Biggest myth in NBA: Lebron's rings with colluded super-teams count, but KD's don't

[3ba11]

Baron Davis and Dwight Howard beat 67-win teams, while the KD Warriors only won 65 or 67 games - so 73 wins is just a number and means nothing

Ultimately, Wade/Bosh > Klay/Dray, so Lebron had more help than Curry and his rings shouldn't count just like KD's don't count.. Wade/Bosh were perennial all-stars while Klay/Dray were 1st timers.

In 2010, Wade had a 28 PER and 9 BPM compared to Kobe's 21 and 4, while Bosh was a 6x all-star before Lebron and Pau was 1x before Kobe - so Lebron teamed up with the rich man's version of Kobe-Pau, but went 2/4.. Therefore, the media lies by saying Lebron's rings count and KD's don't.. They should all count, or they should all not count - there's no picking and choosing - both guys unfairly colluded to win their rings.

[Objectivity]

legoat has ZERO (0) legitimate rings :lebroncry:

[8Ball]

73 >72.

LeBron beat the greatest team of all time.

LeBron has higher playoff PER and more 30 PER runs than Jordan.

This is fact that can never be rewritten.

[3ba11]

73 >72.

LeBron beat the greatest team of all time.

LeBron has higher playoff PER and more 30 PER runs than Jordan.

This is fact that can never be rewritten.


No one thinks the Curry Warriors were anywhere near the best team ever - that's delusional dumbness on your part

Baron Davis and Dwight Howard beat 67-win teams, while the KD Warriors only won 65 or 67 games - so 73 wins is just a number and means nothing

Ultimately, Wade/Bosh > Klay/Dray, so Lebron had more help than Curry and his rings shouldn't count just like KD's don't count.. Wade/Bosh were perennial all-stars while Klay/Dray were 1st timers.

In 2010, Wade had a 28 PER and 9 BPM compared to Kobe's 21 and 4, while Bosh was a 6x all-star before Lebron and Pau was 1x before Kobe - so Lebron teamed up with the rich man's version of Kobe-Pau, but went 2/4.. Therefore, the media lies by saying Lebron's rings count and KD's don't.. They should all count, or they should all not count - there's no picking and choosing - both guys unfairly colluded to win their rings.

[Bronbron23]

Baron Davis and Dwight Howard beat 67-win teams, while the KD Warriors only won 65 or 67 games - so 73 wins is just a number and means nothing

Wade/Bosh > Klay/Dray, so Lebron had more help than Curry and his rings shouldn't count just like KD's don't count.. Wade/Bosh were perennial all-stars while Klay/Dray were 1st timers.

In 2010, Wade had a 28 PER and 9 BPM compared to Kobe's 21 and 4, while Bosh was a 6x all-star before Lebron and Pau was 1x before Kobe - so Lebron teamed up with the rich man's version of Kobe-Pau, but went 2/4.. Therefore, the media lies by saying Lebron's rings count and KD's don't.. They should all count, or they should all not count - there's no picking and choosing - both guys unfairly colluded to win their rings.

Greatest team of all time? Holy shit do u guys actually believe this crazy shit? Since when does a regular season record make u the greatest of all time? Greateast regular season team of all time maybe. The kd warriors maybe have a claim to that title but we know how that turned out for bron.

That all said the 16 warriors were definitely a very good team kd joining them wasn't the same as brons super teams because the warriors were all ready established as a great team. The chemistry was already their. Brons super teams were an experiment that was gonna take some time to figure out.

[3ba11]

Brons super teams were an experiment that was gonna take some time to figure out.





The easiest path possible is landing on the Year 1 league favorite, which Lebron did twice in 2011 and 2015 - and he mostly lost with those super-teams, so he never figured anything out.. his skillset actually prevents it - skillsets that turn teammates into spot-up shooter are incapable of developing teammates or championship brand, so Lebron's talent-based approach mostly lost...

So you guys just speak in generalities without knowing what's actually going on... "b-b-but Lebron's super-teams had to figure it out"... What did they figure out?... how to mostly lose with super-teams??... lol, gtfo with garbage takes and espn drivel shallowness and ignorance

Ultimately, Lebron hand-picked the preseason favorite from 2011-2016 but became underdog or loser every year except the Ray Allen miracle.. So the facts show that Lebron is a complete fraud but people just ignore it.

[3ba11]

We know the media is lying about Lebron because Kyrie isn't a champion in their eyes - only Lebron gets credit for the 2016 ring.

Or look at Pippen - the media says he's a winner and champion for averaging 19 on 42% in the Finals and coattailing rings, while Kyrie is a bum loser for outplaying the league MVP and completely dominating the Finals with one of the best performances ever.

It's obvious bias and misreporting

[j3lademaster]

You can't just 'take rings and fmvp's away'. They all count. The spurs literally won one with a ref who was in gambling trouble, and we don't asterisk that. You have to put context behind the rings though. Lebron's only real blemish was 2011. No excuses, he flat out choked. Perfect physical health, team was playing more than well enough. His mind just wasn't there. But other than that Lebron has never had a series he could have won without playing like a superstar. KD and Steph could when they teamed up, that's the difference.

Bosh was still unproven in the playoffs, and the Heat have prior evidence they would fit well together. I admit the INTENTION of forming that Heat team was cowardly, but the Warrior's core already made 2 finals and won one. And would have been favorites the following year without KD(a lot of people thought the loss was because Steph was injured). So KD wasn't forced to play well to win every time. And same with Steph, so that created a no pressure environment for them to just front-run.

[tpols]

When KD joined the warriors, Curry still got max stats. Klay did too. If the Warriors had struggled and got upset in their first year together, it would have appeared to be more of a struggle, and thus KD would get more credit for winning later. Nobody should get a cookie for making themselves appear weak at first only to win later. Rather than just dominate the whole time. Durant hung literally the best numbers of all time in the Warriors Finals wins. 35 ppg on 70TS vs lebron H2H

[3ba11]

Lebron's only real blemish was 2011.





you guys are forced to say that 2011 was Lebron's fault because he was so bad - there's no plausible deniability...

If there was any way you could find excuses like his many other losses as the favorite, you would.. So you guys are just delusional - Lebron lost plenty as the favorite and when expected to win.

The reality is that Jordan's high scoring was partially-assisted, which elevated teammate role, while Lebron's high scoring reduces teammates to spot-up roles and therefore can't win.. Lebron never wins outside the 1st Round when he scores 35+ like he did in the 2009 ECF, so he lost as a massive favorite - the Magic were one of the 5 biggest underdogs to win a series.






Bosh was still unproven in the playoffs, and the Heat have prior evidence they would fit well together.





he'd reduced Bosh to spot-up shooter, therefore robbing Bosh of the capacity to step up.. Lebron-ball simply doesn't achieve dynasties or great teams that dominate eras because he reduces teammates and prevents a championship brand of ball (ball movement) - so his teams mostly lose regardless of cast...

He also choked in 2010 by quitting the series and averaging 21 on 35% for the last 3 games... Ultimately, he lost as the favorite from 2009-2011, and lost by record amount with super-teams in 2014 and 2017.

It's Lebron's job to fit with teammates - that's what organic winning requires, but his skillset can't fit with teammates - his ball-dominance imposes spot-up roles that stall teammates, so he needs ready-made stars to win (team-hopping)... his skillset prevents organic winning.







I admit the INTENTION of forming that Heat team was cowardly, but the Warrior's core already made 2 finals and won one. And would have been favorites the following year without KD(a lot of people thought the loss was because Steph was injured).





The Cavs were the preseason favorites in 2015 and 2016 - so you're just making up your own facts.. That's what you guys do.. Make shit up.

Lebron hand-picked the preseason favorite from 2011-2016 but fell to underdog or loser every year except the Ray Allen miracle.

Carry on.






KD wasn't forced to play well to win every time. And same with Steph, so that created a no pressure environment for them to just front-run.





In the 2016 Finals, Lebron averaged 24 and 6 TO's thru 4 games because he had Kyrie sharing the load as equal-scoring partner (1b)..

In the 2013 Finals, teammates staved off an 0-3 deficit while Lebron averaged 16 on 39% for the first 3 games.. His 23 on 43% was insufficient thru 6 games and needed Ray Allen to force Game 7...

This is just a couple examples - Lebron's super-team help allowed him to play like garbage all the time.. He had a zero plus/minus and negative net rating in the 13' Finals (the Heat didn't win with him on the floor)... In 2020, AD led the league in playoff scoring and led the Lakers all year statistically - Lebron was the "pippen"

Only MJ had to drop 30+ every game because Pippen wasn't contributing like Kyrie, Wade or AD did (elite 1st option production).

[FKAri]

No rings count. It's a ball game for children invented so kids have something to do indoors in winter. Why would anyone take this seriously?

[j3lademaster]

The Cavs were the preseason favorites in 2015 and 2016 - so you're just making up your own facts.. That's what you guys do.. Make shit up.

Lebron hand-picked the preseason favorite from 2011-2016 but fell to underdog or loser every year except the Ray Allen miracle.

Carry on. What does that have to do with 2017? Also the Warriors were predicted to have a better record in 2016 than the Cavs, Cavs got better championship odds being in the East. It's a good thing we play the games though, because with Steph's 2016 performance it was hard to not put them as favorites come playoff time. And let's be real, if not for Steph's horrendous finals performance Warriors would have won.


In the 2016 Finals, Lebron averaged 24 and 6 TO's thru 4 games because he had Kyrie sharing the load as equal-scoring partner (1b).. Right. And the Cavs were down 1-3 as a result. Like I said, Lebron can't win a playoff series playing bad, so games 5-7 were a Herculean effort resulting in him leading the series in all stats.


If there was any way you could find excuses like his many other losses as the favorite, you would.. So you guys are just delusional - Lebron lost plenty as the favorite and when expected to win.

The reality is that Jordan's high scoring was partially-assisted, which elevated teammate role, while Lebron's high scoring reduces teammates to spot-up roles and therefore can't win.. Lebron never wins outside the 1st Round when he scores 35+ like he did in the 2009 ECF, so he lost as a massive favorite - the Magic were one of the 5 biggest underdogs to win a series.I don't get this board. Say something nice about MJ, you're a MJ dickrider; say something nice about Lebron, you're a delusional Lebron stan. I'm actually a Bulls fan and my favorite players are MJ, Iverson, Jcrossover, D-Rose and Westbrook. I like long walks on the beach and whites with my surf, reds with my turf. Surf and Turf can get adventurous. My dog's pretty good at catching frisbees, so we do that together sometimes.

[j3lademaster]

No rings count. It's a ball game for children invented so kids have something to do indoors in winter. Why would anyone take this seriously?Because life is depressing and we need distractions.

[HBK_Kliq_2]

The only main difference is that Durant went to a team that already had chemistry, already an established group that won a championship.

While LeBron pretty much just starts from scratch and forms super teams with random stars like Irving/wade but he has to create his own chemistry within the team.

It's most impressive what kawhi did in 2019 - go to a team that has never won anything and have no stars

[Orange_Cassidy]

neither count. and I love durant

[AussieSteve]

The Warriors were back to back conference champs and probably would have been favoured to make the conference finals again without KD.

KD left a conference finals team with an MVP team mate to go to the team that beat him, rather than having to face them again and face an unbeatable Lebron in the finals. 2018 Lebron was unbeatable by any team that didn't contain multiple MVP calibre players and KD knew this. So did Steph, Klay and Dray.

Lebron left a team who's best player was Anderson Varejão and Mo Williams, to join a team who lost in the 1st round that season.

See the difference?

[DevBooker'sMask]

All rings count

[Orange_Cassidy]

All rings count

to some people


to most people though? not really.


the value of a ring besides its weight in gold and diamonds is no different than the value of bitcoin. one has to buy into it and believe in its value since it's worth is entirely dependent on each individual and what they're willing to risk on it. for some people it's not worth a dime and they will never own bitcoin. same goes for people who witnessed lebron and durants collusions

[Axe]

Yet kong beat a 73-win team. A unique feat nonetheless. :confusedshrug:

[Ne 1]

I stopped reading at wade/bosh over klay/feat because how are you not gonna add the fact that kd not only had klay/ dray(btw klay thompson is the BEST catch and shoot player of all time and draymond is a two time dpoy winner) but had two time mvp winner steph curry as well as a entire finals mvp coming OFF OF THE BENCH. Not even saying you argument is dumb but in no way possible can you compare kds team to lebron's .

[Orange_Cassidy]

Yet kong beat a 73-win team. A unique feat nonetheless. :confusedshrug:

stop saying he beat a 73 win team

draymond suspended for game 5

curry taken out on touch fouls in game 6

kyrie series winner in game 7

bogut injured

iggy injured

lebron/kyrie/love > curry/klay/green

and the cavs coasted all year. gunning for 70+ wins actually hurts you in the finals. by the end of the year you're worn out.. see Jordan's finals stats after the Bulls won 72. probably his worst line in his playoff career

[And1AllDay]

Yet kong beat a 73-win team. A unique feat nonetheless. :confusedshrug:

the best to ever do it :rockon:

[Ne 1]

You use surface stats to try to make an utterly irrational argument that but bottom line is Miami before LeBron was barley making the playoffs with Wade cuz there was literally no one else. Hence why they did absolutely nothing. Now KD going to a team that already won a ship in 2015 and 73 games with basically the western conference all stars that bounced you out the year before. That’s a complete bitch made move. Bron was without question the best player on the floor hands down on both teams in every finals but his teams were only the favorite in two finals he’s been in. Literally has NEVER played with an MVP KD has played with MVPs his entire career. Go take a nap bruh.

[Ne 1]

Draymond was suspened the NBA rules of 16th technical foul leads to 1 game suspension.

Curry fouled out he had five already and the game was over when he left anyway.

LeBron's block made sure Kyrie's 3 even mattered and they were still only up by 3 against the 2 greatest 3 point shooters ever.

Bogut wouldn't have made a difference.

Iggy still played

LeBron was the best player on the court regardless.

Jordan was doing fine until GP guarded him and then his numbers went to shit. GP was injured but you won't bring that up will you? go to bed.

[Orange_Cassidy]

Draymond was suspened the NBA rules of 16th technical foul leads to 1 game suspension.

Curry fouled out he had five already and the game was over when he left anyway.

LeBron's block made sure Kyrie's 3 even mattered and they were still only up by 3 against the 2 greatest 3 point shooters ever.

Bogut wouldn't have made a difference.

Iggy still played

LeBron was the best player on the court regardless.

Jordan was doing fine until GP guarded him and then his numbers went to shit. GP was injured but you won't bring that up will you? go to bed.

no technical was assessed to draymond. silver suspended him retroactively after lebron called him and complained about the video Wildhorse showed him


and curry was sitting for the entire run that out the game away from ticky tack fouls


bogut was very important to them at the time.


iggy being healthy is why lrbron got locked up the year before dummy

[Axe]

stop saying he beat a 73 win team

draymond suspended for game 5

curry taken out on touch fouls in game 6

kyrie series winner in game 7

bogut injured

iggy injured

lebron/kyrie/love > curry/klay/green

and the cavs coasted all year. gunning for 70+ wins actually hurts you in the finals. by the end of the year you're worn out.. see Jordan's finals stats after the Bulls won 72. probably his worst line in his playoff career
Lmao reasons, kenneth. Reasons. :oldlol:

[3ba11]

What does that have to do with 2017?





The significance is that Lebron never faced a super-team until 2017.. Only Lebron had a super-team before that, and it was so formidable that KD needed to join Curry/Klay to supercede it.. Lebron stacked the deck with his super-teams, which forced KD to 1-up him... So again, Lebron and KD don't deserve credit for their rings because they only learned to team-hop - they never learned to WIN (organic)..






the Warriors were predicted to have a better record in 2016 than the Cavs, Cavs got better championship odds being in the East.





^^^ False - Klay and Dray hadn't been all-stars yet heading into the 2015 season, so the Cavs were preseason favorites as the only team with 3 perennial all-stars and viewed as goat collection of talent by the world's top statisticians:



https://i.makeagif.com/media/6-29-2021/J3KiZV.gif


^^^ Lebron stacked the deck with his super-teams, which were so historic (shown above) that KD had to join Curry/Klay to 1-up him (also shown above)..

So again, Lebron and KD don't deserve credit for their rings because they only learned to team-hop - they never learned to WIN (organic)..






Lebron can't win a playoff series playing bad





Lebron won the 13' Finals despite the Heat not winning with him on the floor - he had a zero plus/minus and negative net rating, while his horrible stats through 6 games required Ray Allen to force Game 7.. he also won the 2014 ECF with only 22.8 ppg (Wade averaged 20/5/5 as the 1b).

But more importantly, Lebron does infact play poorly and have horrific series, while Jordan never had a bad series.. So Lebron's poor play causes losses, while Jordan never did because he never had a bad series.. For example, the 08' Cavs were defending conference champs and took the Celtics to 7 games despite Lebron's 26 on 35% - if he plays a tad better on a few key possessions, the Cavs return to the Finals.. Lebron also averaged 21 on 34% for the last 3 games to lose a 2-1 lead against the underdog Celtics in 2010..

And in the 2009 ECF, Lebron had a heavy scoring burden but some of that scoring needed to be assisted, so teammates weren't reduced to spot-up shooter - what fool thinks he's going to win by using live dribbles exclusively at such high scoring levels?.. That only wins at the AAU level.. Stan Van Gundy said they "wanted him to dribble and get stats"..

Ultimately, Lebron lost as the favorite or with super-teams from 09-11', 14' and 17' because he either played poorly or suboptimally.






Right. And the Cavs were down 1-3 as a result. Like I said, Lebron can't win a playoff series playing bad, so games 5-7 were a Herculean effort resulting in him leading the series in all stats.





it's impossible to lose when your sidekick is destroying the league MVP - the Cavs' 2nd option was capable of outplaying the Warriors' 1st option and therefore had more talent - that's why they were initially favored in the 15' and 16' preseason..

In 2020, Lebron's teammate was the playoff scoring leader (aka the most help possible), and he had prime Wade/Bosh in 11' and 12' but still was loser or underdog in those Finals (pathetic)... Again, Lebron hand-picked the preseason favorite from 11-16' but fell to loser or underdog every year because his weak brand caused the team to underperform it's favored talent.





I don't get this board. Say something nice about MJ, you're a MJ dickrider; say something nice about Lebron, you're a delusional Lebron stan. I'm actually a Bulls fan and my favorite players are MJ, Iverson, Jcrossover, D-Rose and Westbrook. I like long walks on the beach and whites with my surf, reds with my turf. Surf and Turf can get adventurous. My dog's pretty good at catching frisbees, so we do that together sometimes.





Lebron needed 2 star teammates to win, or a teammate that out-produces him (AD)... That's a lot more help than Jordan had.

Lebron also needed a teammate to match or lead him in scoring for entire playoff runs (11', 16', 20'), while Jordan led his sidekick for every series by at least 10 ppg.. So Lebron never carried teams like Jordan, who was perfect in the Finals without 1b's or 3rd scoring options that Lebron enjoyed (and mostly lost with).

[8Ball]

Thread cliffs:

73 > 72

[TheCorporation]

Thread cliffs:

73 > 72


Back out to 8ball...

B A N G! ! !
:lebronamazed:

[Orange_Cassidy]

Lmao reasons, kenneth. Reasons. :oldlol:

so when lebron and AD lost this year in the 1st round. we're they really just sh*tty or where they dealing with injuries.

[ImKobe]

Both obviously count. We don't take away titles from Russell, Bird, Magic or Kareem for winning titles with absolutely loaded teams. Magic was in the same situation as Lebron on the Heatles/2nd stint cavs (loaded teams in a historically weak Conference) which is why he made 9 Finals in a little over a decade but we never took any credit away from his accomplishments, even with Worthy and past-prime Kareem winning FMVPs.

[3ba11]

Both obviously count. We don't take away titles from Russell, Bird, Magic or Kareem for winning titles with absolutely loaded teams. Magic was in the same situation as Lebron on the Heatles/2nd stint cavs (loaded teams in a historically weak Conference) which is why he made 9 Finals in a little over a decade but we never took any credit away from his accomplishments, even with Worthy and past-prime Kareem winning FMVPs.


We don't knock Magic for his super-teams but we should - he's only 5-4 including an asterisk ring despite playing with the alleged GOAT? That's pathetic, so no wonder he isn't in conversation for goat

Ultimately, rings with super-teams mean nothing.. it's a damn super-team - where's the accomplishement?

[3ba11]

so when lebron and AD lost this year in the 1st round. we're they really just sh*tty or where they dealing with injuries.


AD spotted the Lakers 2 games, but Lebron only averaged 20 ppg, so they couldn't win 2 more.

[3ba11]

Both obviously count.


But KD's don't count - the media says they don't count, while Lebron's collusions do... So it's BS and the media is picking winners and losers, while the fans go along with it.

dumbness all around

Ultimately, Lebron's super-team collusions were SO formidable, that KD had to team-up with Curry/Klay to supercede him - that's the historical record, but it isn't reported that way... It's reported that Lebron is a goat winner, while KD just teamed up..

Meanwhile, Kyrie has zero championships and is a rank loser, while Pippen is a goat winner despite never playing anywhere near as good as Kyrie.

[BlakFrankWhite]

Man, KD himself disagrees with you. Why else you think he bailed out when he could've been competing with GSW for the next 5 years.

[3ba11]

Man, KD himself disagrees with you. Why else you think he bailed out when he could've been competing with GSW for the next 5 years.


KD hated Draymond and never cared much for Curry

Ultimately, Lebron's super-team collusions were SO formidable from 2011-2016, that KD had to team-up with Curry/Klay to supercede him - that's the historical record, but it isn't reported that way... It's reported that Lebron is a goat winner, while KD just teamed up..

Meanwhile, Kyrie has zero championships and is a rank loser, while Pippen is a goat winner despite never playing anywhere near as good as Kyrie - Kyrie dominated the Finals at a goat level, while Pippen was horrible most years, yet Kyrie is a loser and Pippen is a winner.

The media just mis-reports everything

[ImKobe]

We don't knock Magic for his super-teams but we should - he's only 5-4 including an asterisk ring despite playing with the alleged GOAT? That's pathetic, so no wonder he isn't in conversation for goat

Ultimately, rings with super-teams mean nothing.. it's a damn super-team - where's the accomplishement?

Yeah, which is why it's tough to rank all these guys in a historical context. Bill Russell did a lot for the game and was the first black superstar & coach but I would never give him the same kind of credit for his 11 rings as someone who did it in the modern era. Also, Kobe and Jordan won their rings in an era where there were essentially no superteams (except for the Celtics) while battling it out with other teams that had an equal amount of talent around their best players (1 superstar + co-star formula).

[ShawkFactory]

Yeah, which is why it's tough to rank all these guys in a historical context. Bill Russell did a lot for the game and was the first black superstar & coach but I would never give him the same kind of credit for his 11 rings as someone who did it in the modern era. Also, Kobe and Jordan won their rings in an era where there were essentially no superteams (except for the Celtics) while battling it out with other teams that had an equal amount of talent around their best players (1 superstar + co-star formula).

Are we not considering the 00-02 Lakers a superteam now? :lol

You have two of the probably 10 best players ever on one team. That's a superteam regardless of what else is there (and guys like Fisher, Fox, Grant, and Horry were gamers as well).

You'd have a point if discussing solely the 09 and 10 rings but for the first 3? Nah.

[ImKobe]

But KD's don't count - the media says they don't count, while Lebron's collusions do... So it's BS and the media is picking winners and losers, while the fans go along with it.

dumbness all around

Ultimately, Lebron's super-team collusions were SO formidable, that KD had to team-up with Curry/Klay to supercede him - that's the historical record, but it isn't reported that way... It's reported that Lebron is a goat winner, while KD just teamed up..

Meanwhile, Kyrie has zero championships and is a rank loser, while Pippen is a goat winner despite never playing anywhere near as good as Kyrie.

I don't agree with that though, KD's rings absolutely count if Lebron's do as well. He chose the best situation for him to win the championship, and it was Lebron who set that tone by team-hopping twice by the time KD finally left OKC and actually joined a team that gave him some spacing.

And let's be honest - the Cavs were about as talented as GS in 2017. Irving was as talented of an offensive player as Curry with his superior clutch scoring and finishing ability (Kevin Love was no scrub either), which is why they won in 2016 and why many still gave them a chance to beat the Warriors in '17, it's Lebron who got outplayed by KD in Game 3 which basically ended the series, otherwise it would have been 2 - 2 and we would have probably seen another Game 7.

Just for reference, KD's 3rd option (Klay) averaged just 15/4/2 on 38.7%3PT/50.7%TS for the championship run. Kevin Love averaged 17/11/2 on 45%3PT/60.4%TS for the 2017 Playoffs and both averaged 16 ppg in the Finals.

[3ba11]

I don't agree with that though, KD's rings absolutely count if Lebron's do as well. He chose the best situation for him to win the championship, and it was Lebron who set that tone by team-hopping twice by the time KD finally left OKC and actually joined a team that gave him some spacing.

And let's be honest - the Cavs were about as talented as GS in 2017. Irving was as talented of an offensive player as Curry with his superior clutch scoring and finishing ability (Kevin Love was no scrub either), which is why they won in 2016 and why many still gave them a chance to beat the Warriors in '17, it's Lebron who got outplayed by KD in Game 3 which basically ended the series, otherwise it would have been 2 - 2 and we would have probably seen another Game 7.

Just for reference, KD's 3rd option (Klay) averaged just 15/4/2 on 38.7%3PT/50.7%TS for the championship run. Kevin Love averaged 17/11/2 on 45%3PT/60.4%TS for the 2017 Playoffs and both averaged 16 ppg in the Finals.


Exactly..,. Nick Wright swore up and down that Lebron/Kyrie would take down KD/Curry in the 2017 Finals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjQR259CrwQ&t=62s

[ImKobe]

Are we not considering the 00-02 Lakers a superteam now? :lol

You have two of the probably 10 best players ever on one team. That's a superteam regardless of what else is there (and guys like Fisher, Fox, Grant, and Horry were gamers as well).

You'd have a point if discussing solely the 09 and 10 rings but for the first 3? Nah.

No, they were not. Kobe was not a top 5 player yet in 2000, that team was solid but got tested by much lesser teams and could have easily blown a 3 - 1 lead if not for one of the all-time 4th quarters in Game 7.

Lakers were incredibly top-heavy in '01 and '02 + with injuries to Kobe/Shaq and not that deep of a bench. They had a 7-man rotation in '01 & an 8-man rotation in '02 with Devean George and Samaki Walker as their 6th and 7th players in minutes that year.

They had two stars and some solid role players who hit timely wide open shots. If Kobe and Shaq had been both in the middle of their peaks I would agree, but it was a young Kobe with peak Shaq & Shaq started declining physically after their 1st chip and Kobe was always hurt too.

[ImKobe]

Exactly..,. Nick Wright swore up and down that Lebron/Kyrie would take down KD/Curry in the 2017 Finals:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AjQR259CrwQ&t=62s

:kobe: and I bet (without ever having watched his show apart from like 2 clips) that he would later discredit KD's rings and say that the Finals loss did not count for Lebron as he faced a much tougher team, right?

[ShawkFactory]

No, they were not. Kobe was not a top 5 player yet in 2000, that team was solid but got tested by much lesser teams and could have easily blown a 3 - 1 lead if not for one of the all-time 4th quarters in Game 7.

Lakers were incredibly top-heavy in '01 and '02 + with injuries to Kobe/Shaq and not that deep of a bench. They had a 7-man rotation in '01 & an 8-man rotation in '02 with Devean George and Samaki Walker as their 6th and 7th players in minutes that year.

They had two stars and some solid role players who hit timely wide open shots. If Kobe and Shaq had been both in the middle of their peaks I would agree, but it was a young Kobe with peak Shaq & Shaq started declining physically after their 1st chip and Kobe was always hurt too.

I mean you have to consider the era. You can't just create the definition of super team an apply it in a vacuum to everything. I mean..you can but it doesn't do much for a argument. The early 2000s were filled with one star teams and deep teams without true star power.

The 2000 Lakers were both. There were unselfish players that sacrificed their own numbers to fit in with two guys who were going to be taking 60% of the teams shots.

And in 01 and 02 there wasn't a team in the league that had an answer for both Shaq and Kobe at the same time. You don't really need incredible depth when you have those 2.

[3ba11]

:kobe: and I bet (without ever having watched his show apart from like 2 clips) that he would later discredit KD's rings and say that the Finals loss did not count for Lebron as he faced a much tougher team, right?


Exactly... Nick Wright predicted a Cavs victory, and so did Cowherd... Broussard picked the Warriors in 6 but they were supposed to be close games and it was supposed to be a tight series... lol

[ImKobe]

I mean you have to consider the era. You can't just create the definition of super team an apply it in a vacuum to everything. I mean..you can but it doesn't do much for a argument. The early 2000s were filled with one star teams and deep teams without true star power.

The 2000 Lakers were both. There were unselfish players that sacrificed their own numbers to fit in with two guys who were going to be taking 60% of the teams shots.

And in 01 and 02 there wasn't a team in the league that had an answer for both Shaq and Kobe at the same time. You don't really need incredible depth when you have those 2.

It's a team sport, of course you need some depth, which is why they almost lost in '02 and why they eventually lost in '03 and '04. You could make a case for the '01 team because of how dominant they were but the '02 team was definitely not on that level. Spurs and Kings were much deeper, which is why the Spurs led in almost every 4th quarter of the '02 series and why the Lakers were a shot away from going down 1 - 3 to the Kings in the WCF. Kings had the better team in '02 and the Lakers were about even with the Spurs that year.

[Ne 1]

no technical was assessed to draymond. silver suspended him retroactively after lebron called him and complained about the video Wildhorse showed him


and curry was sitting for the entire run that out the game away from ticky tack fouls


bogut was very important to them at the time.


iggy being healthy is why lrbron got locked up the year before dummy

The NBA rule book says you get suspended for 1 game after your 16th technical foul of the season. That's not anything specific for Draymond. You're a liar. It's very easy to prove too.

[ImKobe]

The NBA rule book says you get suspended for 1 game after your 16th technical foul of the season. That's not anything specific for Draymond. You're a liar. It's very easy to prove too.

Yeah, a technical which they gave him AFTER the game because one of the league officials apparently heard Draymond call Lebron a bitch.. How many times do we see a player get T'ed up retroactively, in the Finals no less?

[Ne 1]

Yeah, a technical which they gave him AFTER the game because one of the league officials apparently heard Draymond call Lebron a bitch.. How many times do we see a player get T'ed up retroactively, in the Finals no less?

It was actually a flagrant 1 foul for him swiping up at his groin area. He was already in hot water for kicking dudes in the nuts and all those technical fouls on top of that.

[Ne 1]

Stop acting like it made that much of a difference anyway. LeBron scored 41& shot a HIGHER percentage when Draymond came back.

[Hey Yo]

Stop acting like it made that much of a difference anyway. LeBron scored 41& shot a HIGHER percentage when Draymond came back.

Draymond, at home, in game 7.... put up 32-15-9 and Golden St. STILL lost.

[ELITEpower23]

https://i.postimg.cc/MGR4Fm7m/GOATchipalltime.jpg


It's over now OP, you can finally get some rest.

[3ba11]

It's over now OP, you can finally get some rest.





Kyrie was an equal-scoring partner and hit the closing shot, so Lebron never carried teams like Jordan did - Lebron has teammates match or lead the scoring for entire playoff runs, while Jordan averaged more than his sidekick in every series by at least 10 ppg...

So it isn't remotely close - no one carried teams like MJ - it's statistical fact... no one cares about sharing various categories with teammates - only carry-jobs matter, and only MJ carried various statistical categories, like the most important one - scoring