Does Popovich surpass Phil with another title?

[Ca$H]

What Pop is doing is amazing. He is winning with an old Duncan, old Ginobilli, prime Parker, and young role players. I really don't think Phil would win with this squad. I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.

[SilkkTheShocker]

One has 11 titles as a head coach. The other has 4.

I have a feeling Pop winning another title won't leap frog him over Jackson.

[JonatanRey]

He is already over Phil.

[Suguru101]

:roll:

[Dr Seuss]

You dont think phil could win with this current spurs team running the triangle? One thing this team has, thats phils last few teams lacked is, a very deep and consistent bench. Phils greatest bench during his last two years were the "killer bees" blake, barnes, and brown. yuck

[atljonesbro]

He's already above Jackson. Pop is infinitely more skilled as a coach than Jackson

[Sarcastic]

He would need to win 6 more after this one just to tie Phil.

Pop never repeated as champion. Phil has three-peated three times, and had another back to back, coming close to 3 peating for a 4th time.

[Akrazotile]

He is already over Phil.

This.


Anyone who wants to go the "rings" route.... first tell me about how Horry > MJ

[Jlamb47]

Pop is a better Coach then Phil. His adjustements are better and skills are better. Phil had Mj/Kobe two top 5 players of all time

[gts]

This.


Anyone who wants to go the "rings" route.... first tell me about how Horry > MJ

They get paid to produce rings, not winning seasons that end up falling short

But skip the rings route and Phil still has a better resume with a higher win percentage in the playoffs

Go with the big picture and include the whole reason they get paid the big money, Phil nearly triple the rings, 3 separate runs of three peats and a back to back finals win.. success with 2 different teams across multiple eras with three very different squads

Phil has clearly got the most out of his teams where Pops has clearly failed to capitalize on a previous seasons success time after time

[Sarcastic]

Pop is a better Coach then Phil. His adjustements are better and skills are better. Phil had Mj/Kobe two top 5 players of all time


Pop has had Duncan the entire time.


How many rings did MJ and Kobe win without Phil?

[Jailblazers7]

Pop has had Duncan the entire time.


How many rings did MJ and Kobe win without Phil?

How many championship caliber teams did they play on w/o Phil?

[Sarcastic]

How many championship caliber teams did they play on w/o Phil?


What was the big difference that Phil had that Del Harris didn't have? He had Shaq and Kobe, no?

[oarabbus]

Pop is a better coach than PJax. By quite a bit.

[Jailblazers7]

What was the big difference that Phil had that Del Harris didn't have? He had Shaq and Kobe, no?

Yeah mean the fact that Kobe had barely turned 20 by the time Del Harris was fired? Hardly Dell's fault that Kobe didn't walk into the league averaging 28 ppg as an 18 year old. LAL still won 56 & 61 games under Del with a young Kobe who wasn't even starting yet.

Not saying Phil isn't a great coach but give me a break with the "MJ and Kobe never won without him" stuff as evidence that he is the better coach.

[SexSymbol]

Popovich is far away from Pjax as a coach.
Pop costed Spurs the championship last year.

[D-FENS]

He's already above Jackson. Pop is infinitely more skilled as a coach than Jackson

11 > 4 and I'm a Celtics guy

[Crafty]

Popovich's better.
Phil had prime Jordan, Pippen, Kobe, Shaq.

[Akrazotile]

They get paid to produce rings, not winning seasons that end up falling short

But skip the rings route and Phil still has a better resume with a higher win percentage in the playoffs

Go with the big picture and include the whole reason they get paid the big money, Phil nearly triple the rings, 3 separate runs of three peats and a back to back finals win.. success with 2 different teams across multiple eras with three very different squads

Phil has clearly got the most out of his teams where Pops has clearly failed to capitalize on a previous seasons success time after time


You literally cannot ascertain the value of an individual in a team sport by measuring any team-related criteria.

The reason it's done by the media and most fans is because it's an "LCD" conversation point. Lowest common denominator simplification that the greatest number of people will be able to grasp and repeat in their own discussions. But it's woefully inadequate if you actually care about things like accuracy and objectivity.

The best way to measure a person's performance is to simply watch and analyze. There is a reason both Pop and Phil have multiple rings and yet have also been booted in the first round. Circumstances yield enormous impact on an individual's success, particularly in team games. Comparing "numbers" without any context is meaningless, but again, most people simply aren't able to articulate the differences in qualities and the differences in circumstances, and NEED to rely on "11 > 4" in order to be able to participate in the discussion and appear as if they have something worthwhile to say. It's a crutch.

[Harison]

From coaching perspective, Pop always was better than Phil, who only won with the best team in NBA (and still failed plenty of times). Pops takes average to solid teams, and almost always exceeds expectations, Phil have never done it.

That said, Phil was also brilliant coach, and knew how to deal with superstars egos. Still he never was as great coach as Pop, Larry Brown, or Red, etc. Also I'm not a big fan of Phil's cherry picking teams a la Horry ring chasing.

[GimmeThat]

it's like asking whether you think bombing or gain of land is more effective in winning the war.

[sportjames23]

One has 11 titles as a head coach. The other has 4.

I have a feeling Pop winning another title won't leap frog him over Jackson.


Can't believe I'm gonna say this, but I agree with Silkk.

[diamenz]

agreed - pop > jack.

[DCL]

Erik Spoelstra has 2 nba rings... and who cares?

[hawksdogsbraves]

Pop is twice the coach Jackson ever was. Jackson's abject failure as a GM should be a real eye opener to some of you.

[Odinn]

From coaching perspective, Pop always was better than Phil, who only won with the best team in NBA (and still failed plenty of times). Pops takes average to solid teams, and almost always exceeds expectations, Phil have never done it.
Yeah. Sure. Right.

1989-90 / contender / lost in ECF
1990-91 / contender / won it all
1991-92 / contender / won it all
1992-93 / contender / won it all
1993-94 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1994-95 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1995-96 / contender / won it all
1996-97 / contender / won it all
1997-98 / contender / won it all
1999-00 / contender / won it all
2000-01 / contender / won it all
2001-02 / contender / won it all
2002-03 / contender / lost in 2nd round
2003-04 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2005-06 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2006-07 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2007-08 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2008-09 / contender / won it all
2009-10 / contender / won it all
2010-11 / contender / lost in 2nd round

He had a contending team for 16 seasons and won it all 11 times. 11 out 16 must suck. 5 is 'plenty' I guess.

I wonder how these Pop-lovers (those have been uprising after 2010-11) would explaing 2008-09 and onwards?
Even while getting tons of appreciation, Pop is still can be criticized.
2010-11; Despite winning 60+ games, lost in 1st round.
2011-12; 20W streak, then he couldn't make proper adjustments against Scott Brooks adjustments and lost 4 in a row. Scott Brooks FFS!
2012-13; No further explanation needed.

Be honest, tell me when Riley or P-Jax lost a series against a Brooks-level coach while they had a contending team. Or lost a ring because of just a, one single idiotic play.

I love Pop. But this overreaction has gotten way too far. Enough of it.

[gts]

You literally cannot ascertain the value of an individual in a team sport by measuring any team-related criteria.

.Now i've heard everything...:roll:


He's the effing coach of the team, hired to make them play as a team... they're hired and fired by one thing and one thing alone, TEAM SUCCESS..

Team success is the only way to judge a coach

[Jlamb47]

Yeah. Sure. Right.

1989-90 / contender / lost in ECF
1990-91 / contender / won it all
1991-92 / contender / won it all
1992-93 / contender / won it all
1993-94 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1994-95 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1995-96 / contender / won it all
1996-97 / contender / won it all
1997-98 / contender / won it all
1999-00 / contender / won it all
2000-01 / contender / won it all
2001-02 / contender / won it all
2002-03 / contender / lost in 2nd round
2003-04 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2005-06 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2006-07 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2007-08 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2008-09 / contender / won it all
2009-10 / contender / won it all
2010-11 / contender / lost in 2nd round

He had a contending team for 16 seasons and won it all 11 times. 11 out 16 must suck. 5 is 'plenty' I guess.

I wonder how these Pop-lovers (those have been uprising after 2010-11) would explaing 2008-09 and onwards?
Even while getting tons of appreciation, Pop is still can be criticized.
2010-11; Despite winning 60+ games, lost in 1st round.
2011-12; 20W streak, then he couldn't make proper adjustments against Scott Brooks adjustments and lost 4 in a row. Scott Brooks FFS!
2012-13; No further explanation needed.

Be honest, tell me when Riley or P-Jax lost a series against a Brooks-level coach while they had a contending team. Or lost a ring because of just a, one single idiotic play.

I love Pop. But this overreaction has gotten way too far. Enough of it.


someone get him some pepper with that salt
#weaksauce

[ILLsmak]

What Pop is doing is amazing. He is winning with an old Duncan, old Ginobilli, prime Parker, and young role players. I really don't think Phil would win with this squad. I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.


I dunno, man... this is how I see it, tho.

It's really hard to tell who is the reason that the Spurs are winning. Is it TD/Manu/TP? Or is it Pop? Phil has won with different cores. Riley has won with different cores.

I wanna see what Pop does when they have to refresh their talent. Not that he has to get right back into the 50win every year club, but eventually he should be able to get some more championships. If he doesn't, I think we gotta just say he was a great coach, but he's not Phil or Riley.

-Smak

[Lakers Legend#32]

Pop can't win back-to- back titles. Phil has done it multiple times.

Pop would have to get on his mother's shoulders to kiss Phil's azz.

[smoovegittar]

Pop is one of the best coaches ever. But I would be interested to see his affect on another team (which will never happen). His work ethic and relationships with the players are very similar to PJ's. But at this juncture I would have to give a SLIGHT edge to PJ.

Should PJ bring a championship home to NYC, then there's no discussion.

[SwayDizzle]

oh hell no. Jax is a tier higher. You all just got to watch lazy and overworked PJax towards the end of his career. What he has done consistently throughout his career is nothing short of incredible. untouchable stuff

[Spurs5Rings2014]

Pop is one of the best coaches ever. But I would be interested to see his affect on another team (which will never happen). His work ethic and relationships with the players are very similar to PJ's. But at this juncture I would have to give a SLIGHT edge to PJ.

Should PJ bring a championship home to NYC, then there's no discussion.

Phil isn't coach of NYC.

:confusedshrug:

Phil had 3 top 10 players of all time, Pop had 1. 11 rings vs. 4. 4x3 = 12, so Pop is better.

[Dr Seuss]

Phil had 3 top 10 players of all time, Pop had 1. 11 rings vs. 4. 4x3 = 12, so Pop is better.

what the fck are you babbling about?

[rezznor]

Pops is the GOAT coach. imagine him with Phil's stacked teams.

[Robalvarez2010]

What Pop is doing is amazing. He is winning with an old Duncan, old Ginobilli, prime Parker, and young role players. I really don't think Phil would win with this squad. I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.

Honest answer, HELLLLL NOOOO. Phil has 11 rings. If phil would be the coach of the current spurs he would win a couple of more rings. Matter of fact, if phil would have been the coach of the spurs last season, it would have been an automatic win. He would have not made the same mistake on taking out duncan not once but twice too cost them that game.
Dont get me wrong I'm not taking any credit away from pop. He's still one of my all time favorite coaches.

[Robalvarez2010]

:roll:
oh hell no. Jax is a tier higher. You all just got to watch lazy and overworked PJax towards the end of his career. What he has done consistently throughout his career is nothing short of incredible. untouchable stuff

Couldn't agree more. Not too many people on here saw him when he was coaching the bulls. The majority of the people on here got a glimpse of him while he was coaching the Lakers.

[smoovegittar]

What Pop is doing is amazing. He is winning with an old Duncan, old Ginobilli, prime Parker, and young role players. I really don't think Phil would win with this squad. I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.



I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.[/QUOTE]

Generalized statement. Of course I know Phil isn't coaching.

I also don't understand your "math". Phil went to another team, and won there as well. This alone leads me to believe he's a better coach.



If OKC comes back to win the series, do you retract your statement? (probably not).

[Uncle Drew]

IMO, Pop's already the greatest coach in the history of basketball.

[Draz]

This.


Anyone who wants to go the "rings" route.... first tell me about how Horry > MJ
This. POP daddy

[r0drig0lac]

From coaching perspective, Pop always was better than Phil, who only won with the best team in NBA (and still failed plenty of times). Pops takes average to solid teams, and almost always exceeds expectations, Phil have never done it.

That said, Phil was also brilliant coach, and knew how to deal with superstars egos. Still he never was as great coach as Pop, Larry Brown, or Red, etc. Also I'm not a big fan of Phil's cherry picking teams a la Horry ring chasing.
basically it, pop is a better coach than pj

[smoovegittar]

Pop - 1 team 4 championships. w/l record below .500 six times.

PJ - 2 teams 11 championships w/l record below .500 three times.


Say what you want. I love both coaches. Pop has more work to do if he wants to overtake Phil.

[Akrazotile]

Now i've heard everything...:roll:


He's the effing coach of the team, hired to make them play as a team... they're hired and fired by one thing and one thing alone, TEAM SUCCESS..

Team success is the only way to judge a coach


:facepalm


Then Spoelstra is a better coach than Larry Brown, Carlisle, and Adelman in your book?

Hello, according to your logic he is the equivalent of those three coaches COMBINED.

:facepalm

[COnDEMnED]

What Pop is doing is amazing. He is winning with an old Duncan, old Ginobilli, prime Parker, and young role players. I really don't think Phil would win with this squad. I think Pop surpasses Phil if he wins the championship this year.
Wtf...no

[stalkerforlife]

:biggums:

[D.J.]

Phil Jackson has 3-peated on three occasions and also repeated one other time. He has 11 titles all together and has been to the Finals 13 times. Popovich, even with a title this year, only has 5. He also has never repeated. Pretty clear that Phil > Pops.

[sportjames23]

Yeah. Sure. Right.

1989-90 / contender / lost in ECF
1990-91 / contender / won it all
1991-92 / contender / won it all
1992-93 / contender / won it all
1993-94 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1994-95 / not a contender / lost in 2nd round
1995-96 / contender / won it all
1996-97 / contender / won it all
1997-98 / contender / won it all
1999-00 / contender / won it all
2000-01 / contender / won it all
2001-02 / contender / won it all
2002-03 / contender / lost in 2nd round
2003-04 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2005-06 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2006-07 / not a contender / lost in 1st round
2007-08 / contender / lost in NBA Finals
2008-09 / contender / won it all
2009-10 / contender / won it all
2010-11 / contender / lost in 2nd round

He had a contending team for 16 seasons and won it all 11 times. 11 out 16 must suck. 5 is 'plenty' I guess.

I wonder how these Pop-lovers (those have been uprising after 2010-11) would explaing 2008-09 and onwards?
Even while getting tons of appreciation, Pop is still can be criticized.
2010-11; Despite winning 60+ games, lost in 1st round.
2011-12; 20W streak, then he couldn't make proper adjustments against Scott Brooks adjustments and lost 4 in a row. Scott Brooks FFS!
2012-13; No further explanation needed.

Be honest, tell me when Riley or P-Jax lost a series against a Brooks-level coach while they had a contending team. Or lost a ring because of just a, one single idiotic play.

I love Pop. But this overreaction has gotten way too far. Enough of it.

/thread

[stalkerforlife]

Imagine Pop going on one of those angry rants at MJ, Kobe, or Shaq...lololol.

[played0ut]

comparing accolades and overall? Phil, easily.


I think style wise, i prefer pop. Phil uses mind games and is a little manipulative (to great effect and benefit of most, i feel).

But pop seems straightforward and doesn't hesistate to bitch and yell and say directly what he wants from his players.