bird's Celtics, Isiah's Pistons and Jordan's Bulls. Iverson that year was going against Ray Allen's Bucks and Vince Carter's Raptors. Not even close to same kind of competition.
[QUOTE=AngelEyes]Barkley was going against teams that were light years better than the teams Iverson faced. He was going against Bird's Celtics, Isiah's Pistons and Jordan's Bulls. Iverson that year was going against Ray Allen's Bucks and Vince Carter's Raptors. Not even close to same kind of competition.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, I'm not questioning that. I'm just analysis what each player did in their respective era. But you're right that the competition in the East was better in the early 00s. Depending on the year, I think there were multiple teams in the 80s that didn't make it to the Finals that could beat the 01 76ers. At least they were way more talented than that team.
[QUOTE=JimmyMcAdocious]Mr. Fo, Fo, Fo is above Barkley as a 76er, imo.[/QUOTE]
Iverson is over Doc
And I will leave it at that
[QUOTE=houston]dr. j he brought the team a championship[/QUOTE]
So did Wilt. Moses was the best player on '83 team.
[QUOTE=Micku]Barkley was the better player than Iverson was, but Iverson took the 76ers further than him.
Wilt, Moses Malone and Dr. J brought more to the table than both of them in terms of being apart of team success because they won a championship. Dr. J been in multiple finals and Moses Malone and Dr. J were apart of the 83 76ers, one of the best teams of all time. The 67 team is also considered to be one of the best.
Wilt probably hold the most records than them all. And probably had the best individual prime.
But I guess it's a mixture of all the above. Who has been here longer, who has brought more to the table, who stayed the most competitive for long periods of time, and who was the best player? Or...who had the most prestige during their respected time.[/QUOTE]
While I love the Doc, Wilt is the best Sixer of all time. This is from someone who never saw Wilt in real time, but the stories about him and his stats in the Philly area are legendary. Wilt battled those great Celtic teams, and while coming away a loser most of the time, when he finally broke through, the Sixers had built one of the great teams in NBA history.
The Sixers-Celtics rivalry used to be as good as any in sports, and it was due to those battles in the 60s. Now Doc is 2nd best because he continued the rivalry, and came away beating Bird in a fair share of H2H battles in the Playoffs. Then of course, Doc also won a title in 1983.
So it's 1.Wilt 2. Doc 3. Moses 4.Iverson 5.Barkley.. Except for Wilt, I saw them all. Andrew Toney could have been a beast.
Iverson was outscoring Barkley in slower-paced leagues, and has four scoring titles in the same timespan. Higher career ppg and totals points scored. Neither are lockdown defenders, but Iverson was a better defender, as evidenced by his two Big East DPOY honors from Georgetown, and his three steals titles, two of which came when he was leading the league in minutes, and was top-3 in scoring. He led his collegiate teams further, and is still the Hoyas all-time leading scorer. His '01 run beats anything Barkley ever did. He's led the league in scoring, steals, minutes, and top-5 in dimes all in the same 82 . Iverson and Jordan only 2 players to score at least 50 twice in same playoff series. Jordan, Wilt and Iverson only players with at least 3 50 point playoff games. Iverson most steals in a playoff game. Iverson 4 straight seasons Top 10 scoring and assists. Jordan and Iverson only players to lead the NBA in scoring and steals at least twice in the same season. Iverson and Jordan highest usage rate in a season Jordan 88 and Iverson 2001. Second highest ppg average in playoff history. He had better discipline, he had more skill, his will to win was unquestionably better. I love both, don't get me wrong, I just give the nod to Iverson for doing what he did, in a tougher era, while being just 5'11 or so, in a league which Barkley had it easier, remember they created the five-second b2tb rule because of Barkley. Someone'll bring up efficiency, but we already saw what he could do when handchecking was vanquished, 33-3-7.5 on 45% with two steals :applause:
Iverson and Michael Jordan are the two greatest competitors I have ever watched play the game
In my opinion:
Stilt
Iverson
Barkley
Moses
Erving
I personally think Erving gets overrated a lot due to his ABA career
[QUOTE=Dr.J4ever]While I love the Doc, Wilt is the best Sixer of all time. This is from someone who never saw Wilt in real time, but the stories about him and his stats in the Philly area are legendary. Wilt battled those great Celtic teams, and while coming away a loser most of the time, when he finally broke through, the Sixers had built one of the great teams in NBA history.
The Sixers-Celtics rivalry used to be as good as any in sports, and it was due to those battles in the 60s. Now Doc is 2nd best because he continued the rivalry, and came away beating Bird in a fair share of H2H battles in the Playoffs. Then of course, Doc also won a title in 1983.
So it's 1.Wilt 2. Doc 3. Moses 4.Iverson 5.Barkley.. Except for Wilt, I saw them all. Andrew Toney could have been a beast.[/QUOTE]
I'd like to hear your take on why Moses and Dr. J are better than Iverson, 'cause personally I just don't see it.
[QUOTE=Audio One]Iverson was outscoring Barkley in slower-paced leagues, and has four scoring titles in the same timespan. Higher career ppg and totals points scored. Neither are lockdown defenders, but Iverson was a better defender, as evidenced by his two Big East DPOY honors from Georgetown, and his three steals titles, two of which came when he was leading the league in minutes, and was top-3 in scoring. He led his collegiate teams further, and is still the Hoyas all-time leading scorer. His '01 run beats anything Barkley ever did. He's led the league in scoring, steals, minutes, and top-5 in dimes all in the same 82 . Iverson and Jordan only 2 players to score at least 50 twice in same playoff series. Jordan, Wilt and Iverson only players with at least 3 50 point playoff games. Iverson most steals in a playoff game. Iverson 4 straight seasons Top 10 scoring and assists. Jordan and Iverson only players to lead the NBA in scoring and steals at least twice in the same season. Iverson and Jordan highest usage rate in a season Jordan 88 and Iverson 2001. Second highest ppg average in playoff history. He had better discipline, he had more skill, his will to win was unquestionably better. I love both, don't get me wrong, I just give the nod to Iverson for doing what he did,[B] in a tougher era, [/B]while being just 5'11 or so, in a league which Barkley had it easier, remember they created the five-second b2tb rule because of Barkley. Someone'll bring up efficiency, but we already saw what he could do when handchecking was vanquished, 33-3-7.5 on 45% with two steals :applause:[/QUOTE]
I'm curious of what you mean about tougher era?
I don't think you meant the teams or competition factor because Barkley competed against tougher teams in his era than Iverson did in his. Plus, Barkley played PF, so he was a 6'6 undersize power forward going up against bigger guys and outrebounding them.
[QUOTE=Micku]I'm curious of what you mean about tougher era?
I don't think you meant the teams or competition factor because Barkley competed against tougher teams in his era than Iverson did in his. Plus, Barkley played PF, so he was a 6'6 undersize power forward going up against bigger guys and outrebounding them.[/QUOTE]
Ok, Barkley's peak was from 88-93. During those years, his competition was at least equal to the competition of Iverson's, probably better, so I concede that. I was referring to the pace, and how the rules were more favorable to big men, UpChuck. Iverson's prime coincided during the rugby-league era, with handchecking, and comparable talent league-wide, while giving up 6.5 inches at least. Iverson had it harder than Barkley, and still got his, so that for me gives him the tiny edge
One forgotten name here is Hal Greer, he is certainly in the discussion.
-10x All Star
-Sixers All Time Leading Scorer
-NBA Champion (1967)
[URL="http://www.nba.com/history/players/greer_bio.html"]http://www.nba.com/history/players/greer_bio.html[/URL]
[FONT=arial][SIZE=4][I] "If there were an award given for a player who is most respected by basketball insiders, while getting the minimum public appreciation, Greer could win hands down." [/I][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=arial][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/FONT]
[QUOTE=PHILA]One forgotten name here is Hal Greer, he is certainly in the discussion.
-10x All Star
-Sixers All Time Leading Scorer
-NBA Champion (1967)
[URL="http://www.nba.com/history/players/greer_bio.html"]http://www.nba.com/history/players/greer_bio.html[/URL]
[FONT=arial][SIZE=4][I] "If there were an award given for a player who is most respected by basketball insiders, while getting the minimum public appreciation, Greer could win hands down." [/I][/SIZE][/FONT][FONT=arial][SIZE=2][/SIZE][/FONT][/QUOTE]
His number has been retired in the rafters so yes, he is one of the best ever. Honestly, it's hard to discuss players I never saw, but from all accounts from the older guys, he's right up there.
[QUOTE=Audio One]In my opinion:
Stilt
Iverson
Barkley
Moses
Erving
I personally think Erving gets overrated a lot due to his ABA career[/QUOTE]
:applause:
Also overrated because of his "GOAT aesthetic style" which is highly overrated anyway; he's neither the best dunker nor the most aesthetically pleasing player.
[QUOTE=Audio One]I'd like to hear your take on why Moses and Dr. J are better than Iverson, 'cause personally I just don't see it.[/QUOTE]
I'm a big admirer of Iverson. I will never forget his legendary will to win. His will to win was as good as any player in history, and that includes Michael. AI was a scoring machine of the first order.
However, at the end of the day, it's about winning. That to me is purpose for creating stats, and having a great will, and that is TO WIN GAMES. AI won many games, and led the Sixers to the Finals, but it wasn't enough. Why?
Many factors, but some of them had to do with AI himself. As great as he was, he also suppressed his teammates abilities at times.
AI got teamed with Stackhouse, Kukoch, Robinson, Coleman, and maybe a few I forgot, but these scorers never had their best games with AI. None of these players will think they had their best years with AI. The game has a lot to do with making your teammates better, and AI sadly didn't always do that.
AI didn't always want to win "the right way", like Larry Brown would say. AI was selfish at times, and didn't play defense at an acceptable level during other times. It's not about assists or steals, which can be bogus stats, but it's about "gluing" the team together to make the whole better than the individual parts. This is where AI failed.
Wilt had his unbreakable records and numbers as a Philadelphia Warrior. He still posted insane numbers and won a championship as a Sixer but only in a couple of seasons.
How do you factor his numbers and stuff?
[QUOTE=DMV2]Wilt had his unbreakable records and numbers as a Philadelphia Warrior. He still posted insane numbers and won a championship as a Sixer but only in a couple of seasons.
How do you factor his numbers and stuff?[/QUOTE]
Wilt was a Sixer from 1965-68, so yes he played with the Phila warriors early on, but the 1967 Sixers are still one of the great teams in NBA history.
If the question is who was the greatest Sixer, then Wilt was the greatest Sixer.
Iverson has no business being uttered in the same breath as Wilt and the Doctor. It's a joke to even put Iverson and his 28 shot attempts to average 31.5 points in the same sentence as legends like Wilt and Julius. Only some stupid ghetto trash kids would even think Iverson was better or even in the league of such legends.
Also LMFAO till a near heartache to listen to AudioOne's plethora of bullshit. Iverson was a ****ing terrible defensive player during his NBA career. He got all those steals because he had no respect for team defense and gambled to get that 1 or 2 steals a game. He was an absolutely atrocious team defender and team defense is what matters when you are playing 5 on 5. AudioOne shut the **** up and stop embarassing yourself with your buillshit.
Wilt. Doctor J played his BEST basketball w/ the Nets from what I've read and limited ABA footage I saw.