How did LeBron win with Kyrie as his #2 option against GOAT 73-win team?

[FromDowntown]

Seeing Boston do BETTER with Kemba in place of Kyrie has me scratching my head even moreso. How the hell did LeBron win with Kemba Walker light against a 73-win record setting team. It defies logic.

[kawhileonard2]

How did he win bronze medal twice?

https://archive.fiba.com/pages/eng/fa/game/p/gid/A/grid/75/rid/5152/sid/3507/_/2006_FIBA_World_Championship/statistic.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/olympics/games/2004-08-27-USA-ARG/

[Roundball_Rock]

Don't forget Brooklyn did better without Kyrie too. How great can he be if his teams keep doing better without him? Kyrie is a great playground player, a great YouTube player, great Sportscenter player but it is obvious his numbers and playing style come at the expense of his teammates and the net on the team has been negative. Look at how much better everyone in Boston plays without him around.

Boston was in the ECF in 17', 18', and going back in 20'. Hmmm...what changed in that one year they didn't make the ECF? :lol

[Vino24]

LeBron always finds a way. Hell Bron made boobie Gibson look like an nba player

[BigtimeNBAFan]

Because Kyrie is a beta star. He is pretty good when he isn't the leader. He was a great #2 and likely will be again when Durant comes back. Just don't ever ask him to be the face of your franchise.

[Overdrive]

Don't forget Brooklyn did better without Kyrie too. How great can he be if his teams keep doing better without him? Kyrie is a great playground player, a great YouTube player, great Sportscenter player but it is obvious his numbers and playing style come at the expense of his teammates and the net on the team has been negative. Look at how much better everyone in Boston plays without him around.

Boston was in the ECF in 17', 18', and going back in 20'. Hmmm...what changed in that one year they didn't make the ECF? :lol

Kyrie is a great fit for Lebron. Basically a Bezos' man's Derek Fisher. He can playmake a bit, but not a enough to be the primary ballhandler. What he does is thrive next to a great playmaker. That's why I don't think Kyrie/KD(even if he comes back in prime form) is a great duo.

[Roundball_Rock]

Kyrie's numbers remained about the same when he went to Boston. What changed is the team impact. In Cleveland the Cavs did the same with or without him; in Boston his team did much worse without him. Since Kyrie is so injury prone we have the benefit of a decent sample size of games of his teams without him.

Agree--KD and Kyrie are a bad fit. KD doesn't want to be the face of a franchise either--by his own admission. Both are headcases. Their games aren't complementary. Yet because of their name value they will have title or bust expectations so they are going to get a lot of flack if they underachieve.

[NBAGOAT]

i'm less worried about kd/kyrie as a duo even though there are some diminishing returns and more about the rest of their roster. the defensive roster is lacking and team looks like a bottom ten defense. their next 2 best players in dinwiddie and levert and pretty good for a 3rd and 4th but are ball dominant shot creators, they just wont be too productive with kd and kyrie mostly do the creating. All changes if they make a big trade ofc

[3ball]

Celtics were #1 and doing great with Kyrie pre-injury and pre-hayward return.. they do great without Hayward

[Roundball_Rock]

i'm less worried about kd/kyrie as a duo even though there are some diminishing returns and more about the rest of their roster. the defensive roster is lacking and team looks like a bottom ten defense. their next 2 best players in dinwiddie and levert and pretty good for a 3rd and 4th but are ball dominant shot creators, they just wont be too productive with kd and kyrie mostly do the creating. All changes if they make a big trade ofc

Who do you think would be a good fit in a trade?

[3ball]

.
More help?


Playoffs

Kyrie 16-17' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/irvinky01.html#2016-2017-sum:playoffs_per_game)...... 23.9 ppg.. 57.3 ts... 23.0 PER.. 0.181 ws/48.. 3.6 obpm
Pippen 91-96' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1991-1996-sum:playoffs_per_game)... 19.8 ppg.. 52.4 ts... 19.7 PER.. 0.157 ws/48.. 3.1 obpm

Kyrie 16-17' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/irvinky01.html#2016-2017-sum:playoffs_advanced)...... outplayed league mvp.. hit Finals-winning shot
Pippen 91-96' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1991-1996-sum:playoffs_advanced)... outplayed by schrempf.. no winning shots


Finals

Kyrie 16' and 17'... 28.0 on 46.5%
Pippen 6 Finals..... 19.0 on 42.5%


It's not close - Kyrie > Pippen

[FromDowntown]

LeBron always finds a way. Hell Bron made boobie Gibson look like an nba player

Some how
Some way

Turned Kemba Walker into a Hall of Fame player

[NBAGOAT]

Who do you think would be a good fit in a trade?

a defensive 3/d guy or trade for a 3rd star. 3 guys who need the ball is still better than 4. a levert or dinwiddie for jrue holiday swap could work pretty well.

[FromDowntown]

.
More help?


Playoffs

Kyrie 16-17' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/irvinky01.html#2016-2017-sum:playoffs_per_game)...... 23.9 ppg.. 57.3 ts... 23.0 PER.. 0.181 ws/48.. 3.6 obpm
Pippen 91-96' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1991-1996-sum:playoffs_per_game)... 19.8 ppg.. 52.4 ts... 19.7 PER.. 0.157 ws/48.. 3.1 obpm

Kyrie 16-17' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/i/irvinky01.html#2016-2017-sum:playoffs_advanced)...... outplayed league mvp.. hit Finals-winning shot
Pippen 91-96' (https://www.basketball-reference.com/players/p/pippesc01.html#1991-1996-sum:playoffs_advanced)... outplayed by schrempf.. no winning shots


Finals

Kyrie 16' and 17'... 28.0 on 46.5%
Pippen 6 Finals..... 19.0 on 42.5%


It's not close - Kyrie > Pippen

Imagine comparing 2 years to 6 :lol

91 Pip shits on any nearly #2
Keep up :lol

3ball shoooook

[Roundball_Rock]

a defensive 3/d guy or trade for a 3rd star. 3 guys who need the ball is still better than 4. a levert or dinwiddie for jrue holiday swap could work pretty well.

JRue would be great for them.


3ball shoooook

1-9ball is sweating the Clippers are at risk of going down 2-1, since the Clippers are the one team that would be favored over the Lakers.

[3ball]

JRue would be great for them.



1-9ball is sweating the Clippers are at risk of going down 2-1, since the Clippers are the one team that would be favored over the Lakers.

I fully expect the Lakers to win because of AD

Unlike you, I'm sane on this topic.. so I correctly understand that any top 20 all-time player alongside this era's Hakeem will win rings.. and quite easily..

It would require a collapse bigger than 2011 to screw this up... And with the lack of defensive era?.. it should be a piece of cake

[kawhileonard2]

JRue would be great for them.



1-9ball is sweating the Clippers are at risk of going down 2-1, since the Clippers are the one team that would be favored over the Lakers.

I wouldn't use that logic. Nets in 2004 was up 3-2 vs the Pistons. Had the Nets won they nor Indiana had a shot vs the Lakers that year.

[tpols]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ClArCksWQAQ_EqP.jpg


That's how...

[Young X]

What a stupid thread. Kyrie was >> anybody on the Warriors. From games 3-5 he averaged 35/6 on 65 TS%. Then in game 7 hit one of the biggest shots in NBA history.

If we're being real, Kyrie doesn't get enough credit for that series. Especially now.

[GimmeThat]

how did the team that ISO-ed better beat the team that passed better? the Cavs kept their mouth shut while they were on the floor, while the Warriors just kept yapping

[FromDowntown]

What a stupid thread. Kyrie was >> anybody on the Warriors. From games 3-5 he averaged 35/6 on 65 TS%. Then in game 7 hit one of the biggest shots in NBA history.

If we're being real, Kyrie doesn't get enough credit for that series. Especially now.

Yes of course he was. But why?

Why has he not done anything close to that 2016 run? How did LeBron elevate him to such great heights? LeElevate is a thing

[ZenMaster7210]

How did he win bronze medal twice?

https://archive.fiba.com/pages/eng/fa/game/p/gid/A/grid/75/rid/5152/sid/3507/_/2006_FIBA_World_Championship/statistic.html
https://www.basketball-reference.com/olympics/games/2004-08-27-USA-ARG/

:oldlol::oldlol: Lebronze

[Young X]

Yes of course he was. But why?

Why has he not done anything close to that 2016 run? How did LeBron elevate him to such great heights? LeElevate is a thing
Kyrie made the All-NBA 2nd team last year.

How come Lebron couldn't beat the Warriors in 2015? Why did he get swept in 2018?

[Young X]

Kyrie dropped two 40 point games against the Warriors in 2017 as well.

[FromDowntown]

Kyrie made the All-NBA 2nd team last year.


1st one of his career if I'm not mistaken. Congrats..? :lol

Plus, you didn't answer my question. You were too shook to respond to it directly. Bad move.



How come Lebron couldn't beat the Warriors in 2015?'

His second option was Matthew Delevedova. Did you not watch the series?



Why did he get swept in 2018?

He dropped 51-8-8 in a loss because a certain someone forgot the score and that blunder could have changed a lot. Again, I ask, Did you not watch the series? I order you to go to YouTube or something and do some educational brushing up. I forbid you to post again until you're more aware of basketball history. Please and thank you.

[Young X]

^ Now imagine if he has Kyrie in the 2015 Finals dropping 30 and 40 point games.

Be grateful. Kyrie was a great teammate for Lebron and helped him big time in the playoffs. He needed Kyrie.

[k 96]

ESPN/NBA Refs, that's how.

[FromDowntown]

ESPN/NBA Refs, that's how.

Oh

Did this have anything to do with it

https://i.postimg.cc/G3jt1W6p/8bd81a50eb70b4f479f5a77d891c133d.jpg

[k 96]

Oh

Did this have anything to do with it

https://i.postimg.cc/G3jt1W6p/8bd81a50eb70b4f479f5a77d891c133d.jpg

Try using that same stat padding logic when we talk about what matters most FACTS..


3 OF 9

[Shooter]

Oh

Did this have anything to do with it

https://i.postimg.cc/G3jt1W6p/8bd81a50eb70b4f479f5a77d891c133d.jpg


LeGoat

[HBK_Kliq_2]

How did Kawhi beat the 73 win core with Lowry/Siakam as his #2 and #3

Who had bigger playoff meltdown and drop off without Kawhi? Was it Lowry or Siakam?

Lowry 2020 playoffs relative to title run with Kawhi:

-4 TS, -2.6 assist percentage, -7 offensive rating

Siakam 2020 playoffs relative to title run with Kawhi:

- 6 TS, -3.8 PER, -3.1 BPM, -9 offensive rating

[GimmeThat]

How did Kawhi beat the 73 win core with Lowry/Siakam as his #2 and #3



so you're now saying DeMarcus Cousins have similar impact to Harrison Barnes, and last year's Shaun Livingston, is the same as the Barbosa during the 73 win 16' season

[Shaquille O'Neal]

That wasn't the GOAT team. Best regular season record, true. GOAT teams to even be in consideration have to win the chip.
GSW lost only 9 games out of 82.
Then they lost 9 more out of the next 24, aka 15/9 in the playoffs. 3 losses to OKC too. So that was a team built for the regular season. For context, see this year and last year's Milwaukee Bucks. Same thing.

[GimmeThat]

That wasn't the GOAT team. Best regular season record, true. GOAT teams to even be in consideration have to win the chip.
GSW lost only 9 games out of 82.
Then they lost 9 more out of the next 24, aka 15/9 in the playoffs. 3 losses to OKC too. So that was a team built for the regular season. For context, see this year and last year's Milwaukee Bucks. Same thing.

essentially, when Harlem Globetrotters meet NBA. I feel like I'm getting the blame for the collapse of the organ donation market.

[3ball]

MJ led these raptors to the title 6 times (led a 2nd round team to title)

[k 96]

LeGoat

LeHype 3 of 9 James

[GimmeThat]

MJ led these raptors to the title 6 times (led a 2nd round team to title)

against teams with different rosters, instead of 1 single team who would have the opportunity to counter roster improvements of the Bulls. which, would be the only way to make your statement hold weight under the principle of leverage

sure, it's possible to equalize Russell vs Russell with Russell vs Wilt, nullifying the rookie salary scale would be a start.

[Spurs m8]

We talking the same Kyrie who averaged nearly 30ppg and hit the bail out shot?

Thought so

What brons ring count before multiple collusions?
Asking for a friend...

[E_Stamkos]

Dumb ass thread

[Kiddlovesnets]

This is dumb, he couldnt have made it to even 6 games without Irving.

[Roundball_Rock]

against teams with different rosters, instead of 1 single team who would have the opportunity to counter roster improvements of the Bulls. which, would be the only way to make your statement hold weight under the principle of leverage

sure, it's possible to equalize Russell vs Russell with Russell vs Wilt, nullifying the rookie salary scale would be a start.

The Bulls outscored the Knicks in the series (Hue Hollins bailed the Knicks out--they deserved to lose)--the Raptors are getting mauled by the Celtics. Only 1-9ball would equate the two.

He also ignores the Bulls with Pippen/Jordan also lost in the second round, same as Pippen/Grant (except they did worse vs. Orlando than against the Knicks). They won only with a Grant or Rodman at PF.

[Shooter]

That wasn't the GOAT team. Best regular season record, true. GOAT teams to even be in consideration have to win the chip.
GSW lost only 9 games out of 82.
Then they lost 9 more out of the next 24, aka 15/9 in the playoffs. 3 losses to OKC too. So that was a team built for the regular season. For context, see this year and last year's Milwaukee Bucks. Same thing.

If Milwaukee won 73 games, sure maybe but I think you can power up enough math skills to realize they were not reaching 73 wins.

[francesco totti]

Kyrie was forever a shooting guard, in point guard body. Lebron masked Kyrie weakness there, big time.

[Shooter]

Hold

TF

Up

LeBron beat a 73 win team that had three all NBAs with a career loser as his #2 option while having a run that has never been replicated for a playoff run>?

26/9/7/2/1 on 50%

Is this real life I need to know

https://media.giphy.com/media/NBPhWGmDS1Kuc/giphy.gif

[Turbo Slayer]

LeBron played like he was the best player in the world in the last 3 games. And Kyrie went beserk too. Also hit one of the most clutch shots in NBA Finals history over Curry. My reasoning.

[NBAGOAT]

kyrie is a bit unlucky with the boston stuff perception wise. He deserves a bit of blame but tatum and brown made jumps as young guys and hayward got healthy and they got rid of actual negative impact guys like rozier and morris. You can argue tatum and brown dont develop as well but we just dont know. He's not more ball dominant or worse on defense than guys like lillard(worse) or kemba(better) so his impact should be in that range. Cavs winning one less game without him is deceiving because their srs was way worse, they just won a bunch of close games.

only indictment again him is cavs playing pretty well without him 2016 but that's more about lebron coasting the other years. had worse rpm/pipm 16-17 but that says more about love being underrated during the rs. kyrie was still the guy in the playoffs

[Roundball_Rock]

kyrie is a bit unlucky with the boston stuff perception wise. He deserves a bit of blame but tatum and brown made jumps as young guys and hayward got healthy and they got rid of actual negative impact guys like rozier and morris. You can argue tatum and brown dont develop as well but we just dont know

The problem is, and the same thing happened in Brooklyn, that as soon as Kyrie gets hurt everyone else on the team magically starts playing a lot better. It can't be development if people start balling overnight. We have seen stars whose teams maintain without them. Kyrie is the only one whose teams actually improve with a bench player replacing him. That is why he sticks out.