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Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE]If given the choice of any player in NBA history to start a franchise, legendary coach Phil Jackson says Celtics center Bill Russell would win out over his former player Michael Jordan.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is pick 'em
Phil Jackson is so overrated.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is pick 'em
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is pick 'em
[QUOTE=b0bab0i]pOST liNKS to sauces?[/QUOTE]
[url]http://southernfood.about.com/od/spaghettisaucerecipes/r/bl30623n.htm[/url]
[url]http://allrecipes.com/recipe/alfredo-sauce-2/[/url]
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is pick 'em
[QUOTE=AngelEyes][url]http://southernfood.about.com/od/spaghettisaucerecipes/r/bl30623n.htm[/url]
[url]http://allrecipes.com/recipe/alfredo-sauce-2/[/url][/QUOTE]
:roll: :oldlol: :roll: :oldlol:
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Who the hell is Phil Jackson, and just what the hell does he know about basketball?
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Dat backpedaling
Kobe prob sent him a spiteful text message
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Wtf.
At the Kobe. Not just because Jordan is in a different level, but because he was less of a headache for him.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Bill Russell is probably the 2nd best player of all time after MJ. It's not crazy to say he was better than Jordan. Russ was a beast.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]Bill Russell is probably the 2nd best player of all time after MJ. It's not crazy to say he was better than Jordan. Russ was a beast.[/QUOTE]
Not even close my friend. The only player that has a case for clear cut 2nd best, and arguably tied with MJ is Kareem.
Bill Russell was like Dwight Howard with b-ball IQ, much better defender, rebounder, shot blocker, and overall intangibles.
He was Dennis Rodman mixed with Barkley, and a dash of Howard, but better than all 3.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0]Not even close my friend. The only player that has a case for clear cut 2nd best, and arguably tied with MJ is Kareem.
Bill Russell was like Dwight Howard with b-ball IQ, much better defender, rebounder, shot blocker, and overall intangibles.
He was Dennis Rodman mixed with Barkley, and a dash of Howard, but better than all 3.[/QUOTE]
Russell was the ultimate team player. He could get in the head of anybody, could dominate the game by taking five shots, and was one of the best passers in the league at the time. Hondo said their team took a huge shock the year after he retired because they ran through his passes.
He was super unselfish and was the GOAT defender and rebounder. Also, an amazing athlete. If I got a team full of shooters I'm gonna pick Russell, if I have a team with scrubs, I'm taking MJ.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]Russell was the ultimate team player. He could get in the head of anybody, could dominate the game by taking five shots, and was one of the best passers in the league at the time. Hondo said their team took a huge shock the year after he retired because they ran through his passes.
He was super unselfish and was the GOAT defender and rebounder. Also, an amazing athlete. If I got a team full of shooters I'm gonna pick Russell, if I have a team with scrubs, I'm taking MJ.[/QUOTE]
Agree. Bill Russell is hands down the greatest defender of all time. I would love to start a franchise with Mr. Russell. I still put MJ and Kareem SLIGHTLY ahead of him. I mean by the slightest of margins.
Russell on defense was like a cheat code. Never knew he was such a great passer. Makes him even more deadly.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Yeah, Bill won a lot and you can argue between him and Mj to start a franchise, but MJ or Kobe? C'mon ...
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
No surprise. If given the choice, Phil would also take Shaq over MJ. He's always felt that basketball is a big man's game.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
The only reason I really think Russell has a case over Kareem is that Bill had such heart and was obsessed with winning. It was almost scary :lol He got sick before every single game. I never really saw a killer instinct in Kareem.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Mr. I'm So Rad]No surprise. If given the choice, Phil would also take Shaq over MJ.[/QUOTE]
Until he comes out and says so himself, let's not put words in his mouth or act like we're privy to his thoughts he hasn't divulged.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]The only reason I really think Russell has a case over Kareem is that Bill had such heart and was obsessed with winning. It was almost scary :lol I never really saw that killer instinct in Kareem.[/QUOTE]
True. Bill Russell is easily my favorite big man. He was like a created character in a videogame, if you raised all his stats to 99 on the defensive side, and intangibles.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0][B][U][COLOR="Green"]Not even close my friend[/COLOR][/U][/B]. The only player that has a case for clear cut 2nd best, and arguably tied with MJ is Kareem.
[B][U][COLOR="DarkGreen"]Bill Russell was like Dwight Howard[/COLOR][/U][/B] with b-ball IQ, much better defender, rebounder, shot blocker, and overall intangibles.
He was Dennis Rodman mixed with Barkley, and a dash of Howard, but better than all 3.[/QUOTE]:coleman:
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=teddytwelvetoes]:coleman:[/QUOTE]
OK, I exaggerated with not even close. You know what I meant with the Dwight Howard comparison. Just imagine Dwight Howard being 100x better, and you got Bill Russell.
P.S. Depending on what mood I'm in, Russell is easily my favorite player of all time.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Wow did I change your mind about Bill that much?! :lol You changed your avatar to him.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=teddytwelvetoes]:coleman:[/QUOTE]
Howard was the latest in a long line of "next Bill Russells" which has spanned from Nate Thurmond to Anthony Davis and Nerlens Noel, but this season should definitively put a permanent moratorium on Howard ever being put in the same sentence as Russell again.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]Wow did I change your mind about Bill that much?! :lol You changed your avatar to him.[/QUOTE]
YES. :D
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Comment:
[QUOTE]Kobe had a higher ceiling but lower floor than Jordan but Jordan was more consistent, it really is a toss up.
[/QUOTE]
Its funny that this is the compromise Kobe stans have settled for now, but no. I'm sorry, the answer's still no. Not even close.
For the record, Kobe taking more difficult shots only means he wasn't talented enough or smart enough to create better shots. Either way, its not a good thing.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0]YES. :D[/QUOTE]
:applause:
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]Howard was the latest in a long line of "next Bill Russells" which has spanned from Nate Thurmond to Anthony Davis and Nerlens Noel, but this season should definitively put a permanent moratorium on Howard ever being put in the same sentence as Russell again.[/QUOTE]
Howard lacks the intelligence, game, and mentality to even be compared to Russell.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
As a Jordan fan, I have no problem PJax picking Russell over MJ. I rank MJ, KAJ, Bird and Magic over Bill but that's my opinion.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]Howard was the latest in a long line of "next Bill Russells" which has spanned from Nate Thurmond to Anthony Davis and Nerlens Noel, but this season should definitively put a permanent moratorium on Howard ever being put in the same sentence as Russell again.[/QUOTE]
Did Walton ever get any 'next Bill Russell' hype? Everything I've read has painted him as a different player than Wilt or Russ, but I feel like it must've been there to some extent.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0]Howard lacks the intelligence, game, and mentality to even be compared to Russell.[/QUOTE]
True, but that didn't stop people from comparing them anyway. I keep track of this stuff, and there was a lot of talk about Howard possibly being the next Bill Russell, with Matt Guokas famously saying he was better, a statement which seems even more silly now.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]True, but that didn't stop people from comparing them anyway. I keep track of this stuff, and there was a lot of talk about Howard possibly being the next Bill Russell, with Matt Guokas famously saying he was better, a statement which seems even more silly now.[/QUOTE]
Who do you think is the closest representation of him ATM?
Noah? A super, super, super bootleg version of Russ.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
The ring argument on its own is ridiculous. In that case, Phil would pick Sam Jones as his second choice?
HOWEVER, there is a legitimate argument for Russell. Russell's offensive deficiencies are well documented, but it doesn't tell the story. Russell sacrificied his offensive game (for the most part) in favour of doing the things that WON all those championships: defense. He was the one consistent factor in all 11 rings because he modelled his game perfectly for his team mates to succeed. And, ultimately, the weak era argument is quite meaningless because you can only defeat what's in front of you - the ultimate purpose of basketball is to win, and that's exactly what he did. For eleven out of those thirteen seasons.
When he was needed to play offense, he did. I do recall seeing that he had some pretty big offensive games when the situation called for it, but he was a true pioneer of the game.
He focused on the unflashy things and didn't lose sight of what he had to do to bring success. That is an attitude and mindset that might be unparalleled in the history of game.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0]Who do you think is the closest representation of him ATM?
Noah? A super, super, super bootleg version of Russ.[/QUOTE]
Marc Gasol. A great defensive big man who's great at passing and is great because of the little things he does that aren't on the stat sheet. He's different offensively and no where near as athletic as him but he's still kind of similar. Gasol will never be the player Russell is though so there really isn't a close representation of him. The closest to him in the past was peak Bill Walton. A poor man's Walton would be a good comparison for Gasol.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=fpliii]Did Walton ever get any 'next Bill Russell' hype? Everything I've read has painted him as a different player than Wilt or Russ, but I feel like it must've been there to some extent.[/QUOTE]
Walton received some comparisons to Russell both in UCLA and at Portland, and if I remember correctly, I think Russell himself was asked about it while he was a commentator. It wasn't to the extent that, to give more modern examples, David Robinson at Navy or Patrick Ewing at Georgetown were hyped as "next Bill Russells" before setting foot in the NBA, but Walton was likened to Russell during Walton's short-lived prime due to their outlet passing, defense and making teams better, and I remember a couple people saying afterward that Walton was the only center who came closest to Russell's impact. I could send you some stuff later, if you wish.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
First he said MJ was better, but now he can't make a decision on who to pick?
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]Marc Gasol. A great defensive big man who's great at passing and is great because of the little things he does that aren't on the stat sheet. He's different offensively and no where near as athletic as him but he's still kind of similar.[/QUOTE]
Yeah, but when I think of Russell, I think of a crazy athletic specimen that's flying up and down the court, wreaking havoc.
In a way yes, Gasol can be compared to Russ, but aesthetically wise, Gasol is too lumbering for me to compare the 2.
What about a 200-300x better version of Kenneth Faried with much better offensive awareness?
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=ThaRegul8r]Walton received some comparisons to Russell both in UCLA and at Portland, and if I remember correctly, I think Russell himself was asked about it while he was a commentator. It wasn't to the extent that, to give more modern examples, David Robinson at Navy or Patrick Ewing at Georgetown were hyped as "next Bill Russells" before setting foot in the NBA, but Walton was likened to Russell during Walton's short-lived prime due to their outlet passing, defense and making teams better, and I remember a couple people saying afterward that Walton was the only center who came closest to Russell's impact. I could send you some stuff later, if you wish.[/QUOTE]
Agreed. Walton was an amazing player at his peak. Too bad injuries got to him.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=tikay0]Yeah, but when I think of Russell, I think of a crazy athletic specimen that's flying up and down the court, wreaking havoc.
In a way yes, Gasol can be compared to Russ, but aesthetically wise, Gasol is too lumbering for me to compare the 2.
What about a 200-300x better version of Kenneth Faried with much better offensive awareness?[/QUOTE]
No. Faried is a good rebounder and athletic. That's it. He isn't a great defender which was Russell's biggest skill.
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
[QUOTE=Shade8780]No. Faried is a good rebounder and athletic. That's it. He isn't a great defender which was Russell's biggest skill.[/QUOTE]
I guess you're right. OK, Faried with 500x better defense and 300x better on offense. :confusedshrug:
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
When will people realize that Phil just says this shit for attention?
As far as picking Bill Russell he's the greatest winner in NBA history as a player. Isn't that the point of the game?
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Order of players I would draft first as a GM:
1. Bird
2. MJ
3. Russell
4. Magic
5. Kareem
6. Shaq
7. Wilt
[B]THIS IS [U]NOT[/U] MY TOP 10...BIG DIFFERENCE.[/B]
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Re: Phil Jackson picks Bill Russell over MJ & basically says MJ or Kobe is a pick 'em
Not that I care what Phil thinks, I form my own opinions and saying something is true just because Phil Jackson said so is a fallacious argument. But it's funny how all the usual Kobe detractors were quoting Phil like his words were gospel from the bible when it fit their agenda, but now that he says he was willing to flip a coin because Kobe and Mike were both so dominating, you haters don't like it and say "who cares what Phil says, he's just trying to appease Kobe". :oldlol:
[QUOTE]he wasn't talented enough or smart enough to create better shots. [/QUOTE]
Uh, no. Kobe/Phil have already talked about this
Kobe has SMALL HANDS and can't control the ball when going to the basket like Mike. MJ was more athletic, which allowed him to get to the basket at a better rate. Kobe doesn't take tougher shots cause he's not smart or has a low basketball IQ, he just didn't get the same physical gifts as Jordan or LeBron. He's already on the record saying that if he had bigger hands, that he would take it to the basket every play and dunk the ball or lay it up. He just can't do it because he didn't win the genetic lottery like LeBron or Mike.
Which is why him being who he is becomes so impressive. This is a guy with average-good athleticism, but not the outta this world athleticism that Mike, LeBron or even Vince Carter have, yet he's been able to place himself right there with Bron and MJ. That is why I respect and admire Kobe. He dedicated time to develop his skills and worked around his short-comings. He isn't who he is because he's an anomaly of biology like LeBron James who simply cannot be stopped because he's a 6'8" 270 pound freak of nature with the speed and agility of a 6'4 200 pound point guard.