Kobe Was Swept By The 2011 Mavs

[FireDavidKahn]

How come this is so conveniently swept under the rug?:oldlol:

[KobesFinger]

Who sweeps it under the rug? I'm sure if there was a 3ball style poster for Kobe, it would get brought up

[FireDavidKahn]

Who sweeps it under the rug? I'm sure if there was a 3ball style poster for Kobe, it would get brought up

Because it was the same Mavs team that beat the Heat. No one ever brings up that Kobe got swept by that same team.

People using that loss by the Heat as a knock on LBJ's legacy should be consistent and realize that being swept by that same team should take an even massive more hit on Kobe's legacy

[HoopsNY]

It's one of the reasons why Kobe is overrated. He has many playoff performances that were underwhelming, and this was one of them.

[Shooter]

Beat KD in 5 games as well :( No one could stop Mavs that year

[Nashty]

Not to mention Jason Terry had better GmSc than Kobe that series. But, people do not mention it because they want to trash LeBron for being outplayed by Terry.

[Doranku]

Lakers were coming off 3 straight finals appearances, Kobe was injured, Gasol was depressed because Shannon Brown banged his wife... meanwhile Bran was coming off 2 straight playoff losses as #1 seed to lesser teams and an offseason guarantee of 7 titles.

Not quite the same circumstances. :oldlol:

[tpols]

Kobe was washed that year. Basically a shell of himself. He missed a gamewinner in game 1, and the floodgates opened after that. I always wonder what wouldve happened in that series had he made that shot.

Kobe did have a sick poster in the playoffs that year though on emeka okafor.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxmrHVe8hVM

Reggie Miller color commentary. :lol

Straight gold.

[Bronbron23]

How come this is so conveniently swept under the rug?:oldlol:

Well when lebron lost he lost with a top 5 and top 10 scorer by his side so its pretty crazy he lost to a lesser team. Kobe had odom who probably wasnt even a top 100 and pau gasol wasnt a top 10 so its not as bad. Still no excuse to get swept like that though.

[Rysio]

Kobe was garbage against the hornets too he only averaged 22 PPG he clearly was both washed up and injured.

[ArbitraryWater]

Lakers were coming off 3 straight finals appearances, Kobe was injured, Gasol was depressed because Shannon Brown banged his wife... meanwhile Bran was coming off 2 straight playoff losses as #1 seed to lesser teams and an offseason guarantee of 7 titles.

Not quite the same circumstances. :oldlol:

injured so bad he had 2 monster throwback dunks AND this lift off:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h8mDjhwIQVg

one of the nastiest injuries ive seen in my life

[Shooter]

Lakers were coming off 3 straight finals appearances, Kobe was injured, Gasol was depressed because Shannon Brown banged his wife... meanwhile Bran was coming off 2 straight playoff losses as #1 seed to lesser teams and an offseason guarantee of 7 titles.

Not quite the same circumstances. :oldlol:

Not even a game :( SweepBe

[SouBeachTalents]

It's funny how the teams that have failed in their 3peat quest have almost always gotten eviscerated

1989 Lakers: Swept (albeit with major injuries)
1991 Pistons: Swept
1996 Rockets: Swept
2011 Lakers: Swept
2014 Heat: Massacred

Only the Warriors last year put up a fight

[tpols]

arby look at how his production and efficiency dropped off from 2010

From 30 ppg on 115 ORTG to 23 ppg 105 ORTG?

What? you think he just suddenly became ass out of the blue? Lets hear your reasoning.

[tpols]

It's funny how the teams that have failed in their 3peat quest have almost always gotten eviscerated

1989 Lakers: Swept (albeit with major injuries)
1991 Pistons: Swept
1996 Rockets: Swept
2011 Lakers: Swept
2014 Heat: Massacred

Only the Warriors last year put up a fight

yea... i mean the teams are usually tired. The amount of mental and physical effort you have to put into winning 4 playoff series is insane.

[warriorfan]

Did he get outscored by Jason Terry in far less minutes played?

[imdaman99]

He had left his prime the year before. He was bad in his game 7 and it was a downhill trend after that. He won back to back rings before that so it was excusable honestly.

It's not realistic to expect 3peats. Pau fell off too after 2010. Maybe a teammate slept with his gf/wife, I don't remember which one it was.

Here's a crazy fact; Knicks have won a playoff game more recently than the Lakers :eek: yeah I'm not bragging they have been shit, just found it strange. Things will change in a few weeks though.

[Nashty]

Did he get outscored by Jason Terry in far less minutes played?

Terry scored 14 points less on 37 FGs less. He actually had higher Game Score with 17.7 to Kobe's 13.6.

[ArbitraryWater]

He had left his prime the year before. He was bad in his game 7 and it was a downhill trend after that. He won back to back rings before that so it was excusable honestly.

It's not realistic to expect 3peats. Pau fell off too after 2010. Maybe a teammate slept with his gf/wife, I don't remember which one it was.

Here's a crazy fact; Knicks have won a playoff game more recently than the Lakers :eek: yeah I'm not bragging they have been shit, just found it strange. Things will change in a few weeks though.

He didnt leave his prime in 2010 at all.

[ArbitraryWater]

arby look at how his production and efficiency dropped off from 2010

From 30 ppg on 115 ORTG to 23 ppg 105 ORTG?

What? you think he just suddenly became ass out of the blue? Lets hear your reasoning.

Subpar form due to mental fatique doesnt dissolve of responsibility.

Look at 2018 LeBron.

Fresh as ever, physically and mentally.

[LegendaryBaller]

Kobe was washed that year. Basically a shell of himself. He missed a gamewinner in game 1, and the floodgates opened after that. I always wonder what wouldve happened in that series had he made that shot.

Kobe did have a sick poster in the playoffs that year though on emeka okafor.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxmrHVe8hVM

Reggie Miller color commentary. :lol

Straight gold.
He also had a crazy left handed banger in the same game.

[AlternativeAcc.]

Terry scored 14 points less on 37 FGs less. He actually had higher Game Score with 17.7 to Kobe's 13.6.

Ouch :lol

Recluse poison

[HBK_Kliq_2]

Lakers were coming off 3 straight finals appearances, Kobe was injured, Gasol was depressed because Shannon Brown banged his wife... meanwhile Bran was coming off 2 straight playoff losses as #1 seed to lesser teams and an offseason guarantee of 7 titles.

Not quite the same circumstances. :oldlol:

Ya this is your answer. Its hard to win 3 straight. Kobe/Pau still won back to back which Duncan/Manu/Parker never did. Dirk also never did it either or even came close. Also, if you want to use the "primes" argument.

I would say LeBron's prime was 2009-present
Kobe's prime 2001-2010.

[tpols]

He also had a crazy left handed banger in the same game.

it makes me realize bro... when Kobe missed that game winner. With a clean look.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OQGFi_hLwM

The Mavericks smelled blood.

They realized if they could beat Kobe, they could beat anybody and their confidence soared.

They went great white from that game on. Shitting on OKC. and then Miami.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/2SYq8662Z4v7rZCkoN/giphy.gif

The Mavs had more trouble with the Brandon Roy led Blazers then they did with any team going forward.

[SouBeachTalents]

it makes me realize bro... when Kobe missed that game winner. With a clean look.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OQGFi_hLwM

The Mavericks smelled blood.

They realized if they could beat Kobe, they could beat anybody and their confidence soared.

They went great white from that game on. Shitting on OKC. and then Miami.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/2SYq8662Z4v7rZCkoN/giphy.gif

The Mavs had more trouble with the Brandon Roy led Blazers then they did with any team going forward.
Absolutely not :oldlol: The Heat had their foot on the Mavs throats a couple of times in the Finals, but they had the colossal choke at home in Game 2, then blew another big 4th quarter lead with LeBron having the worst playoff game of his career in Game 4. The Mavs were extremely fortunate to have that series tied at 2 heading into Game 5. I didn't even feel like the Mavs were the better team in that series until the end of Game 5. Only in Game 6 did they thoroughly outplay the Heat

[ELITEpower23]

Terry scored 14 points less on 37 FGs less. He actually had higher Game Score with 17.7 to Kobe's 13.6.

Wrekt :oldlol:

[tpols]

Absolutely not :oldlol: The Heat had their foot on the Mavs throats a couple of times in the Finals, but they had the colossal choke at home in Game 2, then blew another big 4th quarter lead with LeBron having the worst playoff game of his career in Game 4. The Mavs were extremely fortunate to have that series tied at 2 heading into Game 5. I didn't even feel like the Mavs were the better team in that series until the end of Game 5. Only in Game 6 did they thoroughly outplay the Heat


That's the whole point.

The Heat were WAY better than the Mavericks. But once they realized they could crush HOF laden teams like LAL and OKC they were able to muster up the moxie to beat the Heat.

It's absolutely undeniable that their prior victories against titan teams didn't build the resolve they needed to come back on and defeat Miami.

[ELITEpower23]

That's the whole point.

The Heat were WAY better than the Mavericks. But once they realized they could crush HOF laden teams like LAL and OKC they were able to muster up the moxie to beat the Heat.

It's absolutely undeniable that their prior victories against titan teams didn't build the resolve they needed to come back on and defeat Miami.

Are you saying the more a team wins the more confidence they have? :lol

And you are just now, at the age of 41, figuring this out?

[Axe]

It's one of the reasons why Kobe is overrated. He has many playoff performances that were underwhelming, and this was one of them.
The perk of wanting to be flashy. And when shaq points out how much of a showboat he is, we get where he's coming from.

[warriorfan]

Terry scored 14 points less on 37 FGs less. He actually had higher Game Score with 17.7 to Kobe's 13.6.

What is a game score?

[HoopsNY]

Kobe was washed that year. Basically a shell of himself. He missed a gamewinner in game 1, and the floodgates opened after that. I always wonder what wouldve happened in that series had he made that shot.

Kobe did have a sick poster in the playoffs that year though on emeka okafor.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CxmrHVe8hVM

Reggie Miller color commentary. :lol

Straight gold.

He averaged 25.3 PPG and his PER, WS/48, OBPM, VORP, and TS% were all better than the previous year (a championship year).

Then the next season, he averaged 27.9 PPG in the regular season. In the playoffs he averaged 30.0 PPG (two rounds).

All three years (2010, 2011, 2012) he was All-NBA 1st team. I hardly think he was washed. What I think it really is is that Kobe is often looked at as the golden child of the NBA post Jordan without any criticism. The fact remains, Kobe had a lot of bad playoff performances.

[Axe]

He averaged 25.3 PPG and his PER, WS/48, OBPM, VORP, and TS% were all better than the previous year (a championship year).

Then the next season, he averaged 27.9 PPG in the regular season. In the playoffs he averaged 30.0 PPG (two rounds).

All three years (2010, 2011, 2012) he was All-NBA 1st team. I hardly think he was washed. What I think it really is is that Kobe is often looked at as the golden child of the NBA post Jordan without any criticism. The fact remains, Kobe had a lot of bad playoff performances.
Imagine calling him washed-up but he's still able to play in the postseason until 34 years old. :lol

[tpols]

He averaged 25.3 PPG and his PER, WS/48, OBPM, VORP, and TS% were all better than the previous year (a championship year).

Then the next season, he averaged 27.9 PPG in the regular season. In the playoffs he averaged 30.0 PPG (two rounds).

All three years (2010, 2011, 2012) he was All-NBA 1st team. I hardly think he was washed. What I think it really is is that Kobe is often looked at as the golden child of the NBA post Jordan without any criticism. The fact remains, Kobe had a lot of bad playoff performances.

Playoffs.

He went from 29 ppg on 115 ORTG in 2010 to 23 ppg on 105 ORTG in 2011.

Book shut.

Done.

:lol

[tpols]

Again with the accolades... All NBA and All D teams when it comes to Kobe exceeded his impact in many of his later years. They were pure legacy reputation awards.

I am a known big time kobe fan. And I'm telling you this. If you couldnt see how much a step he lost after 2010 you weren't watching back then.

And the numbers reflect it.

[Roundball_Rock]

Playoffs.

He went from 29 ppg on 115 ORTG in 2010 to 23 ppg on 105 ORTG in 2011.

Book shut.

Done.

:lol

Yeah, and the next year the washed up guy went 30/5/4 in the playoffs. Small sample sizes. :oldlol:

[Doranku]

He averaged 25.3 PPG and his PER, WS/48, OBPM, VORP, and TS% were all better than the previous year (a championship year).

Then the next season, he averaged 27.9 PPG in the regular season. In the playoffs he averaged 30.0 PPG (two rounds).

All three years (2010, 2011, 2012) he was All-NBA 1st team. I hardly think he was washed. What I think it really is is that Kobe is often looked at as the golden child of the NBA post Jordan without any criticism. The fact remains, Kobe had a lot of bad playoff performances.

Holy shit this got me good. :oldlol: What world do you live in? Kobe is probably the most criticized player in NBA history. He didn't have the media backing him like Jordan and Bran do, who are really the only other comparable players in terms of criticism.

[tpols]

he still had negative splits. 30 ppg on 52 TS and bad defense? yea that's not gonna cut it.

[34-24 Footwork]

Lakers were coming off 3 straight finals appearances, Kobe was injured, Gasol was depressed because Shannon Brown banged his wife... meanwhile Bran was coming off 2 straight playoff losses as #1 seed to lesser teams and an offseason guarantee of 7 titles.

Not quite the same circumstances. :oldlol:

I don't see the difference at all. Same-same. Lmao.

[Shooter]

Holy shit this got me good. :oldlol: What world do you live in? Kobe is probably the most criticized player in NBA history. He didn't have the media backing him like Jordan and Bran do, who are really the only other comparable players in terms of criticism.

Right? :lol

The one MVP, missed playoffs in his prime, rapist was the golden child of the NBA

:roll: :roll:

I knew there was a reason I stay on this site. The comedic gold is too valuable.

[Shooter]

Again with the accolades... All NBA and All D teams when it comes to Kobe exceeded his impact in many of his later years. They were pure legacy reputation awards.

I am a known big time kobe fan. And I'm telling you this. If you couldnt see how much a step he lost after 2010 you weren't watching back then.

And the numbers reflect it.

2012 and 2013 were bounce back years for him

27.9 and 27.3 ppg in the regular season and 30-5-4 in the 2012 playoffs.

Quit it :oldlol:

[Lebron23]

Dallas was just a more motivated team after choking in the 2006 nba finals, and in the first round of the 2007 nba playoffs. Once that motivation was gone they never repeat as nba champion.

[Nashty]

What is a game score?

Game score is a metric developed by basketball statistician John Hollinger as an extension of Player Efficiency Rating (as well as a simpler alternative).
It is intended to give a “total perspective” on a player’s statistical performance in a basketball game, taking into account every statistic listed on a player’s box score.
Game score is intended to be used for a single game, and represent a parallel number, but an alternative to points scored – 40 is a fantastic game score, and ten an average performance.

Game Score (GmSc) is calculated as:
Game Score = Points Scored + (0.4 x Field Goals) – (0.7 x Field Goal Attempts) – (0.4 x (Free Throw Attempts – Free Throws)) + (0.7 x Offensive Rebounds) + (0.3 x Defensive Rebounds) + Steals + (0.7 x Assists) + (0.7 x Blocks) – (0.4 x Personal Fouls) – Turnovers

[scuzzy]

Kobe getting smacked around in 1st/2nd rounds or missing the playoffs was the norm for more than half his career


Not really much of a talking point, his standard was always much lower

[ArbitraryWater]

it makes me realize bro... when Kobe missed that game winner. With a clean look.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9OQGFi_hLwM

The Mavericks smelled blood.

They realized if they could beat Kobe, they could beat anybody and their confidence soared.

They went great white from that game on. Shitting on OKC. and then Miami.

https://media0.giphy.com/media/2SYq8662Z4v7rZCkoN/giphy.gif

The Mavs had more trouble with the Brandon Roy led Blazers then they did with any team going forward.


you said yourself the 2011 finals were basically in control from miami until end of g2 or even g4, at no point did portland ever control the series

[warriorfan]

So you are trying to tell me LeBron James in the middle of his prime got outscored by an old Jason Terry in the NBA Finals? With LeBron playing much more minutes too? Damn. That’s worse than his mom getting f.ucked by Delonte West. :(

[Stanley Kobrick]

Game score is a metric developed by basketball statistician John Hollinger as an extension of Player Efficiency Rating (as well as a simpler alternative).
It is intended to give a “total perspective” on a player’s statistical performance in a basketball game, taking into account every statistic listed on a player’s box score.
Game score is intended to be used for a single game, and represent a parallel number, but an alternative to points scored – 40 is a fantastic game score, and ten an average performance.

Game Score (GmSc) is calculated as:
Game Score = Points Scored + (0.4 x Field Goals) – (0.7 x Field Goal Attempts) – (0.4 x (Free Throw Attempts – Free Throws)) + (0.7 x Offensive Rebounds) + (0.3 x Defensive Rebounds) + Steals + (0.7 x Assists) + (0.7 x Blocks) – (0.4 x Personal Fouls) – Turnovers
very interesting, high iq user

[warriorfan]

So you are trying to tell me LeBron James in the middle of his prime got outscored by an old Jason Terry in the NBA Finals? With LeBron playing much more minutes too? Damn. That’s worse than his mom getting f.ucked by Delonte West. :(

Kgreaction.gif

[HoopsNY]

Playoffs.

He went from 29 ppg on 115 ORTG in 2010 to 23 ppg on 105 ORTG in 2011.

Book shut.

Done.

:lol

Yes. But that doesn't make him "washed." That means he played poorly.

2011 Playoffs: 22.8/3.4/3.3 on 54% TS%
2012 Playoffs: 30.0/4.8/4.3 on 53% TS%

So he became washed up in the 2010-11 season (where his Advanced numbers were somehow better than the previous year) due to his playoff numbers, but then he became unwashed in 2012?

[HoopsNY]

Holy shit this got me good. :oldlol: What world do you live in? Kobe is probably the most criticized player in NBA history. He didn't have the media backing him like Jordan and Bran do, who are really the only other comparable players in terms of criticism.


Right?

The one MVP, missed playoffs in his prime, rapist was the golden child of the NBA

I knew there was a reason I stay on this site. The comedic gold is too valuable.

Then I believe we're weighing things differently. I lived through the Jordan era and he was heavily criticized due to off the court issues with gambling.

LeBron was criticized for not being able to win, prompting his departure in 2010. Between 2003-2007, his shooting was consistently criticized.

Kobe was criticized for issues with Shaq and of course the rape allegations.

But what I am referring to is more of Kobe as a player from both a pure performance and skill level. By 22, fans were anointing him as being better than Jordan. To the world, Kobe was already the most athletic player, and soon he was the GOAT with a killer instinct like no other (despite all the erratic shots and missed field goals in clutch moments), as well as being the best defensive player.

Talk to Laker fans, there were no flaws in Kobe's game.

[ArbitraryWater]

Holy shit this got me good. :oldlol: What world do you live in? Kobe is probably the most criticized player in NBA history. He didn't have the media backing him like Jordan and Bran do, who are really the only other comparable players in terms of criticism.

Bahaha.

The delusions.

Kobe was always protected by the large LA media center.

How was he never called out for all his disastrous playoff series' and 4th quarter chokes?

Hardly ever a talking point on major sports shows.

[Nashty]

If it wasn't for the media, he would be forgotten by now. The guy was a Mitch Richmond type of player, but media always was advertising him as some big superstar. The funniest is when they call him clutch, while he was shooting like 30% from the field in the clutch.

[HoopsNY]

Bahaha.

The delusions.

Kobe was always protected by the large LA media center.

How was he never called out for all his disastrous playoff series' and 4th quarter chokes?

Hardly ever a talking point on major sports shows.

These are things that people conveniently forget and never levy against him. The horrid first two playoff series against Utah, including the 4 airball performance in crunch time?

The bad 2000 finals performance? The horrible performance in the '04 finals? Game 7 meltdown of Kobe refusing to shoot against Phoenix in the second half? Even Jim Jackson said he was shocked.

[Roundball_Rock]

2011 Playoffs: 22.8/3.4/3.3 on 54% TS%
2012 Playoffs: 30.0/4.8/4.3 on 53% TS%

So he became washed up in the 2010-11 season (where his Advanced numbers were somehow better than the previous year) due to his playoff numbers, but then he became unwashed in 2012?

:lol

Going to the finals frequently takes a toll. Look at Gasol on the same team:

2010 PO: 20/11/4 60% TS
2011 PO: 13/8/4 50% TS

89' and 90' Lakers after 3 finals:

Magic 89' PO: 18/6/12 61% TS
Magic 90' PO: 25/6/13 60% TS

Worthy 89' PO: 25/7/3 61% TS
Worthy 90' PO: 24/6/3 55% TS

Scott 89' PO: 20/4/3 59% TS
Scott 90' PO: 13/4/3 54% TS

People can bring other examples if they want but we have five players mentioned in this thread with everyone but Magic experienced a notable decline.

[Doranku]

These are things that people conveniently forget and never levy against him. The horrid first two playoff series against Utah, including the 4 airball performance in crunch time?

The bad 2000 finals performance? The horrible performance in the '04 finals? Game 7 meltdown of Kobe refusing to shoot against Phoenix in the second half? Even Jim Jackson said he was shocked.

Nobody forgets any of that. :oldlol: Shit is routinely brought up WAY more than any of Magic, Bird, Kareem, Duncan, etc bad series.

[AirBonner]

Kobe isn’t top 10. He isn’t held to GOAT standards

[kawhileonard2]

He is ahead of Lebron on Skip Bayless list and Shannon Sharp's list.

[LAmbruh]

Kobe isn’t top 10. He isn’t held to GOAT standards

I have him ranked 12th


Still respectable



RIPbe

[light]

For all of the talk of mamba mentality and related success, Kobe had bad habits/negative impulses that he could never get full control over. This led to inconsistencies all over his career and indeed his life.

[Axe]

Yes. But that doesn't make him "washed." That means he played poorly.

2011 Playoffs: 22.8/3.4/3.3 on 54% TS%
2012 Playoffs: 30.0/4.8/4.3 on 53% TS%

So he became washed up in the 2010-11 season (where his Advanced numbers were somehow better than the previous year) due to his playoff numbers, but then he became unwashed in 2012?
Became unwashed only because the lakers were still able to win one game against the western champs thunder during the 2012 wcsf :oldlol: