How can you be a goat candidate if you need Kareem to win or AD to play like Kareem?

[3ba11]

Plus a bunch of other stars as well?.

The high level of supporting talent needed confirms the inferiority of the STRATEGY (ball-dominance).

[zeerghit]

Kareem>>>>Jordan

[RRR3]

Snivelly lied about having a college basketball career.

[3ba11]

Kareem>>>>Jordan


Kareem wasn't the best player for half of his rings

So Jordan has twice as many rings as the best player than Kareem, despite just 1 all-star teammate (9 for Kareem).

[1987_Lakers]

Bird fed


Both AD and Kareem needed super-point guards like Oscar, Magic, and now Lebron to find synergies and have a great team.

Without these guys bird-feeding them, they're losers.

I mentioned last year that AD's teams are only as good as the guys getting him the ball, which explains his weak teams in previous years (I like Jrue Holiday, but there's a lot of teams with ballhandlers that compare or exceed him, hence AD's underwhelming teams in previous years)

But now AD has his Magic; he has his Oscar, just like Kareem did.

:roll:

[ShawkFactory]

Bird fed



:roll:

COMPLETELY flipping the script :lol

[3ba11]

Thread title:

How can you be a goat candidate if you need Kareem to win or AD to play like Kareem?

Unanswered

[TheCorporation]

Birdfed AD is thriving thanks to LeBron



Both AD and Kareem needed super-point guards like Oscar, Magic, and now Lebron to find synergies and have a great team.

Without these guys bird-feeding them, they're losers.

I mentioned last year that AD's teams are only as good as the guys getting him the ball, which explains his weak teams in previous years (I like Jrue Holiday, but there's a lot of teams with ballhandlers that compare or exceed him, hence AD's underwhelming teams in previous years)

But now AD has his Magic; he has his Oscar, just like Kareem did.

[TheCorporation]

BTW, are you saying that LeBron elevated a borderline top 75 player (A.D.) to drawing comparisons to a top 3 GOAT candidate (Kareem).

LeBron elevated AD to Kareem status and that's...bad? :lol

[SouBeachTalents]

Bird fed



:roll:
Yikes, another player this fakkit completely flipped flopped on within a matter of months :lol

[r15mohd]

Yikes, another player this fakkit completely flipped flopped on within a matter of months :lol

matter of time before it's weeks to days... at which point he wont even care how much of hypocrite or contradictory he sounds

as for college ball - much of the same. claims he played for FIU (did by bachelors there), but has threads on here saying he went to school in Chicago and played at pickup gyms MJ use to as well. :facepalm the tapes are there 3ball, you're nothing but a gimmick

[3ba11]

Yikes, another player this fakkit completely flipped flopped on within a matter of months :lol


My main gripes for years have specifically been ball-dominators and bird-feeders.. BOTH player types

Ball-dominators and bird-feeders need each other to win, so they need too much help and aren't in my top 10 (no centers or ball-dominators in my top 10 - it's literally an official criteria (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?499177-My-top-10-(supercedes-all-previous-rankings-for-reference-purposes-going-forward))).

100% consistency

[RRR3]

matter of time before it's weeks to days... at which point he wont even care how much of hypocrite or contradictory he sounds

as for college ball - much of the same. claims he played for FIU (did by bachelors there), but has threads on here saying he went to school in Chicago and played at pickup gyms MJ use to as well. :facepalm the tapes are there 3ball, you're nothing but a gimmick
Yikes, imagine lying about being a college basketball player. Dude is living in a fantasy world.

[Phoenix]

My main gripes for years have specifically been ball-dominators and bird-feeders.. BOTH player types

Ball-dominators and bird-feeders need each other to win, so they need too much help and aren't in my top 10 (no centers or ball-dominators in my top 10 - it's literally an official criteria (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?499177-My-top-10-(supercedes-all-previous-rankings-for-reference-purposes-going-forward))).

100% consistency

"Both AD and Kareem needed super-point guards like Oscar, Magic, and now Lebron to find synergies and have a great team.

Without these guys bird-feeding them, they're losers."

So are Magic and Lebron ball dominators, or super point guards? Or are you saying they're both? Because the former isn't a complimentary term, while the latter appears to be.

[John8204]

Well to answer the question...because all the GOAT candidates have an issue like that.

Mikan - dominated the game with the weakest supporting cast but it was first generation
Russell - wasn't even the best scorer on his team and had a hall of famer at every position
Kareem - needed an all-time PG to win, failed to dominant the easier half of his career during his prime productive years
Wilt - won the fewest titles (2) and couldn't shoot a free throw
Bird - 50/50 over top competition only played 2/3rds of a career
Magic - 50/50 over top competition, needed Kareem, only played 2/3rds of a career
Jordan - never beat the other goat (Larry) in the playoffs, took the longest time of any GOAT to win a chip
James - lost in the finals more than he won, had to rebuild his title team every five years or so

[Bronbron23]

Plus a bunch of other stars as well?.

The high level of supporting talent needed confirms the inferiority of the STRATEGY (ball-dominance).

Magic proved as a rookie he didn't need kareem. Did mj do anything close as a rookie? Pur some respect on magics name bruh

[StrongLurk]

The saddest part about OP is that he doesn't get paid at all for wasting so much of his time on this site. Is there anyone else who posts as much as OP (while also somehow repeating that same few subjects)?

[RogueBorg]

Jordan - took the longest time of any GOAT to win a chip


You sure?

1984-'85 to 1990-'91 = 7 seasons
2003-'04 to 2011-'12 = 9 seasons

[Airupthere]

You sure?

1984-'85 to 1990-'91 = 7 seasons
2003-'04 to 2011-'12 = 9 seasons

With 85-86 mostly out due to injury. That was a momentum killer.

[TheCorporation]

BTW, are you saying that LeBron elevated a borderline top 75 player (A.D.) to drawing comparisons to a top 3 GOAT candidate (Kareem).

LeBron elevated AD to Kareem status and that's...bad? :lol

[John8204]

You sure?

1984-'85 to 1990-'91 = 7 seasons
2003-'04 to 2011-'12 = 9 seasons

True...but MJ was older than Lebron so it took MJ more years and Lebron more seasons

[GrayGoat]

3ball better be careful. His henchmen are tired of carrying his dumbass in every stupid fvcking thread he makes :)

[000]

Plus a bunch of other stars as well?.

The high level of supporting talent needed confirms the inferiority of the STRATEGY (ball-dominance).

AD is shedding light on Kareem's career & ranking, imo (new all-time rankings inside)

Both AD and Kareem needed super-point guards like Oscar, Magic, and now Lebron to find synergies and have a great team.

Without these guys bird-feeding them, they're losers.

I mentioned last year that AD's teams are only as good as the guys getting him the ball, which explains his weak teams in previous years (I like Jrue Holiday, but there's a lot of teams with ballhandlers that compare or exceed him, hence AD's underwhelming teams in previous years)

But now AD has his Magic; he has his Oscar, just like Kareem did.. A ring is automatic barring injuries..

But this sheds light on the historical rankings - given this apparent dynamic (that AD and Kareem's teams are only as good as the guys getting them the ball), Kareem should certainly rank below Magic, and historic PG's like Magic and Oscar are more valuable than any big man not named Wilt or Shaq, whose physical dominance controlled games.

However, even though historic PG's have good teams without a dominant big man, they still seem to need an all-time big man to win a championship, while 2-way assassin-style players with scoring versatility, aka MJ, Kobe and even Kawhi seem immune from this need.

So to me, 2-way assassins with scoring versatility (MJ, Kobe) are the goats because they seemed to need the least help... So they're in the top 3 for me.. the historic PG's are next in line, with goat physical forces Wilt and Shaq coming next.. Kareem comes AFTER all these guys, and ahead of team-hoppers/super-team seekers Durant and Lebron..


1) MJ
2) Bird
3) Kobe
4) Magic
5) Wilt
6) Shaq
7) Kareem
8) Duncan (seriously considering Duncan over Kareem)
9) Russell
10) Oscar
11) Lebron
12) Dr. J
13) Durant


Something like that.. If Kawhi wins a couple rings with the Clippers, he would easily be top 10 because he fits the optimal player type of "2-way assassin with scoring versatility"

And you might be wondering how I have Bird #2 as a 2-way assassin... I think his defense is vastly underrated and he actually was a 2-way assassin.. Celtics had the #1 defense with Bird and his savvy/next-level basketball brain/instinct
.

[GrayGoat]

Kareem has 3ball shook

[SouBeachTalents]

AD is shedding light on Kareem's career & ranking, imo (new all-time rankings inside)

Both AD and Kareem needed super-point guards like Oscar, Magic, and now Lebron to find synergies and have a great team.

Without these guys bird-feeding them, they're losers.

I mentioned last year that AD's teams are only as good as the guys getting him the ball, which explains his weak teams in previous years (I like Jrue Holiday, but there's a lot of teams with ballhandlers that compare or exceed him, hence AD's underwhelming teams in previous years)

But now AD has his Magic; he has his Oscar, just like Kareem did.. A ring is automatic barring injuries..

But this sheds light on the historical rankings - given this apparent dynamic (that AD and Kareem's teams are only as good as the guys getting them the ball), Kareem should certainly rank below Magic, and historic PG's like Magic and Oscar are more valuable than any big man not named Wilt or Shaq, whose physical dominance controlled games.

However, even though historic PG's have good teams without a dominant big man, they still seem to need an all-time big man to win a championship, while 2-way assassin-style players with scoring versatility, aka MJ, Kobe and even Kawhi seem immune from this need.

So to me, 2-way assassins with scoring versatility (MJ, Kobe) are the goats because they seemed to need the least help... So they're in the top 3 for me.. the historic PG's are next in line, with goat physical forces Wilt and Shaq coming next.. Kareem comes AFTER all these guys, and ahead of team-hoppers/super-team seekers Durant and Lebron..


1) MJ
2) Bird
3) Kobe
4) Magic
5) Wilt
6) Shaq
7) Kareem
8) Duncan (seriously considering Duncan over Kareem)
9) Russell
10) Oscar
11) Lebron
12) Dr. J
13) Durant


Something like that.. If Kawhi wins a couple rings with the Clippers, he would easily be top 10 because he fits the optimal player type of "2-way assassin with scoring versatility"

And you might be wondering how I have Bird #2 as a 2-way assassin... I think his defense is vastly underrated and he actually was a 2-way assassin.. Celtics had the #1 defense with Bird and his savvy/next-level basketball brain/instinct
.
No Curry, Dirk, Giannis or Kawhi, that list sucks

[000]

No Curry, Dirk, Giannis or Kawhi, that list sucks
I think it's an alright list but Wilt needs to be replaced with Rick Barry, who won a title while outscoring his 2nd option by 20