Lets talk phenoms. On pre draft hype only....who is the all time #1 pick?

[Kblaze8855]

Figured it was worth bringing up with all the Zion talk....

Plenty of options....plenty of obvious #1 picks...but a phenom is more than a top pick. Its a guy the world decides is the guy long before its that time. These are the guys you trade your best players away for a chance to draft. We arent talking Kenyon Martin just because he went #1. Im talking the "We got him!" prospects.




To make it clear....this is how you react when you win the lottery for a known phenom...



https://thumbs.gfycat.com/AdoredClassicGypsymoth-size_restricted.gif

^
Ewing lottery




https://thumbs.gfycat.com/MinorHorribleBooby-size_restricted.gif


^
Shaq lottery





This is how you react when you have to go figure out what youre gonna do with your pick:





https://thumbs.gfycat.com/LateFrequentInvisiblerail-size_restricted.gif




^
Ben Simmons lottery. Good player. Just not Shaq or Patrick Ewing.







We clear? Our younger posters will remember a few but not that many. Lebron of course. Zion is that guy now. Im not sure we had one in between....were you all in on Wiggins? Duncan may have been one in 97....there was no question at all who that draft was for. Celtics were set back a decade when they lost the lottery for him and ended up with Billups(or was it Ron mercer?).

AI had talk but wasnt on that level prospect wise. Shaq was. Ewing before him. Hakeem as well. Bill Walton. Kareem. Maybe Magic. Jordan was to the people who paid attention but going behind Bowie hurts. It was stupid....and they were wrong clearly....but the kind of hype we are talking doesnt allow you to not go #1(allowing for era rules like the territory pick days where you got the rights to guys who were local...obviously Wilt is a phenom).

Im gonna give you a name or two that wont come to everyones mind quickly...


Larry Johnson was a big deal. Danny Manny was a big deal. But the guy im gonna focus on?


Im not 100% sure he wouldnt go #1 all time based only off hype. Hed have a tough fight with Kareem and Walton.....but he might take it. Some of you 30+ already thought of him no doubt....


Ralph Sampsons. You really have no way to understand how major that guy was supposed to be. And ill show you why...


He was about 7'2'' barefoot(I saw a measurement of 7'1'' and 7/8ths when he was like 18) but listed 7'4''. In shoes he was probably 7'3''. He ran the floor...he could shoot...dunk from the Ft line...handle it.








Here...this is Ralph Sampson:



https://thumbs.gfycat.com/IdioticColorlessCutworm-size_restricted.gif







https://thumbs.gfycat.com/OblongOrdinaryFrog-size_restricted.gif










https://thumbs.gfycat.com/UnkemptTestyFoxterrier-size_restricted.gif


Yes....really tall guys could move 35 years ago.


Now...let me give you an impression of how badly he was wanted...

He and Hakeem are the reason the draft lottery exists. The Bulls, Knicks, and Pacers made a mockery of the game trying to lose late in those seasons to get into the coin flip. Back then there was a coin flip between the worst teams in each conference for the top pick.....so worst you could get was #2. Teams started trading away talent and benching guys or playing washed up vets huge minutes. Late in Ralphs rookie year to make sure they got Hakeem the Rockets pulled Ralph after a hot start and played through 39 year old Elvin Hayes who played 53 minutes in the second to last game of his career and had a triple double in a blowout loss.

But let me make this even more clear....this is what teams were willing to give up for the pick to get him....

The Lakers had a locked up top 2 pick in 82. Sampson was a junior. He told them if they got the first two picks...so he could be sure to go there? HEd come out early. They had the Cavs pick because they traded it for nothing to LA before the NBA changed the rules to stop the Lakers fleecing shitty run teams. But the Clippers were also ass. So it was gonna be down to LA(Cleveland) or the Clippers. But Sampson wasnt willing to risk being a Clipper and he was gonna have to declare for the draft before the coin flip.

So....




Buss offered $ 6 million for the guarantee of the pick. Sterling declined. Buss offered $ 6 million plus (should he have it) the number two pick in the upcoming draft. Sterling declined. Buss offered $ 6 million plus the number two pick in the upcoming draft and the team’s first-round pick in 1984. Sterling declined again. Buss suggested that he could, somehow, land the Clippers Moses Malone from Houston. Sterling was moderately intrigued, but he also wanted two Laker players— Norm Nixon and Michael Cooper. Buss said he’d have to think about it.

Clippers ended up not doing it. Wouldnt take the league MVP(Moses) an all star point and a DPOY level wing for the pick because it MIGHT be Sampson. So Ralph went back to school. Pick ended up being the Lakers but it was too late. Lakers got Worthy and the Clippers Terry Cummings.

So after his senior year? The tanking I mentioned which embarrassed the league.... but even worse?

The rockets TURNED DOWN Drexler and the #2 pick for Sampson....which would have given them the GOAT big 3 of Hakeem, Jordan, and Drexler.

Think about that for a second.

Portland offered young Clyde Drexler...and a pick that would have been Jordan to pair with their #1 pick(Hakeem). They said no...and instead drafted Hakeem to play with Ralph to make a Twin Towers instead of an inside/out threat with Hakeem/MJ and Drexler on the wings. And Drexler and Hakeem both went to Houston in college....so it would have been two local legends...plus Michael Jordan.

They said no.

To keep Ralph Sampson.


He ended up injured and a scrub on the Warriors....but when he was whole you couldnt have traded anyone in the NBA for him short of Larry Bird or maaaaaaaaaaaybe Magic.


Hes not gonna be anyones all time #1 who doesnt remember how glowingly he was praised and how much people gushed over him but really....hes up there.

Ralph Sampson off hype alone....might go all time #1.

Wouldnt be my pick...but hed go pretty high.

So...


Who is your phenom of choice in the all time draft? Again....guys like Jordan and Steph while obviously amazing picks...they wouldnt go over these guys at draft time.

Im asking more what you remember hype wise than who ended up the proper pick.

[Ben Simmons 25]

Shaq, it's not close.

[The Iron Fist]

https://s.yimg.com/lo/api/res/1.2/aVdTnuT9fRrL3N7lT71Qxw--~B/YXBwaWQ9eWlzZWFyY2g7Zmk9Zml0O2dlPTAwNjYwMDtncz0wME EzMDA7aD02OTQ7dz00MDA-/http://img1.iwascoding.com/4/paid/2016/11/29/BD/AE0860AC3F8F4145B6939933FF256368.jpg.cf.jpg

[Loco 50]

DRob was so coveted the Lakers tried to deal for him before seeing a single game and the Spurs were willing to draft him despite knowing he was going to fulfill his obligation to the Navy.

Boston tried to throw half it's team at the Spurs for Duncan.

[Kblaze8855]

Shaq, it's not close.



Jerry Buss offered Donald Sterling 80% of the value of an NBA franchise, the #2 pick, and 2 key players from a title team and he said no. You could buy an NBA team for 8-9 million in 1982. The Nuggets sold for 2 million 4 years earlier. The Rockets sold for 8.9 in 83. Sterling wouldnt take almost the cash value of his franchise plus still having his pick of 2 hall of famers(Worthy and Nique) for Ralph sampson.

Its at least close.

[kennethgriffen]

the ewing lottery was the most hyped because it was new york and the first lottery format


as far as who gets selected #1 i would say kareem

[Ben Simmons 25]

Jerry Buss offered Donald Sterling 80% of the value of an NBA franchise, the #2 pick, and 2 key players from a title team and he said no. You could buy an NBA team for 7-9 million in 1983. Sterling wouldnt take almost the cash value of his franchise plus still having his pick of 2 hall of famers(Worthy and Nique) for Ralph sampson.

Its at least close.

Literally every single team in the 1992 lottery had a pre made jersey with Shaq's name on it ready to go... I'm not sure that ever happened before or since.

https://i.postimg.cc/6p19dS94/ha.jpg

I think the 2003 lottery had some pre made James jerseys, but it wasn't the entire set of teams like 1992.

[tpols]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/OblongOrdinaryFrog-size_restricted.gif



biggest thing is the foot control & general coordination... hes changing pace all over the place. javale mcgee wouldve compiled a HOF shaqtin highlight in some of those situations.

:biggums:

[Kblaze8855]

Im not saying Shaq isnt in the discussion....im saying....im not sure you could have traded your actual franchise for Ralph Sampson in 1983. He was worth about...what an NBA team was worth. Buss offered 2.5 times the salary cap at that point.

The cash offer for Ralph Sampson was about the same as the NBA salary cap of 1988.

[elementally morale]

Best player drafted number 1 and biggest hype ever for a player are not the same. The best is probably Kareem.

As for hype, I'm not sure Zion would be drafted ahead of LeBron. LeBron got insane hype even in high school.

[Ben Simmons 25]

I'll never be able to discuss this topic rationally.

Literally the first time I saw an NBA game on TV or in person was in 1992... at the O-Rena... when Shaq was a rookie... against the Rockets. He's literally the reason I became an NBA fan.

**** it.

[Kblaze8855]

I get that. I just want you to understand the creepy affection basketball people had for Ralph Sampson. Its in no way anti Shaq.....but...


http://i65.tinypic.com/5yxf2w.jpg




It was a love affair.

[Ben Simmons 25]

https://www.basketball-reference.com/boxscores/199211250ORL.html

Yep, pretty trippy that I can say that I know the exact game, but it had to be this one... and that was my very first experience ever with NBA basketball... and it was in person.

I even remember we sat in the lower bowl... with handicap seating at the top of the lower bowl... someone gave my dad the tickets.

Scott Skiles played 48 minutes... the ****? :roll:

[SpaceJam2]

Im not saying Shaq isnt in the discussion....im saying....im not sure you could have traded your actual franchise for Ralph Sampson in 1983. He was worth about...what an NBA team was worth. Buss offered 2.5 times the salary cap at that point.

The cash offer for Ralph Sampson was about the same as the NBA salary cap of 1988.

Insane :eek:

[Kblaze8855]

Insane :eek:


For comparisons sake...the highest paid teams and players 4 years later....not when the offer was made....after salaries started to rise:


1. Los Angeles Lakers $8,579,750
2. New Jersey Nets $6,840,500
3. Philadelphia 76ers $6,825,500
4. New York Knicks $6,691,500
5. Boston Celtics $6,560,000
6. Seattle Supersonics $5,683,333
7. Los Angeles Clippers $4,745,000
8. Detroit Pistons $4,603,666
9. Chicago Bulls $4,486,000
10. Washington Bullets $4,381,383
11. Golden State Warriors $4,365,833
12. Houston Rockets $4,259,000
13. Phoenix Suns $4,189,500
14. San Antonio Spurs $4,052,846
15. Dallas Mavericks $4,052,346
16. Sacramento Kings $4,052,000
17. Cleveland Cavaliers $3,920,666
18. Portland Trailblazers $3,831,000
19. Indiana Pacers $3,758,200
20. Atlanta Hawks $3,671,250
21. Milwaukee Bucks $3,661,332
22. Denver Nuggets $3,425,500
23. Utah Jazz $2,914,500


Top 25 players
1. Magic Johnson (LAL) $2,500,000
2. Moses Malone (Phi) $2,145,000
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (LAL) $2,030,000
4. Larry Bird (Bos) $1,800,000
5. Jack Sikma (Sea) $1,600,000
6. Julius Erving (Phi) $1,485,000
7. Patrick Ewing (NY) $1,250,000
8. Ralph Sampson (Hou) $1,165,500
9. Mitch Kupchak (LAL) $1,150,000
10. Otis Birdsong (NJ) $1,100,000
10. Marques Johnson (LAC) $1,100,000
12. Albert King (NJ) $1,035,000
13. Kevin McHale (Bos) $1,000,000
14. Wayman Tisdale (Ind) $987,000
15. Adrian Dantley (Uta) $950,000
16. Bill Cartwright (NY) $925,000
17. Buck Williams (NJ) $915,000
18. Sidney Moncrief (Mil) $884,000
19. Akeem Olajuwon (Hou) $882,500
20. Bernard King (NY) $874,000
21. Alex English (Den) $825,000
22. Darryl Dawkins (NJ) $808,000
23. George Gervin (Chi) $806,000
24. Joe Barry Carroll (GS) $800,000
24. Tom Chambers (Sea) $800,000






And Buss offered 6 million plus picks and players for Sampson 4 years before that. He offered Magic, Kareem, and Birds combined salary just as the cash bonus on top of a great basketball offer for a prospect.

[Ben Simmons 25]

But to be fair did every team in the league feel that strongly or was it just Buss?

Read the entire OP... some teams did, but did they all?

[Kblaze8855]

Hard to say. But the Blazers did offer Drexler and the number 2 pick knowing they would take Michael Jordan there and a bunch of cash. Safe to say if they opened it to bidding it would have become a

[Kblaze8855]

I feel like they have to be somebody in Houston trying to talk them into taking that deal though. You can bring Drexler home to Houston to pair with the other university of Houston superstar in Hakeem and taking Michael Jordan on top of it? Two hometown hero athletic freak lottery picks with Jordan along for the ride?

That’s the best deal anyone has ever passed on in hindsight right?

[elementally morale]

[QUOTE=Kblaze8855]Hard to say. But the Blazers did offer Drexler and the number 2 pick knowing they would take Michael Jordan there and a bunch of cash. Safe to say if they opened it to bidding it would have become a

[SpaceJam2]

I was like 8-9 years old at the time and in Europe so I obviously can't remember. But was the actual hype greater than what LeBron got? I mean... regular newspapers were writing columns about LeBron when he was in high school. Not sports outlets. Ordinary websites had articles on how LeBron James will be the greatest player of all time... and he was like 17 years old.

Well at least they were right :D

[Ben Simmons 25]

I was like 8-9 years old at the time and in Europe so I obviously can't remember. But was the actual hype greater than what LeBron got? I mean... regular newspapers were writing columns about LeBron when he was in high school. Not sports outlets. Ordinary websites had articles on how LeBron James will be the greatest player of all time... and he was like 17 years old.

There was all kinds of debate surrounding that draft as to who deserved to go #1. You throw Shaq in there and there probably isn't a debate.

[Ben Simmons 25]

I feel like they have to be somebody in Houston trying to talk them into taking that deal though. You can bring Drexler home to Houston to pair with the other university of Houston superstar in Hakeem and taking Michael Jordan on top of it? Two hometown hero athletic freak lottery picks with Jordan along for the ride?

That’s the best deal anyone has ever passed on in hindsight right?

Would have to be. That's beyond insane. I didn't even know such a thing existed. Hindsight is a bitch.

[StrongLurk]

Wait...is Kblaze actually 3ball? Someone was telling me that like a week ago and I thought that was crazy.

But now thinking about it while reading the OP's style along with gifs...idk Kblaze and 3ball really could be the same person...but that would just be too crazy.

[Ben Simmons 25]

Wait...is Kblaze actually 3ball? Someone was telling me that like a week ago and I thought that was crazy.

But now thinking about it while reading the OP's style along with gifs...idk Kblaze and 3ball really could be the same person...but that would just be too crazy.

Nah, they've debated far too much. Kblaze has publicly shamed him multiple times.

If they're the same person, it would take a special kind of schizo... in other words... they're not the same person.

[Duncan21formvp]

Kareem, not sure how it is even close.

[eliteballer]

If we're talking purely pre-draft hype it's obviously LeBron because of the expectations and precedent Jordan/Magic/Bird set as perimeter players.

If we're talking who's the biggest freak/phenom:


https://media.giphy.com/media/6n300FFBvWo1y/giphy.gif


https://media.giphy.com/media/j4cr97VIy2BgY/giphy.gif


https://media.giphy.com/media/AJ5HPXV7MqaQM/giphy.gif


https://media.giphy.com/media/5MZeoM8gYvOTu/giphy.gif

[SpaceJam2]

Kareem, not sure how it is even close.

Literally everyone has mentioned a different person and you're dumb enough to ask how it's even close? :lol

We've had Ralph Samson, Shaq, Ewing, LeBron James, apparently Kareem now, and yet you wonder how it's close? :lol

[SpaceJam2]

For comparisons sake...the highest paid teams and players 4 years later....not when the offer was made....after salaries started to rise:


1. Los Angeles Lakers $8,579,750
2. New Jersey Nets $6,840,500
3. Philadelphia 76ers $6,825,500
4. New York Knicks $6,691,500
5. Boston Celtics $6,560,000
6. Seattle Supersonics $5,683,333
7. Los Angeles Clippers $4,745,000
8. Detroit Pistons $4,603,666
9. Chicago Bulls $4,486,000
10. Washington Bullets $4,381,383
11. Golden State Warriors $4,365,833
12. Houston Rockets $4,259,000
13. Phoenix Suns $4,189,500
14. San Antonio Spurs $4,052,846
15. Dallas Mavericks $4,052,346
16. Sacramento Kings $4,052,000
17. Cleveland Cavaliers $3,920,666
18. Portland Trailblazers $3,831,000
19. Indiana Pacers $3,758,200
20. Atlanta Hawks $3,671,250
21. Milwaukee Bucks $3,661,332
22. Denver Nuggets $3,425,500
23. Utah Jazz $2,914,500


Top 25 players
1. Magic Johnson (LAL) $2,500,000
2. Moses Malone (Phi) $2,145,000
3. Kareem Abdul-Jabbar (LAL) $2,030,000
4. Larry Bird (Bos) $1,800,000
5. Jack Sikma (Sea) $1,600,000
6. Julius Erving (Phi) $1,485,000
7. Patrick Ewing (NY) $1,250,000
8. Ralph Sampson (Hou) $1,165,500
9. Mitch Kupchak (LAL) $1,150,000
10. Otis Birdsong (NJ) $1,100,000
10. Marques Johnson (LAC) $1,100,000
12. Albert King (NJ) $1,035,000
13. Kevin McHale (Bos) $1,000,000
14. Wayman Tisdale (Ind) $987,000
15. Adrian Dantley (Uta) $950,000
16. Bill Cartwright (NY) $925,000
17. Buck Williams (NJ) $915,000
18. Sidney Moncrief (Mil) $884,000
19. Akeem Olajuwon (Hou) $882,500
20. Bernard King (NY) $874,000
21. Alex English (Den) $825,000
22. Darryl Dawkins (NJ) $808,000
23. George Gervin (Chi) $806,000
24. Joe Barry Carroll (GS) $800,000
24. Tom Chambers (Sea) $800,000






And Buss offered 6 million plus picks and players for Sampson 4 years before that. He offered Magic, Kareem, and Birds combined salary just as the cash bonus on top of a great basketball offer for a prospect.

That is effin insane. I heard about him being hyped but not to this degree. This is on another level. Was it injuries that got the best of him or was he just not NBA level dominant? I saw that his peak numbers were okay but nothing amazing.

[Kblaze8855]

He was never NBA dominant he was just a unicorn. Nobody had seen anything like that. He was essentially a 7'4''(ish) small forward and he was supposed to do for bigs what Magic did for guards. Too big for forwards or guards....too quick for centers....he really was an impossible matchup. He had games with like 28/12/13 blocks and some assists. He was just unusual. The type every coach thinks they could rule the universe with.

[Kblaze8855]

After some thought my rankings are something like....

1.Kareem
2.Ralph Sampson
3.Ewing(he was supposed to be Bill Russell)
4.Lebron
5.Bill Walton(tough one....arguably over Lebron)
6.Shaq(another tough one but a lot of people expected him to be a defensive standout who wouldnt be able to score)
7.Hakeem
8.Magic Johnson
9.Zion
10.Duncan
11.Larry Johnson
12.Derrick Coleman
13. Anthony Davis
14.Danny Manning
15. Glenn robinson(another guy you would have to have been there to understand the hype)


Im not sure where to put Wilt. Hed clearly have gone #1 no matter who had the pick but it was the territory days where Philly got him because he was from there.

That isnt my for sure final list....im sure I forgot someone....but those guys were all pretty outrageously hyped.

[SamuraiSWISH]

1a. Shaq
1b. LeBron

That I

[SpaceJam2]

After some thought my rankings are something like....

1.Kareem
2.Ralph Sampson
3.Ewing(he was supposed to be Bill Russell)
4.Lebron
5.Bill Walton(tough one....arguably over Lebron)
6.Shaq(another tough one but a lot of people expected him to be a defensive standout who wouldnt be able to score)
7.Hakeem
8.Magic Johnson
9.Zion
10.Duncan
11.Larry Johnson
12.Derrick Coleman
13. Anthony Davis
14.Danny Manning
15. Glenn robinson(another guy you would have to have been there to understand the hype)


Im not sure where to put Wilt. Hed clearly have gone #1 no matter who had the pick but it was the territory days where Philly got him because he was from there.

That isnt my for sure final list....im sure I forgot someone....but those guys were all pretty outrageously hyped.


What's the story with Danny Manning?

[Phoenix]

In the time I've watched, Shaq and Lebron.

[sdot_thadon]

After some thought my rankings are something like....

1.Kareem
2.Ralph Sampson
3.Ewing(he was supposed to be Bill Russell)
4.Lebron
5.Bill Walton(tough one....arguably over Lebron)
6.Shaq(another tough one but a lot of people expected him to be a defensive standout who wouldnt be able to score)
7.Hakeem
8.Magic Johnson
9.Zion
10.Duncan
11.Larry Johnson
12.Derrick Coleman
13. Anthony Davis
14.Danny Manning
15. Glenn robinson(another guy you would have to have been there to understand the hype)


Im not sure where to put Wilt. Hed clearly have gone #1 no matter who had the pick but it was the territory days where Philly got him because he was from there.

That isnt my for sure final list....im sure I forgot someone....but those guys were all pretty outrageously hyped.
Quick question Kblaze: Are you asking to compare them as they were or as if they all were in a draft class together but with the hype intact? To me that changes things slightly because individually some guys had way more hype than others. I think that list is solid, but if they're all in the same class I couldn't see Lebron a highschool kid going over many, if any of the great bigs that would be available.

Also I'd slide Greg Oden somewhere into that top 10 if we're factoring hype without hindsight. Poor Greg.

[jayfan]

Since the time I started following the league-

Ewing & Lebron on their own level as far as hype.

[Jacques Webster]

Only saw the hype for LeBron before 2003 and people were oozing about him coming to the NBA. I'll say him. I'm sure the other guys hype was huge too, but with internet and cable being as large as it was in 2003 it probably got out to more people to build hype around him.

[Kblaze8855]

Hype intact one draft. And I didnt know what to do with Oden but there was alot of Durant talk at the time. There was Melo talk with Lebron but no way would have have been drafted first. I think more teams had Darko>Lebron than Melo. I think some teams would have drafted Durant over Oden.

[iamgine]

In terms of pure number of people getting hyped, it might be Yao Ming.

[SamuraiSWISH]

In terms of pure number of people getting hyped, it might be Yao Ming.
Yeah but that was only out of nationalism pride, and sheer numbers. He wasn

[Smoke117]

Ewing didn't live up to the hype at all.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Patrick lost his athleticism due to injury, following the 1990 season. But he still was a top-five center in the most dominant era of big man of all time. Nobody was winning rings over Jordan. The only failures on his resume, is that blown lay up in the series against the Pacers. And the 1994 finals which weren’t even exclusively his fault. Yao Ming was more of a failure to meet hype than Patrick Ewing was.

[Kblaze8855]

CBS special on Ewing from right before his first game:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgZPropJdww


They really thought something was about to happen.

They got better in like 3 years but took 8 years to make so much as a conference finals.

[Kblaze8855]

[QUOTE=SamuraiSWISH]Patrick lost his athleticism due to injury, following the 1990 season. But he still was a top-five center in the most dominant era of big man of all time. Nobody was winning rings over Jordan. The only failures on his resume, is that blown lay up in the series against the Pacers. And the 1994 finals which weren

[Smoke117]

Patrick lost his athleticism due to injury, following the 1990 season. But he still was a top-five center in the most dominant era of big man of all time. Nobody was winning rings over Jordan. The only failures on his resume, is that blown lay up in the series against the Pacers. And the 1994 finals which weren’t even exclusively his fault. Yao Ming was more of a failure to meet hype than Patrick Ewing was.

He was absolute dogshit in that finals series. 18.9ppg on .39%ts. (22.8 shots a game) Hakeem Olajuwon went balls deep with no lube. People go on about the Hakeem/Robinson 95 series when Robinson wasn't even close to as bad as Ewing in this finals series less than a year before. He was actually decent by any real standard.

[DaHeezy]

1- Shaq
2- Kareem
3- Lebron

Despite the clear anti-Lebron bias here, Lebron would have gone 1st overall at grade 11. His hype was unreal.

[FKAri]

He was absolute dogshit in that finals series. 18.9ppg on .39%ts. (22.8 shots a game) Hakeem Olajuwon went balls deep with no lube. People go on about the Hakeem/Robinson 95 series when Robinson wasn't even close to as bad as Ewing.
I think it's because the 95 series was a turning point for some people in the DRob vs Hakeem debate. No one was debating Ewing over Hakeem going into the finals except for maybe knicksman's dad.

[iamgine]

Ewing lost his first 8 NBA games...must've put quite a damper on Knicks fans' enthusiasm. :lol

[Smoke117]

1- Shaq
2- Kareem
3- Lebron

Despite the clear anti-Lebron bias here, Lebron would have gone 1st overall at grade 11. His hype was unreal.

I think you are overrating his hype. It was high, but it wasn't higher than guys like Walton and David Robinson relative to the popularity of the sport of the time. It's easy to say LeBron was more hyped, but he also came into a league with much more media around. Those two guys were much more highly regarded by the basketball community, though.

[Kblaze8855]

Davids the one I forgot. Hes somewhere around #10 id say ahead of Duncan....partly because his hype died down a bit when he went away to the navy for a few years.

[Phoenix]

I think it's because the 95 series was a turning point for some people in the DRob vs Hakeem debate. No one was debating Ewing over Hakeem going into the finals except for maybe knicksman's dad.

I'd say that, fairly or otherwise, this one over-played moment is what determined their legacies:

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/JovialTepidEmu-small.gif

Their careers in terms of head to head numbers outside of that one beatdown is much closer than one would think otherwise. Robinson never really recovered from that in terms of perception, while Hakeem was thrust into another tier. We've forgotten that many thought the Admiral was gonna take over the league back in 92, and that's when guys like Jordan, Barkley, Malone were at their peak with Shaq on the horizon.

[Kblaze8855]

Watching PTI earlier they argued that Virginia

[Ben Simmons 25]

https://66.media.tumblr.com/f932468691da836ce989e56559c9b7e0/tumblr_nca9oxFyiF1qcmnsoo1_400.gif

[eliteballer]

Sampson wasn't close to 7-4. Roughly the same height as Kareem.

Just look at him with Yao in that picture with all the Rockets centers when Dwight went there.

[BigShotBob]

I don't think people understand how hyped Kareem was. He was a winner at every level and was lauded as the greatest basketball player on the planet.....ahead of Wilt before he was even drafted.

Of the most hype it's definitely Kareem and he should be first on everyone's lists. Yes, ahead of Shaq since he's better and more dominant than him anyways.

Ralph Samson is a good catch. They had flyers of him everywhere in every sports magazine and I had no idea who he was at the time.

A.I. deserves an honorable mention. He was compared to everyone from Zeke to MJ to Magic and Tim Hardaway and he got out of prison and made it to the NBA draft. He was a success story.

Then we have others like OJ Mayo, Sebastian Telflair, Blake Griffin, and so on who received an unprecedented amount of hype.

But the only real answer is Kareem.

Again, he was compared to prime Wilt before he even committed to college.

Prime Wilt.

While he was in high school.

It was unbelievable.

[FireDavidKahn]

I wasn't around for Sampson and was only a few years old when Shaq came out so I wasn't there either, but in my 2+ decades of following the NBA I think LeBron takes the cake and no one comes close...which isn't to say that other people didn't have extreme hype but LeBron was next level.

[FireDavidKahn]

Only saw the hype for LeBron before 2003 and people were oozing about him coming to the NBA. I'll say him. I'm sure the other guys hype was huge too, but with internet and cable being as large as it was in 2003 it probably got out to more people to build hype around him.
Yep.

LeBron was so hyped that even nonbasketball fans (and non sport fans in general) knew exactly what you were talking about when you said the word "LeBron".

Then you add in the fact that the Cavs won the lottery and with the whole "home town hero" angle the hype went even further.

[FireDavidKahn]

Sampson wasn't close to 7-4. Roughly the same height as Kareem.

Just look at him with Yao in that picture with all the Rockets centers when Dwight went there.
:biggums:

https://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/1204/classic.ralph.sampson.pics/images/twin-towers2.jpg
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/bill-fitch-poses-with-hakeem-olajuwon-and-ralph-sampson-of-the-at-picture-id928083818

Sampson is no question taller and at least a few inches more than the Dream.

[Gotterdammerung]

Kareem Abdul-Jabbar probably had the highest peak coming in. They thought he was the perfect combination of Chamberlain and Russell. Even when he was in high school, they televised his games against DeMatha powerhouse. :eek:

Wilt Chamberlain was hyped coming in, but the NBA was much smaller in 1959, and he skipped his final college season for the Harlem Globetrotters.

[eliteballer]

:biggums:

https://cdn-s3.si.com/s3fs-public/si/multimedia/photo_gallery/1204/classic.ralph.sampson.pics/images/twin-towers2.jpg
https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/bill-fitch-poses-with-hakeem-olajuwon-and-ralph-sampson-of-the-at-picture-id928083818

Sampson is no question taller and at least a few inches more than the Dream.
I said Kareem not Hakeem, foolio.

[FireDavidKahn]

I said Kareem not Hakeem, foolio.
:oldlol: :facepalm

My mistake.

[1987_Lakers]

In my time of watching basketball the most hyped players I saw coming into the draft were LeBron and Greg Oden. Oden was getting Bill Russell comparisons, and I'm not even joking.

I would have to imagine Kareem was insanely hyped too, 3x NCAA champ and dominated in UCLA. In Bill Simmons book, he talks about how incredibly hyped David Robinson was, not sure about Shaq, but I believe he was a tier below David in terms of hype.

[DCL]

92 draft was known as the shaquille o'neal draft sweepstakes.

pat williams straight up nutted in his pants on TV when he got the #1. there was no secret which player was going to be picked #1. orlando knew. every other jealous gms knew. ESPN knew. sports illustrated knew. all the analysts, from respectable to shitty, knew. all the fans knew. everyone in the whole world knew. it was as a total no-brainer.

pat williams even brought out the jersey as soon as it was announced that orlando got the grand prize.

http://oi64.tinypic.com/2e5m98n.jpg

[FKAri]

It's one of:
Kareem
Lebron
Wilt

Then come guys like Shaq, Sampson, Ewing, etc

Lebron got the most "hype" but it's to be expected with the much larger media presence in 2003. In terms of expectations for a pick, it's Kareem at #1.

[DCL]

https://thumbs.gfycat.com/MinorHorribleBooby-size_restricted.gif

allan bristow's reaction was pretty funny too.

he's trying to look cool but couldn't hide his disappointment like "dammit, FML". he looked like the guys who didn't win the oscar.

but 2nd prize wasn't even bad. it was alonzo!

[Marchesk]

Not sure how people are forgetting Wilt.

It's either Kareem, Wilt or Sampson.

Shaq is there with Ewing, Robinson and Olajuwon. But he was in no way more hyped than the top three, certainly not Kareem. Not given Kareem's college career.

[Duderonomy]

I can only speak for my lifetime

10. Yao Ming/Ben Simmons
9. Carmelo Anthony
8. Greg Oden
7. Derrick Rose
6. Anthony Davis
5. Dwight Howard
4. John Wall
3. Duncan
2. Zion
1. LeBron

[aau]

easy
got his teammate- who couldn't play a lick -drafted in the top 5
hahaha . . . ahead of sidney moncrief

https://nbagenius.co/nba-re-drafts/1979-nba-re-draft/

looking the other way;
yall might take med/rs bowie and oden as the worst picks ever
(taken ahead of jordan and durant, respectively) kwame , maybe
but the worst draft pick in league history has to be david greenwood

i was thinking 'what do they see"



but to pass on mj and kd


jordan and moncrief

and pippen


haha

[Kblaze8855]

I felt the need to bring Sampson back up now that he has a similar modern comparison.

The skilled and mobile giant always gets wild hype. Victor might approach a Sampson level of hype. If the Spurs win it and the Kings could somehow trade they’re whole franchise Pop probably says no right?

[WhiteKyrie]

LeBron. Second best player of all time.

[Im so nba'd out]

https://i.postimg.cc/hvhzJMKC/8-FA13-A6-A-EFDC-41-EC-AF88-E1-CD1026-E299.gif


Goat reaction

[TheGoatest]

I'm not sure what kind of hype the likes of Wilt and Kareem had, but in modern basketball #1 is easily LeBron.
We will never see fans of teams argue that they should tank an entire season for a 16 year-old high school kid two seasons prior to that player entering the NBA draft, like they were arguing in the 2001-02 season for the prospects of drafting LeBron.
#2 and #3 are Shaq or Patrick Ewing. #4 is Zion. Wembanyama could get up to #2 by next year's draft though.

[Kblaze8855]

Fans in 02 weren’t as certain about Lebron as you suggest. I was here in 02. Plenty didn’t think he’d be that great. Kareem was seen by some as the best basketball player ever before he got to the nba. And Ewing was more widely assumed to be a sure thing than Lebron too. You go back and watch the Lebron talk there was a lot about how he couldn’t possibly match some peoples expectations.

Some people were all in but even they wouldn’t say he’d have the career he did. Off predraft hype alone he doesn’t beat a few of the bigs. He had people going both ways. I doubt anyone felt Kareem wasn’t a lock.

[TheGoatest]

I know all too well that some people weren't as certain about LeBron back in 2002: I was one of them! In an era where every draft shat out a Darius Miles, Jonathan Bender and a bunch of other high schoolers who clearly should've went to college, I was wondering why there was so much hype about this one high school kid in particular for me to have to be hearing about him not one but two freakin seasons before he would even enter the draft. Especially because this was right around the period where a high schooler Kwame Brown was even picked #1 (thanks to a certain moron), and it became pretty obvious that he would turn out to be a huge bust.
With all that said, the fact is that the hype around LeBron was there, and it was bigger than the hype for any player in modern basketball.

[Kblaze8855]

Welk I suppose that depends on what you call “modern”. To me modern is the shit I have clear memory of. Modern to my little cousins is like….the start of the warriors run. You’d have to be 27-28 to even remember seeing Kobe being a good player in your adult life. Time passes quickly I guess.

I distinctly remember Ewing’s hype about though I understand not everyone does. My friends son is a senior in high school and a basketball player and he didn’t know Melo used to be a star. He barely remembers Lebron on the Heat. The era difference is significant for these things.

[PerkinsFor3]

I felt the need to bring Sampson back up now that he has a similar modern comparison.

The skilled and mobile giant always gets wild hype. Victor might approach a Sampson level of hype. If the Spurs win it and the Kings could somehow trade they’re whole franchise Pop probably says no right?

Year after year after year we have people falling for the Thabeet/Bol Bol/Pokusevski whatever hype.


On Lebron: Dude was crowned 'The King' before he played a game - glad he lived up to the hype, but boy, it was real.

[1987_Lakers]

Fans in 02 weren’t as certain about Lebron as you suggest. I was here in 02. Plenty didn’t think he’d be that great. Kareem was seen by some as the best basketball player ever before he got to the nba. And Ewing was more widely assumed to be a sure thing than Lebron too. You go back and watch the Lebron talk there was a lot about how he couldn’t possibly match some peoples expectations.


I mean, they didn't have internet forums where they discussed prospects like Ewing back then, I'm sure there would be a few who thought Ewing wouldn't be that great if the internet was around back then.

[Kblaze8855]

Well sure because somebody somewhere thinks everything. But I knew people in person who didn’t even think LeBron should be a top pick that year. I’ve never heard Ewing wasn’t a sure thing once. Though oddly people didn’t think he would be what he was. He was supposed to come and be maybe the best guy ever shutting down the lane. Turned into a scorer who blocked shots instead of Russell with a mean streak which was the talk.

[PerkinsFor3]

I mean, they didn't have internet forums where they discussed prospects like Ewing back then, I'm sure there would be a few who thought Ewing wouldn't be that great if the internet was around back then.

What if I told you there was?

Some quotes from 1985, regarding Ewing:


The Celtics get a first round pick in '86 from Seattle for Henderson.
Seattle has a good chance of missing the playoffs, so there is a chance
of getting a very high pick. Too bad it's not for '85; oh, but for a
shot at local Pat Ewing! A sound move, I think, as long as it doesn't
have a bad effect on the "chemistry" of the team. That's hard to
predict.


I thought Dallas would pull out the Midwest division. They are a very
good team, but they desparately need a center. Remember they have
Cleveland's first-round pick next year, so they will definitly be in the
Patrick Ewing lottery. Ewing could give them quite a dynasty in Dallas. :-)
Houston has a good shot at winning it. Bill Fitch is the perfect coach
for young talent such as the Twin Towers. Denver is off to a much
better start than expected.


This year's crop of rookies is the best since at least the '79 group
including Bird and Magic. Jordan is almost a shoe-in for
rookie-of-the-year. I can see why Houston was under local pressuse to
pick Akeem, but they would be better off with Jordan in the backcourt
and Sampson at center. Akeem is a very good athlete and will get better
as he learns the game, but he's no Pat Ewing. But Portland really blew
it by passing up Jordan, not to mention trading everyone to Denver for
Kiki. Barkley is a very impressive rebounder with Philadelphia (and a
definite improvement over Ivaroni).


wing is an imposing player -- arguably the most imposing player in
college basketball. He is not, however, the keystone of Georgetown's
game and to center your game around him will get you killed from the
wings and the backcourt. Why Georgetown is a great team is (if
nobody else has noticed) that they are incredibly balanced. Ewing
is a little like a Ferris Wheel at an amusement park. He ain't
the whole thing, just the thing you see first.


As a Sonics fan I am, of course, rooting for a successful
nosedive. It is not that we need the no. 1. pick; Ewing would be
great, but Seattle doesn't need another center. Sure, you could move
Sikma to power forward and let Ewing dominate the paint, but that
isn't what Seattle needs.

How about this: Seattle gets a top number in the draft and
trades the pick to Boston for Kevin McHale. With Sikma, McHale, and
Cedric Henderson together, Seattle would once again have the
potential to go all the way. It would take a few more key players,
but at least they wouldn't be stuck in the doldrums as they have been
the past few years. Wilkens is a good coach, if he has the horses to
work with.


Why should Seattle trade the pick if they get it? So far,
all the comments have been to the effect that it would be extremely
stupid to pass on Patrick Ewing because he may become one of those
once in a lifetime players, like Kareem. Maybe he will, but it
will be at least a couple of years before he plays at that kind
of level. At the moment, Ewing is a great defensive player. In
time he may be a great offensive player. However, Seattle doesn't
need defense, it needs offense. Sure, you could draft Ewing and
start a frontline of Ewing, Sikma, and Tom Chambers. That would be
one of the best defensive frontlines in the league, but it wouldn't
score any points.


i've said it time and time again. the celtics are protected by the league
office and the referees. not that they need it, they have alot of good
players and one great player. only by playing in boston could ainge get
away with the body blocks (off the ball of course) and general ROUGH play
that he gets away with every game. and there is of course the strong arm
and long arm tactics of m.l. carr and kevin mchale, respectively.
the fast flow of the game is no excuse for the referees consistently missing
those calls. the refs look at tapes too. after you see it happening alot,
you have to start looking for those hits. you can either decide to call them
or decide to let them go.

of course, i do not complain about the possible conspiracies in the nba.
the knicks just won the right to draft patrick ewing. great for us new
york fans...just very convenient for the nba.


The Knicks get Ewing? As if that division wasn't already
too tough. They are going to love him in NY. He better
improve his free throws or he could turn NY against him
real quick. On second thought, the NY fans are pretty easy
going...With two near-legitimate centers already, the
Knickerbockers will surely sell one for a




Well Ewing is going to be a Knick!!! Think of the team
the Knicks will have. Two seasons ago when the Knicks where
healthy they took boston to a seventh game. Last season they were
injury plagued and finished terribly. My point is even without
Ewing, the knicks when healthy are a .500 team...

Now enter Ewing !!!! Think of the potential !!! A
starting front line of Ewing,Cartwright, and King!! Its as good
as any in the league. It has scoring, rebounding, defense,
everything. This combined with the always good backcourt of
Walker,Sparrow,Tucker, and Carter will prove to be a tough
opponent against the rest of the league. Finally, we cant forget
Cummings and Bannister They are solid players.

To sum up, people say that one player doesnt make a team,
and thats true, but the Knicks when healthy already had a solid
team and with Ewing WATCH OUT!!!!!!! The Knicks can match up well
against any team in the league.......

This one especially for Kblaze:


I think it's time to be a bit more realistic about Patrick Ewing and the
New York Knicks. All I've been hearing lately is that NY is going to be
awesome... even that they have a chance to become NBA Champions next year.
Give me a break. The same was said about Sampson... Houston didn't do it
in his rookie year. In fact, they were still bad enough to get Akeem "The
Dream" the next year. Both of which are so called "franchaise players."
Even with the Twin Towers they couldn't do it. Certainly they have improved,
but they weren't in the same division as Philadelphia and Boston.

Certainly Ewing will be a force in the NBA for years to come, but I think it's
going to take him a little while to adjust to the NBA and especially Hubie
Brown.




As if the balance of power wasn't already in the East,
the New York Knicks now have the rights to Patrick Ewing.
This is sure to turn the Knicks into more than a legitimate
contender for the Division title.
For the past two years, it has been said that their (the Knicks)
division has been the most powerful in the NBA. What does
Ewing's coming to New York make it now? The most powerful
in the history of the NBA ???

I can only hope and pray that New York will be so constrained
by the salary cap that they will have to dilute some of their
talent in order to sign Patrick.

Golden State has the worst record in the league and they
get seventh pick. Teriffic. I hope this is the first and
last time we see Commissioner Stern's idea of a good time.

[Kblaze8855]

Yea I was about to go search the newsgroups from the 80s myself. Always good content. I have an old topic or two about them I like to update at times.

People talking dynasty there or saying he’d take a couple years to be Kareem…..

I like Pat in retrospect more than I did when I was young but that hype is still funny. He was nice but got damn.

[Johnny32]

in my lifetime, lebron. dude was called 'the chosen one' on the cover of si as a jr in high school. i've read kareem was really hyped but before my time.

[PerkinsFor3]

I also liked this one:


A lot of players have been arrogant, but only a few have been consistently able
to live up to it (Oscar, West, Kareem, Wilt, Russell come immediately to mind).
Bird is clearly in this elite group of the very best we have ever seen. (Bill
Walton might have gotten there had his feet taken him further, and Bernard King,
Ralph Sampson and Magic Johnson still might get there).

It's much in line with what I feel about Bird. Few players in history have been able to impose their will on the game like peak Bird did. A few struggled to do it every now and then, some more than others, but I haven't seen many do it since Bird. And especially not the way he did it.

[sdot_thadon]

Was gonna say Kareem, Duncan and Lebron off the top of my head based on pre-draft hype, but man i think Sampson takes the cake. He's gotta be one of the greatest injury what-if stories because he was a unicorn before they existed. He was basically washed up by the time I was following the Rox closely as a kid but there was no shortage of hope in him down here from the fans i grew up around.

[tontoz]

Young people probabaly don't know that Bird played his senior season in college after he was drafted at 6 by the Cs.

As to the topic Kareem was before my time but his hype was up there with Lebron, if not moreso. He was an athletic freak over 7' tall with great skills.

If you want to see an example of how athletic he was you can pull up old youtube clips of him fighting Bruce Lee in a movie.

[Chick Stern]

It’s Kareem the GOAT, and it’s not particularly close.