MJ averaged 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot

[3ball]

The same as Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, or Rip Hamilton.. These guys ALSO got 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot, while the rest of their points were FT's and maybe a couple catch-and-go buckets or transition.

The only difference was that Jordan got about 15-20 ADDITIONAL points via other methods, including post, catch-and-go, and primary ballhandler.

MJ had the same elite catch-and-go ability as these guys, but simply did many other things as well.

Tell me how I'm wrong here.. Also, given MJ's vastly higher volume, his total points scored via catch-and-shoot is probably the same or even higher than than any of the aforementioned players.

Btw, people always say Jordan couldn't shoot as good as these guys but he's a better shooter on ALL types of 2-point shots and 2-pointers still represent the majority of these players' shot attempts.. Here's Ron Artest saying MJ was the toughest to guard and that he was "like Reggie Miller from the mid-range":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5dXZxj6Zbc&t=0m57s
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[livinglegend]

Nobody cares



NEXT

[RightToCensor]

What exactly are you arguing? This is my first time in one of your threads and I'm wondering what's the debate.

[navy]

Did you notice everytime you find something new you spam it repeatedly?

[Sarcastic]

GOAT gonna GOAT.

[Smoke117]

Michael Jordan

Yup.

[RRR3]

This thread is now about Flying Hippos

http://fc09.deviantart.net/fs50/f/2009/291/7/b/Flying_Hippo_by_Pierrot_Pelgrim.png

[DonDadda59]

The same as Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, or Rip Hamilton.. These guys ALSO got 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot, while the rest of their points were FT's and maybe a couple catch-and-go buckets or transition.

The only difference was that Jordan got about 15-20 ADDITIONAL points via other methods, including post, catch-and-go, and primary ballhandler.

MJ had the same elite catch-and-go ability as these guys, but simply did many other things as well.

Tell me how I'm wrong here.. Also, given MJ's vastly higher volume, his total points scored via catch-and-shoot is probably the same or even higher than than any of the aforementioned players.

Btw, people always say Jordan couldn't shoot as good as these guys but he's a better shooter on ALL types of 2-point shots and 2-pointers still represent the majority of these players' shot attempts.. Here's Ron Artest saying MJ was the toughest to guard and that he was "like Reggie Miller from the mid-range":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5dXZxj6Zbc&t=0m57s
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Eh, maybe mid range/interior but nowhere near the same from the 3.

[RRR3]

http://www.peacefulhippo.info/flying_hippo.jpg

[Hamtaro CP3KDKG]

One of the best offball guards ever. He didnt have to dominate the ball 24/7 like other players with garbage offball games

BTW 3ball what version of MJ do u take 1990, 91 or 92?

[swagga]

The same as Reggie Miller, Ray Allen, or Rip Hamilton.. These guys ALSO got 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot, while the rest of their points were FT's and maybe a couple catch-and-go buckets or transition.

The only difference was that Jordan got about 15-20 ADDITIONAL points via other methods, including post, catch-and-go, and primary ballhandler.

MJ had the same elite catch-and-go ability as these guys, but simply did many other things as well.

Tell me how I'm wrong here.. Also, given MJ's vastly higher volume, his total points scored via catch-and-shoot is probably the same or even higher than than any of the aforementioned players.

Btw, people always say Jordan couldn't shoot as good as these guys but he's a better shooter on ALL types of 2-point shots and 2-pointers still represent the majority of these players' shot attempts.. Here's Ron Artest saying MJ was the toughest to guard and that he was "like Reggie Miller from the mid-range":

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b5dXZxj6Zbc&t=0m57s
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1. i see you weren't old enough to watch ray allen play combo guard. Ray allen is very different from reggie and rip.
2. MJ didn't get that much on catch-and-shoots

[SaltyMeatballs]

MJ was a great scorer with or without the ball

[Dr Seuss]

yo... so which one is it?? 10,11,12,13,14,15???

cause thats like me saying "ish has 200-500 retards posting on here"

[dubeta]

Nice, but Jordan's ball dominance hindered his team, stopping them from playing to their maximum capacity.

This is evident from 93-94, where Jordan was replaced by a D-League player (yourafag.com) and the Bulls did not missing a beat, Pippen was allowed to play his role as a primary-ball handler (opisafag.com), which allowed him to excel.

[3ball]

Ray allen is very different from reggie and rip.

MJ didn't get that much on catch-and-shoots


talking out of your ass again when you don't really know, just like with the drop-step.

MJ scored 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot... watch ANY game...

you are forgetting that MJ averaged 34 PPG for his career.. so incorporating a rip hamilton volume of catch-and-shoot was nothing for him.

[3ball]

MJ used catch-and-shoot every game, but he could also RELY on it for big games when he needed:

In Game 1 of the 1988 first round against Cleveland's 5th-ranked defense, MJ scored 50 points.. No one had ever scored 50 in back-to-back playoff games before (or since), so Cleveland made adjustments to stop MJ in Game 2.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U06ly1eN4tI

MJ simply counter-adjusted and dropped 55 in Game 2 by relying almost exclusively on catch-and-shoot jumpers.. No one else would've been able to replicate the 50 point performance of Game 1.. But Jordan did by resorting to his GOAT-level catch-and-shoot game... :confusedshrug:
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[VengefulAngel]

Flying hippo's.

http://gp1.wac.edgecastcdn.net/802892/production_public/Artist/377545/image/small/flying-hipo-color-lwr_1256406994_1256407053.jpg

http://fc08.deviantart.net/fs70/f/2011/099/3/6/flying_hippo_by_renabl-d3dkxwq.jpg

[3ball]

http://gp1.wac.edgecastcdn.net/802892/production_public/Artist/377545/image/small/flying-hipo-color-lwr_1256406994_1256407053.jpg
are you implying that MJ didn't score 10-15 PPG on catch-and-shoot?

you're just going by the erroneous, pre-conceived notion that most people have of him as a guy who went 1-on-5 every possession off-the-dribble - you should watch some tape before posting.

you are forgetting that MJ averaged 34 PPG for his career.. so incorporating a rip hamilton volume of catch-and-shoot was nothing for him.
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[Im so nba'd out]

Being bird fed points is nothing to brag about :facepalm

[3ball]

Being bird fed points is nothing to brag about :facepalm


yeah it is - it's a testament to how elite he was in every area and how smart he was to seek out and master even the most rudimentary of scoring methods.

MJ's catch-and-shoot ability diversified his game and helped make him unstoppable.

otoh, ball-dominators such as Harden, Lebron, or Westbrook should not expect to reach the highest level by just dominating the ball all the time - good teams in the playoffs invariably shut down ball-dominators if they can't resort to some sort of off-ball game to diversify their game (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11188520&postcount=37) with.
.

[Hey Yo]

He scored a lot less when he was catching dice and shootin' craps

[Im so nba'd out]

yeah it is - it's a testament to how elite he was in every area and how smart he was to seek out and master even the most rudimentary of scoring methods.

MJ's catch-and-shoot ability diversified his game and helped make him unstoppable.

otoh, ball-dominators such as Harden, Lebron, or Westbrook should not expect to reach the highest level by just dominating the ball all the time - good teams in the playoffs invariably shut down ball-dominators if they can't resort to some sort of off-ball game to diversify their game (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11188520&postcount=37) with.
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Its like passing to a teammate so they can shoot free throws to seal the game.Yeah its the right thing to do but i would never brag about it.

Example: "hey i have more faith in that guy than myself in the clutch."

Maybe it just me though i would never brag about being bird fed points.

[Blue&Orange]

Being bird fed points is nothing to brag about :facepalm
He was running through screens catching the ball while in motion and shooting off balance. Yes spoon fed, if LEbron had to to that his % would drop hilariously, but hey today defenses are super advanced so he can't, he has to hold on to the ball until he feels comfortable enough to take a shot, or pass the ball to Wade\Kyrie with 3 seconds left, or resort to that fast break layup, poor guy.

[Im so nba'd out]

He was running through screens catching the ball while in motion and shooting off balance. Yes spoon fed, if LEbron had to to that his % would drop hilariously, but hey today defenses are super advanced so he can't, he has to hold on to the ball until he feels comfortable enough to take a shot, or pass the ball to Wade\Kyrie with 3 seconds left, or resort to that fast break layup, poor guy.
im not a lebron stan i hate the way he plays...i admit he's great tho

[pauk]

What is your point?

1. That he can catch-n-shoot? (I doubt this is your point though, everybody knows he can/could catch-n-shoot, what perimeter player COULDNT catch-n-shoot?)

2. That he is just as good/accurate of a shooter / catch-n-shoot'er as Reggie, Ray & Rip?

3. That Reggie, Ray & Rip were similar players to Jordan really, they could also be averaging the same points as Jordan if they also did more of catch-n-go, posting up & ballhandling?

4. That Jordan could also average around 15 PPG on catch-n-shoot with only 13 FGA?

5. That Reggie, Ray & Rip could average 30 PPG on catch-n-shoot if they averaged the same amount of FGA as Jordan? (up to 28 FGA in a season)

[24-Inch_Chrome]

What exactly are you arguing? This is my first time in one of your threads and I'm wondering what's the debate.

There isn't a debate. 3ball just gets insecure whenever a modern player is being hyped up and starts making Jordan threads to try to tear down the hype despite none of the modern players in question ever being compared to Jordan.

[3ball]

2. That he is just as good/accurate of a shooter / catch-n-shoot'er as Reggie, Ray & Rip?


that's correct - MJ was a superior shooter on all 2-point shots - this is material, since 2-pointers are still the majority of shots taken.





4. That Jordan could also average around 15 PPG on catch-n-shoot with only 13 FGA?


obviously, MJ could do that easily, although it would be hard for him to restrict his scoring and stop shooting after 13 FGA.





5. That Reggie, Ray & Rip could average 30 PPG on catch-n-shoot if they averaged the same amount of FGA as Jordan?


Nah.. Those guys have the necessary skills to get their 18 PPG on mostly catch-and-shoot - but to get 30 PPG, they need all those other skills (http://www.insidehoops.com/forum/showpost.php?p=11188520&postcount=37).
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