Couple things to think about if Phil returns.

[Clippersfan86]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

[Clutch]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.
http://www.midwestsportsfans.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/mj-laughing.gif

Guy had Melo,Amare and J.R.Smith on the roster and he couldn't make a top15 offense out of it.
He's nothing without Steve Nash. NOTHING
Let me describe his offense: Give Steve Nash the ball and surround him with shooters.Let Steve do whatever he wants and tell the others to jack up threes as fast as they can.

[HEAT111]

Phil vs Graig Sager

The battle continues!:cheers:

[HorryIsMyMVP]

I don't think Phil is the right man for this job either. would prefer Mike D personally.

[SpecialQue]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

Pau wasn't a Laker when he came back. That was two seasons later.

[senelcoolidge]

Jackson can't save this team in the long run unless they make more moves. They still have no bench. Nash and Kobe are old they can't play heavy minutes all season long. The triangle offense will not fit with Nash. Jackson is a stat padder in the coaching world. He only goes to teams that are loaded like you said. That way he doesn't have to really coach. This just isn't a team build for success in the long run.

[All Net]

Fans were calling for Phil's head when he left but when you see Mike Brown it makes you forget...

[SpecialQue]

Jackson can't save this team in the long run unless they make more moves. They still have no bench. Nash and Kobe are old they can't play heavy minutes all season long. The triangle offense will not fit with Nash. Jackson is a stat padder in the coaching world. He only goes to teams that are loaded like you said. That way he doesn't have to really coach. This just isn't a team build for success in the long run.

How loaded was that Lakers team he came back to in 05-06?

[chazzy]

How loaded was that Lakers team he came back to in 05-06?
+1.. he came after the Lakers were in the lottery AND traded Butler away for Kwame

[Optimus Prime]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

Someone's scared. :rolleyes:

Also, everything else the others have already thoroughly proven you completely wrong with.

:kobe: Mamba out

PS - I was never calling for Phil to leave and was sad to see him go. It was only media morons and Internet trolls who were clamoring for him to leave. The Zen Master deserves to go out in style, and what better opportunity than this? :pimp:

[UtahJazzFan88]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

Not really. He was with the Lakers for the 2 years before that trade when it was just Kobe, Lamar Odom, and a bunch of awful scrubs, and exited in the first round both years.

[daily]

PS - I was never calling for Phil to leave and was sad to see him go. It was only media morons and Internet trolls who were clamoring for him to leave. The Zen Master deserves to go out in style, and what better opportunity than this? :pimp:
I never wanted Phil out myself but you could see he was toasted and tired of coaching that last season. If a coach ever phoned in a playoff game that Dallas series was it.

[no pun intended]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.
Coaching a lot of egos in a single team is an amazing feat. I don't see why this should be negatively noted.

[Mr. Jabbar]

Fans were calling for Phil's head when he left but when you see Mike Brown it makes you forget...

LOL so true.

Anyway Phil wasn't coaching his last LA year, he was thinking about retirement.

[BlackVVaves]

Couple of corrections for you CF86.


Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

This is actually not true. When Phil joined the Bulls there were far from loaded, unless you consider a underperforming Scottie Pippen and Kwame Brown and Smush Parker a loaded roster. Pau was 2 years from being a Laker when Phil returned.


2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

By the end of his tenure he had also coached a Kobe/Gasol led Laker team to the Finals three years in a row, after fours removed from coaching a Laker team to the Finals 4 years out of 5. I remember Laker fan whining too, but it had far less to do with Phil being set in his ways and more to do with 1) Phil was injured and wanted to sit out road games because of it 2) Kobe was injured and his knees were literally bone rubbing against bone 3) After 3 straight years of 100+ game seasons, the Laker team finally burnt out, and their lack of depth during their mini-dynasty was exposed, just as it was exposed after the same exact occurrence in 2003. Which lead to 4) The team was exhausted mentally and no longer responding to Phil's coaching methods. Coupled with the fact that it was Phil's last year on his contract and he had already stated he was retiring, the team players and coaches lacked the motivation to break through the walls that presented themselves in 2011.


3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

Let's revisit 2007. Phil and Kobe both emphatically called for Jason Kidd both behind the scenes and through the media. Phil desired a point guard like Jason Kidd, someone with elite vision, to allow the team to dive deeper into the realms of the Triangle offense. The reason why the Triangle "didn't work" with Gary Payton (I always laugh when people say it didn't work, I mean they got to the Finals and before injuries hit had a 19-3 record, no?) is because Payton fought the triangle. And we've all heard and seen how ineffective the Triangle is when all parties don't buy into it. Go check out the 1999-2000 Chicago Bulls for some proof. The point guard especially has to be willing and able.

I'm typing on my iPhone so I can't retrieve the article now, but a few years back (I believe pre-Gasol trade) Brian Shaw articulated how more effective the Triangle would be with a point guard that could shoot and expertly handle the ball. There are different depths of the triangle, some of which Phil never even integrated into the offense due to the personell. Which makes the claim that he wouldn't at least try and adjust the offense for Nash quite misleading; Phil has a system, and he has often adjusted it ever so slightly for his teams if it meant overall success. Like in 2006, when he attempted to implement a faster-pace moving Triangle for the benefit of Jordan Farmar (which failed because Farmar generally sucked, as a starter).



If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

Can you explain what makes Mike D'Antoni an offensive genius? How much intellect is truly displayed in the "configuration" of an offense that's only mantra is "Shoot the ball in 7 seconds or less, just run run run!" ? He essentially tells his teams to spread the floor and run, that's it. His only "genius" is rooted in his out of timeout plays...that's it. Why do you think he failed in NY? Lack of shooters to spread the floor last season and two big guys in the middle, resulting in a stagnant and dysfunctional offense. When Melo and Amare went out, and Lin played with JR Smith, Novak, and only one big (Tyson Chandler), the Knicks briefly thrived. If Mike doesn't have shooters on the perimeter and a small lineup playing, his system is ineffective. Now, tell me how that would translate into a Laker team that A) lacks shooters B) loses two big men in their starting lineup? Not to well.

D'Antoni would be better suited on a team like the Clippers, however given his focus (or lack thereof) on defense, it wouldn't take them much farther (but farther than Del Negro, that's for sure).

The Lakers need a system that is simpler, yet still proficient, and circulates around weak side pick and roll (like the Triangle offense the Lakers used from 2008-2010). Their offense wasn't the issue thusfar, but due to unfamiliarity with each other and the offense Brown was "teaching," the efficient offense resulted in many turnovers, resulting in fastbreak opportunities that exploited the Lakers age and ensured their defense would remain horrid. They also need a coach that will inspire effort on the defensive end, so when the turnovers are controlled, they can execute pressure on opposing teams and allow their big men to limit team's to one shot opportunities.

Anyway. Even with Phil, the Lakers aren't getting passed OKC, barring some miracle working by the Zen Master. So if they do ultimately get him, he will improve the team, but I doubt it'll be enough to secure a title :confusedshrug:

[Whoah10115]

Couple of corrections for you CF86.



This is actually not true. When Phil joined the Bulls there were far from loaded, unless you consider a underperforming Scottie Pippen and Kwame Brown and Smush Parker a loaded roster. Pau was 2 years from being a Laker when Phil returned.



By the end of his tenure he had also coached a Kobe/Gasol led Laker team to the Finals three years in a row, after fours removed from coaching a Laker team to the Finals 4 years out of 5. I remember Laker fan whining too, but it had far less to do with Phil being set in his ways and more to do with 1) Phil was injured and wanted to sit out road games because of it 2) Kobe was injured and his knees were literally bone rubbing against bone 3) After 3 straight years of 100+ game seasons, the Laker team finally burnt out, and their lack of depth during their mini-dynasty was exposed, just as it was exposed after the same exact occurrence in 2003. Which lead to 4) The team was exhausted mentally and no longer responding to Phil's coaching methods. Coupled with the fact that it was Phil's last year on his contract and he had already stated he was retiring, the team players and coaches lacked the motivation to break through the walls that presented themselves in 2011.



Let's revisit 2007. Phil and Kobe both emphatically called for Jason Kidd both behind the scenes and through the media. Phil desired a point guard like Jason Kidd, someone with elite vision, to allow the team to dive deeper into the realms of the Triangle offense. The reason why the Triangle "didn't work" with Gary Payton (I always laugh when people say it didn't work, I mean they got to the Finals and before injuries hit had a 19-3 record, no?) is because Payton fought the triangle. And we've all heard and seen how ineffective the Triangle is when all parties don't buy into it. Go check out the 1999-2000 Chicago Bulls for some proof. The point guard especially has to be willing and able.

I'm typing on my iPhone so I can't retrieve the article now, but a few years back (I believe pre-Gasol trade) Brian Shaw articulated how more effective the Triangle would be with a point guard that could shoot and expertly handle the ball. There are different depths of the triangle, some of which Phil never even integrated into the offense due to the personell. Which makes the claim that he wouldn't at least try and adjust the offense for Nash quite misleading; Phil has a system, and he has often adjusted it ever so slightly for his teams if it meant overall success. Like in 2006, when he attempted to implement a faster-pace moving Triangle for the benefit of Jordan Farmar (which failed because Farmar generally sucked, as a starter).




Can you explain what makes Mike D'Antoni an offensive genius? How much intellect is truly displayed in the "configuration" of an offense that's only mantra is "Shoot the ball in 7 seconds or less, just run run run!" ? He essentially tells his teams to spread the floor and run, that's it. His only "genius" is rooted in his out of timeout plays...that's it. Why do you think he failed in NY? Lack of shooters to spread the floor last season and two big guys in the middle, resulting in a stagnant and dysfunctional offense. When Melo and Amare went out, and Lin played with JR Smith, Novak, and only one big (Tyson Chandler), the Knicks briefly thrived. If Mike doesn't have shooters on the perimeter and a small lineup playing, his system is ineffective. Now, tell me how that would translate into a Laker team that A) lacks shooters B) loses two big men in their starting lineup? Not to well.

D'Antoni would be better suited on a team like the Clippers, however given his focus (or lack thereof) on defense, it wouldn't take them much farther (but farther than Del Negro, that's for sure).

The Lakers need a system that is simpler, yet still proficient, and circulates around weak side pick and roll (like the Triangle offense the Lakers used from 2008-2010). Their offense wasn't the issue thusfar, but due to unfamiliarity with each other and the offense Brown was "teaching," the efficient offense resulted in many turnovers, resulting in fastbreak opportunities that exploited the Lakers age and ensured their defense would remain horrid. They also need a coach that will inspire effort on the defensive end, so when the turnovers are controlled, they can execute pressure on opposing teams and allow their big men to limit team's to one shot opportunities.

Anyway. Even with Phil, the Lakers aren't getting passed OKC, barring some miracle working by the Zen Master. So if they do ultimately get him, he will improve the team, but I doubt it'll be enough to secure a title :confusedshrug:



With you until the OKC part.


I still think Nash might be a bit dribble happy. Jason Kidd was different, because he was a little slower than he used to be, and had adjusted to grinding things out. That, and Jason Kidd fits in any system, because he's all about controlling the game...really, he controls the game...like quite like anyone I've seen. He's like basketball's Xavi.

[rodman91]

OP is as wrong as being a fan of wrong LA team.:lol

[BlackVVaves]

With you until the OKC part.


I still think Nash might be a bit dribble happy. Jason Kidd was different, because he was a little slower than he used to be, and had adjusted to grinding things out. That, and Jason Kidd fits in any system, because he's all about controlling the game...really, he controls the game...like quite like anyone I've seen. He's like basketball's Xavi.

You think Lakers beat OKC?

And I agree with you to an extent. But I think Nash is more flexible than people give him credit for. He may be less impactful without the ball in his hand 100% of the time, but because he's an elite shooter he can still be effective in a system offense if his jumper is falling at an exceptional rate. If he becomes more comfortable shooting off the ball, he can help stretch the defense a bit when the ball isn't in his hands.

I agree with everything you say about Kidd though. Phil especially wanted him because he was a big guard that could pass and defend. A la Ron Harper. But his use for a point guard that can manage the offers entirely is still prevalent. And Nash fits that mold.

[IGOTGAME]

You think Lakers beat OKC?

And I agree with you to an extent. But I think Nash is more flexible than people give him credit for. He may be less impactful without the ball in his hand 100% of the time, but because he's an elite shooter he can still be effective in a system offense if his jumper is falling at an exceptional rate. If he becomes more comfortable shooting off the ball, he can help stretch the defense a bit when the ball isn't in his hands.

I agree with everything you say about Kidd though. Phil especially wanted him because he was a big guard that could pass and defend. A la Ron Harper. But his use for a point guard that can manage the offers entirely is still prevalent. And Nash fits that mold.
Will he be effective enough without the ball to negate his horrible defense. Leta not sugar coat it, he is horrible.

[BlackVVaves]

Will he be effective enough without the ball to negate his horrible defense. Leta not sugar coat it, he is horrible.

Yea, he is (horrible), though not for a lack of effort. Lakers should either A) have Kobe guard opposing point guard for a portion of the game or B) seriously consider implementing zone defenses into their schemes.

Or, and I don't know why they haven't already, C) sign Delonte West. Very good defender and can come in when Nash is getting especially lit up.

[Clippersfan86]

I thought Phil returned right after Pau trade, thanks for correction guys. I just want Lakers fans to know Phil.isn't the only good choice even if Phil doesn't come. And if he does coe don't expect immediate dominance. Same kinks on the team need to be worked out and that takes time.

[DixieNourmous]

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_md9cnxy90H1qlmqp7o1_500.jpg

[necya]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

after reading your poor threead about the most loaded PG era because of your CP3, you confirm here that you dont know what you are talking about.

[Clippersfan86]

Woj talking a out some of what I said but in way more detail. People seem to forget the bad and only remember good.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--phil-jackson-reunion-with-lakers-could-lack-perfect-hollywood-ending-09281209.html

[BlackVVaves]

I thought Phil returned right after Pau trade, thanks for correction guys. I just want Lakers fans to know Phil.isn't the only good choice even if Phil doesn't come. And if he does coe don't expect immediate dominance. Same kinks on the team need to be worked out and that takes time.

They shouldn't expect dominance, but you know they will anyway. At least the unreasonable ones. The more realistic Laker fans will understand that amongst everything, Phil would offer a level of reliability and direction. Someone the team can respect and inherently admire, which in the past has resulted in Phil coached teams exhibiting a great deal of effort when it counts, which enables them to perservere (the 1991 and 1998 Bulls and 2000, 2002, and 2010 Lakers come to mind).

By the way, any response to the points in my first post?

[BlackVVaves]

Woj talking a out some of what I said but in way more detail. People seem to forget the bad and only remember good.

http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nba--phil-jackson-reunion-with-lakers-could-lack-perfect-hollywood-ending-09281209.html

My man. It's not people forget the bad. It's that, like in 2005, the team is lost, it has no concrete direction coming from it's coaching staff. And this year is more important than even winning a title this year from those guys. It's about showing Dwight how committed they are to winning at any cost. It's about convincing him to sign that contract in July and ensure a bright future for at least 5 years. It's about instilling faith in him that the Lakers will always put winning first. They have no time to take risks on Mike Brown or the like. How do you not see that bro?

If you were the Jerry Buss (who the order came directly from to fire Brown because of the points I highlighted), would you really mortgage the future of the Lakers on Mike ****ing D'Antoni, or the man that has helped reign in 5 championships for the franchise in the last 12 years?

I understand your point that there are other suitable coaches out there (really only 2 - Shaw and Sloan), but you're looking at it from a extremely narrow perspective.

It's about the option that provides the Lakers a balanced combination of winning this year, and ensuring Dwight remains a Laker. It's about business and basketball. It always is with the Lakers.

[Whoah10115]

You think Lakers beat OKC?

And I agree with you to an extent. But I think Nash is more flexible than people give him credit for. He may be less impactful without the ball in his hand 100% of the time, but because he's an elite shooter he can still be effective in a system offense if his jumper is falling at an exceptional rate. If he becomes more comfortable shooting off the ball, he can help stretch the defense a bit when the ball isn't in his hands.

I agree with everything you say about Kidd though. Phil especially wanted him because he was a big guard that could pass and defend. A la Ron Harper. But his use for a point guard that can manage the offers entirely is still prevalent. And Nash fits that mold.



I do think LA beats OKC, unless LA just don't get it together. They have the better team, I feel. And the way Kobe is playing...it's early, but Kobe looks incredible. He's not shooting stupid jumpshots. He's playing within the offense and he's going to the basket, which is incredible. If he plays like this, he can actually be the best player on the court...and I thought LA would beat OKC without thinking Kobe would be this good.

[niko]

Now first off let me say he's the GOAT NBA coach and a massive upgrade but a few things must be noted.

1. Phil seems to conveniently only want to coach loaded teams. Both times he quit the Lakers was wheb they started declining rapidly. He came back for Pau and now will come back for Dwight.

2. Lakers fans shouldn't forget that by the end of his first two tenures they were calling for his head because he's so set in his ways among other things.

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

That's ridiculous. Mike D has no clue how to use bigs if they can't hit jumpers, and he has no clue how to allow anyone to play defense. This Laker teams problem is defense and turnovers so far, not offense.

[Noof]

Phil did not come back for Pau. He came back in 2005, way before we got Pau. Our roster sucked when he came back.

[Pacquiao]

who wins without superstars?

[Clippersfan86]

That's ridiculous. Mike D has no clue how to use bigs if they can't hit jumpers, and he has no clue how to allow anyone to play defense. This Laker teams problem is defense and turnovers so far, not offense.

Pau Gasol has one of the purest strokes of any big in the league. Mike D'Antoni's Suns teams were actually 13-15 in their prime years in defensive efficiency which is still very respectable. Turnovers won't be an issue if Nash is utilized to the fullest.

[RazorBaLade]

Pau Gasol has one of the purest strokes of any big in the league. Mike D'Antoni's Suns teams were actually 13-15 in their prime years in defensive efficiency which is still very respectable. Turnovers won't be an issue if Nash is utilized to the fullest.

pau cant shoot for shit anymotr

[poido123]

Phil is the best fit for this type of team. He knows how to manage egos, and he knows how to build a team for a playoff run. Phil was able to manage a hard headed Jordan and a volatile Rodman in the day, half of coaching basketball is to get the maximum effort and talent out of each player, more so than just the x's and o's. Dealing with big egos and expectations is exactly what Phil knows how to manage. There is not many coaches available that could handle the type of team the Laker team is now, very very few.

[Clippersfan86]

pau cant shoot for shit anymotr

Pau is being utilized terribly. The thing you lose LAST in basketball as a great player like Pau is your shot. He can shoot lights out in the right set up.

[Clippersfan86]

http://www.nba.com/2012/news/11/10/lakers-mike-dunleavy-mike-dantoni/index.html

I don't understand why if this was so perfect why the Lakers didn't offer Phil the job on the spot???

[iamgine]

If I'm Phil Jackson, I'd also only coach contenders. The more loaded, the better.

[poido123]

If I'm Phil Jackson, I'd also only coach contenders. The more loaded, the better.

It's smart and protects both his reputation and the ability to get future jobs as head coach(Not that he wants to, but has that option). If his team has the talent, he knows how to maximise it, without letting any one player derail the team.

[sick_brah07]

Couple of corrections for you CF86.



This is actually not true. When Phil joined the Bulls there were far from loaded, unless you consider a underperforming Scottie Pippen and Kwame Brown and Smush Parker a loaded roster. Pau was 2 years from being a Laker when Phil returned.



By the end of his tenure he had also coached a Kobe/Gasol led Laker team to the Finals three years in a row, after fours removed from coaching a Laker team to the Finals 4 years out of 5. I remember Laker fan whining too, but it had far less to do with Phil being set in his ways and more to do with 1) Phil was injured and wanted to sit out road games because of it 2) Kobe was injured and his knees were literally bone rubbing against bone 3) After 3 straight years of 100+ game seasons, the Laker team finally burnt out, and their lack of depth during their mini-dynasty was exposed, just as it was exposed after the same exact occurrence in 2003. Which lead to 4) The team was exhausted mentally and no longer responding to Phil's coaching methods. Coupled with the fact that it was Phil's last year on his contract and he had already stated he was retiring, the team players and coaches lacked the motivation to break through the walls that presented themselves in 2011.



Let's revisit 2007. Phil and Kobe both emphatically called for Jason Kidd both behind the scenes and through the media. Phil desired a point guard like Jason Kidd, someone with elite vision, to allow the team to dive deeper into the realms of the Triangle offense. The reason why the Triangle "didn't work" with Gary Payton (I always laugh when people say it didn't work, I mean they got to the Finals and before injuries hit had a 19-3 record, no?) is because Payton fought the triangle. And we've all heard and seen how ineffective the Triangle is when all parties don't buy into it. Go check out the 1999-2000 Chicago Bulls for some proof. The point guard especially has to be willing and able.

I'm typing on my iPhone so I can't retrieve the article now, but a few years back (I believe pre-Gasol trade) Brian Shaw articulated how more effective the Triangle would be with a point guard that could shoot and expertly handle the ball. There are different depths of the triangle, some of which Phil never even integrated into the offense due to the personell. Which makes the claim that he wouldn't at least try and adjust the offense for Nash quite misleading; Phil has a system, and he has often adjusted it ever so slightly for his teams if it meant overall success. Like in 2006, when he attempted to implement a faster-pace moving Triangle for the benefit of Jordan Farmar (which failed because Farmar generally sucked, as a starter).




Can you explain what makes Mike D'Antoni an offensive genius? How much intellect is truly displayed in the "configuration" of an offense that's only mantra is "Shoot the ball in 7 seconds or less, just run run run!" ? He essentially tells his teams to spread the floor and run, that's it. His only "genius" is rooted in his out of timeout plays...that's it. Why do you think he failed in NY? Lack of shooters to spread the floor last season and two big guys in the middle, resulting in a stagnant and dysfunctional offense. When Melo and Amare went out, and Lin played with JR Smith, Novak, and only one big (Tyson Chandler), the Knicks briefly thrived. If Mike doesn't have shooters on the perimeter and a small lineup playing, his system is ineffective. Now, tell me how that would translate into a Laker team that A) lacks shooters B) loses two big men in their starting lineup? Not to well.

D'Antoni would be better suited on a team like the Clippers, however given his focus (or lack thereof) on defense, it wouldn't take them much farther (but farther than Del Negro, that's for sure).

The Lakers need a system that is simpler, yet still proficient, and circulates around weak side pick and roll (like the Triangle offense the Lakers used from 2008-2010). Their offense wasn't the issue thusfar, but due to unfamiliarity with each other and the offense Brown was "teaching," the efficient offense resulted in many turnovers, resulting in fastbreak opportunities that exploited the Lakers age and ensured their defense would remain horrid. They also need a coach that will inspire effort on the defensive end, so when the turnovers are controlled, they can execute pressure on opposing teams and allow their big men to limit team's to one shot opportunities.

Anyway. Even with Phil, the Lakers aren't getting passed OKC, barring some miracle working by the Zen Master. So if they do ultimately get him, he will improve the team, but I doubt it'll be enough to secure a title :confusedshrug:

Respect ^^

This poster knows basketball

[no pun intended]

I'm typing on my iPhone so I can't retrieve the article now, but a few years back (I believe pre-Gasol trade) Brian Shaw articulated how more effective the Triangle would be with a point guard that could shoot and expertly handle the ball. There are different depths of the triangle, some of which Phil never even integrated into the offense due to the personell. Which makes the claim that he wouldn't at least try and adjust the offense for Nash quite misleading; Phil has a system, and he has often adjusted it ever so slightly for his teams if it meant overall success. Like in 2006, when he attempted to implement a faster-pace moving Triangle for the benefit of Jordan Farmar (which failed because Farmar generally sucked, as a starter).


tl;dr:

http://cdn.memegenerator.net/instances/400x/29994012.jpg

[tomtucker]

Couple of corrections for you CF86.


shot opportunities.

Anyway. Even with Phil, the Lakers aren't getting passed OKC, barring some miracle working by the Zen Master. So if they do ultimately get him, he will improve the team, but I doubt it'll be enough to secure a title :confusedshrug:

i think they can beat okc....miami in the finals is a different matter !

[RazorBaLade]

Pau is being utilized terribly. The thing you lose LAST in basketball as a great player like Pau is your shot. He can shoot lights out in the right set up.

is kobe spitting on the ball before he passes to him? he just doesnt jump as high/as easily anymore and he cant adjust


http://www.nba.com/2012/news/11/10/lakers-mike-dunleavy-mike-dantoni/index.html

I don't understand why if this was so perfect why the Lakers didn't offer Phil the job on the spot???

my understanding is that its phils job to turn down, and in case he does they already want to know exactly who they are hiring. but they need to continue to debate the issue of control over bball decisions and travel/coaching restrictions (read he doesnt want to do shootarounds)

jackson has all the leverage, which makes deals tough. but unless one side gets butthurt , its happening.

fwiw, no in person interview planned with dantoni - 2nd one already planned wit phil

[COnDEMnED]

I thought Phil returned right after Pau trade, thanks for correction guys. I just want Lakers fans to know Phil.isn't the only good choice even if Phil doesn't come. And if he does coe don't expect immediate dominance. Same kinks on the team need to be worked out and that takes time.
I have to say something about this before I go to bed or else im going to be stuck there shaking my head at the ceiling. Im going to sound like a dick, but not intentionally. All of the several mistakes in your OP aside, how can you sit there and admit your wrong in this first sentence, then act like you are going to inform Lakers fans about a man we have been watching on and off for more then a decade? The notion you are going to tell me what I can expect from Phil Jackson and what not to expect in immediate dominance is insulting. I dont know if it was intended that way, but thats the way it looks. Like I dont know my own favorite team. I hope you know im making an extra attempt not to jump on you in other threads when/if you make a fool of yourself. In this case, sometimes its just best to shut it down and zip your lips. Fingers in this case. You telling us there are great coaches available other than PJax is :facepalm. In the future I also dont need you to tell me the Lakers jersey colors are Purple/Gold and sometimes White or Blue. I can see that. Serious question, If VDN gets canned tomorrow, who do you want as your head coach? Phil Jackson or Mike D'Antoni? Dont answere that, its a loaded question intended to expose you one way or the other.

[poido123]

I have to say something about this before I go to bed or else im going to be stuck there shaking my head at the ceiling. Im going to sound like a dick, but not intentionally. All of the several mistakes in your OP aside, how can you sit there and admit your wrong in this first sentence, then act like you are going to inform Lakers fans about a man we have been watching on and off for more then a decade? The notion you are going to tell me what I can expect from Phil Jackson and what not to expect in immediate dominance is insulting. I dont know if it was intended that way, but thats the way it looks. Like I dont know my own favorite team. I hope you know im making an extra attempt not to jump on you in other threads when/if you make a fool of yourself. In this case, sometimes its just best to shut it down and zip your lips. Fingers in this case. You telling us there are great coaches available other than PJax is :facepalm. In the future I also dont need you to tell me the Lakers jersey colors are Purple/Gold and sometimes White or Blue. I can see that. Serious question, If VDN gets canned tomorrow, who do you want as your head coach? Phil Jackson or Mike D'Antoni? Dont answere that, its a loaded question intended to expose you one way or the other.

LOL poor Clippersfan, he does mean well but you definately exposed him here.

[swi7ch]

Clippers will be irrelevant. Again. :oldlol:

[jl1718]

is kobe spitting on the ball before he passes to him? he just doesnt jump as high/as easily anymore and he cant adjust



my understanding is that its phils job to turn down, and in case he does they already want to know exactly who they are hiring. but they need to continue to debate the issue of control over bball decisions and travel/coaching restrictions (read he doesnt want to do shootarounds)

jackson has all the leverage, which makes deals tough. but unless one side gets butthurt , its happening.

fwiw, no in person interview planned with dantoni - 2nd one already planned wit phil
Phil doesn't want to be there for shootarounds or travel on road trips. Lakers turned this deal down last time. I don't believe it's anywhere close to done.

[bluechox2]

what kinda coach doesnt want to coach his teams road games :lol, "i \ll just half ass it and get my ring anyway"

[Kujo]

Phil, say retired. Don't return to this circus. Things didn't really end well the last time.

Plus, I don't care who's coaching the Lakers, they're not beating OKC or SA imho. I'm not even sure they would beat the Clippers. Their roster just isn't deep enough (no bench).

[COnDEMnED]

Phil, say retired. Don't return to this circus. Things didn't really end well the last time.

Plus, I don't care who's coaching the Lakers, they're not beating OKC or SA imho. I'm not even sure they would beat the Clippers. Their roster just isn't deep enough (no bench).
While I agree with you the Lakers probably wont get past OKC or the Spurs this year, its hard to gauge just how good or bad our bench is. Someone either A) Didnt play a crucial part of our bench at all , B) Took other crucial parts of our bench and made them play out of position, or C) Would rather play Blake instead of Morris. Im not making excuses for the bench, I just feel perhaps the parts would have worked better if people were actually given the opportunity to do what they were brought here to do. If we can get even a somewhat solid game every day from Morris, Meeks, Hill and Jamison, thats not a completely terrible bench. Not a world beater, but with the starting lineup one would think that wouldnt be necessary. I firmly believe CDR should have stayed a Laker. My guess is by the time the trade deadline gets a little closer, some of the dead weight will be gone if for nothing more than some second round picks.

[TheFan]

How loaded was that Lakers team he came back to in 05-06?

Not exactly... he was promised by the Lakers FO that they would do all the possible things to put a contender around Kobe... i was very active in Lakers boards like lakerstopbuzz and lakersground to name a few... I remember reading that Lakers FO said they needed a season to show the players(aka inflate their value), then all would be traded for better players... remember names like Jason Kidd, Jermaine Oneal and Ron Artest, all being mentioned around potential deals for the lakers.

[mentallooser]

Jerry Sloan seems like a better fit.

[BlackVVaves]

what kinda coach doesnt want to coach his teams road games :lol, "i \ll just half ass it and get my ring anyway"

He doesn't want to sit out all road games or all shootarounds. The talk is, he wants to have his assistant coaches/and a coach that he and the Lakers brass will agree on being his predecessor run some road game shootarounds and coach some seemingly minuscule road games against lesser opponents (against the Pistons, Raptors, Bobcats of the league). Not all, just some. He wants to groom a coach so that when he leaves this time the transition is a smooth one as his "mentee" takes the reigns. Opposed to what has happened the last two times Phil has left, with Rudy and Brown hardly filling in those shoes.

Not saying that's a reasonable or unreasonable caveat. Just saying, he's not sitting out 41 games of the season.

[TimmyDuncan]

3. Never has an all star caliber, ball dominant PG thrived in the triangle so if Nash get's used poorly he wasn't worth trading for. Let's hope Phil breaks the triangle for Nash.

They got him for nothing. Even in the triangle, Nash is worth more than nothing

And an all time great shooter at PG is very usefull in the triangle

[BlackVVaves]

Respect ^^

This poster knows basketball

:cheers:

[Clippersfan86]

They got him for nothing. Even in the triangle, Nash is worth more than nothing

And an all time great shooter at PG is very usefull in the triangle

4 or 5 1st rounders right? That may not be super valuable with the Lakers future prospects but it definitely hampers the future just a tad bit. Nash+Kobe retire, Gasol walks in free agency. Basically the only way the Lakers will now be able to rebuild is around Dwight and that's if he stays. Obviously signing Phil will pretty seal that deal but you never know with somebody like Dwight.

[BlackVVaves]

4 or 5 1st rounders right? That may not be super valuable with the Lakers future prospects but it definitely hampers the future just a tad bit. Nash+Kobe retire, Gasol walks in free agency. Basically the only way the Lakers will now be able to rebuild is around Dwight and that's if he stays. Obviously signing Phil will pretty seal that deal but you never know with somebody like Dwight.

So you're just going to ignore the $60 Million coming off the books for them next season? :lol

I'm disappointed, you haven't responded to any of my posts directed to you in this thread.

:(

[Vertical-24]

I have to say something about this before I go to bed or else im going to be stuck there shaking my head at the ceiling. Im going to sound like a dick, but not intentionally. All of the several mistakes in your OP aside, how can you sit there and admit your wrong in this first sentence, then act like you are going to inform Lakers fans about a man we have been watching on and off for more then a decade? The notion you are going to tell me what I can expect from Phil Jackson and what not to expect in immediate dominance is insulting. I dont know if it was intended that way, but thats the way it looks. Like I dont know my own favorite team. I hope you know im making an extra attempt not to jump on you in other threads when/if you make a fool of yourself. In this case, sometimes its just best to shut it down and zip your lips. Fingers in this case. You telling us there are great coaches available other than PJax is :facepalm. In the future I also dont need you to tell me the Lakers jersey colors are Purple/Gold and sometimes White or Blue. I can see that. Serious question, If VDN gets canned tomorrow, who do you want as your head coach? Phil Jackson or Mike D'Antoni? Dont answere that, its a loaded question intended to expose you one way or the other.

:eek:

[BlackVVaves]

^^Yea, Condemed went in.

[Clippersfan86]

So you're just going to ignore the $60 Million coming off the books for them next season? :lol

I'm disappointed, you haven't responded to any of my posts directed to you in this thread.

:(

That's what I was trying to imply. Free agency is the teams only way to build going forward. Doesn't mean they won't succeed just means improving through draft is out (yes I know for the Lakers this is usually how it is). No real trade assets at all either. I didn't ignore your posts, I responded to them and acknowledged where I was wrong etc.

[Clippersfan86]

I have to say something about this before I go to bed or else im going to be stuck there shaking my head at the ceiling. Im going to sound like a dick, but not intentionally. All of the several mistakes in your OP aside, how can you sit there and admit your wrong in this first sentence, then act like you are going to inform Lakers fans about a man we have been watching on and off for more then a decade? The notion you are going to tell me what I can expect from Phil Jackson and what not to expect in immediate dominance is insulting. I dont know if it was intended that way, but thats the way it looks. Like I dont know my own favorite team. I hope you know im making an extra attempt not to jump on you in other threads when/if you make a fool of yourself. In this case, sometimes its just best to shut it down and zip your lips. Fingers in this case. You telling us there are great coaches available other than PJax is :facepalm. In the future I also dont need you to tell me the Lakers jersey colors are Purple/Gold and sometimes White or Blue. I can see that. Serious question, If VDN gets canned tomorrow, who do you want as your head coach? Phil Jackson or Mike D'Antoni? Dont answere that, its a loaded question intended to expose you one way or the other.

I don't think you know what a loaded question is. There are some situations where Mike D may be a better fit than Jackson so not sure what the offensive part of me saying that is. Phil has become OVERRATED apparently. Dude has won more than anybody but look at what he's had to work with? Take away the brilliant front offices of the Lakers and Bulls and who knows what happens to him? I still think he's an incredible coach but that doesn't mean he's automatically the best fit for any team :biggums: .

Honestly for the roster the Clippers have in place I'd absolutely take Mike D or Sloan over Phil. I think in typical Lakers fan fashion you place talent above chemistry which we are seeing how that works so far for the team itself this year. All the talent in the world, no cohesion and some bad fitting pieces= losses. Not saying it won't change but to act like Phil is the end all and no other coach can possibly do as well or better with this particular roster is ignorant as hell.

Also please try to space out your blocks of text because it's damn near impossible to read when you're a pretty incoherent drunk to begin with.

[BlackVVaves]

CF86, do you think the Clippers would win a championship with D'Antoni?

I think you're allowing your disdain for VDN (disdain worth carrying) cloud your perspective on other coaches for your team. Pretty much anyone would be better than Del Negro, but a "do whatever the hell you want CP3 just score in under 7 seconds" offense would inherently negate defense (an issue for the Clippers last season) and be easily defendable in a half court setting pace (the post-season).

D'Antoni would only prove to be a good coach for the Clippers (or Lakers) if he diversified the structure of his system, and placed more emphasis on scheme that could excel even in the playoffs. As it stands, his system only works with a very limited and specific type of personell. One thing about the Triangle, it is not predicated on having great perimeter shooters, and is built to increase the opportunities for players that aren't as skilled creating easy baskets for themselves. D'Antoni, in contrast, needs a small lineup, revolving around only one big man (with range) and 4 shooters, including a ball- dominant guard. Freethrow shooting for his bigs is also important in his systems, for the big man is designed to be afforded the most opportunities to get to the charity stripe through constant pick and roll action. Where does DJ and Blake fit in all of that?

[Legends66NBA7]

Phil has become OVERRATED apparently

He's a Top 2 coach at worst, bro.

[DixieNourmous]

I still think he's an incredible coach but that doesn't mean he's automatically the best fit .



Phil`s strongest asset is that he make egos work together. He is the best fit and you know it.

[Clippersfan86]

CF86, do you think the Clippers would win a championship with D'Antoni?

I think you're allowing your disdain for VDN (disdain worth carrying) cloud your perspective on other coaches for your team. Pretty much anyone would be better than Del Negro, but a "do whatever the hell you want CP3 just score in under 7 seconds" offense would inherently negate defense (an issue for the Clippers last season) and be easily defendable in a half court setting pace (the post-season).

D'Antoni would only prove to be a good coach for the Clippers (or Lakers) if he diversified the structure of his system, and placed more emphasis on scheme that could excel even in the playoffs. As it stands, his system only works with a very limited and specific type of personell. One thing about the Triangle, it is not predicated on having great perimeter shooters, and is built to increase the opportunities for players that aren't as skilled creating easy baskets for themselves. D'Antoni, in contrast, needs a small lineup, revolving around only one big man (with range) and 4 shooters, including a ball- dominant guard. Freethrow shooting for his bigs is also important in his systems, for the big man is designed to be afforded the most opportunities to get to the charity stripe through constant pick and roll action. Where does DJ and Blake fit in all of that?

My main point which was undeservedly shredded by trolls was that to assume Phil is automatically the best fit based on previous success is very off base to begin with. I think Mike D will do a very good job at getting Nash+bigs gelled and will still find a way to get Kobe 20 shots or more a game with his ball movement and tempo.

People are quick to point out their defensive issues but Mike's Suns were a little better than middle of the road defensively and that was mainly due to a lack of quality defenders to begin with.

Phil isn't a defensive mastermind by any means, he's just had amazing personnel to work with defensively. The dude fu**ing had Rodman, Jordan and Pippen... then he's had guys like Artest, Kobe, Shaq, Payton etc. I mean if you give Jackson the 05 Suns I don't think he has the success Mike D'Antoni did and if you give Mike the Lakers obviously he doesn't either.

Which proves my point of fit being a valuable aspect to coaching.

[Clippersfan86]

He's a Top 2 coach at worst, bro.

Not overrated to the point of not being top 2 or even being the best. Overrated in the sense of people acting like no matter what he's the best, in all situations. Dixie I already said Phil is the answer for this team managing egos. He's the best locker room fixer of any of these coaches.

Does he have the game plan that will utilize the talent to the max? Not in my personal opinion. I think these Lakers are much different than his previous Lakers team and despite already being an offense force they could be the best offense in NBA history with Mike D.

[Whoah10115]

I think D'Antoni would work very well with Dwight. I don't believe Dwight needs range. I think D'Antoni succeeded in Phoenix and wanted to take that approach to other teams. He clearly loves playing that kind of basketball, and I think he wanted to play the way he wanted to play, and showing that success was possible with it.



The Knicks sucked when he came over. His rotations were shit with us in his last year, I get it. But that doesn't mean he can't coach. He went to a team that was bare, which meant he had carte blanche and could build it as he wanted it to be. The Anthony trade impeded that progress. Getting rid of D'Antoni was fair, but it's hardly the final say on his coaching ability.



The Suns sucked and had the biggest turnaround in NBA history, followed by losing Amare for a year, followed by getting ripped off by the NBA. All that in a 3 year window and followed by Steve Kerr pulling off one of the dumbest trades in recent memory.


That team had 4 years. Please.

[Clippersfan86]

I think D'Antoni would work very well with Dwight. I don't believe Dwight needs range. I think D'Antoni succeeded in Phoenix and wanted to take that approach to other teams. He clearly loves playing that kind of basketball, and I think he wanted to play the way he wanted to play, and showing that success was possible with it.



The Knicks sucked when he came over. His rotations were shit with us in his last year, I get it. But that doesn't mean he can't coach. He went to a team that was bare, which meant he had carte blanche and could build it as he wanted it to be. The Anthony trade impeded that progress. Getting rid of D'Antoni was fair, but it's hardly the final say on his coaching ability.



The Suns sucked and had the biggest turnaround in NBA history, followed by losing Amare for a year, followed by getting ripped off by the NBA. All that in a 3 year window and followed by Steve Kerr pulling off one of the dumbest trades in recent memory.


That team had 4 years. Please.

Great post man, repped :applause: . I'm not saying Mike>Phil because he clearly doesn't. I'm saying fit wise he just MIGHT be better :hammerhead:

[RRR3]

Yea, he is (horrible), though not for a lack of effort. Lakers should either A) have Kobe guard opposing point guard for a portion of the game or B) seriously consider implementing zone defenses into their schemes.

Or, and I don't know why they haven't already, C) sign Delonte West. Very good defender and can come in when Nash is getting especially lit up.
Kobe's defense is pretty poor these days.

[Gotterdammerung]

If I'm the Lakers I'd go for Mike D who is an offensive genius and knows how to utilize everybody on the floor. Phil is still an amazing get though.

Others already dismissed most of the points raised in the OP, but allow me to explain why D'Antoni is a horrible coach.

He has a shoot first and don't ask questions strategy that works with a great point guard. Entertaining but not championship proven. A D'Antoni strategy will have Nash dominate the ball -- alienating Bryant. Building around a 39 year old PG is not a sound gameplan, either for the short-term or the long-term.

As for Phil Jackson, Kobe, World Peace, Gasol, & Blake are all already well-versed with the triangle offense, and the transition won't be too challenging. P-Jax will be refreshed after time off and time to heal his body.

Jerry Sloan is a great coach, but too inflexible and will not allow the freedom Nash & Bryant require to fully utilize their game.

Nate McMillian is a terrific coach by all regards, but he's way too independent for the Lakers front office to control.

[Clippersfan86]

Others already dismissed most of the points raised in the OP, but allow me to explain why D'Antoni is a horrible coach.

He has a shoot first and don't ask questions strategy that works with a great point guard. Entertaining but not championship proven. A D'Antoni strategy will have Nash dominate the ball -- alienating Bryant. Building around a 39 year old PG is not a sound gameplan, either for the short-term or the long-term.

As for Phil Jackson, Kobe, World Peace, Gasol, & Blake are all already well-versed with the triangle offense, and the transition won't be too challenging. P-Jax will be refreshed after time off and time to heal his body.

Jerry Sloan is a great coach, but too inflexible and will not allow the freedom Nash & Bryant require to fully utilize their game.

Nate McMillian is a terrific coach by all regards, but he's way too independent for the Lakers front office to control.

I think there is a MUCH greater chance of a Triangle offense led by Phil alienating Nash than Mike'd system alienating Kobe. Mike D has always loved Kobe and respected his game. I know for a fact he will start the offense with a lot of PG to big action but Kobe will still get more shots than he did this year under Mike Brown due to pace and ball movement.

[BlackVVaves]

Phil isn't the best coach in all situations, and, like it is for all coaches, personell and talent are paramount pieces to the puzzle of coaching success. However, in this particular situation, considering the lost direction of the team, and the business aspect of getting Dwight to re-sign by illustrating a stark contrast between the Orlando Magic's and the Lakers' front offices approach to winning at all costs, Phil is the best and safest pick.

I just don't think Mikd D'Antoni is a great head coach. Color me badd :confusedshrug:

[Clippersfan86]

Phil isn't the best coach in all situations, and, like it is for all coaches, personell and talent are paramount pieces to the puzzle of coaching success. However, in this particular situation, considering the lost direction of the team, and the business aspect of getting Dwight to re-sign by illustrating a stark contrast between the Orlando Magic's and the Lakers' front offices approach to winning at all costs, Phil is the best and safest pick.

I just don't think Mikd D'Antoni is a great head coach. Color me badd :confusedshrug:

This is a very fair, logical point. I think you need to choose Phil if not only because Dwight and Kobe openly asked for him. Phil= re-signed Dwight.

[Gotterdammerung]

I think there is a MUCH greater chance of a Triangle offense led by Phil alienating Nash than Mike'd system alienating Kobe.

Why?

The triangle is not as one-dimensional as Seven Seconds or Less offense. The Triangle is similar to the princeton - a read & react offense that requires intelligence and skill. Nash has among the highest IQ in the league and has the skill to hit any shot from any where.

The only reason the Triangle won't work is if you have a low IQ player who's ball dominant like Gary Payton. :no:

Read Jack McCallum's book "SSOL (http://www.amazon.com/Seven-Seconds-Less-Season-Phoenix/dp/0743298136)" and enlighten yourself about the limitations of D'Antoni's coaching acumen.

[Clippersfan86]

Why?

The triangle is not as one-dimensional as Seven Seconds or Less offense. The Triangle is similar to the princeton - a read & react offense that requires intelligence and skill. Nash has among the highest IQ in the league and has the skill to hit any shot from any where.

The only reason the Triangle won't work is if you have a low IQ player who's ball dominant like Gary Payton. :no:

Read Jack McCallum's book "SSOL (http://www.amazon.com/Seven-Seconds-Less-Season-Phoenix/dp/0743298136)" and enlighten yourself about the limitations of D'Antoni's coaching acumen.

I don't think you guys understand that the Suns are the top offense in NBA HISTORY according to the numbers. I think Phil is being treated like an untouchable God and Mike D a bad coach which isn't accurate at all. Do you know Mike D was voted multiple years in SI by players as being the best coach to play for as well as coach they would like to play for?

[ILLsmak]

The only reason Phil would be the wrong choice is because he's wasting away. If he can't go on certain road games, that's not a good look. That means he is an injury risk, too, and having your head coach injured whether he falls and breaks his hip or just gets fatigued is not good shit. Unless he's got a good staff.

Phil is ultimately the GOAT coach, as said, not because of his xs and os but because he understands people and knows how to get the most out of them. No coach has ever been as good as Phil at that.

As long as he can be present at the games, I think he's the right coach.

Nobody else can say shit to Kobe. Phil is not a player's coach in that he caters to them; he's an equal. He pays attention to them and understands them and tries to help them. Nobody else is doing it on that level. Surprising that the NBA has no other coaches like him, but... it's true.

-Smak

[Clippersfan86]

The only reason Phil would be the wrong choice is because he's wasting away. If he can't go on certain road games, that's not a good look. That means he is an injury risk, too, and having your head coach injured whether he falls and breaks his hip or just gets fatigued is not good shit. Unless he's got a good staff.

Phil is ultimately the GOAT coach, as said, not because of his xs and os but because he understands people and knows how to get the most out of them. No coach has ever been as good as Phil at that.

As long as he can be present at the games, I think he's the right coach.

Nobody else can say shit to Kobe. Phil is not a player's coach in that he caters to them; he's an equal. He pays attention to them and understands them and tries to help them. Nobody else is doing it on that level. Surprising that the NBA has no other coaches like him, but... it's true.

-Smak

I don't know about that. Pop is the one coach IMO who's just as good at getting the most out of any player if not maybe better. What's more is Pop doesn't manipulate to do it and use the media as much to bash his players.

[TryToBeUnbias]

Phil is their best option.

[Gotterdammerung]

...
:facepalm
Why didn't you answer my question?

Instead of talking "at" others, try talking TO them.

Also, read McCallum's book and stop treating D'Antoni as something he's not.

[Whoah10115]

I really don't think that Jackson makes Howard stay in LA. I think Howard stays, regardless.



People really think Howard needs Jackson to right the ship to stay? It's the Lakers. If Howard digs LA and playing with Kobe, and doesn't have the urge to play in another place, why would he leave?

[BlackVVaves]

I really don't think that Jackson makes Howard stay in LA. I think Howard stays, regardless.



People really think Howard needs Jackson to right the ship to stay? It's the Lakers. If Howard digs LA and playing with Kobe, and doesn't have the urge to play in another place, why would he leave?

You don't think Dwight's head coach, or rather a competent coach that he respects as a leader of men and believes can coach a championship team, won't impact his thought process when deciding his immediate future?

[Whoah10115]

You don't think Dwight's head coach, or rather a competent coach that he respects as a leader of men and believes can coach a championship team, won't impact his thought process when deciding his immediate future?




I don't think that, between the coaches being mentioned, that Phil brings that specific edge. He might be the guy Howard most respects and all that. But would Howard not respect Jerry Sloan? If he didn't respect D'Antoni, I doubt he'd be the only one lacking in respect. And at that point, D'Antoni would be gone.


I just can't see Howard have doubts over the Lakers ability to move forward.

[COnDEMnED]

I don't think you know what a loaded question is. There are some situations where Mike D may be a better fit than Jackson so not sure what the offensive part of me saying that is. Phil has become OVERRATED apparently. Dude has won more than anybody but look at what he's had to work with? Take away the brilliant front offices of the Lakers and Bulls and who knows what happens to him? I still think he's an incredible coach but that doesn't mean he's automatically the best fit for any team :biggums: .

Honestly for the roster the Clippers have in place I'd absolutely take Mike D or Sloan over Phil. I think in typical Lakers fan fashion you place talent above chemistry which we are seeing how that works so far for the team itself this year. All the talent in the world, no cohesion and some bad fitting pieces= losses. Not saying it won't change but to act like Phil is the end all and no other coach can possibly do as well or better with this particular roster is ignorant as hell.

Also please try to space out your blocks of text because it's damn near impossible to read when you're a pretty incoherent drunk to begin with.
Right over your head, huh? Obviously my experiment of trying to converse with you as my equal and not somebody I despise has failed. Guess I'll just revert back to thinking of you as a moron since you can't even process 8 lines of text without secreting blood in your vaglnal discharge.

The purpose of my post was to inform you. You don't need to speak to Lakers fans, almost in a fatherly scolding fashion, about what we can expect from a man we clearly already know and clearly you dont know enough about. Gauging from the various posts pointing out your flaws on the matter, thats how it appears anyway.

Is this enough spacing for you?

It is a loaded question and here's why. You're wrong either way giving the context of your OP and follow up replys. Your wrong if you choose D'Antoni because that means you're choosing a coach who has won 0 rings in comparison to someone with 11. You're wrong if you choose Phil Jackson because it means you can't even stick by your own opinion that he's overrated. It also makes you wrong because it gives off the impression you know more about what is the right coach for the Lakers team over the Lakers players themselves. Most who are calling for Phil to return.

Oops was that too much text in one segment?

I'll try again sometime next week to interact with you as my equal. Maybe it will go better in that time frame. We will have all been given the opportunity to mature a week.

[Clippersfan86]

Right over your head, huh? Obviously my experiment of trying to converse with you as my equal and not somebody I despise has failed. Guess I'll just revert back to thinking of you as a moron since you can't even process 8 lines of text without secreting blood in your vaglnal discharge.

The purpose of my post was to inform you. You don't need to speak to Lakers fans, almost in a fatherly scolding fashion, about what we can expect from a man we clearly already know and clearly you dont know enough about. Gauging from the various posts pointing out your flaws on the matter, thats how it appears anyway.

Is this enough spacing for you?

It is a loaded question and here's why. You're wrong either way giving the context of your OP and follow up replys. Your wrong if you choose D'Antoni because that means you're choosing a coach who has won 0 rings in comparison to someone with 11. You're wrong if you choose Phil Jackson because it means you can't even stick by your own opinion that he's overrated. It also makes you wrong because it gives off the impression you know more about what is the right coach for the Lakers team over the Lakers players themselves. Most who are calling for Phil to return.

Oops was that too much text in one segment?

I'll try again sometime next week to interact with you as my equal. Maybe it will go better in that time frame. We will have all been given the opportunity to mature a week.

You have some serious issues. You being a prick= talking to me like an equal and being reasonable :biggums: . Take your head out of your ass if this is how you reason with people dude. What somebody has accomplished before has nothing to do with who is the better fit right now. Besides I gave my personal opinion, nothing for you to call me out for because well... it's an OPINION. I didn't state anything as cold hard facts like you're doing.

[RRR3]

Fez vs. dude with Rob Zombie avatar. Underrated rivalry :applause:

[Clippersfan86]

Fez vs. dude with Rob Zombie avatar. Underrated rivalry :applause:

:oldlol: guess he's still living in the 90's. Last time me and him talked he said "You have no life" then mentioned how he spends his time sitting on his porch with his dog drinking a beer.

http://media.marconews.com/media/img/photos/2011/07/20/110615BB-TS-BONITASPRINGS31_t607.jpg

[BlueandGold]

Phil`s strongest asset is that he make egos work together. He is the best fit and you know it.
Exactly, his entire MO is to bring together super-egos.

[Clippersfan86]

http://www.emailajoke.com/images/ver4/funny_pics/general/weekend-relax-shit-on-porch-whatever.jpg

[RRR3]

http://images2.fanpop.com/images/photos/6400000/fez-that-70s-show-6429207-270-400.jpghttp://www.welovemetal.com/newsite/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2012/02/VS-logo.jpghttp://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20100317044525/halloweenmovie/images/b/b1/Rob_Zombie.jpg

[KOBE143]

If Phil wants another gift ring from Kobe then he should return ASAP..

[Clippersfan86]

Jamal Crawford just tweeted that Lakers should just keep Bickerstaff and he's talked about how he was a great coach in his experience playing under him.

"Lakers should maybe consider just hiring Bernie Bickerstaff...not always about big names, but guys that get it done.."

[Legends66NBA7]

Jamal Crawford just tweeted that Lakers should just keep Bickerstaff and he's talked about how he was a great coach in his experience playing under him.

"Lakers should maybe consider just hiring Bernie Bickerstaff...not always about big names, but guys that get it done.."

Good for him.

[TheBigVeto]

If Phil wants another gift ring from Kobe then he should return ASAP..

You got it backwards.
If Phil returns, it's a guaranteed ring for Kobe coz Phil ain't coming back without guarantee from David Stern that he's not going to retire again like he did back when Rick Carlisle slapped his bitchy ass all over.

[chazzy]

You got your wish, CF

[kennethgriffin]

oops