Kevin Durant 25 straight games with 25 points or more..

[All Net]

Amazing stat. The longest streak since Allen Iverson did it in 27 consecutive games during the 2000-01 season.

Doesn't look like he is slowing down either. 33 points last night in another Thunder win.

almost averaging 30, 7 and 3 on 48% from the floor and 38% from three.

great stuff from KD who knows he could lead his team to hosting a playoff series.

[kurple]

He needs to lead his team to the 2nd round.

[D-Rose]

He needs to lead his team to the 2nd round.
Oh ya mean something Melo's never done without Chauncey :D

[FinishHim!]

I honestly cannot believe my dude is only 21 years old. This is incredible.

[kmartshopper]

Best player in the L by next season.

[kurple]

Oh ya mean something Melo's never done without Chauncey :D

yes.

Difference is that everyone called Melo an loser for not getting past the 1st round, but Durant is an top 3 player in the NBA even if he hasn't made the playoffs yet

[antondijk]

yes.

Difference is that everyone called Melo an loser for not getting past the 1st round, but Durant is an top 3 player in the NBA even if he hasn't made the playoffs yet


Are you on drugs man? Melo has always been up the ladder in NBA.

[WhySoInsecure?]

yes.

Difference is that everyone called Melo an loser for not getting past the 1st round, but Durant is an top 3 player in the NBA even if he hasn't made the playoffs yet
That might have to do something with the fact that his team is on pace to make the playoffs when everyone expected them to be deep in the lottery

[ILLsmak]

Stop w/ the Hate he's barely been in the league. Nobody from his draft class has lead their team to any playoff success (some have been good role players on playoff teams, but he is his team's star.) Just the fact that he turned the crappy thunder into a playoff team is amazing in itself.

Every time someone mentions Durant I am going to say... HOW CAN SOMEONE HAVE THOUGHT ODEN WAS A BETTER PICK? I'm never gonna shut up about that, and I think anyone who thought that KD should have been picked number one has the right to eternally rub that in people's faces now that it's all played out.

And we're not even talking about injuries... even if Oden didn't get injured who really thinks he'd be as good as KD.

Much love for KD...

-Smak

[All Net]

He needs to lead his team to the 2nd round.

This year? no way..in like 3 years time he should be focusing on NBA finals appearances.

I think KD is going be a real thorn in Lebron's quest for many NBA titles. Will be a great rivarly.

Luckily for Kevin he has some great talent at the Thunder. Westbrook is a stud.

[joyner82]

Durant is carrying a pg who can't shoot, an undersized small forward with a limited post game, and a box of cracker jacks to the playoffs. If they finish in the 4 seed or above Durant deserves the MVP over Lebron, just like Webber said last night. Lebron didn't make the playoffs in either of his first 2 years and neither did Jordan technically seeing as his team did while he was injured. And they were in the garbage East.

[AtomSmasher]

yes.

Difference is that everyone called Melo an loser for not getting past the 1st round, but Durant is an top 3 player in the NBA even if he hasn't made the playoffs yet
why do you have to come in here and try and discredit KD? you obviously have some childish agenda. respect the man. he's a great player in the league you supposedly love.

[Papaya Petee]

Oh ya mean something Melo's never done without Chauncey :D
Ha ok, if Durant versed those Spurs for two straight years and then the Lakers, you wouldn't be talking. Melo just led his team to a 54-28 record and a WCF while putting up great numbers, what has Durant done?

[Basketbolero]

Stop w/ the Hate he's barely been in the league. Nobody from his draft class has lead their team to any playoff success (some have been good role players on playoff teams, but he is his team's star.) Just the fact that he turned the crappy thunder into a playoff team is amazing in itself.

Every time someone mentions Durant I am going to say... HOW CAN SOMEONE HAVE THOUGHT ODEN WAS A BETTER PICK? I'm never gonna shut up about that, and I think anyone who thought that KD should have been picked number one has the right to eternally rub that in people's faces now that it's all played out.

And we're not even talking about injuries... even if Oden didn't get injured who really thinks he'd be as good as KD.

Much love for KD...

-Smak

Of course, because you know more about basketball than actual professionals. Hindsight strikes again, don't confuse it with wisdom.

Oden may always have been a more limited player than Durant, but great centers win championships, and I don't think you can predict injuries, can you? I also thought Durant was going to be a better player, but I can see why Portland chose him. Anyways, congrats to Durant on such an amazing streak.

[PleezeBelieve]

Durant is carrying a pg who can't shoot, an undersized small forward with a limited post game, and a box of cracker jacks to the playoffs. If they finish in the 4 seed or above Durant deserves the MVP over Lebron, just like Webber said last night. Lebron didn't make the playoffs in either of his first 2 years and neither did Jordan technically seeing as his team did while he was injured. And they were in the garbage East.
OKC being a #4 would mean the West is garbage, son.

You people are hilarious. :oldlol:

[joyner82]

OKC being a #4 would mean the West is garbage, son.

You people are hilarious. :oldlol:

OKC is 16-6 vs the East this year and lost @ Cleveland by 1 on a play where Durant was fouled by Anthony Parker.

[PleezeBelieve]

Stop w/ the Hate he's barely been in the league. Nobody from his draft class has lead their team to any playoff success (some have been good role players on playoff teams, but he is his team's star.) Just the fact that he turned the crappy thunder into a playoff team is amazing in itself.

Every time someone mentions Durant I am going to say... HOW CAN SOMEONE HAVE THOUGHT ODEN WAS A BETTER PICK? I'm never gonna shut up about that, and I think anyone who thought that KD should have been picked number one has the right to eternally rub that in people's faces now that it's all played out.

And we're not even talking about injuries... even if Oden didn't get injured who really thinks he'd be as good as KD.

Much love for KD...

-Smak
Portland w/Oden > OKC w/Durant

I know cause saw it happen earlier in the year.

Where was this post then?

It amazes how clowns pile on players while they're injured.

[PleezeBelieve]

OKC is 16-6 vs the East this year and lost @ Cleveland by 1 on a play where Durant was fouled by Anthony Parker.
Ok, so what happned the other FIVE times Durant has lost to the Cavs?

Get on your job you..you..you excuse-mongerer.

[Amil23]

Ok, so what happned the other FIVE times Durant has lost to the Cavs?

Get on your job you..you..you excuse-mongerer.
+1 In the east Durant would still be a 5 seed

[joyner82]

Ok, so what happned the other FIVE times Durant has lost to the Cavs?

Get on your job you..you..you excuse-mongerer.

What's your excuse as to why Lebron has never won a championship? I would hope Durant at 19-20 wouldn't be leading a .300 team to wins over the "best player in the NBA" whose team had the best record in the NBA.

[Amil23]

What's your excuse as to why Lebron has never won a championship? I would hope Durant at 19-20 wouldn't be leading a .300 team to wins over the "best player in the NBA" whose team had the best record in the NBA.
you are a huge troll

[oh the horror]

you are a huge troll



Hes a troll because hes making a point you dont agree with? Oooookay.

[PleezeBelieve]

What's your excuse as to why Lebron has never won a championship? I would hope Durant at 19-20 wouldn't be leading a .300 team to wins over the "best player in the NBA" whose team had the best record in the NBA.
Well, in 2010, Durant is on a .500+ team and still can't beat the best player in the game.

So what's your point?

[Amil23]

Hes a troll because hes making a point you dont agree with? Oooookay.
go to espn forums and you'll see

[joyner82]

Well, in 2010, Durant is on a .500+ team and still can't beat the best player in the game.

So what's your point?

Lebron hasn't beaten the Celtics this year and couldn't beat them in 08 in the ECSF when they were healthy. Obviously the Pierce>Lebron because his team has been better in the past. See I can make absurd statements too.

[macpierce]

Lebron hasn't beaten the Celtics this year and couldn't beat them in 08 in the ECSF when they were healthy. Obviously the Pierce>Lebron because his team has been better in the past. See I can make absurd statements too.

thanks for telling the truth pierce > lebron

[Thunderstruck]

Durant is carrying a pg who can't shoot, an undersized small forward with a limited post game, and a box of cracker jacks to the playoffs.

Last night those cracker jacks and that undersized small forward won the game in the 4th quarter.

[Disaprine]

Amazing stat. The longest streak since Allen Iverson did it in 27 consecutive games during the 2000-01 season.

Doesn't look like he is slowing down either. 33 points last night in another Thunder win.

almost averaging 30, 7 and 3 on 48% from the floor and 38% from three.

great stuff from KD who knows he could lead his team to hosting a playoff series.
:applause:

[ProfessorMurder]

Durant is so sick. I bet he can break AI's string of games.

His next three games are against Mavs, Knicks and Minnesota.

[O.J A 6'4Mamba]

when we look at the 10s Decade. It will be

1a. LeBron
1b. Durant
2a. Melo
2b. Mayo
3. Rose

[gts]

if the thunder have a strong second half of the season, and he keeps on this type of pace, he's going to start getting serious MVP talk

[Basketbolero]

when we look at the 10s Decade. It will be

1a. LeBron
1b. Durant
2a. Melo
2b. Mayo
3. Rose
And then, again, guess who doesn't belong there...:ohwell:

[lilbeastnani]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJBa6WgYzzc
"It's sensing that what could be is about to become, what is."

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3612/3369193960_f4ce3ae6d6.jpg

[joyner82]

when we look at the 10s Decade. It will be

1a. LeBron
1b. Durant
2a. Melo
2b. Mayo
3. Rose


LMFAO Mayo


1. Lebron/Durant
2. Howard
3. CP3/Rose

[joyner82]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJBa6WgYzzc
"It's sensing that what could be is about to become, what is."

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3612/3369193960_f4ce3ae6d6.jpg


More like, "It's sensing that what could be has become"

[lilbeastnani]

^^ Well that quote was made prior to the beginning of the season.

[NBASTATMAN]

Durant is the man... :applause:

[DuMa]

for the record, the record isnt held by AI. Jordan did it in a string of 40 games 2 different times. that is the record.

[All Net]

for the record, the record isnt held by AI. Jordan did it in a string of 40 games 2 different times. that is the record.

Nobody said the record was held by Iverson.

He was just the last person to hold a higher amount.

[ProfessorMurder]

for the record, the record isnt held by AI. Jordan did it in a string of 40 games 2 different times. that is the record.

I knew AI didn't have the record, but wasn't sure who did.

Does the record have to be in one season though? Say he drops over 25 in every remaining game... Misses the playoffs, and starts next season off with 25+ again.

[lilbeastnani]

The thing I like the most about KD is that he's got that hunger. I mean you always hear about this guy working non-stop. Participating in summer leagues when he doesn't have to, working hard on his game, saying all the right things, being a humble guy. He's just got it all right now.

[PistonsFan#21]

its pretty obvious that Durant is going to be better (if not already better) than LeBron. the question is how many more rings is he going to win than LeBron?

LMAO! Durant is only a good scorer. He isnt on Lebron's level

[Dave3]

Durant is carrying a pg who can't shoot, an undersized small forward with a limited post game, and a box of cracker jacks to the playoffs. If they finish in the 4 seed or above Durant deserves the MVP over Lebron, just like Webber said last night. Lebron didn't make the playoffs in either of his first 2 years and neither did Jordan technically seeing as his team did while he was injured. And they were in the garbage East.
LeBron won 50 games in his 3rd year with 31, 7 and 6 on 48% and didn't get MVP. I doubt Durant being at 30 7 and 3 on 48% winning about 50 games would get him the MVP this year, expecially since LeBron is a much better candidate this year than Nash was in 2006.

[Bodhi]

so scoring isn't part of the game now?
isn't that how people win?
does he now average more boards the LeBron.
is his help defense now going to be better than Lebron's in 2 years times?
doesn't he not rely on his athleticism like LeBron does on his?

Durant averages more TOs than assists and hasn't learned how to play defense yet. He's got a long ways to go.

[oh the horror]

Again, people are not taking into account that Durant is only 21-22 years old. This is only his what....3rd year in the league? And he is already putting up numbers that can be compared to the likes of Lebron James, who may be 25...but has had more years in the league as well.



Durant is going to be a monster.

[PleezeBelieve]

Again, people are not taking into account that Durant is only 21-22 years old. This is only his what....3rd year in the league? And he is already putting up numbers that can be compared to the likes of Lebron James, who may be 25...but has had more years in the league as well.



Durant is going to be a monster.
I know you a Kobe fan but everything isn't about stats. Even if it was, LeBron still reigns supreme.

Lol @ Kobe Fan jumping on Durant's bandwagon.

[ShaqAttack3234]

and neither did Jordan technically seeing as his team did while he was injured. And they were in the garbage East.

Jordan did it in his rookie season as well. 28.2 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 5.9 apg, 2.4 spg and 51.5% shooting on a playoff team as a rookie.


when we look at the 10s Decade. It will be

1a. LeBron
1b. Durant
2a. Melo
2b. Mayo
3. Rose

:roll: Howard is and will remain easily better than Rose and Mayo. I'd take him over Melo as well and probably Durant.

[oneeyeddeacon]

for the record, the record isnt held by AI. Jordan did it in a string of 40 games 2 different times. that is the record.
I'm pretty sure Wilt Chamberlain has the record, since he had a string of 65 games scoring 30+ points at one point.

[D-Rose]

Durant averages more TOs than assists and hasn't learned how to play defense yet. He's got a long ways to go.
Don't think you've watched much KD, he's an above average defender. Totally improved from last year.

[GOBB]

Amazing stat. The longest streak since Allen Iverson did it in 27 consecutive games during the 2000-01 season.

Doesn't look like he is slowing down either. 33 points last night in another Thunder win.

almost averaging 30, 7 and 3 on 48% from the floor and 38% from three.

great stuff from KD who knows he could lead his team to hosting a playoff series.

More support for AI being MVP yet you wont find many caring. Durant does it tho? And well homage is being paid. Funny.

[RJChPD]

The way things are looking, it seems a lot of Bryant fans on this board will be huge Durant fans in a few years from now. I wonder why ?

[tsforthrees]

now that i think about it, Durant's Thunder and AI's Sixers are pretty comparable. Durant has a lot of good role players (much younger than AI's cast) surrounding him that can play defense, rebound, and play scrappy basketball on both ends of the court.

[The GM]

It just shows how much his game has evolved over the course of a year, amazing achivement for such a young player.

[bagelred]

Well, if we miss out on Lebron next year, there's always Durant.....:lol

Kevin Durant in NY :rockon: 2012 baby!!!!!!

[Amil23]

The way things are looking, it seems a lot of Bryant fans on this board will be huge Durant fans in a few years from now. I wonder why ?

+ 1.I notice alot of them converting to.

[D-Rose]

+ 1.I notice alot of them converting to.
Oh you mean like how MJ fans converted to LeBron?

[Bigsmoke]

Kevin Durant will be a beast for years to come.

i already think he's better than Tmac was :rockon:

[ThaRegul8r]

for the record, the record isnt held by AI. Jordan did it in a string of 40 games 2 different times. that is the record.

I'm pretty sure Wilt Chamberlain has the record, since he had a string of 65 games scoring 30+ points at one point.

You're correct. Wilt did it all 80 games he played in the '61-62 season; if you were to throw in the playoffs it'd be 91 straight games.

*wonders how anyone could possibly think the record for consecutive 25+ point games in a season is 40 when a guy averaged 50 a game for a season*

:confusedshrug:

[jlauber]

Regul8r,

I was waiting for someone to comment on Wilt's achievement. In that '61-'62 season, Wilt's LOW game was 26. His next low game was 28. The other 78 games were 30+. Incidently, as you are aware, those two low games were against Russell (as well as his 22 point game in game six of the Eastern Finals.)

In fact, as was mentioned earlier, Wilt had a streak of 65 straight games of over 30 points. During the season, he had a streak of SEVEN straight 50+ games (50, 57, 55, 59, 51, 53, and 60)...and wrapped around those seven games, were another seven of 78, 61, 55, 54, 52, 43, and 41...for 14 straight 40+ games. Near the end of the season he had a streak of five 50+ games (67, 65, 61, 100, and 58.) And, while Russell held Wilt to his season and playoff lows, Wilt did hang a 62 point game on him, and averaged nearly 40 ppg for the season against Russell (with a 50 point game in the playoffs.)

Chamberlain also holds the two longest 20 ppg streaks of 126 and 92.

Just another staggering commentary on the greatest offensive player of all-time.

[ODEN>DURANT]

dudes incredible. SO much improvement from last season.

[Jacks3]

Durant>Kobe.

[GOBB]

Kevin Durant will be a beast for years to come.

i already think he's better than Tmac was :rockon:

If what Tmac did happened today you wouldnt feel that way.

[PistonsFan#21]

Again, people are not taking into account that Durant is only 21-22 years old. This is only his what....3rd year in the league? And he is already putting up numbers that can be compared to the likes of Lebron James, who may be 25...but has had more years in the league as well.



Durant is going to be a monster.

i guess you haven't seen the numbers Lebron was putting up in his 3rd year at age 21...

Lebron: 31.4pts, 6.6ast, 7rebs, 1.6stls, 0.8blk, 3.3TO on 48% FG
Durant: 29.7pts, 2.9ast, 7.4rebs, 1.4stls, 0.8blk, 3.8TO on 48.5% FG

[PleezeBelieve]

i guess you haven't seen the numbers Lebron was putting up in his 3rd year at age 21...

Lebron: 31.4pts, 6.6ast, 7rebs, 1.6stls, 0.8blk, 3.3TO on 48% FG
Durant: 29.7pts, 2.9ast, 7.4rebs, 1.4stls, 0.8blk, 3.8TO on 48.5% FG
And third-year LeBron was 20-21 years old.

Was 20 years old for the first three months of the '05-06 season, 21 years old by the time he was leading his team to a first round win and a second round 7-game thriller in his first playoff appearance against the team with league's best record.

:roll: :roll: :roll: @ people trying to connect Durant and LeBron. It's not even close. The more people hype Durant, the more they further LeBron's legacy without even realizing it.

[OneMoreSucka]

He's going to beat 40.

[joyner82]

i guess you haven't seen the numbers Lebron was putting up in his 3rd year at age 21...

Lebron: 31.4pts, 6.6ast, 7rebs, 1.6stls, 0.8blk, 3.3TO on 48% FG
Durant: 29.7pts, 2.9ast, 7.4rebs, 1.4stls, 0.8blk, 3.8TO on 48.5% FG



Durant has been a much more efficient scorer than Lebron from years 1-3. Hell Durant this year is the most efficient scorer in NBA history in their first 3 years. This is why Lebron gets so much hype

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron +15.3

Defense rating Durant-102pp100p
Lebron-104ppg100p


PER 36 at age 21

Durant-26.7 ppg 18.2 FGA 52.4 eFG% 60.8 TS% 1.477 PPS
Lebron-26.5 ppg 19.5 FGA 51.5 eFG% 56.8 TS% 1.365 PPS
Jordan-26.5 ppg 18.6 FGA 51.8 eFG% 59.2 TS% 1.422 PPS

THE 1.477 FOR DURANT IS #1 IN NBA HISTORY FOR A PLAYER UNDER 22 AVERAGING 21+ PPG. JORDAN MATCHED THAT NUMBER ONCE IN HIS CAREER, 1988-89. LEBRON HAS NEVER HAD A FULL SEASON THAT EVEN CAME CLOSE TO IT.



ALSO THE YEAR JORDAN SCORED 37 PPG HE WAS TAKING 27.8 FGA

IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD HE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG.





The number of NBA players averaging 21+ ppg with a trueshot percentage of over 60% in one of their first 3 seasons? 3,

Kareem Abdul Jabbar-31.2 ppg 60.6 TS%
Shaquille O'Neal-29.2 ppg 60.2 TS%
Kevin Durant-29.7 60.8 TS%





Maybe the most amazing stat of all though is this

Durant is averaging 29.9 ppg while shooting 49% from the field, 37.2% from 3, 88% from the line, and a TS% of 60.6.


How many other players in NBA history have averaged 29+ ppg with a shooting line of 48+/35+/85+?

Larry Bird, and he did it once. That's the list. He did it at age 31 in his 8th season which happened to be the best season of his career, Durant is doing it at 21. If Durant keeps his current shooting numbers and gets up to 30 ppg by season's end he will be the only player in NBA history to score 30 ppg while shooting 48/35/85 or better. Also if he wins the scoring title this year he'll be the youngest scoring champion in NBA history by a full 2 years.


Larry Bird in 86-87(31) 29.9 ppg 60.8 TS%
Kevin Durant 09-10(21) 29.7 ppg 60.8 TS%

[PistonsFan#21]

Durant has been a much more efficient scorer than Lebron from years 1-3. Hell Durant this year is the most efficient scorer in NBA history in their first 3 years. This is why Lebron gets so much hype

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron +15.3

Defense rating Durant-102pp100p
Lebron-104ppg100p


PER 36 at age 21

Durant-26.7 ppg 18.2 FGA 52.4 eFG% 60.8 TS% 1.477 PPS
Lebron-26.5 ppg 19.5 FGA 51.5 eFG% 56.8 TS% 1.365 PPS
Jordan-26.5 ppg 18.6 FGA 51.8 eFG% 59.2 TS% 1.422 PPS

THE 1.477 FOR DURANT IS #1 IN NBA HISTORY FOR A PLAYER UNDER 22 AVERAGING 21+ PPG. JORDAN MATCHED THAT NUMBER ONCE IN HIS CAREER, 1988-89. LEBRON HAS NEVER HAD A FULL SEASON THAT EVEN CAME CLOSE TO IT.



ALSO THE YEAR JORDAN SCORED 37 PPG HE WAS TAKING 27.8 FGA

IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD HE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG.





The number of NBA players averaging 21+ ppg with a trueshot percentage of over 60% in one of their first 3 seasons? 3,

Kareem Abdul Jabbar-31.2 ppg 60.6 TS%
Shaquille O'Neal-29.2 ppg 60.2 TS%
Kevin Durant-29.7 60.8 TS%





Maybe the most amazing stat of all though is this

Durant is averaging 29.9 ppg while shooting 49% from the field, 37.2% from 3, 88% from the line, and a TS% of 60.6.


How many other players in NBA history have averaged 29+ ppg with a shooting line of 48+/35+/85+?

Larry Bird, and he did it once. That's the list. He did it at age 31 in his 8th season which happened to be the best season of his career, Durant is doing it at 21. If Durant keeps his current shooting numbers and gets up to 30 ppg by season's end he will be the only player in NBA history to score 30 ppg while shooting 48/35/85 or better. Also if he wins the scoring title this year he'll be the youngest scoring champion in NBA history by a full 2 years.


Larry Bird in 86-87(31) 29.9 ppg 60.8 TS%
Kevin Durant 09-10(21) 29.7 ppg 60.8 TS%

You notice how your whole argument is based on scoring? Durant is a slightly more effective scorer just because of the FT%. The difference in their 3pt% is about 1% and Lebron shoots 2% better from the field.

As for the overall game, Durant was never on Lebron's level. Lebron is a better leader, a better playmaker, a better defender and more clutch. They are about equal in scoring and rebounding. So yeah...
Oh and also you can't make assumptions such as :"IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD BE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG." Because you dont take into account that taking that many more shots will mean he will have less quality shots, which will decrease his FG%, He will also get tired after a while and the defense will make more adjustments if they know a guy is gonna take that many shots a game.

[juju151111]

You notice how your whole argument is based on scoring? Durant is a slightly more effective scorer just because of the FT%. The difference in their 3pt% is about 1% and Lebron shoots 2% better from the field.

As for the overall game, Durant was never on Lebron's level. Lebron is a better leader, a better playmaker, a better defender and more clutch. They are about equal in scoring and rebounding. So yeah...
Oh and also you can't make assumptions such as :"IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD BE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG." Because you dont take into account that taking that many more shots will mean he will have less quality shots, which will decrease his FG%, He will also get tired after a while and the defense will make more adjustments if they know a guy is gonna take that many shots a game.
LJ was not known has some great defendewr in 06. In fact those were the years he was being critized for his defense.

[joyner82]

You notice how your whole argument is based on scoring? Durant is a slightly more effective scorer just because of the FT%. The difference in their 3pt% is about 1% and Lebron shoots 2% better from the field.

As for the overall game, Durant was never on Lebron's level. Lebron is a better leader, a better playmaker, a better defender and more clutch. They are about equal in scoring and rebounding. So yeah...
Oh and also you can't make assumptions such as :"IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD BE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG." Because you dont take into account that taking that many more shots will mean he will have less quality shots, which will decrease his FG%, He will also get tired after a while and the defense will make more adjustments if they know a guy is gonna take that many shots a game.



OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron in 06 +15.3



That's all you need to look at


And lol @ Lebron shooting 2% better. Maybe this year, from 19-21 Durant>Lebron in 3P%, FT%, eFG%, FG%, and TS% every year.

The difference between Lebron's D this year and Durant's this year is the same as Durant's this year vs Lebron's in 06. Also Lebron wasn't clutch in his first 3 years at all and was known to not even want to take a shot in crunch time. How do you think he got the nickname LeChoke?

[PleezeBelieve]

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron in 06 +15.3



That's all you need to look at


And lol @ Lebron shooting 2% better. Maybe this year, from 19-21 Durant>Lebron in 3P%, FT%, eFG%, FG%, and TS% every year.

The difference between Lebron's D this year and Durant's this year is the same as Durant's this year vs Lebron's in 06. Also Lebron wasn't clutch in his first 3 years at all and was known to not even want to take a shot in crunch time. How do you think he got the nickname LeChoke?
TS% is so awesome. Nothing else matters.

From now on, I personally think GM's should scout with players with high TS% potential. Durant has redefined how we watch basketball.

Good post, bra. You really opened my eyes to Durant's greatness.

[joyner82]

TS% is so awesome. Nothing else matters.

From now on, I personally think GM's should scout with players with high TS% potential. Durant has redefined how we watch basketball.

Good post, bra. You really opened my eyes to Durant's greatness.


In translation: I'm an idiot and I'm sorry I ever questioned you. Durant is clearly a better scorer than Lebron and more important to his team at the same age.

[PleezeBelieve]

In translation: I'm an idiot and I'm sorry I ever questioned you. Durant is clearly a better scorer than Lebron and more important to his team at the same age.
No, I think you are single-handily changing the way many people judge player performance. You are basing your argument in the all-telling measure of statistical greatness:

TS%

I just think many it us overlooked this. Keep at it...

[OneMoreSucka]

The girl in your avatar is pretty young, PB, but I'd still probably hit it

[joyner82]

No, I think you are single-handily changing the way many people judge player performance. You are basing your argument in the all-telling measure of statistical greatness:

TS%

I just think many it us overlooked this. Keep at it...

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron in 06 +15.3


explain

[PleezeBelieve]

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron in 06 +15.3


explain
Durant > LeBron at the same age????

I mean, by gosh what else could it be?

[PistonsFan#21]

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron in 06 +15.3


explain

you pull off stats that i bet you dont even understand yourself. WTF is a Roland Rating? And who is the highest ranked player on that list?

[joyner82]

you pull off stats that i bet you dont even understand yourself. WTF is a Roland Rating? And who is the highest ranked player on that list?

top 5 in roland rating this year

1. Lebron
2. Wade
3. Durant
4. Kobe
5. Dirk



It's an analysis of a players performance vs the player he guards. Also how well his team does with him on the court and off the court.

[joyner82]

Durant > LeBron at the same age????

I mean, by gosh what else could it be?

It shows he's obviously more important to his team and is more efficient at the same age. The reason Lebron's assist numbers are so high is because he demands the ball. Have you ever wondered why pg's assist numbers are career lows when playing with Lebron? Has a pg even averaged 5 asp for a season playing with Lebron? Westbrook runs the point for OKC which is why Durant only averages 3 asp. Also you talk about turnovers...


19-21
Lebron-3.36 TO/pg
Durant-3.26 TO/pg

[nolebball]

Portland w/Oden > OKC w/Durant

I know cause saw it happen earlier in the year.

Where was this post then?

It amazes how clowns pile on players while they're injured.

Portland's players (Roy, Aldridge, Blake, Webster, Fernandez, Batum, Outlaw, Miller) >>>>>>>>>>> OKC's players (Westbrook, Green, Harden, Sefolosha, ****ING ETAN THOMAS, NENAD KRSTIC, NICK COLLISON).




On Durant's achievment, pretty amazing. Props.

On Durant - LeBron comparison, I don't think anyone here thinks Durant now > LeBron now, especially since no one has explicitly said that. But the argument that Durant now being equal to LeBron in his 3rd year is definitely justified, and I personally agree. You argue that Durant needs to get past the first round to prove this, well you may have forgotten but the playoffs haven't come yet.... The Thunder have a great, GREAT shot at the second round considering they've got the 5th best scoring D in the League right now.

[joyner82]

Portland's players (Roy, Aldridge, Blake, Webster, Fernandez, Batum, Outlaw, Miller) >>>>>>>>>>> OKC's players (Westbrook, Green, Harden, Sefolosha, ****ING ETAN THOMAS, NENAD KRSTIC, NICK COLLISON).




On Durant's achievment, pretty amazing. Props.

On Durant - LeBron comparison, I don't think anyone here thinks Durant now > LeBron now, especially since no one has explicitly said that. But the argument that Durant now being equal to LeBron in his 3rd year is definitely justified, and I personally agree. You argue that Durant needs to get past the first round to prove this, well you may have forgotten but the playoffs haven't come yet.... The Thunder have a great, GREAT shot at the second round considering they've got the 5th best scoring D in the League right now.


This pretty much. Noone is questioning that Lebron James isn't the best player in basketball right now. But Lebron at 21 is being vastly overrated because Durant is putting up more efficient numbers and having a greater impact on his team.


Also Lebron was in the EAST with Durant being in the stacked WEST. Lebron won 50 games and Durant is on pace for 48. However with the upcoming schedule and with them being on a 6 game win streak

Dallas
@ New York
@ Minnesota
Phoenix
@ San Antonio
Minnesota
Toronto
Sacramento
@ Denver
@ LA Clippers
@ Sacramento
New Orleans
New Jersey
Utah
@ Charlotte
@ Toronto
@ Indiana




They're 1 1/2 back of the 4 and 2 back of the 3 seed. They could easily finish 14-3 given how easy this schedule is and that would put them at 20-3 over their last 23 games and most likely in the 3 if not 2 seed.

[PleezeBelieve]

Portland's players (Roy, Aldridge, Blake, Webster, Fernandez, Batum, Outlaw, Miller) >>>>>>>>>>> OKC's players (Westbrook, Green, Harden, Sefolosha, ****ING ETAN THOMAS, NENAD KRSTIC, NICK COLLISON).




On Durant's achievment, pretty amazing. Props.

On Durant - LeBron comparison, I don't think anyone here thinks Durant now > LeBron now, especially since no one has explicitly said that. But the argument that Durant now being equal to LeBron in his 3rd year is definitely justified, and I personally agree. You argue that Durant needs to get past the first round to prove this, well you may have forgotten but the playoffs haven't come yet.... The Thunder have a great, GREAT shot at the second round considering they've got the 5th best scoring D in the League right now.
No, Durant is not = a third year LeBron

But whatever....

[Lebron23]

This pretty much. Noone is questioning that Lebron James isn't the best player in basketball right now. But Lebron at 21 is being vastly overrated because Durant is putting up more efficient numbers and having a greater impact on his team.


What are you talking about?

LeBron in his 3rd NBA Season averaged 31.4 ppg, 7 rpg, and 7 apg.

The Cavs won 50 games with Larry Hughes missing over 46 games in the Regular Season.

[joyner82]

No, Durant is not = a third year LeBron

But whatever....

You have nothing that supports what you're saying. You're just saying that because you like Lebron and are insecure regarding his standing all time.

[Lebron23]

No, Durant is not = a third year LeBron

But whatever....

Joyner82 is the worst troll in this forum.

[joyner82]

What are you talking about?

LeBron in his 3rd NBA Season was averaging 31.4 ppg, 7 rpg, and 7 apg.

The Cavs won 50 games with Larry Hughes missing over 50 games in the Regular Season.


Look at the efficiency numbers. Also look at OKC with and without Durant vs Cleveland with and without Lebron.


Hell Durant's numbers this year in FG, 3P, FT, TS, and eFG are higher than the career highs from Lebron in years 1-6. But look at your avatar, you probably think Lebron is better than Jordan.

[Lebron23]

Look at the efficiency numbers. Also look at OKC with and without Durant vs Cleveland with and without Lebron.


Hell Durant's numbers this year in FG, 3P, FT, TS, and eFG are higher than the career highs from Lebron in years 1-6. But look at your avatar, you probably think Lebron is better than Jordan.


F*ck the Efficiency Rating
F*ck the Roland Ratings
F*ck those BS Statistics
F*ck you

Cavs are going to win the NBA Championship this year.

And LeBron would be a 2x NBA Most Valuable Player of the year.

Can you dig it???? Haterss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[joyner82]

F*ck the efficieny,
F*ck the Roland Ratings
F*ck those BS Statistics
F*ck you


lol @ your insecurity. it won't even matter in 5 years when Lebron is in Kobe's shape and Durant is dominating the league at 26.

[PleezeBelieve]

This pretty much. Noone is questioning that Lebron James isn't the best player in basketball right now. But Lebron at 21 is being vastly overrated because Durant is putting up more efficient numbers and having a greater impact on his team.


Also Lebron was in the EAST with Durant being in the stacked WEST. Lebron won 50 games and Durant is on pace for 48. However with the upcoming schedule and with them being on a 6 game win streak

Dallas
@ New York
@ Minnesota
Phoenix
@ San Antonio
Minnesota
Toronto
Sacramento
@ Denver
@ LA Clippers
@ Sacramento
New Orleans
New Jersey
Utah
@ Charlotte
@ Toronto
@ Indiana




They're 1 1/2 back of the 4 and 2 back of the 3 seed. They could easily finish 14-3 given how easy this schedule is and that would put them at 20-3 over their last 23 games and most likely in the 3 if not 2 seed.
In '05-06 all the following were true:

*Detroit had the league's best record

*Miami won the title

*Both teams play in the East


:roll: @people continuing with this Western Conference FUD.

[joyner82]

In '05-06 all the following were true:

*Detroit had the league's best record

*Miami won the title

*Both teams play in the East


:roll: @people continuing with this Western Conference FUD.


The Western conference has won 8 of the last 11 championships. lol wtf are you talking about.

[PleezeBelieve]

The Western conference has won 8 of the last 11 championships. lol wtf are you talking about.
lol

You a clown to me.

[Dave3]

F*ck the Efficiency Rating
F*ck the Roland Ratings
F*ck those BS Statistics
F*ck you

Cavs are going to win the NBA Championship this year.

And LeBron would be a 2x NBA Most Valuable Player of the year.

Can you dig it???? Haterss!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wow. You sound exactly like CantStop right now...what's happened to you?

[nolebball]

What are you talking about?

LeBron in his 3rd NBA Season averaged 31.4 ppg, 7 rpg, and 7 apg.

The Cavs won 50 games with Larry Hughes missing over 46 games in the Regular Season.

As posted before, here are the 3rd year numbers for both.
Lebron: 31.4pts, 6.6ast, 7rebs, 1.6stls, 0.8blk, 3.3TO on 48% FG
Durant: 29.7pts, 2.9ast, 7.4rebs, 1.4stls, 0.8blk, 3.8TO on 48.5% FG

That's not a big enough difference to be considered, especially with LeBron taking 3 more shots. The assist discrepancy comes down to the fact that Cavs' best PG was old ass Eric Snow, and Thunder is Westbrook.

It also needs to be said that in both 3rd year seasons, at 51 games into the season, both teams were/are 30-21....

It also needs to be said that 51 games into the season, Durant has scored less than 25 only five times, while at 51 games, LeBron scored less than 25 nine times.

[Lebron23]

Wow. You sound exactly like CantStop right now...what's happened to you?

Joyner82 is posting the same stuff over and over again.

:lol :lol :lol



As posted before, here are the 3rd year numbers for both.
Lebron: 31.4pts, 6.6ast, 7rebs, 1.6stls, 0.8blk, 3.3TO on 48% FG
Durant: 29.7pts, 2.9ast, 7.4rebs, 1.4stls, 0.8blk, 3.8TO on 48.5% FG

That's not a big enough difference to be considered, especially with LeBron taking 3 more shots. The assist discrepancy comes down to the fact that Cavs' best PG was old ass Eric Snow, and Thunder is Westbrook.

It also needs to be said that in both 3rd year seasons, at 51 games into the season, both teams were/are 30-21....

It also needs to be said that 51 games into the season, Durant has scored less than 25 only five times, while at 51 games, LeBron scored less than 25 nine times.


It's a pretty good comparison, but I still take 2006 LeBron over 2010 Kevin Durant.

[joyner82]

Joyner82 is posting the same stuff over and over again.

:lol :lol :lol





It's a pretty good comparison, but I still take 2006 LeBron over 2010 Kevin Durant.


I have a question. If you have a point guard that can distribute the ball extremely well, what does Lebron bring that is better than Durant?

[joyner82]

lol

You a clown to me.


"you a clown"

You're a dumbass to me

[paintingshade]

I posted this on realgm, spent a good amount of time on it and wanted to see what ISH thought. it compares bosh to durant.

Let me start by saying that the notion that anyone but Lebron getting MPV is kinda ridiculous... but yes you can make arguments I suppose. I think the biggest testament to OKC's turnaround is Durant

[Dave3]

Durant has been a much more efficient scorer than Lebron from years 1-3. Hell Durant this year is the most efficient scorer in NBA history in their first 3 years. This is why Lebron gets so much hype

OKC with Durant on the court +5.5, -10.2 with him off net +15.7

Cleveland in 06 with Lebron on court +3.9, -7.2 with him off net +11

Roland Rating-Durant +16.3
Lebron +15.3

Defense rating Durant-102pp100p
Lebron-104ppg100p


PER 36 at age 21

Durant-26.7 ppg 18.2 FGA 52.4 eFG% 60.8 TS% 1.477 PPS
Lebron-26.5 ppg 19.5 FGA 51.5 eFG% 56.8 TS% 1.365 PPS
Jordan-26.5 ppg 18.6 FGA 51.8 eFG% 59.2 TS% 1.422 PPS

THE 1.477 FOR DURANT IS #1 IN NBA HISTORY FOR A PLAYER UNDER 22 AVERAGING 21+ PPG. JORDAN MATCHED THAT NUMBER ONCE IN HIS CAREER, 1988-89. LEBRON HAS NEVER HAD A FULL SEASON THAT EVEN CAME CLOSE TO IT.



ALSO THE YEAR JORDAN SCORED 37 PPG HE WAS TAKING 27.8 FGA

IF DURANT WAS AVERAGING 27.8 FGA THIS YEAR HE WOULD HE AVERAGING 41.5 PPG.





The number of NBA players averaging 21+ ppg with a trueshot percentage of over 60% in one of their first 3 seasons? 3,

Kareem Abdul Jabbar-31.2 ppg 60.6 TS%
Shaquille O'Neal-29.2 ppg 60.2 TS%
Kevin Durant-29.7 60.8 TS%





Maybe the most amazing stat of all though is this

Durant is averaging 29.9 ppg while shooting 49% from the field, 37.2% from 3, 88% from the line, and a TS% of 60.6.


How many other players in NBA history have averaged 29+ ppg with a shooting line of 48+/35+/85+?

Larry Bird, and he did it once. That's the list. He did it at age 31 in his 8th season which happened to be the best season of his career, Durant is doing it at 21. If Durant keeps his current shooting numbers and gets up to 30 ppg by season's end he will be the only player in NBA history to score 30 ppg while shooting 48/35/85 or better. Also if he wins the scoring title this year he'll be the youngest scoring champion in NBA history by a full 2 years.


Larry Bird in 86-87(31) 29.9 ppg 60.8 TS%
Kevin Durant 09-10(21) 29.7 ppg 60.8 TS%
First, defensive rating is dependent on team defense, and can't be used for individual defenders.

Secondly, in your per 36 comparisons, you're comparing Jordan at age 21...did he ever play in the NBA at age 21?

Thirdly, you state LeBron has never come close to 1.477 pps. Last year he was 1.43, which is definitely close, and this year he's at 1.5 which is higher.

About your point of Durant averaging 41ppg on the same FGA as Jordan, that's pure extrapolation and never actually works in real life. The shots he gets wouldn't be nearly as good if he took 27 of them a game vs. 20 a game, so that point is dubious.

About your 29+ ppg with a shooting line of 48+/35+/85+ line that only 3 players have achieved, those are incredibly arbitrary stats. Anyone can choose a certain cutoff for stats when they're elite to make them seem like they're more exclusive than other people. You can say Calderon is the only NBA player to average 50%/40%/98% etc. Unless the cutoffs are 50/40/90, everything else is just an arbitrary line drawn to try and separate a player similar to his peers.

Also, if we're going by your standards, then LeBron this year is having a better scoring year than Larry Bird, since his TS% is 61.3 and he's leading the league in scoring. I personally have never watched Larry, so I can't comment, but I'm pretty sure it has to go a little bit beyond stats.

No one is arguing that Durant is a great scorer. I'll admit he is slightly better than LeBron was at the same age (while LeBron is a better scorer now), but in terms of overall game, the advantage still has to go to James. In your argument you bring up every advanced stat that favours Durant, but you don't bring up any of the other stats we normally see (such as PER), which probably favour LeBron. You're presenting only the half of the argument which supports the player you prefer by talking about only scoring, then throwing some stats (but not all stats) in which he is better. Put all the stats down (and without extrapolations like "if he got this many minutes" or "if he took this many shots") to compare them.

[Dave3]

Joyner82 is posting the same stuff over and over again.

:lol :lol :lol

He's using the same stuff because he has yet to be refuted. It's like Kobe fans saying you're always using the same arguments. Well yeah you're going to use the same arguments if no one has an answer for you. Instead of calling him a troll actually try and argue the topic. So far you've sounded like a copy of CantStop/Alphawolf. Actually discuss instead of name calling man. You're good at arguing, so why not do it instead of acting like the trolls on this board?

[paintingshade]

First, defensive rating is dependent on team defense, and can't be used for individual defenders.

Secondly, in your per 36 comparisons, you're comparing Jordan at age 21...did he ever play in the NBA at age 21?

Thirdly, you state LeBron has never come close to 1.477 pps. Last year he was 1.43, which is definitely close, and this year he's at 1.5 which is higher.

About your point of Durant averaging 41ppg on the same FGA as Jordan, that's pure extrapolation and never actually works in real life. The shots he gets wouldn't be nearly as good if he took 27 of them a game vs. 20 a game, so that point is dubious.

About your 29+ ppg with a shooting line of 48+/35+/85+ line that only 3 players have achieved, those are incredibly arbitrary stats. Anyone can choose a certain cutoff for stats when they're elite to make them seem like they're more exclusive than other people. You can say Calderon is the only NBA player to average 50%/40%/98% etc. Unless the cutoffs are 50/40/90, everything else is just an arbitrary line drawn to try and separate a player similar to his peers.

Also, if we're going by your standards, then LeBron this year is having a better scoring year than Larry Bird, since his TS% is 61.3 and he's leading the league in scoring. I personally have never watched Larry, so I can't comment, but I'm pretty sure it has to go a little bit beyond stats.

No one is arguing that Durant is a great scorer. I'll admit he is slightly better than LeBron was at the same age (while LeBron is a better scorer now), but in terms of overall game, the advantage still has to go to James. In your argument you bring up every advanced stat that favours Durant, but you don't bring up any of the other stats we normally see (such as PER), which probably favour LeBron. You're presenting only the half of the argument which supports the player you prefer by talking about only scoring, then throwing some stats (but not all stats) in which he is better. Put all the stats down (and without extrapolations like "if he got this many minutes" or "if he took this many shots") to compare them.


you have alot of good points about extrapolation of stats, but I think you undervalue some statistics. They are by no means an end-all argument, but if look at in the right lens, they can have merit.

you can at least get a glimpse of an individual's defense with defensive rating. it takes into account on/off court differences and opposing player production. Durant is a good defensive player.

that being said, we agree in that Durant isn't close to Lebron. No one is. and I'm not a Lebron ******ger, its just the truth. he's just outlandishly productive this year and years past. Now when it comes to leadership and intangibles like that, it's another discussion altogether.

[Dave3]

you have alot of good points about extrapolation of stats, but I think you undervalue some statistics. They are by no means an end-all argument, but if look at in the right lens, they can have merit.

you can at least get a glimpse of an individual's defense with defensive rating. it takes into account on/off court differences and opposing player production. Durant is a good defensive player.

that being said, we agree in that Durant isn't close to Lebron. No one is. and I'm not a Lebron ******ger, its just the truth. he's just outlandishly productive this year and years past. Now when it comes to leadership and intangibles like that, it's another discussion altogether.
I really doubt that about defensive rating. I think Turkoglu last year (because he played with Dwight) had a higher defensive rating than Kobe, Artest, Battier, or Wade. That's why defensive rating is so flawed, it relies on team defense for the rating.

[RJChPD]

Durant is arguably the most versatile scorer in the league at this stage in his career. I see a lot of Durant/Lebron comparisons at age 21 and these are warranted, given Durant's play this season. I think more-so, this speaks volume about the KD's talent and potential- it's scary. Even though Durant is quite likely Lebron's equal in terms of scoring at age 21, it's LeBron's vision and play making ability that sets him apart from KD at the same age in my opinion. All in all they are both special talents and it will be fun to watch them duke it out in the future.

[joyner82]

----------OFF---DEF----WS-----WS48
Bron----121----101----13.4---.313
Wade---112----104----8.1-----.202
Kobe---110-----103----7.3----.178
Melo----113-----108----5.6----.183
KD------115-----102----9.5----.225


Win shares is an extremely flawed statistic due to the multiplier due to being on a winning team. I prefer +/- and team performance with and without the player. Also it's impossible to compare win shares when one player has 82 games played vs 51 games played as it grows with each game

Durant vs Lebron at 21

----------OFF---DEF---USG%---Team net +/-
Bron----115----104----33.6-----+11.1
KD------115----102----32.2-----+15.2



---------TS%----eFG%----PPS------TRB%
Bron----56.8-----51.5----1.359-----17.1
KD------60.6-----52.4----1.477-----17.3

The numbers are extremely close and sparing assists, Durant>Lebron in most areas.

[PleezeBelieve]

He's using the same stuff because he has yet to be refuted. It's like Kobe fans saying you're always using the same arguments. Well yeah you're going to use the same arguments if no one has an answer for you. Instead of calling him a troll actually try and argue the topic. So far you've sounded like a copy of CantStop/Alphawolf. Actually discuss instead of name calling man. You're good at arguing, so why not do it instead of acting like the trolls on this board?
He's been refuted several times. He just talks in circles similar to the way he did in the response to your 'refuting' post.

He's an idiot.

[Lebron23]

He's using the same stuff because he has yet to be refuted. It's like Kobe fans saying you're always using the same arguments. Well yeah you're going to use the same arguments if no one has an answer for you. Instead of calling him a troll actually try and argue the topic. So far you've sounded like a copy of CantStop/Alphawolf. Actually discuss instead of name calling man. You're good at arguing, so why not do it instead of acting like the trolls on this board?



I am also rooting for Kevin Durant because the fans wants to see another great rivalry in the next decade.

Wilt Chamberlain vs. Bill Russell in the 1960's.
NBA vs. ABA in the 1970's
Larry Bird vs. Magic Jordan in the 1980's
Michael Jordan vs. The rest of the NBA legends
Shaquille O'Neal vs. Tim Duncan in the 2000's.

Durant is improving his game every season, and he's going to turn the OKC Thunder into a perennial playoffs contender in the Western Conference.

If LeBron and Durant meet in the NBA Finals that's going to be one of most exciting NBA Finals series of all time.

The Best player in the Eastern Conference vs. The Best player in the Western Conference.

[joyner82]

I really doubt that about defensive rating. I think Turkoglu last year (because he played with Dwight) had a higher defensive rating than Kobe, Artest, Battier, or Wade. That's why defensive rating is so flawed, it relies on team defense for the rating.

Durant is what, tied for 2nd in defense rating on his team? It's way down from the 114 that he had last year. Lebron's was roughly the same and both teams gave up 95.4 ppg in the players respective 3rd seasons.


Durant's opposition is at +10.4
Lebron's in 06 was at +12.6



Durant's estimated win loss this year is 31-17 or 64.58%
http://www.82games.com/0910/0910OKC1.HTM
Lebron's in 06 was 45-34 of 57%
http://www.82games.com/0506/0506CLE1.HTM



Durant has a net48 of +5.5

Lebron had a net48 of +3.9




The argument will never end because at the end of the day they're 2 very different players despite playing the same position. It's closer to comparing Bird and Magic which you can't because it's 2 different positions.

[paintingshade]

I really doubt that about defensive rating. I think Turkoglu last year (because he played with Dwight) had a higher defensive rating than Kobe, Artest, Battier, or Wade. That's why defensive rating is so flawed, it relies on team defense for the rating.

I suppose you are right about the stat I used, but you can go to http://www.82games.com/0910/09OKC9.HTM and get a better picture of Durant's defense. When he's on the court, the team allows 103.7 points per 100 possessions, and when he's off the court, the team allows 106.4 points per 100 possessions. To compare, Bosh's team allows 113.8 when he's on the court, and 114.1 when he's off.

Relatively, Durant contributes more to his team's defense than Bosh contributes to the Raptors defense.

EDIT: using this method I found some interesting things. Under this method, the Lakers are MUCH worse defensively when kobe is off the court, and the Cavs actually get worse defensively Lebron is off. The Miami Heat also get worse when Wade is off the court. Kobe, and wade seem to have more of an effect on the Laker's defense than Dwight Howard has on the Magic. Carmelo's Nuggets get BETTER defensively when he is off the court. Garnett's Celtics get much worse defensively when he is off the court. To use your Turk example, the Raptors get better defensively when he is off the court. just food for thought.

[Dave3]

Durant is what, tied for 2nd in defense rating on his team? It's way down from the 114 that he had last year. Lebron's was roughly the same and both teams gave up 95.4 ppg in the players respective 3rd seasons.


Durant's opposition is at +10.4
Lebron's in 06 was at +12.6



Durant's estimated win loss this year is 31-17 or 64.58%
http://www.82games.com/0910/0910OKC1.HTM
Lebron's in 06 was 45-34 of 57%
http://www.82games.com/0506/0506CLE1.HTM



Durant has a net48 of +5.5

Lebron had a net48 of +3.9




The argument will never end because at the end of the day they're 2 very different players despite playing the same position. It's closer to comparing Bird and Magic which you can't because it's 2 different positions.
See, with all due respect, but I have no idea what the hell you're talking about in the bolded part. All these numbers are made up stats that I'm sure neither of us understand, and neither of us need to evaluate each player.

[joyner82]

See, with all due respect, but I have no idea what the hell you're talking about in the bolded part. All these numbers are made up stats that I'm sure neither of us understand, and neither of us need to evaluate each player.

It has to do with team performance while player is on vs off court. And back to your defensive stat, Cleveland was actually better defensively with Lebron off the court in 06.

[joyner82]

Key
eFG%-This statistic adjusts for the fact that a 3-point field goal is worth one more point than a 2-point field goal.
TS%- True shooting percentage is a measure of shooting efficiency that takes into account all shots
OWS-Offensive Win Shares
DWS-Defensive Win Shares
WSper48-Win shares per 48 minutes
OFF-Offense Rating(higher the better)
DEF-Defense Rating(lower the better)
TRB%-Percentage of Team Rebounds
PvPPP-Possessions vs Points per possession(Efficiency at it's core)
PPS-Points per shot attempted by the player
TP(+/-)-Team performance with player on and off court
RR-Roland Rating
NT-O(+/-)-Net Offense +/-
NT-D(+/-)-Net Defense +/-
eFG%(+/-)-Net Field Goal % +/- of own team
eOFG%(+/-)-Net Field Goal% +/- of opposing team
netFG%(+/-)-Total Net FG% of both teams combined
TO(+/-)-Own teams turnover +/-
TOF(+/-)-Opponent teams turnover +/-
netTO(+/-)-Net turnovers +/-
ORB(+/-)-Offensive rebounding +/-
DRB(+/-)-Defense rebounding +/-
TRB(+/-)-Total rebounding +/-



---------eFG%----TS%---OWS-----DWS-----WSper48
LBJ----51.5------56.7------5.9--------2.8----------216
KD-----52.4------60.4------6.1-------3.4----------.225


---------OFF-----DEF------PvPPP----PPS
LBJ----115------104---------1.04------1.36
KD-----115------102---------1.06------1.48

--------TP(+/-)-----RR------NT-O(+/-)----NT-D(+/-)
LBJ--(+)11.2-----15.6-----(+)13.3-------(-)3.2 Better w/o LBJ on D
KD---(+)15.7-----16.3-----(+)12.7-------(+)2.7


--------eFG%(+/-)------eOFG%(+/-)------netFG%(+/-)
LBJ----(+)4.7-------------(-).4-----------------(+)4.3
KD-----(+)3.3------------(+)2.8----------------(+)6.1

-------TO(+/-)-----------TOF(+/-)----------netTO(+/-)
LBJ----(+)6---------------(-)3------------------(+)3
KD-----(+)4----------------0--------------------(+)4


--------ORB(+/-)--------DRB(+/-)---------netRB(+/-)
LBJ----(+)2.9------------(-)1.9--------------(+).5
KD-----(+)4.5------------(-)1.2--------------(+)2.8

[asu77golf]

when we look at the 10s Decade. It will be

1a. LeBron
1b. Durant
2a. Melo
2b. Mayo
3. Rose
:rolleyes:

[PistonsFan#21]

I have a question. If you have a point guard that can distribute the ball extremely well, what does Lebron bring that is better than Durant?

He brings more leadership, better defense, and a better player in clutch time. Kevin Durant averages more turnovers then assists. If he was in Lebron's role where he would handle the ball way more often and need to create plays for his team he would end up with maybe 6 assists and 8 turnovers per game

[joyner82]

He brings more leadership, better defense, and a better player in clutch time. Kevin Durant averages more turnovers then assists. If he was in Lebron's role where he would handle the ball way more often and need to create plays for his team he would end up with maybe 6 assists and 8 turnovers per game

Durant is a much better defender at 21. Leadership is arguable. Both players were terrible from 19-21 in the clutch. Lebron averages more turnovers than Durant from 19-21. And once again, the question is if you have a point guard who is an excellent distributor ala Rajon Rondo, then Durant does every thing better than Lebron at 21.

[lilgodfather1]

Durant is a much better defender at 21. Leadership is arguable. Both players were terrible from 19-21 in the clutch. Lebron averages more turnovers than Durant from 19-21. And once again, the question is if you have a point guard who is an excellent distributor ala Rajon Rondo, then Durant does every thing better than Lebron at 21.
If you have a distributing PG then he would be traded or because LeBron is such a superior talent to Durant he would make the adjustment. He still averaged in the top 3 in assists on the Olympic team with CP3 and Deron and JKidd running the point. Yeah I think he would be fine. In fact LeBron was in the top 5 of every single category.

edit: Thought that I would explain the superior talent comment a little. I mean that Lebron is such a superior talent to Durant that LeBron could make the adjustment to being an off the ball player, where as Durant couldn't make the adjustment to being a playmaker.

[joyner82]

If you have a distributing PG then he would be traded or because LeBron is such a superior talent to Durant he would make the adjustment. He still averaged in the top 3 in assists on the Olympic team with CP3 and Deron and JKidd running the point. Yeah I think he would be fine. In fact LeBron was in the top 5 of every single category.


Please tell me why Durant makes his team so much better than Lebron if Lebron is the superior talent

[PistonsFan#21]

Durant is a much better defender at 21. Leadership is arguable. Both players were terrible from 19-21 in the clutch. Lebron averages more turnovers than Durant from 19-21. And once again, the question is if you have a point guard who is an excellent distributor ala Rajon Rondo, then Durant does every thing better than Lebron at 21.

Lebron averaged more turnovers because he had to be a playmaker for his team also. Durant made turnovers while trying to create for himself most of the time..compare their turnovers to assist ratio just for fun.

If Lebron only had to worry about offense like Kevin Durant then he would put up like 35ppg on 50%FG. You can't compare a guy that can only score efficiently to a guy that needs to do it all for his team.

[joyner82]

Lebron averaged more turnovers because he had to be a playmaker for his team also. Durant made turnovers while trying to create for himself most of the time..compare their turnovers to assist ratio just for fun.

If Lebron only had to worry about offense like Kevin Durant then he would put up like 35ppg on 50%FG. You can't compare a guy that can only score efficiently to a guy that needs to do it all for his team.


Their USG% are almost identical and both average the same% of team points, there goes your theory on turnovers. And Durant is a FAR better defender than Lebron at the same age so GTFO with only having to worry about offense.

[lilgodfather1]

Please tell me why Durant makes his team so much better than Lebron if Lebron is the superior talent
???? Durant makes his team better? I can't even talk to you right now because obviously you are high/drunk/retarded. If you think that the Cavs would be any where near where they are now with Durant then I really need to take a step out of this thread. So do you, maybe to umm kill yourself, who knows the world would most likely be a better place with one less troll. Durants supporting cast is not that bad, they are young and full of potential. LeBrons supporting cast is not phenominal yet they are the best team i nthe league.

Edit: It is quotes just like this one that makes me cringe at the thought of Kevein Durant playing another game in the NBA. The kid is talented, he will be a great player, but you are taking the hype way to far now.

[joyner82]

???? Durant makes his team better? I can't even talk to you right now because obviously you are high/drunk/retarded. If you think that the Cavs would be any where near where they are now with Durant then I really need to take a step out of this thread. So do you, maybe to umm kill yourself, who knows the world would most likely be a better place with one less troll. Durants supporting cast is not that bad, they are young and full of potential. LeBrons supporting cast is not phenominal yet they are the best team i nthe league.


lmao @ how upset you are right now


---------eFG%----TS%---OWS-----DWS-----WSper48
LBJ----51.5------56.7------5.9--------2.8----------216
KD-----52.4------60.4------6.1-------3.4----------.225


---------OFF-----DEF------PvPPP----PPS
LBJ----115------104---------1.04------1.36
KD-----115------102---------1.06------1.48

--------TP(+/-)-----RR------NT-O(+/-)----NT-D(+/-)
LBJ--(+)11.2-----15.6-----(+)13.3-------(-)3.2 Better w/o LBJ on D
KD---(+)15.7-----16.3-----(+)12.7-------(+)2.7


--------eFG%(+/-)------eOFG%(+/-)------netFG%(+/-)
LBJ----(+)4.7-------------(-).4-----------------(+)4.3
KD-----(+)3.3------------(+)2.8----------------(+)6.1

-------TO(+/-)-----------TOF(+/-)----------netTO(+/-)
LBJ----(+)6---------------(-)3------------------(+)3
KD-----(+)4----------------0--------------------(+)4


--------ORB(+/-)--------DRB(+/-)---------netRB(+/-)
LBJ----(+)2.9------------(-)1.9--------------(+).5
KD-----(+)4.5------------(-)1.2--------------(+)2.8






This completely destroys any argument you have at saying Lebron made his team better than Durant. Durant's team is far more dependent upon him than the Cavs were on Lebron.

[PistonsFan#21]

Their USG% are almost identical and both average the same% of team points, there goes your theory on turnovers. And Durant is a FAR better defender than Lebron at the same age so GTFO with only having to worry about offense.

what you talkin about? You still havent answered my simple question: what is their assists to turnovers ratio? Durant is a far better defender?? LOL! Both of them are mediocre defenders at age 21

[lilgodfather1]

what you talkin about? You still havent answered my simple question: what is their assists to turnovers ratio? Durant is a far better defender?? LOL! Both of them are mediocre defenders at age 21
He is the same guy that responded to my james could make the adjustment to playing with a distributing PG, where as Durant couldn't adjust to being the playmaker on his team comment with if james is a superior talent how does Durant make his teammates better.

And I gave evidence as to how James could make the adjustment.

[joyner82]

what you talkin about? You still havent answered my simple question: what is their assists to turnovers ratio? Durant is a far better defender?? LOL! Both of them are mediocre defenders at age 21


Durant is one of the top 30 defenders in the league meanwhile Lebron hurt his team on defense in his 3rd year. His team was better at defense while Lebron was off the court meanwhile the Thunder are far worse while Durant is off the court.


And assist to turnover ratio? Lebron is better at distributing...congrats. Lebron also hurts his pg's effectiveness and limits his ability which is demonstrated by their assist numbers with and without Lebron.

[04mzwach]

And then, again, guess who doesn't belong there...:ohwell: Rose and Mayo.

[joyner82]

He is the same guy that responded to my james could make the adjustment to playing with a distributing PG, where as Durant couldn't adjust to being the playmaker on his team comment with if james is a superior talent how does Durant make his teammates better.

And I gave evidence as to how James could make the adjustment.


Lebron is a below average shooter, if he plays in a traditional offense not built around him he's not that great. And guess what, offenses built around him don't win championships as evidenced by the last 7 years.

[lilgodfather1]

Lebron is a below average shooter, if he plays in a traditional offense not built around him he's not that great. And guess what, offenses built around him don't win championships as evidenced by the last 7 years.
Let's not compare championships for leBron with a guy that has yet to make his first playoff appearance. And I want you to post LeBrons shooting percentage on jumpers against the other top talents in the league. Kobe, Melo, Durant, Wade. Tell me what is wrong with your statement and then kill yourself for being a troll.

Edit: **** it i'll post the percentages since you will try and spin your way out of it.

LeBron on Jumpers .439 EFG, Durant .452 EFG So if leBron is a below average shooter, that means that Durant is to.

[Dave3]

Lebron is a below average shooter, if he plays in a traditional offense not built around him he's not that great. And guess what, offenses built around him don't win championships as evidenced by the last 7 years.
He is not a below average shooter. A below average shooter doesn't shoot 36% from 3 and an above average from midrange with the defensive attention LeBron garners and the amount of attempts he makes (as well as their ridiculous difficulty due to some poor shot selection lol).
And LeBron hasn't had a half decent team built around him until last year, so you only have one year of evidence to support your claim that offenses built around him don't win championships. This is of course unless you expected him to win a championship in his rookie year or when his supporting cast was Eric Snow, Sasha Pavlovic, Gooden and Z:ohwell:

[DukeDelonte13]

Durant is one of the top 30 defenders in the league meanwhile Lebron hurt his team on defense in his 3rd year. His team was better at defense while Lebron was off the court meanwhile the Thunder are far worse while Durant is off the court.


And assist to turnover ratio? Lebron is better at distributing...congrats. Lebron also hurts his pg's effectiveness and limits his ability which is demonstrated by their assist numbers with and without Lebron.
:wtf: it's not rocket science here, but when the team's best playmaker is out the PG's got to start handling the load a bit more. It doesn't mean Lebron "hurt's his PG's effectiveness".

[Lebron23]

Let's not compare championships for leBron with a guy that has yet to make his first playoff appearance. And I want you to post LeBrons shooting percentage on jumpers against the other top talents in the league. Kobe, Melo, Durant, Wade. Tell me what is wrong with your statement and then kill yourself for being a troll.


This

I think we needs to stop arguing with Joyner82 aka Lilmarcgasol/SergioRodriquez.

[joyner82]

He is not a below average shooter. A below average shooter doesn't shoot 36% from 3 and an above average from midrange with the defensive attention LeBron garners.
And LeBron hasn't had a half decent team built around him until last year, so you only have one year of evidence to support your claim that offenses built around him don't win championships. This is of course unless you expected him to win a championship in his rookie year or when his supporting cast was Eric Snow, Sasha Pavlovic, Gooden and Z:ohwell:



Last year Lebron shot 37.5% on jumpshots which was one of the worst in the league for any players taking 4+jumpshots per game

Last year Lebron was in the bottom 10 in the league in 3P% for anyone that took 4+ 3's a game

[joyner82]

This

I think we needs to stop arguing with Joyner82 aka Lilmarcgasol/SergioRodriquez.

How many playoff appearances did Lebron have in his first 2 years? And he was playing in the garbage East

[Dave3]

Last year Lebron shot 37.5% on jumpshots which was one of the worst in the league for any players taking 4+jumpshots per game

Last year Lebron was in the bottom 10 in the league in 3P% for anyone that took 4+ 3's a game
Not only are you talking about last year, but yet again you're using arbitrary numbers. He shot 38% on MIDRANGE shots (not all 2 point shots) which was 2% worse than Kobe, and only 1% less from 3 point range than Kobe, who's considered a spectacular shooter. Your arbitrary points of "among those who shoot 4+ jumpers" means nothing. It's only a mask to make stats as convenient as possible for your argument. Finally, I believe you said "LeBron is a below average shooter, not was. Both ways you're wrong, but you're even more wrong when you're talking about now.

[Dave3]

How many playoff appearances did Lebron have in his first 2 years? And he was playing in the garbage East
He won 42 games in his second season and still didn't make the playoffs. There's a difference between going 42-40 and missing the playoffs, and going like 20-62 to miss the playoffs. Even in his second year he won like 37 games and he was inheriting the exact same team that won 17 games the prior year minus Dejuan Wagner.

[joyner82]

He won 42 games in his second season and still didn't make the playoffs. There's a difference between going 42-40 and missing the playoffs, and going like 20-62 to miss the playoffs. Even in his second year he won like 37 games and he was inheriting the exact same team that won 17 games the prior year minus Dejuan Wagner.


You know what Durant inherited? Durant got a team that won 35 games and lost it's best 2 players aka Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis.

[Dave3]

You know what Durant inherited? Durant got a team that won 35 games and lost it's best 2 players aka Ray Allen and Rashard Lewis.
Which was about as bad as LeBron's team, except LeBron still did significantly better in the W/L category in their first two years.

[joyner82]

Not only are you talking about last year, but yet again you're using arbitrary numbers. He shot 38% on MIDRANGE shots (not all 2 point shots) which was 2% worse than Kobe, and only 1% less from 3 point range than Kobe, who's considered a spectacular shooter. Your arbitrary points of "among those who shoot 4+ jumpers" means nothing. It's only a mask to make stats as convenient as possible for your argument. Finally, I believe you said "LeBron is a below average shooter, not was. Both ways you're wrong, but you're even more wrong when you're talking about now.


LOL, that's the only link to shooting stats I have. WTF you want me to do?

[joyner82]

Which was about as bad as LeBron's team, except LeBron still did significantly better in the W/L category in their first two years.


Really? Just as bad?


Westbrook=Murray
Sefalosha<Hughes
Durant=Lebron
Green<Gooden
Kristic<Big Z

[lilgodfather1]

How many playoff appearances did Lebron have in his first 2 years? And he was playing in the garbage East
How many games have they won in their respective three year careers 127 wins for James in his first three years out of a possible 246, 73 for Durant out of a possible 215. LeBrons 3 year win % .516, Durants 3 year win % .340.

[Dave3]

Really? Just as bad?


Westbrook=Murray
Sefalosha<Hughes
Durant=Lebron
Green<Gooden
Kristic<Big Z
We're talking first two years. That's a lineup of Ricky Davis, Darius Miles, Gooden and Z. Ricky and Darius are definitely worse than Westbrook and Sefalosha. Not to mention that team had horrible chemistry because Miles and Davis both wanted to be the ball handlers and took exception to passing the ball to LeBron.
The lineup you used is the one that made it to the freaking finals lol. (if you switch Murray with an even worse Eric Snow)

[lilgodfather1]

Really? Just as bad?


Westbrook=Murray
Sefalosha<Hughes
Durant=Lebron
Green<Gooden
Kristic<Big Z
huches wasn't on LeBrons rookie team.

[joyner82]

How many games have they won in their respective three year careers 127 wins for James in his first three years out of a possible 246, 73 for Durant out of a possible 215. LeBrons 3 year win % .516, Durants 3 year win % .340.


What do wins mean if you don't make the playoffs?

Last time I checked in each's first year in the playoffs, if OKC makes the playoffs this year, Durant will have far more of an effect on OKC making the playoffs than Lebron did on the Cavs making the playoffs.



Also that Cavs team wasn't that bad. They tanked the entire second half of the season and they even admitted to it a few weeks ago.

[Dave3]

LOL, that's the only link to shooting stats I have. WTF you want me to do?
The only link you had told you that LeBron was in the bottom 10 for players with 3+ attempts? That was the most basic link you could find? You mean nba.com didn't have a page for LeBron that says "3P%" and you could see yourself that it was essentially the same as Kobe's last year? Here, let me help:

nba.com/hotspots

[lilgodfather1]

We're talking first two years. That's a lineup of Ricky Davis, Darius Miles, Gooden and Z. Ricky and Darius are definitely worse than Westbrook and Sefalosha. Not to mention that team had horrible chemistry because Miles and Davis both wanted to be the ball handlers and took exception to passing the ball to LeBron.
The lineup you used is the one that made it to the freaking finals lol. (if you switch Murray with an even worse Eric Snow)
Again he is showing how amazing LeBron is. By showing his finals team instead of his rookie team, it is scary.

[Thunderstruck]

Really? Just as bad?


Westbrook=Murray
Sefalosha<Hughes
Durant=Lebron
Green<Gooden
Kristic<Big Z

Horrible logic and still wrong

Westbrook>>>>Murray
Sefalosha>>>>Hughes (defensively)
Durant<Lebron (Lebron makes everyone around him better more than Durant does)
Green>Gooden (On both sides of the ball)
Krstic=Big Z

Thunder Bench>>>>>Cavs Bench

The Cavs now are much better than they were the year they went to the finals. At the top, the east is much stronger now than it was that year.

[Dave3]

What do wins mean if you don't make the playoffs?

Last time I checked in each's first year in the playoffs, if OKC makes the playoffs this year, Durant will have far more of an effect on OKC making the playoffs than Lebron did on the Cavs making the playoffs.



Also that Cavs team wasn't that bad. They tanked the entire second half of the season and they even admitted to it a few weeks ago.
Wins mean a player is more valuable. A player making his team win 42 games is much better than a player making his team win 20:ohwell:

[paintingshade]

people talking about durants overall win% don't understand the point. durant was very below average his first year, average his second year, and this year he's phenomenal. he's made tremendous strides, as opposed to lebron who has been well above average his whole career. lebron and durant ARE comparable at the same age.

[lilgodfather1]

What do wins mean if you don't make the playoffs?

Last time I checked in each's first year in the playoffs, if OKC makes the playoffs this year, Durant will have far more of an effect on OKC making the playoffs than Lebron did on the Cavs making the playoffs.



Also that Cavs team wasn't that bad. They tanked the entire second half of the season and they even admitted to it a few weeks ago.
A disgruntled ex coach saying that his team tanked to get the greatest prospect ever? Yeah I remember. But if the team was tanking then after they made the coaching change they wouldn't have won more games then before. They were not tanking completely.

[joyner82]

We're talking first two years. That's a lineup of Ricky Davis, Darius Miles, Gooden and Z. Ricky and Darius are definitely worse than Westbrook and Sefalosha. Not to mention that team had horrible chemistry because Miles and Davis both wanted to be the ball handlers and took exception to passing the ball to LeBron.
The lineup you used is the one that made it to the freaking finals lol. (if you switch Murray with an even worse Eric Snow)

Sefalosha averages 6 ppg while shooting 42% from the field. He's a good defender, but nothing else.

Westbrook is one of the worst offensive players in the league.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/289927/Off_possVSppp2.jpg

[Dave3]

Horrible logic and still wrong

Westbrook>>>>Murray
Sefalosha>>>>Hughes (defensively)
Durant=Lebron
Green>Gooden (On both sides of the ball)
Krstic=Big Z

Thunder Bench>>>>>Cavs Bench
Let's not go overboard. Z is definitely better than Kristic back in 2005. That guy had amazing mobility for a guy his size.
If Sefalosha is better than Hughes defensively, then he's better in both, since Hughes SUCKED offensively. He has a website dedicated to him to not shoot below 40%:lol

[Dave3]

Sefalosha averages 6 ppg while shooting 42% from the field. He's a good defender, but nothing else.

Westbrook is one of the worst offensive players in the league.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/289927/Off_possVSppp2.jpg
And Darius Miles isn't in the league and Ricky Davis was a chemistry killer and bad player...

[joyner82]

Wins mean a player is more valuable. A player making his team win 42 games is much better than a player making his team win 20:ohwell:

Once again, they were both 30-21 after 51 games. Durant has had a significantly greater effect on his team being 30-21 than Lebron did in his 3rd year.

Durant>Lebron at 21 thus far. The stats don't lie. If you want to cover your ears and scream no then so be it. If you can't let the Lebron homer in you see this as fact then I am sorry for you.

[lilgodfather1]

people talking about durants overall win% don't understand the point. durant was very below average his first year, average his second year, and this year he's phenomenal. he's made tremendous strides, as opposed to lebron who has been well above average his whole career. lebron and durant ARE comparable at the same age.
Not really, LeBrons team was worse at a same age, and he was putting up better stats. Better passer, better scorer, and equal at every thing else means better player. I forgot better leader. Durant is incredibly over rated right now, and if the Thunder don't make the second round I never want to hear his name in the same sentence as Lebrons again.

[lilgodfather1]

Once again, they were both 30-21 after 51 games. Durant has had a significantly greater effect on his team being 30-21 than Lebron did in his 3rd year.

Durant>Lebron at 21 thus far. The stats don't lie. If you want to cover your ears and scream no then so be it. If you can't let the Lebron homer in you see this as fact then I am sorry for you.
The Thunder team this year is better than LeBrons finals team. lol at you right now. I have to put you on ignore and step out of this thread. I can't stand how stupid you are.

[joyner82]

Also isn't this entire argument about Durant and Lebron at 21 aka when they both first made the playoffs? Because that Cleveland lineup was

pg-Murray
sg-Hughes
sf-Lebron
pf-Gooden
c-Big Z

[Dave3]

Once again, they were both 30-21 after 51 games. Durant has had a significantly greater effect on his team being 30-21 than Lebron did in his 3rd year.

Durant>Lebron at 21 thus far. The stats don't lie. If you want to cover your ears and scream no then so be it. If you can't let the Lebron homer in you see this as fact then I am sorry for you.
The subject was about including the first two years.
The second part is your opinion, and the only thing you're using to back it up is selective stats like I've shown you before.

[joyner82]

The Thunder team this year is better than LeBrons finals team. lol at you right now. I have to put you on ignore and step out of this thread. I can't stand how stupid you are.

lolumad

and lol @ comparing Lebron at 22 vs Durant at 21

[joyner82]

The subject was about including the first two years.
The second part is your opinion, and the only thing you're using to back it up is selective stats like I've shown you before.

The only stat I excluded was assist per game and they are factored into those statistics such as FG%, offensive production, etc.

[Thunderstruck]

Let's not go overboard. Z is definitely better than Kristic back in 2005. That guy had amazing mobility for a guy his size.
If Sefalosha is better than Hughes defensively, then he's better in both, since Hughes SUCKED offensively. He has a website dedicated to him to not shoot below 40%:lol

Alright, I'll concede that at one time Big Z was better than Krstic, but he always seemed to slow the Cavs down IMO. You have to admit, he and Krstic are very similar players though.

[AlThornton]

The Thunder team this year is better than LeBrons finals team. lol at you right now. I have to put you on ignore and step out of this thread. I can't stand how stupid you are.

:banghead:

not even close

[joyner82]

:banghead:

not even close

Cleveland homer, what do you expect.


He thinks Thabo Sefalosha>Larry Hughes

[paintingshade]

Not really, LeBrons team was worse at a same age, and he was putting up better stats. Better passer, better scorer, and equal at every thing else means better player. I forgot better leader. Durant is incredibly over rated right now, and if the Thunder don't make the second round I never want to hear his name in the same sentence as Lebrons again.

alright man, I guess I just see the stats differently. :confusedshrug:

[lilgodfather1]

alright man, I guess I just see the stats differently. :confusedshrug:
Maybe, more points = better scorer. More assists = better passer, more steals = better stealer (thief), every thing else is a wash. .5% FG% goes to Durant.

[joyner82]

Maybe, more points = better scorer. More assists = better passer, more steals = better stealer (thief), every thing else is a wash. .5% FG% goes to Durant.


More points=more chucking
More assists=better passer
More steals=wash

LOL @ you saying stealing is in Lebron's favor but every area Durant leads in is a wash.

Durant

More efficient scorer
Better defender
Team is more dependent upon him

Durant is clearly better at 21. You're clearly a Lebron homer and refuse to even consider the comparison.



Durant could be putting up 35 and 15 with the best record in the NBA and you would still say it's Lebron.

[Dave3]

The only stat I excluded was assist per game and they are factored into those statistics such as FG%, offensive production, etc.
I'm talking about your choice of advanced stats. You conveniently don't use PER, which is the most commonly used advanced stat along with TS%. Secondly, assists aren't taken into account by FG% :hammerhead:
Come on, when you leave out a stat in which one player is MORE then double the other, you're clearly displaying biased presentation of stats.

[joyner82]

I'm talking about your choice of advanced stats. You conveniently don't use PER, which is the most commonly used advanced stat along with TS%. Secondly, assists aren't taken into account by FG% :hammerhead:
Come on, when you leave out a stat in which one player is MORE then double the other, you're clearly displaying biased presentation of stats.


Assists are taken into account in team FG%, not a players FG%

[nolebball]

Which was about as bad as LeBron's team, except LeBron still did significantly better in the W/L category in their first two years.

Noooo, Lebron had Boozer his 1st year. Let's put it like this. LeBron's rookie year, next top 3 scorers all averaged 15 a game. Durant's rookie year, next top 3 were 13, 13, and 10. And in all honesty, Jeff McInnis was the PG LeBron's rookie year, and the man was pretty capable from what I remember, and his stat line of 12 ppg, 7.5 apg, and 2 tpg agrees with me.The sophomore year for both doesn't have much of a difference.


people talking about durants overall win% don't understand the point. durant was very below average his first year, average his second year, and this year he's phenomenal. he's made tremendous strides, as opposed to lebron who has been well above average his whole career. lebron and durant ARE comparable at the same age.

In what universe is 20 ppg very below average, or 25 ppg average?


Sefalosha averages 6 ppg while shooting 42% from the field. He's a good defender, but nothing else.

Westbrook is one of the worst offensive players in the league.

http://assets.sbnation.com/assets/289927/Off_possVSppp2.jpg

You clearly didn't read the top. He's at the bottom OF THE TOP 50 IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE.


The Thunder team this year is better than LeBrons finals team. lol at you right now. I have to put you on ignore and step out of this thread. I can't stand how stupid you are.

That is highly debatable. They had the same defensive ranking, and the Cavs had a better offensive ranking. The Thunder's superiority at guard/forward is equal to the Cav's superiority in the post, in my opinion.

[lilgodfather1]

Noooo, Lebron had Boozer his 1st year. Let's put it like this. LeBron's rookie year, next top 3 scorers all averaged 15 a game. Durant's rookie year, next top 3 were 13, 13, and 10. And in all honesty, Jeff McInnis was the PG LeBron's rookie year, and the man was pretty capable from what I remember, and his stat line of 12 ppg, 7.5 apg, and 2 tpg agrees with me.The sophomore year for both doesn't have much of a difference.



In what universe is 20 ppg very below average, or 25 ppg average?



You clearly didn't read the top. He's at the bottom OF THE TOP 50 IN THE ENTIRE LEAGUE.



That is highly debatable. They had the same defensive ranking, and the Cavs had a better offensive ranking. The Thunder's superiority at guard/forward is equal to the Cav's superiority in the post, in my opinion.
I agree and that is why i think that this years Thunder is more talented than LeBrons finals team. And the Cavs superiority in the post wasn't that good either really, Big Z was still 30/31 and Gooden is still an idiot who had no idea what he was doing on some nights.

[joyner82]

How about we just base it off of Roland Rating and +/-?


Lebron +15.3 & +11
Big Z +7.2 and +4
Gooden -1.2 and -4.4
Murray -1.4 and +2.4
Hughes -2.6 and -1.9
Varejao +2.5 and +3.9
Marshall -1.2 and +1.5



Durant +16.3 and +15.7
Westbrook +1.8 and +1.4
Sefalosha -2.8 and -4.7
Kristic -4.3 and -1.6
Green -7.6 and -14
Ibaka -4.7 and -5.9
Harden +2.9 and +1.4

[pierce2008mvp]

Amazing stat. The longest streak since Allen Iverson did it in 27 consecutive games during the 2000-01 season.

Doesn't look like he is slowing down either. 33 points last night in another Thunder win.

almost averaging 30, 7 and 3 on 48% from the floor and 38% from three.

great stuff from KD who knows he could lead his team to hosting a playoff series.

Still not on Pierce's level.

[Dave3]

Noooo, Lebron had Boozer his 1st year. Let's put it like this. LeBron's rookie year, next top 3 scorers all averaged 15 a game. Durant's rookie year, next top 3 were 13, 13, and 10. And in all honesty, Jeff McInnis was the PG LeBron's rookie year, and the man was pretty capable from what I remember, and his stat line of 12 ppg, 7.5 apg, and 2 tpg agrees with me.The sophomore year for both doesn't have much of a difference.

My bad, forgot about Boozer! And I don't think Mcinnis arrived until his second year from what I remember. LeBron I believe was the experimental point guard in his first year.

[crisoner]

Kid is BALLIN!!!!!!

Is OKC selling out their home games now? I heard they aren't.

[vessey632]

Kid is BALLIN!!!!!!

Is OKC selling out their home games now? I heard they aren't.

Averaging 98.3 or 98.4% attendance (can't remember exactly) which is 9th in the league by percentage of capacity. The last few weeks have been rough on attendance due to the weather here. Ice storms make it a bit tough to get out for the game.

[Amil23]

Joyner is a troll who post the exact same stuff on ESPN

[nolebball]

My bad, forgot about Boozer! And I don't think Mcinnis arrived until his second year from what I remember. LeBron I believe was the experimental point guard in his first year.

Nah, those McInnis numbers are from rookie year.

[paintingshade]

In what universe is 20 ppg very below average, or 25 ppg average?





I'm talking about production. players like allen iverson score alot, but don't produce wins. in his rookie and sophomore campaigns, durant did NOT produce. he's completely turned it around this year, and has become top 4 in the league. it's pretty much lebron, kobe, wade, and durant.