Start a franchise. Westbrook or Irving?

[tikay0]

Gimme Westbrook all day and every day.

People like to look at Kyrie's numbers, but don't measure the impact that Westbrook has on the game. He turns entire defenses into pudding. Just like Rose.

[Nastradamus]

Gotta take Westbrook just for health. Irving may be dinged up for his whole career it seems.

[Fresh Kid]

Irving.

[SilkkTheShocker]

I would rather have Irving. Westbrick is too stupid to ever be a key piece on a title team.

[Shade8780]

The artist formerly known as Chuckbrook.

[NASH = BEST]

Irving.

I like the dude's game, I'd rather have Westbrook as an SG than a PG.

[Marchesk]

http://cdn.solecollector.com/media/u/images/jrue-holiday-adidas-adipure-sun.jpg

[LosScandalous]

Irving, future top 5 player, most clutch player in the league, best handles and he's still fresh out of high school. His peak is going to be scary.

[tpols]

I would rather have Irving. Westbrick is too stupid to ever be a key piece on a title team.
He was a key piece on a team that was 2 games away from being a title team.:oldlol:

Dropping 40 pt games in the Finals while his teammates were being outplayed(Durant) or dissapearing(Harden)..

[Trollsmasher]

Westbrook, his health is the dealbreaker

[SilkkTheShocker]

He was a key piece on a team that was 2 games away from being a title team.:oldlol:

Dropping 40 pt games in the Finals while his teammates were being outplayed(Durant) or dissapearing(Harden)..

They weren't two games away from being a title team.

[tpols]

They weren't two games away from being a title team.
game 5--> game 7

Want to argue semantics lol.. 3 wins from being world champs. And hes too stupid to be a key piece? He was their best player in the Finals, the only one to dominate his matchup and make a splash.

Go sit in the corner.

[Mr Exlax]

I'd go with Westbrook. He just brings so much to the table. He's not as good of a traditional PG as Irving, but he's a better basketball player.

[Le Shaqtus]

The only thing Westbrook has over Irving is defense and speed. Otherwise I'm taking Kyrie.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Westbrook. WB can score just as good as Irving if he was on the Cavs. Also WB brings everything on the court above average defense, great playmaking, never takes a play off, runs on the fast break. The only knock I have on WB is critical crunch time plays (under 16 seconds or less)

After all we have never seen WB as a first option. Who knows maybe he is a 30ppg scorer as main banana.

[r15mohd]

Although a bit of a chucker, I'll take Westbrook...he's proven

[tikay0]

The only thing Westbrook has over Irving is defense and speed. Otherwise I'm taking Kyrie.

The only thing Mayweather has over every other fighter is defense and speed. :oldlol:

[tpols]

The only thing Westbrook has over Irving is defense and speed. Otherwise I'm taking Kyrie.
And..

Heart/Competitiveness(very underrated, partially offset by the stupidity it can bring out in WB)
Durability
Slashing Ability


If you look at both of them Kyrie is more talented offensively but not as durable and barely more productive. WB is miles and miles ahead on defense and is more well rounded and established.

[FreezingTsmoove]

Also Westbrook just straight up scares other guards when he plays them. He almost destroyed Lins career in 1 playoff game.

[IGOTGAME]

I don't think it is close. Curry is a borderline all star imo. He will make it some years and miss it others. But a guy like Westbrook is a borderline top 5 player in the world.

[tikay0]

Also Westbrook just straight up scares other guards when he plays them. He almost destroyed Lins career in 1 playoff game.

Pretty much this. He turns entire defenses into mush. He has the luxury of being able to be at the rim in less than 5 seconds.

Kyrie pounds the ball a lot of the time. Westbrook initiates offense within seconds, and doesn't give you time to think.

[SpurrDurr]

The one who'd ask for less money

[SilkkTheShocker]

game 5--> game 7

Want to argue semantics lol.. 3 wins from being world champs. And hes too stupid to be a key piece? He was their best player in the Finals, the only one to dominate his matchup and make a splash.

Go sit in the corner.

I suggest you learn how to actually count before you start talking tough, son. Last time you told someone to go sit down you ended up looking like a damn fool. Remember when you said the same about LeBron during game 6? :oldlol:

[SilkkTheShocker]

Pretty much this. He turns entire defenses into mush. He has the luxury of being able to be at the rim in less than 5 seconds.

Kyrie pounds the ball a lot of the time. Westbrook initiates offense within seconds, and doesn't give you time to think.

Thats not true at all. He played off the ball a ton last season.

[Johnny Jones]

http://cdn.solecollector.com/media/u/images/jrue-holiday-adidas-adipure-sun.jpg
:applause:

[tikay0]

Thats not true at all. He played off the ball a ton last season.

Only times I've ever watched him play, he's usually dribbling out the shot clock with his fancy moves.

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

Kyrie. Even if he hasn't been consistently healthy, his bball IQ is a helluva lot higher than Westbrook's. And he actually passes once in a while.

[Shade8780]

I don't think it is close. Curry is a borderline all star imo. He will make it some years and miss it others. But a guy like Westbrook is a borderline top 5 player in the world.
Curry?

[SilkkTheShocker]

I don't think some of you actually watch Irving. His slashing ability is extremely underrated.

[KG215]

Kyrie. Even if he hasn't been consistently healthy, his bball IQ is a helluva lot higher than Westbrook's. And he actually passes once in a while.

2012-2013 Season:

Kyrie Irving: 5.9 APG, 32.7% AST%
Westbrook: 7.4 APG, 38.4% AST%

[SilkkTheShocker]

One guy gets to play with the 2nd best player in the NBA. The other guy played with Alonzo Gee. I don't see OKC getting worse with Irving instead of Westbrook.

[KG215]

One guy gets to play with the 2nd best player in the NBA. The other guy played with Alonzo Gee. I don't see OKC getting worse with Irving instead of Westbrook.
And I don't see the Cavs getting worse with Westbrook instead of Irving.

[SilkkTheShocker]

And I don't see the Cavs getting worse with Westbrook instead of Irving.

Im not saying either team is better/worse without the other. But this is really the first season we get to see Irving play with actual NBA talent. If Cavs sputter and he can't get them at least into the playoffs, than I will be giving the nod to Westbrook.

[The JKidd Kid]

Westbrook 11 times out of 10.

[Rose'sACL]

Westbrook is clearly the better choice here.

[kenny817]

Irving, future top 5 player, most clutch player in the league, best handles and he's still fresh out of high school. His peak is going to be scary.

Dirk says F you

[nathanjizzle]

you cant go wrong with either. i would choose kyrie though mainly because of aesthetics. he also reminds me of a young d rose.

[SilkkTheShocker]

you cant go wrong with either. i would choose kyrie though mainly because of aesthetics. he also reminds me of a young d rose.


This is such a stupid reason to rate players.

[Chuckbrook]

The artist formerly known as Chuckbrook.
Couldn't have said it better myself. :cheers:

[nathanjizzle]

This is such a stupid reason to rate players.

yea maybe. but finesse and style will tell how good a player is, and if that player has the it factor.

[RedBlackAttack]

It would probably have to do with what kind of a team you are building... Starting with a group of young guys and allowing it a few years to grow or a "win now" model. In a win now scenario, I imagine Westbrook would be the most logical choice. If it's more of a youth movement, Irving makes more sense. Kyrie is several years younger than Westbrook, after all.

I'm biased, but I can tell you there isn't another young player 23-24 and under that I'd rather have right now than Irving for where the Cavs are in their development. He's not a finished product yet, but his ceiling is way up there.

[Twiens]

Westbrook quite easily, he's the best PG in the league

[Johnny Jones]

Westbrook quite easily, he's the best PG in the league
:facepalm

[tikay0]

:facepalm

:applause:

[KyleKong]

The artist formerly known as Chuckbrook.


Aaaaannndddd Shade is now my favorite poster.

But I'd take Irving. And make sure 99.9% of his off season training was learning about on-ball and help defense.

[Graviton]

Seems like everyone is just ignoring durability and their effectiveness so far. It's like people picking Bynum over Howard. :oldlol:

And Westbrook is right up there with Paul and Rose as a top point guard, those 3 are in a tier of their own that have scoring, defense and versatile skillsets. They are a step above Parker/Deron/Curry/Rondo/Irving and other elite PGs.

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

2012-2013 Season:

Kyrie Irving: 5.9 APG, 32.7% AST%
Westbrook: 7.4 APG, 38.4% AST%
stats (and analytics) never lie. But they also don't tell the whole truth or story. Any starting PG can get 7APG playing w/ KD. And what was OKC's and Cleveland's team FG%? What % of Westbrick's assts were before the 2min mark of the 4th quarter in 5-pt games? Who was the #1 option on their respective team? etc etc.

Though :oldlol: @ not debating the IQ part! :cheers:

[RedBlackAttack]

Seems like everyone is just ignoring durability and their effectiveness so far. It's like people picking Bynum over Howard. :oldlol:

And Westbrook is right up there with Paul and Rose as a top point guard, those 3 are in a tier of their own that have scoring, defense and versatile skillsets. They are a step above Parker/Deron/Curry/Rondo/Irving and other elite PGs.
It is nothing like Howard/Bynum. Andrew Bynum's injuries have been very significant and possibly degenerative. He has major knee issues in both legs.

Kyrie has never had an injury to his legs or really anything that can be considered severe. His "biggest" injury has probably been his toe at Duke, which hasn't given him any issues in 2 years in the NBA. In fact, of the two guys, Westbrook has far and away the most serious injury.

Kyrie does need to prove better durability, but there is a huge difference between getting dinged up with minor injuries and having degenerative knee issues.

[Graviton]

stats (and analytics) never lie. But they also don't tell the whole truth or story. Any starting PG can get 7APG playing w/ KD. And what was OKC's and Cleveland's team FG%? What % of Westbrick's assts were before the 2min mark of the 4th quarter in 5-pt games? Who was the #1 option on their respective team? etc etc.

Though :oldlol: @ not debating the IQ part! :cheers:
Westbrook averaged 8APG playing with 2nd/3rd year Durant that wasn't the superstar he is today. He is actually one of the best passers at his position and has amazing bounce/bullet passes. You can question his IQ but his actual passing skill is right up there with "pure point guards". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEmuMesfz_w

What you don't realize is it's not his choice to not make passing his primary priority, Brooks himself has asked him to score more and be more aggressive. It's the reason why his assists dropped from that previous 8 to increase his scoring and actually improve OKC's record as well. OKC is at their best when Westbrook is attacking and breaking down defenses, not pounding the ball, wasting shot clock just to let the defense get set and stop their offense. Durant doesn't need people to pass him the ball, he can set himself up. And the others like Ibaka/Perkins/Thabo are completely useless offensively. You saw what happened when "chucker" Westbrook went down in the playoffs, OKC's offense looked like total garbage that couldn't execute anything properly. Their gameplan every game was give Durant the ball and let him be the PG, turn it over 6 times a game, get triple teamed while Perkins/Ibaka stand around doing nothing. :oldlol:

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

What you don't realize is it's not his choice to not make passing his primary priority, Brooks himself has asked him to score more and be more aggressive.
actually I do realize that. I remember hearing that from Brooks himself like 2 playoffs ago. Westbrook still makes plenty of mistakes that are irrelevant to him being told to be more aggressive.

You OKC fans don't need to defend Westbrick to me. I like the guy's talent and killer instinct mentality, etc. I know OKC needs him, based on how they are built. But I wouldn't build my team like OKC. :cheers:

[Graviton]

actually I do realize that. I remember hearing that from Brooks himself like 2 playoffs ago. Westbrook still makes plenty of mistakes that are irrelevant to him being told to be more aggressive.

You OKC fans don't need to defend Westbrick to me. I like the guy's talent and killer instinct mentality, etc. I know OKC needs him, based on how they are built. But I wouldn't build my team like OKC. :cheers:
Well I consider Westbrook a more emotional, slightly reckless version of Rose. He has some wtf moments every few games when he rushes things. :oldlol:

It's what keeps him from being the best PG in the NBA, Rose combines similar physical talent with skill and better decision making. If Rose can get back to his MVP form, we will have some amazing duels between Paul, Rose, Westbrook, Irving and Curry. Lot of flashy and jaw dropping shit will go down.

[red1]

I know that I am biased towards westbrook but given what we know so far, health has to play a major role in who you take to start a team. Kyrie is too young for us to predict how he holds up for his career meanwhile westbrook has already dropped 40+ in the finals against the best perimeter defense in the league

[Crafty]

Westbrook. Not close.

[tikay0]

Well I consider Westbrook a more emotional, slightly reckless version of Rose. He has some wtf moments every few games when he rushes things. :oldlol:

It's what keeps him from being the best PG in the NBA, Rose combines similar physical talent with skill and better decision making. If Rose can get back to his MVP form, we will have some amazing duels between Paul, Rose, Westbrook, Irving and Curry. Lot of flashy and jaw dropping shit will go down.

Excellent post.

[cavsfanatic]

We comparing 5 year vet Westbrook to 2nd yr vet Kyrie or we talking about them both in 2nd years? I'd take Westbrook though since it seems we talking about now. Durable, defender his only flaw is bad shot selection. I never had a problem with him shooting more than KD

[KG215]

stats (and analytics) never lie. But they also don't tell the whole truth or story. Any starting PG can get 7APG playing w/ KD. And what was OKC's and Cleveland's team FG%? What % of Westbrick's assts were before the 2min mark of the 4th quarter in 5-pt games? Who was the #1 option on their respective team? etc etc.

Though :oldlol: @ not debating the IQ part! :cheers:
You implied Westbrook never passes, which tells me you either don't watch OKC games, or the last OKC game you watched was pre-2013. Westbrook isn't an elite passer/playmaker (neither is Kyrie), but he's a very good one. There were plenty of games this year where Westbrook was a "table setter" in the 4th quarter and led OKC to a win.

[KG215]

Westbrook averaged 8APG playing with 2nd/3rd year Durant that wasn't the superstar he is today. He is actually one of the best passers at his position and has amazing bounce/bullet passes. You can question his IQ but his actual passing skill is right up there with "pure point guards". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VEmuMesfz_w

What you don't realize is it's not his choice to not make passing his primary priority, Brooks himself has asked him to score more and be more aggressive. It's the reason why his assists dropped from that previous 8 to increase his scoring and actually improve OKC's record as well. OKC is at their best when Westbrook is attacking and breaking down defenses, not pounding the ball, wasting shot clock just to let the defense get set and stop their offense. Durant doesn't need people to pass him the ball, he can set himself up. And the others like Ibaka/Perkins/Thabo are completely useless offensively. You saw what happened when "chucker" Westbrook went down in the playoffs, OKC's offense looked like total garbage that couldn't execute anything properly. Their gameplan every game was give Durant the ball and let him be the PG, turn it over 6 times a game, get triple teamed while Perkins/Ibaka stand around doing nothing. :oldlol:
Dude, I agree with most of what you post, but you really need to tone it down on the Ibaka and Sefolosha hate. You take it to the extreme. They're not nearly as bad and useless offensively (nor defensively) as you make them out to be. Thabo is almost a perfect complimentary piece at SG in a lineup featuring Russ and KD at PG and SF.

[Graviton]

Dude, I agree with most of what you post, but you really need to tone it down on the Ibaka and Sefolosha hate. You take it to the extreme. They're not nearly as bad and useless offensively (nor defensively) as you make them out to be. Thabo is almost a perfect complimentary piece at SG in a lineup featuring Russ and KD at PG and SF.
Well, you can keep making excuses for their garbage play in the playoffs and enjoy your early post season exits because of their lack of balls, skills and heart. But I won't be tolerating their disappearing acts any longer.

All they are is glorified one-dimensional role players that are overrated to levels they never even achieved. Thabo is basically homeless man's Kawhi Leonard/Jimmy Butler and Ibaka is a very very poor crackhead's Noah/Duncan/Hibbert with none of the actual skills, IQ or competitiveness.

[tikay0]

Well, you can keep making excuses for their garbage play in the playoffs and enjoy your early post season exits because of their lack of balls, skills and heart. But I won't be tolerating their disappearing acts any longer.

All they are is glorified one-dimensional role players that are overrated to levels they never even achieved. Thabo is basically homeless man's Kawhi Leonard/Jimmy Butler and Ibaka is a very very poor crackhead's Noah/Duncan/Hibbert with none of the actual skills, IQ or competitiveness.

:roll: :oldlol: :applause:

[Marchesk]

Well, you can keep making excuses for their garbage play in the playoffs and enjoy your early post season exits because of their lack of balls, skills and heart. But I won't be tolerating their disappearing acts any longer.

All they are is glorified one-dimensional role players that are overrated to levels they never even achieved. Thabo is basically homeless man's Kawhi Leonard/Jimmy Butler and Ibaka is a very very poor crackhead's Noah/Duncan/Hibbert with none of the actual skills, IQ or competitiveness.

:biggums: :biggums: :biggums:

[Heavincent]

Well, you can keep making excuses for their garbage play in the playoffs and enjoy your early post season exits because of their lack of balls, skills and heart. But I won't be tolerating their disappearing acts any longer.

All they are is glorified one-dimensional role players that are overrated to levels they never even achieved. Thabo is basically homeless man's Kawhi Leonard/Jimmy Butler and Ibaka is a very very poor crackhead's Noah/Duncan/Hibbert with none of the actual skills, IQ or competitiveness.

Thabo for Joe Johnson straight up. Deal?

[IGOTGAME]

There are still a lot of question marks about Kyrie. I don't think anyone knows what type of pg he is yet. I don't even think Kyrie does.

People talking about Westbrooks passing should watch Kyrie play...guy isn't some floor general either. He just doesn't press the issue as much.

[Graviton]

Thabo for Joe Johnson straight up. Deal?
Ha you want a one dimensional defensive role player for a one dimensional washed up overpayed offensive role player? No one wants garbage JJ or his contract. :oldlol:

[IGOTGAME]

There are still a lot of question marks about Kyrie. I don't think anyone knows what type of pg he is yet. I don't even think Kyrie does.

People talking about Westbrooks passing should watch Kyrie play...guy isn't some floor general either. He just doesn't press the issue as much.

Personally Westbrook is the guys want to be the man in LA after Kobe leaves. I think he has that type of talent and under the right coaching could be amazing.

[tikay0]

There are still a lot of question marks about Kyrie. I don't think anyone knows what type of pg he is yet. I don't even think Kyrie does.

People talking about Westbrooks passing should watch Kyrie play...guy isn't some floor general either. He just doesn't press the issue as much.

Personally Westbrook is the guys want to be the man in LA after Kobe leaves. I think he has that type of talent and under the right coaching could be amazing.

Man, Westbrook on the Lakers would be so sick. Lakers fans would be dick riding dude like no tomorrow.

[Heavincent]

Ha you want a one dimensional defensive role player for a one dimensional washed up overpayed offensive role player? No one wants garbage JJ or his contract. :oldlol:

I know that contract fvcks everything up. I'd honestly much rather have Thabo on the Nets than JJ though.

[red1]

Man, Westbrook on the Lakers would be so sick. Lakers fans would be dick riding dude like no tomorrow.
:no: lakers dont deserve him

[rustycage]

Well I consider Westbrook a more emotional, slightly reckless version of Rose. He has some wtf moments every few games when he rushes things. :oldlol:

I agree, but I think his injury will show as a blessing in disguise: he'll have to work on his head and develope his knowledge of the job, leaving aside his rushing wtfery.

[LosScandalous]

:no: lakers dont deserve him

Ahh yes the most massive fanbase, best city, best franchise, best history doesn't deserve a player like Westbrook.

:lol oooooooooooooooooookaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay

[Dr. Cheesesteak]

You implied Westbrook never passes, which tells me you either don't watch OKC games, or the last OKC game you watched was pre-2013. Westbrook isn't an elite passer/playmaker (neither is Kyrie), but he's a very good one. There were plenty of games this year where Westbrook was a "table setter" in the 4th quarter and led OKC to a win.
Look, I respect your knowledge and rational attitude (especially on these forums), but man, I guess ppl were right about you needing to develop a sense of humor. Can't read much into obvious sarcasm, eh? :confusedshrug:

[dbk123]

westbrook but im a huge fan of irving too. But westbrook is one of my favorite pgs in the league

[red1]

Ahh yes the most massive fanbase, best city, best franchise, best history doesn't deserve a player like Westbrook.

:lol oooooooooooooooooookaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay
precisely

[Fresh Kid]

:no: lakers dont deserve him
The raptors do?

[KG215]

Look, I respect your knowledge and rational attitude (especially on these forums), but man, I guess ppl were right about you needing to develop a sense of humor. Can't read much into obvious sarcasm, eh? :confusedshrug:
Sorry, but the sarcasm wasn't obvious to me. It just gets old seeing the same crap posted about Westbrook that's really not true (as much) anymore, like it was 2-3 years ago.

[red1]

The raptors do?
:kobe: did anyone mention the raptors?

[nathanjizzle]

Dude, I agree with most of what you post, but you really need to tone it down on the Ibaka and Sefolosha hate. You take it to the extreme. They're not nearly as bad and useless offensively (nor defensively) as you make them out to be. Thabo is almost a perfect complimentary piece at SG in a lineup featuring Russ and KD at PG and SF.

sefolosha wasnt a good offensive player in chicago, i think he is weakminded on the offensive end. and in the finals last year, he got his layups and dunks blocked all the time.

[KG215]

sefolosha wasnt a good offensive player in chicago, i think he is weakminded on the offensive end. and in the finals last year, he got his layups and dunks blocked all the time.
Right, but he's turned into a reliable spot-up shooter. Again, a 3-and-D guy is a perfect compliment next to a high scoring/high volume PG and SF.

Some of what Graviton said about him and Ibaka is true, but he's over the top and semi-irrational in his hate for everyone on the team not named Westbrook and Durant. I can't figure out if he's just a Westbrook stan or an OKC fan who's favorite player is Westbrook.

[Fresh Kid]

:kobe: did anyone mention the raptors?
No, but I know deep down you think he deserve to be on your team.

[WWRWestbrookDo?]

I'll take the guy that's shown to be durable (freak injury this year) and is arguable a top 5 NBA player.

next question

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-aPvxS3ty_I4/UNyuNSm-c5I/AAAAAAAAAd0/gCIt23nXirA/s320/russell+westbrook.jpg

[VIntageNOvel]

both will be lakers in the future
kyrie as PG and westbrrok SG

westbrook: mini version of kobe :applause:

[LongLiveTheKing]

Give me Westbrook. Great work ethic better all around player, athletic freak, can do it all.

[imdaman99]

goatbrook :rockon: his intensity, he can bully the opposing teams PGs. the way mike conley jr dominated OKC in this year's playoffs was the complete opposite of what he did in the playoffs 2 yrs back against them. westbrook would not let him do much. you can say he improved, but so has westbrook.

surprised we havent seen brendalegend or that dumb duke fan that poses as a rockets fan to shove how kyrie is a good defender based on statistics down our throats, no homo. those same stats told us that bargnani is a good defender :roll:

i understand its a system, and maybe that is why kyrie doesnt try as hard on defense. but hes a kid. he should have all the energy in the world to set an example, especially if hes gonna be the leader. i suppose he needs some defenders around him. if he doesnt get the cavs to the playoffs this year, you all can get off his wagon.

[RRR3]

^statistics favor Westbrook pretty easily, so that'd be a silly argument for them to make. I'm sure they'd try though.

[PickernRoller]

Not fair to Irving - at least 4 more years and hopefully with better teammates. I like Westbrook - only reason they got past us in 12'.

[Electric Slide]

Rustle Westbrick

[KG215]

Not fair to Irving - at least 4 more years and hopefully with better teammates. I like Westbrook - only reason they got past us in 12'.
Yeah, Durant was just kinda "there" more-or-less. The 27-9-3-2-1 on 52/39/86 shooting and the two game winners didn't really play a big part in winning that series.

[SamuraiSWISH]

Westbrook is too feminine. Over emotional and stupid. He can't be trusted leading a team to me. With that said he's clearly a superior defender compared to Irving. Wash on offense. Irving being the smarter more coachable player with higher ceiling. Irving injury prone and now Westbrook possibly with a career altering injury. I can't decide. I guess Irving because of potential and much better intangibles.

[secund2nun]

I wouldn't wanna start a franchise with a PG but if I had to pick I would choose Irving. Even though he has injury problems he has the potential to surpass Westbrook by a good amount.

[KG215]

Westbrook is too feminine. Over emotional and stupid. He can't be trusted leading a team to me. With that said he's clearly a superior defender compared to Irving. Wash on offense. Irving being the smarter more coachable player with higher ceiling. Irving injury prone and now Westbrook possibly with a career altering injury. I can't decide. I guess Irving because of potential and much better intangibles.
Please, explain.

As for the "much better intangibles"....Westbrook isn't completely void in the intangible department.

[EnoughSaid]

Kyrie would be the best pick for a team trying to contend. I feel like he'd go better with players unlike Westbrook.

[mugiwara]

Westbrooks one of the most dynamic PG's to ever play. He is everywhere, a total idiot but he makes is team go. The only player in the league that can be as effective as he is with his basketball IQ, gimme Goatbrook all day erryday

[SillyRabbit]

Westbrook easily.

He's a more durable, more athletic Derrick Rose, with slightly worse decision making.

As a #1 option on his own team he could be a finalist for league MVP.

[dunksby]

GOATBROOK the best PG in the league of course.

[chips93]

westbrook is better right now, but he is 3 and a half years older than kyrie. so for that reason id take kyrie.

its very close though.

westbrook is a little overrated defensively imo. he can really lock in on guys, but he gets lost off the ball and makes bad decisions. however, he has great athleticism, and size/length, so his ceiling as a defensive player is a lot higher than kyrie's, so hopefully in a couple years he becomes a smarter defensive player, and he could become the best defensive pg in the league.


Personally Westbrook is the guys want to be the man in LA after Kobe leaves. I think he has that type of talent and under the right coaching could be amazing.

he is guaranteed through 2017

[unknowns8]

depends on what type fo franchise I'm starting ...

If I'm starting up in Las Vegas i choose Westbrook coz he can manufacture highlight style plays and amazing feats of athleticism all by himself and can even do it whilst the tema is playing poorly and losing - this will sell a massive amount of tickets and merchandising materials and if I'm in Vegas, that's what it's all about, nothing wrong that

If i'm starting up in mid/large market that craves plays offs and finals success then I go with Irving as he's got the mindset to try and win games rather than be an entertaining athlete who happens to be playing basketball - which is what I'm essentially calling Westbrook out as I suppose :lol

[Haks]

Seems like everyone is just ignoring durability and their effectiveness so far. It's like people picking Bynum over Howard. :oldlol:

And Westbrook is right up there with Paul and Rose as a top point guard, those 3 are in a tier of their own that have scoring, defense and versatile skillsets. They are a step above Parker/Deron/Curry/Rondo/Irving and other elite PGs.
LOL a tier above Rondo??!?? How easily ppl forget

[Haks]

And I choose RW but it deffo isnt an easy pick. I think both are very good offensively with Irving being slightly better. But the main reason is because of kyries injury history and matador defence. Ceiling wise though kyries is higher

[KG215]

depends on what type fo franchise I'm starting ...

If I'm starting up in Las Vegas i choose Westbrook coz he can manufacture highlight style plays and amazing feats of athleticism all by himself and can even do it whilst the tema is playing poorly and losing - this will sell a massive amount of tickets and merchandising materials and if I'm in Vegas, that's what it's all about, nothing wrong that

If i'm starting up in mid/large market that craves plays offs and finals success then I go with Irving as he's got the mindset to try and win games rather than be an entertaining athlete who happens to be playing basketball - which is what I'm essentially calling Westbrook out as I suppose :lol
Ummm....Westbrook has been the second best player (to the second best player in the world) on a team that's been a legit contender the last 3 years and has made the Finals one time.

This is the second post I've seen in this thread along the lines of "if I wanted to win I'd take Kyrie" yet it's Westbrook who's been on a contender and had some monster playoff games the last few years, including a 40 point Finals game.

[IGOTGAME]

I really hope Westbrook gets to play away from Durant in his prime. I think Westbrook helps Durants game more than the other way around.

[tikay0]

I really hope Westbrook gets to play away from Durant in his prime. I think Westbrook helps Durants game more than the other way around.

:biggums:

Did you see the #s Durant was putting up in the Playoffs without Westbrook?

[IGOTGAME]

:biggums:

Did you see the #s Durant was putting up in the Playoffs without Westbrook?

They won 1 game. His playmaking just isn't there. It's not like OKC is a bad team without Westbrook, they would still be in the playoffs.

[tikay0]

They won 1 game. His playmaking just isn't there. It's not like OKC is a bad team without Westbrook, they would still be in the playoffs.

I understand that Westbrook is only 1 player, but without Westbrook the entire dynamic of that team changes. That's like taking away Noah AND Deng for the Bulls.

[KG215]

They won 1 game. His playmaking just isn't there. It's not like OKC is a bad team without Westbrook, they would still be in the playoffs.
Durant was putting up monster numbers. Biggest reason they lost games is because Martin and Ibaka went MIA after Westbrook got hurt. If either one of them is more consistent, there's a better than decent chance OKC at least wins a couple more games against the Grizzlies since the games they were losing were so close. A small part of me, now that it's been a couple of months, is sort of glad that people finally got to see how important Westbrook is to the team.

And not that it really matters, but OKC won 3 games without Russ.