As it stands they have had no more success than the Seattle Seahawks run. Despite having home field advantage for 4 straight seasons. They should be the 90's cowboys but we aren't seeing it.
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As it stands they have had no more success than the Seattle Seahawks run. Despite having home field advantage for 4 straight seasons. They should be the 90's cowboys but we aren't seeing it.
They won a superbowl. It can never be considered a wasted anything when that happens. Team go decades without even making the playoffs. The Cowboys have won something like 4 games in the last 30 years.
Its hard to win in this league.
[QUOTE=Carbine;14648043]They won a superbowl. It can never be considered a wasted anything when that happens. Team go decades without even making the playoffs. The Cowboys have won something like 4 games in the last 30 years.
Its hard to win in this league.[/QUOTE]
Wouldn't it be considered a disappointment if the big 3 Heat or the Shaq-Kobe Lakers only won once? Lakers because that's the level of talent KC had.
[QUOTE=Duderonomy;14648082]Wouldn't it be considered a disappointment if the big 3 Heat or the Shaq-Kobe Lakers only won once? Lakers because that's the level of talent KC had.[/QUOTE]
In basketball, having 2 stars could create a dynasty. In football, each team essentially has 3 different groups (offense, defense, special teams), and a lot of times they don't even meet each other much. It's a very different story and a difficult task for everyone to be in synchronous harmony with that many moving parts.
[QUOTE=Duderonomy;14648082]Wouldn't it be considered a disappointment if the big 3 Heat or the Shaq-Kobe Lakers only won once? Lakers because that's the level of talent KC had.[/QUOTE]
With 7 game series, only 5 players on the floor at any given moment, and a rotation of 7-10 players, the NBA playoffs are structured in a way that emphasizes talent differentials and reduces the likelihood and influence of lucky or fluke games. Meanwhile in the 1 and done NFL, teams have 11 guys on the field at any time and overall there are probably 30-40 players getting meaningful playing time every game, which diminishes the influence that a single talented individual can have upon the game... and with a one and done playoff system luck/flukes have MUCH more influence on the NFL playoffs.
When you look at the NBA, its very rare to see a team that wasnt a huge favorite ending up with a championship win (it does happen occasionally, like the Pistons in 2004, the Mavs in 2011, or the Raptors in 2019)... on the other hand, how many people thought the Rams would be champions at the start of last season? How many people picked the Eagles as champions at the start of 2017? How many people picked the Broncos at the start of 2015? How many people picked the Ravens at the start of 2012? How many people picked the Giants at the start of 2011? Meanwhile back in the NBA, in four straight years from 2016-2019, the Finals was Warriors vs Cavs, and from 2011 to 2020 Lebron appeared in 9 out of 10 championship games (and Lebron isnt even the greatest NBA player of all time). Compare that with the NFL, where Bradys Patriots (the undisputed GOAT player and the GOAT team) appeared in 9/18 superbowls.
Aside from the Patriots, how many NFL franchises have won more than one championship in the past couple of decades? The Steelers, Ravens, and Giants? How many NFL franchises have won back to back superbowls? (the last time that happened was 1998) Going back to 1987, there are a grand total of 3 back to back superbowl champs. Meanwhile in the NBA, there have been 4 back to back champs since 1998 (including a lakers 3 peat, something that has never happened in NFL history), and every single NBA championship won between 1987 and 1998 was won as part of back to back championships (Lakers 87 & 88, Pistons 89 & 90, Bulls 91 92 93, Rockets 94 95, Bulls 96 97 98).
Anyway, Mahomes had a down year last year (if 4840 yrds with 37 TDs and 12 INTs can be considered a down year)... but hes only 26 and from a pure talent perspective he easily has the best arm in the NFL. We arent going to know whether the Chiefs wasted their opportunity until Mahomes gets old or leaves the team, and considering he signed for a contract for half a billion over 12 years recently, he probably isnt going to be leaving the team any time soon.
They just played and won the greatest playoff game in the last 30 years.
They'll still be in the thick of things as long as Mahomes is there.
That defense isn't good enough to support the offense in a deep playoff run.
[QUOTE=Nanners;14649603]Anyway, Mahomes had a down year last year (if 4840 yrds with 37 TDs and 12 INTs can be considered a down year)... but hes only 26 and from a pure talent perspective [B]he easily has the best arm in the NFL[/B]. We arent going to know whether the Chiefs wasted their opportunity until Mahomes gets old or leaves the team, and considering he signed for a contract for half a billion over 12 years recently, he probably isnt going to be leaving the team any time soon.[/QUOTE]
That dude from Buffalo has something to say about this one. Couple boys in LA that say hi too.
I understand and agree with what you're saying in general though. The Chiefs will probably get hot win another one when they aren't favorites at the start of the postseason. Happens all the time.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14658126]That dude from Buffalo has something to say about this one. Couple boys in LA that say hi too.
I understand and agree with what you're saying in general though. The Chiefs will probably get hot win another one when they aren't favorites at the start of the postseason. Happens all the time.[/QUOTE]
What is there to agree with?
They've won a superbowl, made another one, and were a few plays from making 3 straight.
Mahomes is 26.
Wtf have they wasted? His career has literally just started and they've already won a SB and make it deep every year.
This take is retarded.
[QUOTE=AlternativeAcc.;14658228][B]What is there to agree with? [/B]
They've won a superbowl, made another one, and were a few plays from making 3 straight.
Mahomes is 26.
Wtf have they wasted? His career has literally just started and they've already won a SB and make it deep every year.
This take is retarded.[/QUOTE]
It was more about disagreeing with him [I]easily [/I]having the best arm.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14658126]That dude from Buffalo has something to say about this one. Couple boys in LA that say hi too.
I understand and agree with what you're saying in general though. The Chiefs will probably get hot win another one when they aren't favorites at the start of the postseason. Happens all the time.[/QUOTE]
No doubt Josh Allen and Justin Herbert both have phenomenal arms, but Mahomes is in a league of his own IMO... he regularly makes throws that Allen and Herbert arent even allowed to attempt (stuff like throwing accross his body to a WR 40+ yards away as someone is tackling him)
Who else has arm talent that is legitimately comparable to Mahomes? IMO other than the ones you mentioned, the only other contenders are maybe Rodgers and maaaaybe Burrow (depends on whether he can improve again this year).
[QUOTE=Nanners;14658662]No doubt Josh Allen and Justin Herbert both have phenomenal arms, but Mahomes is in a league of his own IMO... he regularly makes throws that Allen and Herbert arent even allowed to attempt (stuff like throwing accross his body to a WR 40+ yards away as someone is tackling him)
Who else has arm talent that is legitimately comparable to Mahomes? IMO other than the ones you mentioned, the only other contenders are maybe Rodgers and [B]maaaaybe Burrow[/B] (depends on whether he can improve again this year).[/QUOTE]
So this is where you lose me, or maybe we just aren't talking about the same thing. Are you including timing/touch/accuracy in this? If so then sure, you can put Burrow near the top. But if we're just talking pure arm strength? He can't fvck with Allen and Herbert at all. Allen can throw the ball 100 yards and Herbert has an outrageous release/velocity combination that I've only really seen Rodgers match or exceed.
If you were to argue that Mahomes is in a league of his own as far as making plays and strange throws then I'd agree. But I'm not putting him in a league of his own when it comes to arm strength. In fact I'm not sure he's number 1.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14658684]So this is where you lose me, or maybe we just aren't talking about the same thing. Are you including timing/touch/accuracy in this? If so then sure, you can put Burrow near the top. But if we're just talking pure arm strength? He can't fvck with Allen and Herbert at all. Allen can throw the ball 100 yards and Herbert has an outrageous release/velocity combination that I've only really seen Rodgers match or exceed.
If you were to argue that Mahomes is in a league of his own as far as making plays and strange throws then I'd agree. But I'm not putting him in a league of his own when it comes to arm strength. In fact I'm not sure he's number 1.[/QUOTE]
For the record, I never said Mahomes has the "strongest arm", I said that from a talent perspective he has the best arm in the NFL. No doubt a big part of what makes Mahomes arm so great is his strength, particularly his ability to throw with strength when his body is contorted or he has poor footing... but I wouldnt say Mahomes is great because he has a strong arm, I would say he is great because his arm is able to reliably complete passes that 99% of QBs in all of NFL history would never even attempt.
When I said "arm talent" I was absolutely referring to things like timing/touch/accuracy in addition to strength.
Anyway, no doubt Burrow does not have the insane arm strength of Allen or Herbert (or Mahomes), and I dunno if Rodgers really has that kind of strength these days either (As a young man he did, but hes about to turn 39 in a couple months)...that said I think its pretty self evident that both Burrow and Rodgers have phenomenally "talented" arms.
[QUOTE=Nanners;14658693]For the record, I never said Mahomes has the "strongest arm", I said that from a talent perspective he has the best arm in the NFL. No doubt a big part of what makes Mahomes arm so great is his strength, particularly his ability to throw with strength when his body is contorted or he has poor footing... but I wouldnt say Mahomes is great because he has a strong arm, I would say he is great because his arm is able to reliably complete passes that 99% of QBs in all of NFL history would never even attempt.
When I said "arm talent" I was absolutely referring to things like timing/touch/accuracy in addition to strength.
Anyway, no doubt Burrow does not have the insane arm strength of Allen or Herbert (or Mahomes), and I dunno if Rodgers really has that kind of strength these days either (As a young man he did, but hes about to turn 39 in a couple months)...that said I think its pretty self evident that both Burrow and Rodgers have phenomenally "talented" arms.[/QUOTE]
:cheers:
Yea in that case I 100% agree. Although the way Allen has improved seemingly exponentially every year I am about to put him in that overall throwing category. Pretty much every throw he made last night was on the money. I don't think a lot of quarterbacks would go at Ramsey like that.
Herbert is more mechanical in his movements and doesn't throw at weird angles or anything much but his ability to get the ball out so quickly and with so much power is an unbelievable weapon. Being an OC with a guy like that would be the best job in the world. You can do anything.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14658715]:cheers:
Yea in that case I 100% agree. Although the way Allen has improved seemingly exponentially every year I am about to put him in that overall throwing category. Pretty much every throw he made last night was on the money. I don't think a lot of quarterbacks would go at Ramsey like that.
Herbert is more mechanical in his movements and doesn't throw at weird angles or anything much but his ability to get the ball out so quickly and with so much power is an unbelievable weapon. Being an OC with a guy like that would be the best job in the world. You can do anything.[/QUOTE]
:cheers:
I totally agree about Allen. If Mahomes has another "meh" year while Allen continues to prove that he is elite in virtually every measurable way, I would have no problem putting him in (or possibly above) the mahomes tier of passers. Ultimately both Allen and Mahomes (and Herbert for that matter) are still quite young and while I would currently say that Mahomes has the best arm of the 3 by a good margin, I certainly dont think its impossible for that title to be taken from him.
You are spot on about Herbert btw. I am a U of Oregon alum so I am obligated to be a Herbert fan and I have been tremendously impressed by his strength, not just his ability to throw deep but also his ability to shed tackles or throw while being tackled... kinda reminds me of big ben or something (but Herbert is MUCH more likeable). I wish he was on the Seahawks.
[QUOTE=Nanners;14658732]:cheers:
I totally agree about Allen. If Mahomes has another "meh" year while Allen continues to prove that he is elite in virtually every measurable way, I would have no problem putting him in (or possibly above) the mahomes tier of passers. Ultimately both Allen and Mahomes (and Herbert for that matter) are still quite young and while I would currently say that Mahomes has the best arm of the 3 by a good margin, I certainly dont think its impossible for that title to be taken from him.
You are spot on about Herbert btw. I am a U of Oregon alum so I am obligated to be a Herbert fan and I have been tremendously impressed by his strength, not just his ability to throw deep but also his ability to shed tackles or throw while being tackled... kinda reminds me of big ben or something (but Herbert is MUCH more likeable). I wish he was on the Seahawks.[/QUOTE]
With Hebert it’s not necessarily just his power size-wise like Big Ben though. He goes through progressions quickly, has a quick release, and then has the velocity to put the ball wherever whenever. We’re talk Mahomes and Allen but this dude could legit be the best quarterback in the league very soon. Depends on how he performs under pressure in big games which it TBD. But from what I’ve seen I don’t think they’ll be a problem there.
As an aside: I want to go to a game in Eugene so badly. Wished it was a 1:1 with the Dawgs at both of our places.
[QUOTE=ShawkFactory;14659297]With Hebert it’s not necessarily just his power size-wise like Big Ben though. He goes through progressions quickly, has a quick release, and then has the velocity to put the ball wherever whenever. We’re talk Mahomes and Allen but this dude could legit be the best quarterback in the league very soon. Depends on how he performs under pressure in big games which it TBD. But from what I’ve seen I don’t think they’ll be a problem there.
As an aside: I want to go to a game in Eugene so badly. Wished it was a 1:1 with the Dawgs at both of our places.[/QUOTE]
I agree entirely about Herberts ability to progress through his targets, release the ball quickly, and put velocity on any ball... For the record I never said he was better or worse than Big Ben, I just said that his skillset "kinda reminds me of Big Ben or something".
Anyway as a die hard seahawks fan, I probably hate big ben as much as anyone except browns fans (And while those browns fans were relentlessly destroyed year after year, they never had big ben steal a superbowl from them (like what happened with the Seahawks in 2005))