Facts about "1-9" (for reference purposes)

[3ball]

.
MJ went 1-9 as an 8 seed, whereas Lebron never had less than a 4 seed in the playoffs..

We don't know how lebron would do with a low-seeded cast, like if his 9-seed had been an 8 seed in 2005, and faced the champion pistons in the first round... But we can guess that he'd get swept the same way with an 8 seed as he got swept with a 2 seed and 4 seed (07', 18'), and record loss with a 2 seed (14')..

obviously, if you get swept by champs as a high seed, why wouldn't it happen as a low seed?.. it's a knock on lebron that he got demolished/swept with 2 seeds, and MJ only 8 seeds.

Ultimately, we can't compare Lebron's 1-4 seeds to Jordan's 8 seeds, but we know that jordan's 1-4 seeds greatly outperformed Lebron's.. MJ never lost as 1 or 2 seed (6/6), while lebron lost with a 1 or 2 seed six times (including various sweeps and record losses)

And people will say that MJ should've prevailed by simply achieving better teams/seeds like lebron did, but that negates any "competition" argument, since lebron should've prevailed in the Finals by achieving a better team beforehand as well. The objective is always to BE the better/favored team, not a worse team that must complain about "comp".. unfortunately, lebron's inability to field the best teams has caused people to change the goat criteria away from winning, into losing but appearing to face great odds.. it's a way to weaponize losing when your star can't get it done ("oh, but we were so outmatched", woah is me bs)
.

[Uncle Drew]

It’s done then. 1-9 finally got the better of him. 3ball crumbling like a cookie, folding like a cheap tent. We won.

[superduper]

The fact that Brannies expect years 1-3 Jordan to single handedly beat a top 3 team all time in and of itself proves Jordan's the undisputed GOAT.

[Hey Yo]

The fact that Brannies expect years 1-3 Jordan to single handedly beat a top 3 team all time in and of itself proves Jordan's the undisputed GOAT.
He had Orlando Woolridge's 20ppg in the '85 playoffs and 21ppg in '86.

Nothing single handily about MJ's first 2 playoffs

[FKAri]

The fact that Brannies expect years 1-3 Jordan to single handedly beat a top 3 team all time in and of itself proves Jordan's the undisputed GOAT.
He got swept in the 1st round in his 4th year as well...to a Boston team that got taken the distance by a team with... [wait for it]... ZERO all-stars :oldlol:

[superduper]

He got swept in the 1st round in his 4th year as well...to a Boston team that got taken the distance by a team with... [wait for it]... ZERO all-stars :oldlol:

So why did Bran get swept in embarrassing fashion by the exact same team that King James 1v50'd against and not only took to 7 by himself last year with ZERO allstars but also beat them this year single handedly without his 2nd and 3rd options? :eek:

[Phoenix]

He got swept in the 1st round in his 4th year as well...to a Boston team that got taken the distance by a team with... [wait for it]... ZERO all-stars :oldlol:

4th year? 4th year was 87-88. He lost in the 2nd round to Detroit. Maybe you mean third year(86-87)?

[3ball]

MJ got swept


With an 8 seed, which is better than lebron getting swept with a 2 seed and 4 seed, or record loss with a 2 seed

[Nikola_]

its actually 2-9 for future reference

[3ball]

Fixed the OP

[SouBeachTalents]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/US_1-9.svg/750px-US_1-9.svg.png

[Manny98]

Imagine being the "GOAT" and losing in the 1st round 3 times :roll: :roll: :roll:

[3ball]

Imagine being the "GOAT" and losing in the 1st round 3 times :roll: :roll: :roll:

Imagine considering someone for goat that was a 3-time loser in 2 different rounds at (2nd round and Finals).. an all-time loser in 2 different rounds.. :roll:

And imagine considering someone for goat that lost 6 times with a 1 or 2 seed, including sweeps and record losses, and lost 10 times in 13 playoffs despite never having less than a 4 seed

:roll: :yaohappy:

[Dray n Klay]

Imagine considering someone for goat that was a 3-time loser in 2 different rounds at (2nd round and Finals).. an all-time loser in 2 different rounds.. :roll:

And imagine considering someone for goat that lost 6 times with a 1 or 2 seed, including sweeps and record losses, and lost 10 times in 13 playoffs despite never having less than a 4 seed

:roll: :yaohappy:


LeBron won a championship without another all star teammate in 2016


Why couldn

[Manny98]

Imagine considering someone for goat that was a 3-time loser in 2 different rounds at (2nd round and Finals).. an all-time loser in 2 different rounds.. :roll:

And imagine considering someone for goat that lost 6 times with a 1 or 2 seed, including sweeps and record losses, and lost 10 times in 13 playoffs despite never having less than a 4 seed

:roll: :yaohappy:
At least that person didn't get his cheeks busted in the 1st round of the playoffs :roll:

[superduper]

LeBron won a championship without another all star teammate in 2016


Why couldn’t MJ do the same ONCE from 1985-1987?



What’s the difference?

Why couldn't Bran do the same in 2015?

What's the difference?

You NEVER seem to answer this question of mine. Legit wonder why.

[Marchesk]

Imagine being the "GOAT" and losing in the 1st round 3 times :roll: :roll: :roll:

Here's a thought. Jordan wasn't GOAT yet. In fact, people were calling Bird the GOAT at that point. Kind of went with the promoting Magic/Bird and the 80s over the past, but Bird was considered the best player in the mid 80s, not Mike.

[superduper]

Imagine expecting a year 1-3 player to single handedly beat a top 3 team all time. By having such thought process in your head there is no doubt you agree Jordan is the undisputed GOAT because there is no way anyone else would have such expectations.

[LAmbruh]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/US_1-9.svg/750px-US_1-9.svg.png
:roll: :roll:

[Manny98]

Imagine expecting a year 1-3 player to single handedly beat a top 3 team all time. By having such thought process in your head there is no doubt you agree Jordan is the undisputed GOAT because there is no way anyone else would have such expectations.
23 year old LeBron took the 67 win Celtics superteam to a grueling 7 games

Whilst 23 year old MJ got swept when he faced a weaker Celtics team with a better cast

Give LeBron a guy like Orlando Woolrige as his second option and he would have won in 07 and 08

How df do you get swept with a scoring phenom like Orlando Woolrige as your sidekick it doesn't make sense :biggums:

[superduper]

Bran at age 23 was 4-5 years in.

Jordan was 1-3 years in.

Just straight embarrassing ourselves now.

Yikes.

[Manny98]

Bran at age 23 was 4-5 years in.

Jordan was 1-3 years in.

Just straight embarrassing ourselves now.

Yikes.
So why did MJ miss the playoffs in his 14th and 15th season then

[3ball]

23 year old LeBron took the 67 win Celtics superteam to a grueling 7 games

Whilst 23 year old MJ got swept when he faced a weaker Celtics team with a better cast

Give LeBron a guy like Orlando Wooldrige as his second option and he would have won in 07 and 08

How df do you get swept with a scoring phenom like Orlando Wooldrige as your sidekick it doesn't make sense :biggums:
Lebron was a 4 seed and MJ an 8 seed, and:


Lebron vs. 08' Celts:. 26 on 35%
Jordan vs. 86' Celts:. 44 on 50%


Only Mike Brown's great defense kept the Cavs in the series despite Lebron's woat offense

And lebron's horrible play against champs was nothing new - see the 07' Finals and 11 Finals, before wade/riley got him straight

[superduper]

So why did MJ miss the playoffs in his 14th and 15th season then

Yeah.. you know you lost.

[Phoenix]

23 year old LeBron took the 67 win Celtics superteam to a grueling 7 games



So did the Hawks in the first round. The two best teams that Celtics team faced in the playoffs, the Pistons in the ECFs and the Lakers in the finals, took less games in their respective series.

[Manny98]

Lebron was a 4 seed and MJ an 8 seed, and:


Lebron vs. 08' Celts:. 26 on 35%
Jordan vs. 86' Celts:. 44 on 50%


Only Mike Brown's great defense kept the Cavs in the series despite Lebron's woat offense

And lebron's horrible play against champs was nothing new - see the 07' Finals and 11 Finals, before wade/riley got him straight
So 23 year old LeBron > 23 year old MJ

LeBron took his team to a 4th seed and one game away from a finals appearance

Whilst MJ barely made the playoffs and got embarrassed in the 1st round despite having a better cast than LeBron

[3ball]

So 23 year old LeBron > 23 year old MJ

08' LeBron took his team to a 4th seed and one game away from a finals appearance


08' Lebron took a 4 seed to the 2nd round

89' Jordan took a 6 seed to the ECF

Lebron has never led a low seed in the playoffs, let alone to the ecf and 6 games with the champs..

And surely lebron's 9 seed in 2005 would've been swept as the 8 seed versus the champion pistons, since his 2 seed was swept in 07'

[egokiller]

He had Orlando Woolridge's 20ppg in the '85 playoffs and 21ppg in '86.

Nothing single handily about MJ's first 2 playoffs

Negated by the fact that Woolridge wasn't even voted in as an all star while LeBron got to play with all-star Z his first year. Just another example of MJ doing more with less.:sleeping

[TheCorporation]

There was a time long before Scottie Pippen played for the Chicago Bulls; this time is referred to as the "Pre Savior Pippen" era (or PSP for short) and during the PSP era it was a mighty dreadful time for Jordan considering Chicago Bulls very own Michael "Dad Killer" Jordan had an abysmal playoff record of 1 win and 9 losses, hence the 1-9 reference. He was able to swiftly accumulate three 1st round exits, showing that he is a true 1st round exiting king. Three years with no Pippen, three first round exits, and a 1-9 playoff record to show for.

Although, we could even label Jordan's feat (or lack thereof) as 1-10 since he has 1 win in 10 games. 1-9 does have a nice ring to it, but perhaps 1-10 is better suited to display his lack of success? How say you, OP?

[Trollsmasher]

what results would LeBron get during his first stint at Cleveland if he had a player as good as Olrando Woolridge as his second option?

I think 3 rings are a minimum:pimp:

[3ball]

1-9



Lebron only had 4 seeds or better in the playoffs and MJ did much better with 4+ seeds - he never lost with the 1 or 2 seed (6/6), while lebron lost 6 times with the 1 or 2 seed, including record defeat and 2 sweeps

[And1AllDay]

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cc/US_1-9.svg/750px-US_1-9.svg.png

:oldlol: :oldlol:

Maybe we can change it to 1-10 since he won 1 game in 10 tries :oldlol:

[Uncle Drew]

Lebron only had 4 seeds or better in the playoffs and MJ did much better with 4+ seeds - he never lost with the 1 or 2 seed (6/6), while lebron lost 6 times with the 1 or 2 seed, including record defeat and 2 sweeps
1-9.

[3ball]

1-9.



Championship frequency as 1-4 seeds:


Lebron:.3 for 13 (entire career)
Jordan:.6 for 10 (includes baseball & injury yrs.. 6 for 8 in full seasons)


Championship frequency as 7-8 seeds:

Lebron:.0-0
Jordan:.0-3

[Uncle Drew]

Championship frequency as 1-4 seeds:


Lebron:.3 for 13 (entire career)
Jordan:.6 for 10 (includes baseball & injury yrs.. 6 for 8 in full seasons)


Championship frequency as 7-8 seeds:

Lebron:.0-0
Jordan:.0-3
1-9.

[3ball]

1-9.
MJ won 6 rings in 8 full seasons with 4+ seeds... So if he team-hopped his way to five extra 4+ seeds like Bron did, he'd have an extra 3 rings, or 9 rings total

[Uncle Drew]

MJ won 6 rings in 8 full seasons with 4+ seeds... So if he team-hopped his way to five extra 4+ seeds like Bron did, he'd have an extra 3 rings, or 9 rings total
1-9.

[FKAri]

tr1-9gered

[Duncan21formvp]

How did Lebron James lose to a Career Loser in Dwight Howard with HCA while having a 4x DPOY on his squad.
http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=454610&page=6

Lebron played on team where guys won titles as the man. He played with Ben Wallace who was the only allstar on a team that won it all and then lost to Dwight Howard with that player. He played with Shaq who has 3 finals mvp's (including winning with Kobe and Wade but only round 2 with Lebron) and he played with Wade who has a finals mvp. In fact Lebron played with all of them when they had all won already and Lebron hadn't won jack. He also has been down in a series every year of his career at least 3-2 in a series.

[Duncan21formvp]

How does a player lose in the 2nd round when they have a 3x finals mvp and league mvp winner on the squad like Lebron lost playing with Shaq.

[bigkingsfan]

How do you lose to an 8th seed, that never won a playoff game before?

[StrongLurk]

I just don't understand the mindless trolling. Guess it's a sickness.

1-9 is hardly an insult in the first place. A guy dropping 40+ scoring games on good efficiency and people are trying to act like that is a bad thing?